William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

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tennisking88
Posts: 655
Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:15 am

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby tennisking88 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:35 pm

SPE155 wrote:Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.


You are missing the 40% of the ranking that is based on prestige and peer-assessment.

And, also being from VA, WM/WL have always been peer schools, with WL being ranked higher for all but 3 years of US News' rankings.

EDIT: BIGGER alumni support network doesn't mean better. WL has one of the smallest, but most supportive, in the country.
Last edited by tennisking88 on Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

SPE155
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 3:31 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby SPE155 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:37 pm

wvuchip wrote:
SPE155 wrote:Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.


When were those bar #s from? From my research W&L's first time bar passage rate in VA in July 2011 was 95.83%, higher than UVA. I don't think Feb 2012 has been released yet.


They are the numbers being used in the latest USNWR ranking, so I assume 2011. However, I doubt there rate is actually 95.83%. According to people I have spoken to (recent law grads), the reason for the low bar passage rate is the 3L program at W&L. It supposedly does not allow time for a couple much needed classes if taking the VA bar.

SPE155
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 3:31 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby SPE155 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:38 pm

tennisking88 wrote:
SPE155 wrote:Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.


You are missing the 40% of the ranking that is based on prestige and peer-assessment.

And, also being from VA, WM/WL have always been peer schools, with WL being ranked higher for all but 3 years of US News' rankings.

EDIT: BIGGER alumni support network doesn't mean better. WL has one of the smallest, but most supportive, in the country.


W&M and W&L have the exact same score among lawyers and judges, 3.9.

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wvu
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby wvu » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:44 pm

SPE155 wrote:
wvuchip wrote:
SPE155 wrote:Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.


When were those bar #s from? From my research W&L's first time bar passage rate in VA in July 2011 was 95.83%, higher than UVA. I don't think Feb 2012 has been released yet.


They are the numbers being used in the latest USNWR ranking, so I assume 2011. However, I doubt there rate is actually 95.83%. According to people I have spoken to (recent law grads), the reason for the low bar passage rate is the 3L program at W&L. It supposedly does not allow time for a couple much needed classes if taking the VA bar.

Don't know what you're implying, since that % comes from the VA bar examiners. So I'm more confused about where 70% came from. First I suppose they include all test takers, not just first time, but W&L's class size being smaller also means 1 failure has a bigger impact.

tennisking88
Posts: 655
Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:15 am

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby tennisking88 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:53 pm

SPE155 wrote:
tennisking88 wrote:
SPE155 wrote:Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.


WL's medians (164/3.65) were barely below WM's (165/3.7), to the point where the differences in employment could have easily surpassed WM's advantages.

Edit: my point is that they're peer schools catering to the same markets. the fact that one is ranked 9 spots above the other speaks more to the retarded rankings system than the schools.

SPE155
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 3:31 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby SPE155 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 2:03 pm

wvuchip wrote:
SPE155 wrote:
wvuchip wrote:
SPE155 wrote:Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.


When were those bar #s from? From my research W&L's first time bar passage rate in VA in July 2011 was 95.83%, higher than UVA. I don't think Feb 2012 has been released yet.


They are the numbers being used in the latest USNWR ranking, so I assume 2011. However, I doubt there rate is actually 95.83%. According to people I have spoken to (recent law grads), the reason for the low bar passage rate is the 3L program at W&L. It supposedly does not allow time for a couple much needed classes if taking the VA bar.

Don't know what you're implying, since that % comes from the VA bar examiners. So I'm more confused about where 70% came from. First I suppose they include all test takers, not just first time, but W&L's class size being smaller also means 1 failure has a bigger impact.


The 72.1% bar passage rate is only first time takers.

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wvu
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby wvu » Tue Mar 13, 2012 2:07 pm

Weird. I don't pretend to understand USNWR rankings. :lol:

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anjmissy
Posts: 280
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby anjmissy » Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:17 pm

Where are you all getting the bar passage info from, because last time I checked w&l has the highest in the state --LinkRemoved--

NoleGirl12
Posts: 49
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2011 3:31 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby NoleGirl12 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:32 pm

keep in mind everyone that W&M for the July 2011 bar exam had a 92.6% pass rate while W&L had a 72.7% but in February of that year W&L had a 90% and W&M 73%.

So, honestly it about equals out as far as I can see.


http://regentlawnews.blogspot.com/2011/ ... 57-in.html
--LinkRemoved--

NoleGirl12
Posts: 49
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2011 3:31 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby NoleGirl12 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:34 pm

NoleGirl12 wrote:keep in mind everyone that W&M for the July 2011 bar exam had a 92.6% pass rate while W&L had a 72.7% but in February of that year W&L had a 90% and W&M 73%.

So, honestly it about equals out as far as I can see.


http://regentlawnews.blogspot.com/2011/ ... 57-in.html
--LinkRemoved--



But the link about me shows contradicting result to what i just posted, so idk. i think it about equals out still, b/c of the ebb and flow of different test dates.

SPE155
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 3:31 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby SPE155 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 3:35 pm

anjmissy wrote:Where are you all getting the bar passage info from, because last time I checked w&l has the highest in the state --LinkRemoved--


I know it runs contrary to the link above, but it was the percent in the latest USNWR ranking. Can't say for sure its accurate, but it is what's reported.

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Jsa725
Posts: 2003
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:20 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Jsa725 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 5:11 pm

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Last edited by Jsa725 on Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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DMBFan
Posts: 53
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby DMBFan » Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:38 pm

Current 1L here. If anyone has questions about W&M in general or specifically about the USNWR, please feel free to PM me.

fakemoney
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby fakemoney » Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:20 pm

Jsa725 wrote:Just got email from W&M telling me my app is complete.... Dammit I want an acceptance email!

"Dear Jsa725:

I am pleased to inform you that your application to William & Mary Law School is complete."

...f-ing heart skipped a beat


Ugh... sorry about the false alarm. I am glad to see that they're working over there, though.

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Comoncents
Posts: 110
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Comoncents » Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:22 pm

fakemoney wrote:
Jsa725 wrote:Just got email from W&M telling me my app is complete.... Dammit I want an acceptance email!

"Dear Jsa725:

I am pleased to inform you that your application to William & Mary Law School is complete."

...f-ing heart skipped a beat


Ugh... sorry about the false alarm. I am glad to see that they're working over there, though.



When W&M; WHEN!

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Jsa725
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Jsa725 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:26 pm

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Last edited by Jsa725 on Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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AndShe__Was
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Gradplex livin'

Postby AndShe__Was » Wed Mar 14, 2012 12:02 am

For people who have visited the school, did you get a chance to visit the gradplex?

mjones95
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:01 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby mjones95 » Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:06 pm

In today via email! What a huge relief. 164/3.86 GPA.

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CwallXC322
Posts: 142
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby CwallXC322 » Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:25 pm

mjones95 wrote:In today via email! What a huge relief. 164/3.86 GPA.


Congratulations! Did your status checker change?

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Jsa725
Posts: 2003
Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 9:20 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Jsa725 » Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:30 pm

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Last edited by Jsa725 on Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mjones95
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Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:01 pm

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby mjones95 » Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:36 pm

Jsa725 wrote:
CwallXC322 wrote:
mjones95 wrote:In today via email! What a huge relief. 164/3.86 GPA.


Congratulations! Did your status checker change?

Congrats!! Yeah, what's the deal? Mine just says " complete/will send decision by april 1"


Mine says the same thing, status checker didn't change.

mrjohnsterman
Posts: 171
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2011 12:07 am

Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby mrjohnsterman » Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:42 pm

mjones95 wrote:
Jsa725 wrote:
CwallXC322 wrote:
mjones95 wrote:In today via email! What a huge relief. 164/3.86 GPA.


Congratulations! Did your status checker change?

Congrats!! Yeah, what's the deal? Mine just says " complete/will send decision by april 1"


Mine says the same thing, status checker didn't change.


My status checker did not change until after I submitted the info about whether I was going, considering it or going elsewhere (I said still interested), next day turned to admit from will send by april 1 (this was a month later)

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zapcaz
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby zapcaz » Wed Mar 14, 2012 2:39 pm

In today via email. Submitted in early December.

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Jsa725
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Jsa725 » Wed Mar 14, 2012 2:40 pm

.
Last edited by Jsa725 on Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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zapcaz
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby zapcaz » Wed Mar 14, 2012 2:47 pm

Jsa725 wrote:
zapcaz wrote:In today via email. Submitted in early December.

Congrats! What time did you get email?


Around 12:45 EST




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