UW Madison c/o 2015 Forum

[BearsGrl]

has anyone heard of any scholarship offers yet? will these be delayed at well considering the extended deadline? I was wondering if it is still too soon to ask about scholarship negotiation, if they haven't sent out offers yet...getting impatient

I still haven't heard anything, but I have two things to consider: 1) UW will not have much money to give out because of the political climate in Wisconsin, and 2) my friend who is currently a 1L at UW said that he did not receive a scholarship offer last year until April 27, which was well after the first deposit deadline.

I am not really sure how would be best to handle that situation, especially if scholarship money is a weighty consideration for you. I plan to let them know in person at the Admitted Students Day in a few weeks that I will need to know my scholarship information by the deposit deadline, at latest, in order to make a decision. I have a very strong interest in attending (it is one of my final two or three choices), but I can't go at sticker/without knowing how much it will cost. I think the admissions/financial aid offices will realize those concerns, and if you were to show genuine interest in attending (i.e. visit campus, attend ASW, or speak with dean or financial assistants by phone to discuss your situation), they would work with you to figure out a solution. My guess is that they are holding out so long because there is only so much money to be allocated, and they want to make the best offers to those applicants who will matriculate and become quality students.

Despite the lack of scholarship funds due to the incompetence of the state government (pardon my political leanings), the officials at the school really do have an interest in seeing the best students attend their institution, and I believe that they will try to accommodate the needs of accepted students with a genuine interest in attending as best they can.

1) The political climate isn't as bad as people think. Madison is always an active community for activism. The rest of the state isn't. UW historically hasn't offered much scholarship money to even the top candidates that it has accepted. This isn't political in nature. It seems to be the way they go about things. UW is an attractive campus for more than just its law program so it doesn't have to offer the money that other campuses have to in order to attract candidates.
2) I know from reading past applicant threads that even high LSAT/GPA candidates didn't get a lot of money. They were surprised. If you are really concerned about it, I would ask now versus later so that you're not holding onto a spot for other potential candidates. That's not to say that you can't receive any money or an increase in money, but that it's more rare at Madison than other campuses to do so. I'm merely making an observation based on reading past threads on the matter.

If you're out of state, is there a reason why you wish to practice in WI? Have you talked to lawyers within the state at all? Or are you trying to use it as a launch pad to Chicago? I say that because WI's legal market is protracted so I just want to make sure you make a solid choice either way.

[btw384]

has anyone heard of any scholarship offers yet? will these be delayed at well considering the extended deadline? I was wondering if it is still too soon to ask about scholarship negotiation, if they haven't sent out offers yet...getting impatient

I still haven't heard anything, but I have two things to consider: 1) UW will not have much money to give out because of the political climate in Wisconsin, and 2) my friend who is currently a 1L at UW said that he did not receive a scholarship offer last year until April 27, which was well after the first deposit deadline.

I am not really sure how would be best to handle that situation, especially if scholarship money is a weighty consideration for you. I plan to let them know in person at the Admitted Students Day in a few weeks that I will need to know my scholarship information by the deposit deadline, at latest, in order to make a decision. I have a very strong interest in attending (it is one of my final two or three choices), but I can't go at sticker/without knowing how much it will cost. I think the admissions/financial aid offices will realize those concerns, and if you were to show genuine interest in attending (i.e. visit campus, attend ASW, or speak with dean or financial assistants by phone to discuss your situation), they would work with you to figure out a solution. My guess is that they are holding out so long because there is only so much money to be allocated, and they want to make the best offers to those applicants who will matriculate and become quality students.

Despite the lack of scholarship funds due to the incompetence of the state government (pardon my political leanings), the officials at the school really do have an interest in seeing the best students attend their institution, and I believe that they will try to accommodate the needs of accepted students with a genuine interest in attending as best they can.

1) The political climate isn't as bad as people think. Madison is always an active community for activism. The rest of the state isn't. UW historically hasn't offered much scholarship money to even the top candidates that it has accepted. This isn't political in nature. It seems to be the way they go about things. UW is an attractive campus for more than just its law program so it doesn't have to offer the money that other campuses have to in order to attract candidates.
2) I know from reading past applicant threads that even high LSAT/GPA candidates didn't get a lot of money. They were surprised. If you are really concerned about it, I would ask now versus later so that you're not holding onto a spot for other potential candidates. That's not to say that you can't receive any money or an increase in money, but that it's more rare at Madison than other campuses to do so. I'm merely making an observation based on reading past threads on the matter.

If you're out of state, is there a reason why you wish to practice in WI? Have you talked to lawyers within the state at all? Or are you trying to use it as a launch pad to Chicago? I say that because WI's legal market is protracted so I just want to make sure you make a solid choice either way.

I went to undergrad at UW and lived in the state for a while after graduation. Out of state now because I moved a few years back (drat!), but I agree with most of what you said. Madison is probably the most politically vibrant city I've lived in, and I've lived all over the country.

That being said, I was more focused on the spending cuts the Walker administration has been throwing at UW. There is undeniably less money to go around now than there was say, five years ago. I do agree, though, that UW has a lot going for it and that it doesn't need to hurl around money like many other schools would.

edit: Speaking of Chicago, how often to students from UW make it to Chicago after graduation? That is a piece of information that I have had a tough time digging up.

[BearsGrl]

has anyone heard of any scholarship offers yet? will these be delayed at well considering the extended deadline? I was wondering if it is still too soon to ask about scholarship negotiation, if they haven't sent out offers yet...getting impatient

I still haven't heard anything, but I have two things to consider: 1) UW will not have much money to give out because of the political climate in Wisconsin, and 2) my friend who is currently a 1L at UW said that he did not receive a scholarship offer last year until April 27, which was well after the first deposit deadline.

I am not really sure how would be best to handle that situation, especially if scholarship money is a weighty consideration for you. I plan to let them know in person at the Admitted Students Day in a few weeks that I will need to know my scholarship information by the deposit deadline, at latest, in order to make a decision. I have a very strong interest in attending (it is one of my final two or three choices), but I can't go at sticker/without knowing how much it will cost. I think the admissions/financial aid offices will realize those concerns, and if you were to show genuine interest in attending (i.e. visit campus, attend ASW, or speak with dean or financial assistants by phone to discuss your situation), they would work with you to figure out a solution. My guess is that they are holding out so long because there is only so much money to be allocated, and they want to make the best offers to those applicants who will matriculate and become quality students.

Despite the lack of scholarship funds due to the incompetence of the state government (pardon my political leanings), the officials at the school really do have an interest in seeing the best students attend their institution, and I believe that they will try to accommodate the needs of accepted students with a genuine interest in attending as best they can.

1) The political climate isn't as bad as people think. Madison is always an active community for activism. The rest of the state isn't. UW historically hasn't offered much scholarship money to even the top candidates that it has accepted. This isn't political in nature. It seems to be the way they go about things. UW is an attractive campus for more than just its law program so it doesn't have to offer the money that other campuses have to in order to attract candidates.
2) I know from reading past applicant threads that even high LSAT/GPA candidates didn't get a lot of money. They were surprised. If you are really concerned about it, I would ask now versus later so that you're not holding onto a spot for other potential candidates. That's not to say that you can't receive any money or an increase in money, but that it's more rare at Madison than other campuses to do so. I'm merely making an observation based on reading past threads on the matter.

If you're out of state, is there a reason why you wish to practice in WI? Have you talked to lawyers within the state at all? Or are you trying to use it as a launch pad to Chicago? I say that because WI's legal market is protracted so I just want to make sure you make a solid choice either way.

I went to undergrad at UW and lived in the state for a while after graduation. Out of state now because I moved a few years back (drat!), but I agree with most of what you said. Madison is probably the most politically vibrant city I've lived in, and I've lived all over the country.

That being said, I was more focused on the spending cuts the Walker administration has been throwing at UW. There is undeniably less money to go around now than there was say, five years ago. I do agree, though, that UW has a lot going for it and that it doesn't need to hurl around money like many other schools would.

edit: Speaking of Chicago, how often to students from UW make it to Chicago after graduation? That is a piece of information that I have had a tough time digging up.

Haha - We'll differ politically. That's for sure. I mean, Madison has the reputation of being the Berkeley of the Midwest. I'm from WI and am still waiting to hear back. C'mon Madison!!! Granted - I still have a bunch of other schools to hear back from too. I lived in CA and worked in CA politics for a bit. Madison is probably the best in-state value for state schools. That's my opinion at least.

I am a Hoosier UG though so rooting for the Badgers would feel "different." C'Mon Madison - Let me root for you in good conscience!

[brotoss]

Anyone else see this? Preemption to a large drop in the ranking maybe?

http://law.wisc.edu/news/Articles/Dean_ ... 2012-03-06

[buckythebadger]

Anyone else see this? Preemption to a large drop in the ranking maybe?

http://law.wisc.edu/news/Articles/Dean_ ... 2012-03-06

I don't think they will drop far in the rankings, if at all. Their numbers are down for placement in the NLJ250 firms but so are everyone else's. And Madison is mostly a regional school. You do well, you'll have a decent shot of finding work in Wisconsin and Minnesota. A few spots in the rankings are not going to affect Madison's main feeders for jobs

[jenkswarrior]

Anyone else see this? Preemption to a large drop in the ranking maybe?

http://law.wisc.edu/news/Articles/Dean_ ... 2012-03-06

Ha, no one can know for sure until the rankings come out, it's going to be really interesting to see.

if Madison does take a drop, just read this article and remember, it's probably because other schools are cheating

[BearsGrl]

Anyone else see this? Preemption to a large drop in the ranking maybe?

http://law.wisc.edu/news/Articles/Dean_ ... 2012-03-06

Interesting, but any school outside of T-14 that is trying to sell you on rankings probably is lacking in other areas. The economy is going to hurt schools period. Rank should definitely be only one factor that people use as a consideration.

And I agree with Bucky's assessment overall. I was told years ago by a WI lawyer to not go into law for a bit longer if I could wait it out. I decided against that, but I'm also entering law school and the debt process understanding the short-term vs. long-term market of it all. Both recent grads. that I know (not Madison - one low school rank, one solid Midwest rep) have the same type of job (compliance associate - think finance oriented) in Chicago. That's just the reality of it. Some will get luckier with their prospects, some won't.

[Panther7]

It's unlikely that we drop. We dropped big time last year, yet our incoming classes have had stronger credentials each year. It can't last forever.

As for the political climate, it doesn't affect the law school too much. My understanding is that the law school is run mostly on private funds, I think the public donation part is somewhere around 20% of the budget at most? I wouldn't let the school cuts worry you.

Also, for anyone concerned about going to a different city.... where there is a will, there is a way. UW is a strong law school. I know people going to NYC, San Diego, SF, Chicago, Minneapolis, DC, etc. If you're willing to look, you'll find someone to take you. It may not be big law if you don't have the grades, but that's the same everywhere. Our placement numbers are weak due to many electing to stay in WI (no bar is awesome).

[iamsparticus]

It's unlikely that we drop. We dropped big time last year, yet our incoming classes have had stronger credentials each year. ).

What do you mean by this? I did a search for 2009 and 2010 US news rankings and it looks like uw was 35 for both unless Im seeing bad links (on my cell so not too confident in my quick web search). However-After reading that link I would be pretty surprised if uw stays 35. This really seems like a preemptive defensive stance. Is it correct that the schools already know where they ranked for the new rankings about to come out?

[tooswolle]

It's unlikely that we drop. We dropped big time last year, yet our incoming classes have had stronger credentials each year. ).

What do you mean by this? I did a search for 2009 and 2010 US news rankings and it looks like uw was 35 for both unless Im seeing bad links (on my cell so not too confident in my quick web search). However-After reading that link I would be pretty surprised if uw stays 35. This really seems like a preemptive defensive stance. Is it correct that the schools already know where they ranked for the new rankings about to come out?

Just read the article and it seems very preemptive. From what I've read schools tend to hear the news before the rankings come out. I remember last year some people boasting that their school jumped up 13 spots before anyone one else knew. This could very well explain why they took so long to get back to people and why they waitlisted a lot of students and Urms with competitive numbers for the school. This is very intriguing and I'd like to see how it shakes up.

[buckythebadger]

It's unlikely that we drop. We dropped big time last year, yet our incoming classes have had stronger credentials each year. ).

What do you mean by this? I did a search for 2009 and 2010 US news rankings and it looks like uw was 35 for both unless Im seeing bad links (on my cell so not too confident in my quick web search). However-After reading that link I would be pretty surprised if uw stays 35. This really seems like a preemptive defensive stance. Is it correct that the schools already know where they ranked for the new rankings about to come out?

Just read the article and it seems very preemptive. From what I've read schools tend to hear the news before the rankings come out. I remember last year some people boasting that their school jumped up 13 spots before anyone one else knew. This could very well explain why they took so long to get back to people and why they waitlisted a lot of students and Urms with competitive numbers for the school. This is very intriguing and I'd like to see how it shakes up.

I'm still not sure why people are making a big deal about this. Madison will still be a tier 1 school and the flagship school of the state. Employers in the state will still look to madison for jobs, a few spots in the rankings will not affect that. Will this make things a little more difficult if you want a biglaw position in NYC or another large market on the coast? Sure. But if your NYC biglaw or bust, then Madison probably wasn't the best decision to begin with.

[iamsparticus]

I agree 100%. I think people care way too much about the rankings, and those beliefs are largely proliferated by sites like this and lsn. I almost hope uw does drop a few points and a couple people that overemphasize the importance of that happening withdraw their acceptance and allow some of us that haven't heard yet to get accepted.

It's unlikely that we drop. We dropped big time last year, yet our incoming classes have had stronger credentials each year. ).

What do you mean by this? I did a search for 2009 and 2010 US news rankings and it looks like uw was 35 for both unless Im seeing bad links (on my cell so not too confident in my quick web search). However-After reading that link I would be pretty surprised if uw stays 35. This really seems like a preemptive defensive stance. Is it correct that the schools already know where they ranked for the new rankings about to come out?

Just read the article and it seems very preemptive. From what I've read schools tend to hear the news before the rankings come out. I remember last year some people boasting that their school jumped up 13 spots before anyone one else knew. This could very well explain why they took so long to get back to people and why they waitlisted a lot of students and Urms with competitive numbers for the school. This is very intriguing and I'd like to see how it shakes up.

I'm still not sure why people are making a big deal about this. Madison will still be a tier 1 school and the flagship school of the state. Employers in the state will still look to madison for jobs, a few spots in the rankings will not affect that. Will this make things a little more difficult if you want a biglaw position in NYC or another large market on the coast? Sure. But if your NYC biglaw or bust, then Madison probably wasn't the best decision to begin with.

[BearsGrl]

I agree 100%. I think people care way too much about the rankings, and those beliefs are largely proliferated by sites like this and lsn. I almost hope uw does drop a few points and a couple people that overemphasize the importance of that happening withdraw their acceptance and allow some of us that haven't heard yet to get accepted.

It's unlikely that we drop. We dropped big time last year, yet our incoming classes have had stronger credentials each year. ).

What do you mean by this? I did a search for 2009 and 2010 US news rankings and it looks like uw was 35 for both unless Im seeing bad links (on my cell so not too confident in my quick web search). However-After reading that link I would be pretty surprised if uw stays 35. This really seems like a preemptive defensive stance. Is it correct that the schools already know where they ranked for the new rankings about to come out?

Just read the article and it seems very preemptive. From what I've read schools tend to hear the news before the rankings come out. I remember last year some people boasting that their school jumped up 13 spots before anyone one else knew. This could very well explain why they took so long to get back to people and why they waitlisted a lot of students and Urms with competitive numbers for the school. This is very intriguing and I'd like to see how it shakes up.

I'm still not sure why people are making a big deal about this. Madison will still be a tier 1 school and the flagship school of the state. Employers in the state will still look to madison for jobs, a few spots in the rankings will not affect that. Will this make things a little more difficult if you want a biglaw position in NYC or another large market on the coast? Sure. But if your NYC biglaw or bust, then Madison probably wasn't the best decision to begin with.

I agree with both you and Bucky. As Bucky said above, within the state and Midwest region (I think at least) Madison moving down isn't going to stop Madison general cache, but if people go to UW-Madison and then want to move back home to wherever it is they are from (CA, NY, FL, etc.), their best bet is to choose a more local school to gain the contacts needed. Especially in a job climate like now.

And I also agree with your sentiment for some movement for those of us that are still waiting in review for a long time.

[jenkswarrior]

The thing is the economy is affecting all the schools, so everyone's numbers are being boosted with more/less applicants, depending on the year. What's interesting is that this past year in the U.S. ranking lots of schools are tied at 35 and 42. That means that even slight changes in other school's rankings could pretty dramatically change up the rankings for all schools in the 30/40 range.

[BearsGrl]

The thing is the economy is affecting all the schools, so everyone's numbers are being boosted with more/less applicants, depending on the year. What's interesting is that this past year in the U.S. ranking lots of schools are tied at 35 and 42. That means that even slight changes in other school's rankings could pretty dramatically change up the rankings for all schools in the 30/40 range.

Outside of the T-14 or maybe T-20, school ranking isn't going to matter much though. I mean, if you're interested in public interest, it's better for you to go to the cheapest school (overall - rankings might matter if you have a range of similar priced schools) than to the most expensive. I think rank is often times used too much. People should really choose the region that they want to practice more than anything. It's always good to visit the school and area. If you don't feel comfortable in the area, probably doesn't bode well for your mental state during the law school process.

[jenkswarrior]

Outside of the T-14 or maybe T-20, school ranking isn't going to matter much though. I mean, if you're interested in public interest, it's better for you to go to the cheapest school (overall - rankings might matter if you have a range of similar priced schools) than to the most expensive. I think rank is often times used too much. People should really choose the region that they want to practice more than anything. It's always good to visit the school and area. If you don't feel comfortable in the area, probably doesn't bode well for your mental state during the law school process. [/quote]

I completely agree, and I don't think it would matter much in the end if WI were to go up or down five or ten points. Just pointing out an interesting pileup in the rankings list.

[BearsGrl]

Outside of the T-14 or maybe T-20, school ranking isn't going to matter much though. I mean, if you're interested in public interest, it's better for you to go to the cheapest school (overall - rankings might matter if you have a range of similar priced schools) than to the most expensive. I think rank is often times used too much. People should really choose the region that they want to practice more than anything. It's always good to visit the school and area. If you don't feel comfortable in the area, probably doesn't bode well for your mental state during the law school process.

I completely agree, and I don't think it would matter much in the end if WI were to go up or down five or ten points. Just pointing out an interesting pileup in the rankings list.[/quote]

Understood. And I agree that the slightest of changes with cause schools to go up and down in that range.

You were admitted right? Or you're one of the WLs?

[tennisking88]

Via the MyWisc page, OOS Tuition for 2012-2013 appears to rise to $40,040 from 38,811, about a 3% hike.

[tww909]

Via the MyWisc page, OOS Tuition for 2012-2013 appears to rise to $40,040 from 38,811, about a 3% hike.

sweet zombie jesus that's a lot of money.

[tww909]

if people want to ask questions i did undergrad and 1L at UW before transferring to SLS. i can comment on some housing and life stuff as well as general questions/employment/etc.

[tennisking88]

before transferring to SLS

Wow. So you were top 1% I'm guessing? Any tips on doing well in 1L?

[tww909]

before transferring to SLS

Wow. So you were top 1% I'm guessing? Any tips on doing well in 1L?

i wasn't. i was top 5% though. i am definitely the exception for having gotten in here, but there were some particularly helpful faculty contacts i made at UW and specific reasons why i landed here and not at CCN where 5% likely gets you. but that's neither here nor there.

my only tips are really that there are no tips. doing well in 1L is all about staying engaged and excited about the law and learning. if you love what you're doing it's not that hard to do well. other than do all your reading. every day. and actually think about it. these things seem obvious, but you'd be surprised how many people don't do them.

other than that, trust yourself. stick to what works for you. you don't have to outline to do well (i know people who didn't outline at all and did very well), you don't have to brief cases or take notes on the reading (i didn't and know others who didn't), you don't have to talk a lot in class to do well (i had 3 classes in 1L where i spoke only 1 time - i spoke little more in many others). what you do have to do is know yourself and the way you learn. if something worked well for you and you crushed college there is no reason to change your method. this is just more reading on a different topic than you did in college. it's not so fundamentally different.

[BarcaCrossesTheAlps]

Hey, tww....

Do you mind telling us about other aspects of your time while at UW? For example, were you on a journal and in what capacity? Stuff like that...

Thanks!

[tww909]

Hey, tww....

Do you mind telling us about other aspects of your time while at UW? For example, were you on a journal and in what capacity? Stuff like that...

Thanks!

i wasn't on a journal - there is no 1L involvement in journals except the gender journal which allows 1Ls to do cite checking. just thinking of the couple people i know who did it they made law review (which makes sense given their greater bluebooking experience) so maybe it's not a bad idea to do it if you're interested in doing law review.

i did the write on at UW and actually didn't make law review, but by that point i was pretty committed to transferring, and it definitely wasn't my best work.

somewhat similarly, i did the moot court tryout and made it on the team. that i would recommend if you are interested in doing litigation. it was a ton of fun to do the tryout (you write a brief and then argue it before 3 members of the moot court board) and i'd recommend it to people. i didn't end up doing any of the competitions though (those happen your 2L year), but enjoyed the whole process.

as far as other aspects of things, what are you interested in?

[BarcaCrossesTheAlps]

Since you transferred after your 1L, how did that effect your summer job situation?