William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

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SPE155
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby SPE155 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:31 pm

eaper wrote:Has anyone had luck negotiating?


I haven't really heard but I'm sending a negotiation email this week, and then going up for a visit Friday. Hopefully success though :)

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Jsa725
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Jsa725 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:52 pm

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Last edited by Jsa725 on Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

LawStudent89
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby LawStudent89 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:15 pm

Jsa725 wrote:Has anyone been accepted with " Complete/Will Send Decision By April 1" but not the congrats mailing thingy on the same day? Does the congrats mail sent box change on a diff date?

I read some of the thread and saw people from dec. but nothing around this month...


I believe every person.

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Jsa725
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Jsa725 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:24 pm

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Last edited by Jsa725 on Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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splitsplat
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby splitsplat » Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:26 pm

SPE155 wrote:
eaper wrote:Has anyone had luck negotiating?


I haven't really heard but I'm sending a negotiation email this week, and then going up for a visit Friday. Hopefully success though :)


Report back 8)

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kaftka juice
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby kaftka juice » Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:45 pm

splitsplat wrote:
SPE155 wrote:
eaper wrote:Has anyone had luck negotiating?


I haven't really heard but I'm sending a negotiation email this week, and then going up for a visit Friday. Hopefully success though :)


Report back 8)


How are you planning on negotiating? Do you have an offer from another school? Has anyone successfully negotiated without another scholly offer?

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kroakstool
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby kroakstool » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:18 pm


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Comoncents
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Comoncents » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:23 pm

I am sure to get a ding.

NoleGirl12
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby NoleGirl12 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:45 pm

kroakstool wrote:http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-law-schools/law-rankings/page+1

new rankings



what should we think about this?

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Comoncents
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Comoncents » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:48 pm

Wow, W&M dropped while W&L picked up. Crazy!

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splitsplat
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby splitsplat » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:53 pm

Ouch, that's a pretty big drop for W&M.

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byronmullens
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby byronmullens » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:56 pm

NoleGirl12 wrote:
kroakstool wrote:http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-law-schools/law-rankings/page+1

new rankings



what should we think about this?


ZOMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Because the W&M is ranked lower than Arizona State, employers will pass the school by. Obviously rankings are the only factor everyone should use when making the life decision of where to attended school. Employment figures reported by schools are always accurate and you should seek out schools that employ 99%.

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kroakstool
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby kroakstool » Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:56 pm

splitsplat wrote:Ouch, that's a pretty big drop for W&M.


Ya. With Emory and UGA in-state for me, it's gonna be pretty hard for me to rationalize going to WM anymore :(

NoleGirl12
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby NoleGirl12 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 11:03 pm

byronmullens wrote:
NoleGirl12 wrote:
kroakstool wrote:http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-law-schools/law-rankings/page+1

new rankings



what should we think about this?


ZOMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Because the W&M is ranked lower than Arizona State, employers will pass the school by. Obviously rankings are the only factor everyone should use when making the life decision of where to attended school. Employment figures reported by schools are always accurate and you should seek out schools that employ 99%.



your sarcasm is attractive. it's a genuine question since I'm not 100% sure what the rankings are based on.

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byronmullens
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby byronmullens » Mon Mar 12, 2012 11:12 pm

NoleGirl12 wrote: your sarcasm is attractive. it's a genuine question since I'm not 100% sure what the rankings are based on.


Honestly, the rankings and the power they hold are about patterns over years, schools change a few spots over years but the general reputation doesn't change too much. A large portion of the rankings are based on surveys of law professors and judges (40%) and it has little effect on the hiring picture. The schools who move up and down won't change much. Emory for example dropped and then went back up. Some schools try to game the system like Illinois who inflated their LSAT scores, and just about every school inflates their "employment" figures. I would be very skeptical of any school in the current legal market that claims 99% employment.

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anjmissy
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby anjmissy » Mon Mar 12, 2012 11:25 pm

i was already sold on w&l but not hearing from w&m made me reconsider but seeing these new rankings makes me think whats happened with w&m, but then again they are doing the rankings with a new system

SPE155
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby SPE155 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:42 am

kaftka juice wrote:
splitsplat wrote:
SPE155 wrote:
eaper wrote:Has anyone had luck negotiating?


I haven't really heard but I'm sending a negotiation email this week, and then going up for a visit Friday. Hopefully success though :)


Report back 8)


How are you planning on negotiating? Do you have an offer from another school? Has anyone successfully negotiated without another scholly offer?


I am using an offer from a competing school.

SPE155
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby SPE155 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:10 am

Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.

NoleGirl12
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby NoleGirl12 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:57 am

SPE155 wrote:Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.



I think the sample size, like you mentioned, is prob a big factor. having less people gives you a greater chance of employment in this economy.
The more I think about it, the less worried I am about this drop for W&M, the alum base is still strong (as strong as it can be considering) and with higher bar passage rates, it proves W&M is still superior.
I may be bias b/c W&M is my top choice anyway.

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ap613
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby ap613 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:00 am

SPE155 wrote:Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.



I'm making the same decision and thought the change was strange too, but really if you look over the last decade W&L is usually in the 20-30 range and W&M in the 25-35 range, so its not that suprising.

Here are the rankings from 2000-2008 and you can see W&L is ranked better. Here are the last few years where W&M ranked better.

I'm also from VA and always thought W&M > W&L but this may be because there are so many more W&M grads and I think they're more likely to stay in VA. Anyway, while the W&M drop sucks it doesn't really matter, it's just one year and I'm still leaning towards them.

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Indebted
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Indebted » Tue Mar 13, 2012 11:10 am

uptowngirl22 wrote:Well, according to last year's stats on LSN, the last major group of acceptances came around the end of this week, with a massive barrage of dings/WLs emerging between 13 and 15 March.... starting to feel (very) nervous.


FWIW, went complete on March 7, admitted today, March 13.

Ogresmash
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Ogresmash » Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:38 pm

LawStudent89 wrote:
Jsa725 wrote:Has anyone been accepted with " Complete/Will Send Decision By April 1" but not the congrats mailing thingy on the same day? Does the congrats mail sent box change on a diff date?

I read some of the thread and saw people from dec. but nothing around this month...


I believe every person.


So I don't really understand. If my status says complete/will send decision by April 1st, and it said that on 3/9/2012, does that mean I likely didn't get accepted since my congrats mailing doesn't show up?

_jack
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby _jack » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:05 pm

I have no cue about the congrats mailing. But I do know that on the Georgetown forum they seem to have figured out that if you get updated with USA as your "Country of Citzn" then you are being offered admission. Any insight into that here? I just noticed that I have the USA designation, but my Current Status Dsate is still stuck at 1/27/2012.

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Jsa725
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby Jsa725 » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:12 pm

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Last edited by Jsa725 on Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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wvu
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Re: William and Mary c/o 2015 (2011-2012 Cycle)

Postby wvu » Tue Mar 13, 2012 1:30 pm

SPE155 wrote:Am I missing something on the drop in ranking? I'm still trying to decide where to go and was accepted to W&L and W&M, but over all W&M still seems like the better option after looking at the data used for the ranking:

W&M W&L
LSAT: 161-166 159-165
GPA: 3.46-3.82 3.5-3.8
Accept. %: 22% 24.3%
L&J Score: 3.9 3.9
Employ 9 m: 86.9 90.2
Eploy Grad: 73.8 89.4
Bar Pass: 91.7 72.1 (Statewide %: 77.4)

This says to me that W&L's employment numbers boosts them above W&M and all else goes to W&M as a win. But I would hope percentage wise W&L is higher because they have half as many people. Looking at attendance numbers, W&M placed an estimated 66 more students into jobs, which means bigger alumni network to me. Plus when you graduate at W&L it looks like you don't know enough to even pass the bar.

This jump in rank just seems odd to me. Being orginally from VA and having several friends who are practicing attorneys in the state, the general consensus has always been UVA>W&M>W&L.


When were those bar #s from? From my research W&L's first time bar passage rate in VA in July 2011 was 95.83%, higher than UVA. I don't think Feb 2012 has been released yet.




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