Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

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JUburton
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby JUburton » Wed Mar 06, 2013 7:05 pm

Since we realize that individual factors such as finances or timing may prohibit you from being able to participate, interviews are optional and non-participation will not negatively impact your application.


surrrrrrrrrre

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pedestrian
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby pedestrian » Wed Mar 06, 2013 7:13 pm

justonemoregame wrote:Has anyone responded to the merit scholarship e-mail by demanding to pay full price?


It doesn't hurt to try! I'll bet you could even negotiate them into letting you pay part of someone elses tuition as well. It helps if you can show more expensive T-14 acceptances to use as leverage.

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uconjak
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby uconjak » Wed Mar 06, 2013 7:35 pm

after reviewing the blogs ect. on the Merit scholarship mess with GULC. I think that every accepted applicant got "catfished". they want you to love them and then they pull this kind of crap...I am really pissed about this.

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Aawaldrop
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby Aawaldrop » Wed Mar 06, 2013 7:46 pm

uconjak wrote:after reviewing the blogs ect. on the Merit scholarship mess with GULC. I think that every accepted applicant got "catfished". they want you to love them and then they pull this kind of crap...I am really pissed about this.


Could someone explain the situation?

BigZuck
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby BigZuck » Wed Mar 06, 2013 7:48 pm

Aawaldrop wrote:
uconjak wrote:after reviewing the blogs ect. on the Merit scholarship mess with GULC. I think that every accepted applicant got "catfished". they want you to love them and then they pull this kind of crap...I am really pissed about this.


Could someone explain the situation?


This thread and Campos' blog discuss it. Just start reading around page 70 or so and watch the rage flow.

topped2013
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby topped2013 » Wed Mar 06, 2013 8:04 pm

nba101790 wrote:Congrats! Numbers? Did you interview?


I actually had an LSAT of 160 and a 3.9 GPA and I interviewed a few weeks ago. Obviously, I am very surprised!

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stone_fox
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby stone_fox » Wed Mar 06, 2013 8:06 pm

topped2013 wrote:
nba101790 wrote:Congrats! Numbers? Did you interview?


I actually had an LSAT of 160 and a 3.9 GPA and I interviewed a few weeks ago. Obviously, I am very surprised!


That's a pretty nice surprise, congrats! Was your interview with a group or an alumni?

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jone7007
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby jone7007 » Wed Mar 06, 2013 10:32 pm

I was accepted today for the part-time program. I also had my last completes on 3/1 and 3/4 but did not have an interview.
Last edited by jone7007 on Wed Mar 06, 2013 11:02 pm, edited 2 times in total.

jym_dawg
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby jym_dawg » Wed Mar 06, 2013 10:57 pm

BigZuck wrote:
Aawaldrop wrote:
uconjak wrote:after reviewing the blogs ect. on the Merit scholarship mess with GULC. I think that every accepted applicant got "catfished". they want you to love them and then they pull this kind of crap...I am really pissed about this.


Could someone explain the situation?


This thread and Campos' blog discuss it. Just start reading around page 70 or so and watch the rage flow.


The good stuff starts on 84. i went back and read it for the lols.

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Bfalcon
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby Bfalcon » Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:42 am

risa wrote:
Rory19 wrote:
Bfalcon wrote:Anyone know about timelines for PILS?


+1

I wonder if you get PILS if that 1/3 scholarship is on top or or instead of other merit awards? I am guessing you would not get both, but that is just a hunch.


I feel like they won't decrease your merit award if the PILS 1/3 scholly is less than the merit. But, it likely won't be added TO the merit scholly. So say you get a $25k/year scholly and then get pils. I don't think they will at the 15k a year from PILS to the 25k a year. It'll likely be whatever is higher of the two. I think you're on with that.

So any news on this? When have people heard from PILS in previous years? There is surprisingly little chat on TLS about it...google boolean search isn't bringing up too much...

BigZuck
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby BigZuck » Thu Mar 07, 2013 10:52 am

Bfalcon wrote:
risa wrote:
Rory19 wrote:
Bfalcon wrote:Anyone know about timelines for PILS?


+1

I wonder if you get PILS if that 1/3 scholarship is on top or or instead of other merit awards? I am guessing you would not get both, but that is just a hunch.


I feel like they won't decrease your merit award if the PILS 1/3 scholly is less than the merit. But, it likely won't be added TO the merit scholly. So say you get a $25k/year scholly and then get pils. I don't think they will at the 15k a year from PILS to the 25k a year. It'll likely be whatever is higher of the two. I think you're on with that.

So any news on this? When have people heard from PILS in previous years? There is surprisingly little chat on TLS about it...google boolean search isn't bringing up too much...


Nobody on TLS talks about it because nobody active on TLS goes to Georgetown. Too much of a social stigma. I would probably ask the school directly if you want the answer to these questions.

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cwid1391
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby cwid1391 » Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:19 am

BigZuck wrote:Too much of a social stigma.


I've heard this trope before on TLS, and it's something that worries me about choosing Georgetown, but I don't really understand the basis behind it. Does anyone want to elaborate on it?

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Bfalcon
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby Bfalcon » Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:21 am

Ouch. That's some serious grudge right there! From the negotiation course I just took "One of the judgemental barriers is to over-generalize or labelyour audience. Labels and over-generalization make it appear as if you know your audience, when actually, you have caught only what is on the surface and not the substance. There is no longer a person before you - only a type"

Thanks for the 411 on TLS and gtown...I caught the stigma months ago. That said, nobody is a powerful word. If you have info that will help, please post it, other than that, I got this ;)

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DoveBodyWash
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby DoveBodyWash » Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:26 am

cwid1391 wrote:
BigZuck wrote:Too much of a social stigma.


I've heard this trope before on TLS, and it's something that worries me about choosing Georgetown, but I don't really understand the basis behind it. Does anyone want to elaborate on it?


A good deal of it is just sort of upper T14 elitism towards the lower T14. GULC is traditionally ranked 14th, so it'll just naturally attract a certain amount of condescension.

But there are some legitimate concerns. First it's in arguably the most saturated market in the country. GW, American, GULC are three MASSIVE schools in one city. Then there's your assortment of D.C TTT's. Then there's the fact that anyone who passes the bar in one of the 50 states is technically licensed to practice in D.C, so it maximizes the competition. It's also a popular destination for other T14 & T20 graduates.

Then you have COL. Saying D.C. COL is expensive would be putting it lightly. But the impact is two-fold. First it's just directly expensive for the student. But it also increases overhead costs for GULC and other D.C schools. So they're generally more cash-strapped than their peers and ultimately end up being more stingy with scholly, which drives the cost up.

So large class size*, high cost, saturated market all contribute to GULC being a really risky option if you're not going at a significant discount. Kids who get into GULC tend to have other T14 options or more affordable T20/30 options.

In sum, a lot of the problems with GULC are primarily because of it's location.

*GULC had the largest class size for the class of 2012. It was over 600 students.
Last edited by DoveBodyWash on Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

BigZuck
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby BigZuck » Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:38 am

Bfalcon wrote:Ouch. That's some serious grudge right there! From the negotiation course I just took "One of the judgemental barriers is to over-generalize or labelyour audience. Labels and over-generalization make it appear as if you know your audience, when actually, you have caught only what is on the surface and not the substance. There is no longer a person before you - only a type"

Thanks for the 411 on TLS and gtown...I caught the stigma months ago. That said, nobody is a powerful word. If you have info that will help, please post it, other than that, I got this ;)


Cool.

I have tried to defend Georgetown in the past (see: this very thread). But after meeting the Dean and hearing what he had to say and seeing how their whole scholarship thing played out I can't really defend them. Basically, what Cuse said. I get why everyone applies there but if they don't start being reasonable and both lowering COA and helping their grads get jobs then they will continue to maintain this position as the lowest of the lower T14.

And I'm sure somebody on TLS goes to Georgetown but I can't remember any prominent posters who do. Seems like everybody applies but then ultimately chooses a different school.

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moneyball026
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby moneyball026 » Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:50 am

BigZuck wrote:
Bfalcon wrote:Ouch. That's some serious grudge right there! From the negotiation course I just took "One of the judgemental barriers is to over-generalize or labelyour audience. Labels and over-generalization make it appear as if you know your audience, when actually, you have caught only what is on the surface and not the substance. There is no longer a person before you - only a type"

Thanks for the 411 on TLS and gtown...I caught the stigma months ago. That said, nobody is a powerful word. If you have info that will help, please post it, other than that, I got this ;)


Cool.

I have tried to defend Georgetown in the past (see: this very thread). But after meeting the Dean and hearing what he had to say and seeing how their whole scholarship thing played out I can't really defend them. Basically, what Cuse said. I get why everyone applies there but if they don't start being reasonable and both lowering COA and helping their grads get jobs then they will continue to maintain this position as the lowest of the lower T14.

And I'm sure somebody on TLS goes to Georgetown but I can't remember any prominent posters who do. Seems like everybody applies but then ultimately chooses a different school.


+1 on all this. I am/was someone who is/was legitimately excited about GULC even though I have gotten into higher ranked schools. I have become increasingly disillusioned though as I go through the process, as Georgetown has made it very user-unfriendly. Multiple stages of the scholarship process vs 1 for other schools and then disappointing offers to literally every "Finalist." It's hard to give money to a class size that large, but it just feels like they aren't doing what it takes to bring you, the applicant, to their school and make it a transparent, easy process. If I am GULC and I am fighting to keep my medians, I would at least get the adcomm office to make it seem like you matter and make you feel good about coming there. I feel like an insignificant number to them and it is disappointing as someone who really wants to be able to afford/justify going to GULC.

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Bfalcon
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby Bfalcon » Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:58 am

moneyball026 wrote:
BigZuck wrote:
Bfalcon wrote:Ouch. That's some serious grudge right there! From the negotiation course I just took "One of the judgemental barriers is to over-generalize or labelyour audience. Labels and over-generalization make it appear as if you know your audience, when actually, you have caught only what is on the surface and not the substance. There is no longer a person before you - only a type"

Thanks for the 411 on TLS and gtown...I caught the stigma months ago. That said, nobody is a powerful word. If you have info that will help, please post it, other than that, I got this ;)


Cool.

I have tried to defend Georgetown in the past (see: this very thread). But after meeting the Dean and hearing what he had to say and seeing how their whole scholarship thing played out I can't really defend them. Basically, what Cuse said. I get why everyone applies there but if they don't start being reasonable and both lowering COA and helping their grads get jobs then they will continue to maintain this position as the lowest of the lower T14.

And I'm sure somebody on TLS goes to Georgetown but I can't remember any prominent posters who do. Seems like everybody applies but then ultimately chooses a different school.


+1 on all this. I am/was someone who is/was legitimately excited about GULC even though I have gotten into higher ranked schools. I have become increasingly disillusioned though as I go through the process, as Georgetown has made it very user-unfriendly. Multiple stages of the scholarship process vs 1 for other schools and then disappointing offers to literally every "Finalist." It's hard to give money to a class size that large, but it just feels like they aren't doing what it takes to bring you, the applicant, to their school and make it a transparent, easy process. If I am GULC and I am fighting to keep my medians, I would at least get the adcomm office to make it seem like you matter and make you feel good about coming there. I feel like an insignificant number to them and it is disappointing as someone who really wants to be able to afford/justify going to GULC.


I completely understand all that you guys have been saying with GULC and DC. Coming from Canada, the COL + Tuition (well over double, if not triple the average Canadian law school) + lower tier of T14 + cold attitude of adcoms and scholly approach, it definitely is daunting, if not downright off-putting. That said, there are very tangible benefits and pros to attending GULC, and if you have a particular intent for career or direction, it actually seems like it would be a great opportunity. DC is a competitive enviornment, but to someone who is older and has connections in the capital, the location and the prestige of the name (as far as being a T14), is definitely useful in some regards. There must be people on TLS who have chosen GULC for very particular reasons and advantages it has over other T14. That's my take anway. I'd say for the majority of people heading to law school, it definitely is NOT anywhere near the highest choice.

There is a particular elitism within TLS, and I don't care for it. In the real world, outside of forums etc, opportunities are what you make of it. Personal sklls and character have an insanely higher degree of influence on one's impact and ability to succeed in this world. Making it to a good law school is just one small step.

My 2 cents anyway. Not looking for an argument whatsoever. Thanks though! Mostly just wondering about PILS!

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luxurylawyer
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby luxurylawyer » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:01 pm

Bfalcon wrote:My 2 cents anyway. Not looking for an argument whatsoever. Thanks though! Mostly just wondering about PILS!


Love this.

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moneyball026
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby moneyball026 » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:07 pm

Bfalcon wrote:I completely understand all that you guys have been saying with GULC and DC. Coming from Canada, the COL + Tuition (well over double, if not triple the average Canadian law school) + lower tier of T14 + cold attitude of adcoms and scholly approach, it definitely is daunting, if not downright off-putting. That said, there are very tangible benefits and pros to attending GULC, and if you have a particular intent for career or direction, it actually seems like it would be a great opportunity. DC is a competitive enviornment, but to someone who is older and has connections in the capital, the location and the prestige of the name (as far as being a T14), is definitely useful in some regards. There must be people on TLS who have chosen GULC for very particular reasons and advantages it has over other T14. That's my take anway. I'd say for the majority of people heading to law school, it definitely is NOT anywhere near the highest choice.

There is a particular elitism within TLS, and I don't care for it. In the real world, outside of forums etc, opportunities are what you make of it. Personal sklls and character have an insanely higher degree of influence on one's impact and ability to succeed in this world. Making it to a good law school is just one small step.

My 2 cents anyway. Not looking for an argument whatsoever. Thanks though! Mostly just wondering about PILS!


I agree with everything you said, and I am one of the TLS'ers who will probably be attending GULC based on many of the reasons you mentioned. Character and interpersonal skills carry a lot more weight than the name of the school once you get past the top 6, and TLS neglects this.

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risa
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby risa » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:10 pm

Bfalcon wrote:
risa wrote:I wonder if you get PILS if that 1/3 scholarship is on top or or instead of other merit awards? I am guessing you would not get both, but that is just a hunch.


I feel like they won't decrease your merit award if the PILS 1/3 scholly is less than the merit. But, it likely won't be added TO the merit scholly. So say you get a $25k/year scholly and then get pils. I don't think they will at the 15k a year from PILS to the 25k a year. It'll likely be whatever is higher of the two. I think you're on with that.


This is what I'm thinking as well, given the way they handle need vs. merit aid (you get the higher of the two).

Bfalcon wrote:There is a particular elitism within TLS, and I don't care for it. In the real world, outside of forums etc, opportunities are what you make of it. Personal sklls and character have an insanely higher degree of influence on one's impact and ability to succeed in this world. Making it to a good law school is just one small step.

I will say, while GULC definitely seems to be looked down upon by lots on TLS, in the real world, people have seemed very impressed when I tell them I got in here. I work in the legal field and when I talk about where I've gotten in to people who haven't a clue about USNWR, this is one of the schools whose name resonates with/impresses them. It's funny, when talking to people on either coast, they usually had no clue that Chicago is the "highest ranked" school I've gotten into, whereas my midwest friends were very impressed with that one. Just saying that rankings don't always coincide with which schools regular people know the name and reputation of! (now "regular people" 's impression may not matter when it comes to legal hiring but...)

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Bfalcon
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby Bfalcon » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:25 pm

Whew...glad I made some sense to someone at least! Was a little worried I was going to get mass-post responses of pure hate haha. And there definitely is a difference between real world opinion and legal world.

MacB
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby MacB » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:26 pm

I am literally in the EXACT same position as a few of you folks. I attended the Jan admitted students weekend and fell in love w/ DC and Georgetown really made a good impression as well. At that point I had been admitted to 7 schools ranked better than Gtown, with big money at a few, and I still would have gladly put my seat deposit down at Gtown. I just kept thinking in the back of my mind... "I hope they make it an easy decision when scholarship offers come out." Needless to say, they didn't, and now all of the good will that they created during my visit has just turned to disappointment and resentment over their stupid/opaque/seemingly arbitrary method of awarding merit aid. It seems like a lot of other really qualified (probably over-qualified) applicants have had the same reaction to this whole mess as well, and I can't help but see it as a HUGE misstep on Georgetown's part. If their goal was to disqualify applicants who wouldn't actually attend if offered money, then at least in my case, I know they made a mistake.

As I said earlier in this thread, I would be a fool to pay for a professional education from people who themselves behave so unprofessionally.
Last edited by MacB on Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Trogdorburninator
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby Trogdorburninator » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:31 pm

I emailed the school and asked if I should expect to hear about PILS wore my April 1st scholarship deadlines, and they said that the committee will be meeting this March and announcing the decisions in April, but that if the timeline was a concern we could email them and let them know about other deadlines.

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Bfalcon
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby Bfalcon » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:49 pm

Trogdorburninator wrote:I emailed the school and asked if I should expect to hear about PILS wore my April 1st scholarship deadlines, and they said that the committee will be meeting this March and announcing the decisions in April, but that if the timeline was a concern we could email them and let them know about other deadlines.


Good to know! Thanks!

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DoveBodyWash
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Re: Georgetown c/o 2016 Applicants (2012-2013)

Postby DoveBodyWash » Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:51 pm

I don't think anyone ITT or TLS can reasonably say or ever said that GULC isn't a good school or that it's not well-regarded in the legal world. A GULC J.D. can take you places. But the basis of the concern is based on its real-world cost, which far outpaces its peers.

I truly envy those who got substantive scholarships to GULC. When I say substantive, i mean enough scholly to make a real difference. A 30k award for example is not substantive. It doesn't make any significant difference to the total cost once COL/interest is included.

Again, the concern has nothing to do with GULC prestige. No one is contesting that. But GULC was a risky investment even before the whole scholarship snafu that happened this cycle. If you're planning on financing your degree with student loans and are expecting to pay sticker at GULC, then take a moment to ignore the prestige kool-aid to consider the cost . If you got into GULC you most likely have great alternatives.
Last edited by DoveBodyWash on Thu Mar 07, 2013 12:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.




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