Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

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Haymarket
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Haymarket » Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:43 pm

Samara wrote:Thanks for the response! This is very helpful. I talked to Dany and beezy on chat last night about this too. Beezy said that someone was even given a budget for PI at their biglaw firm. I imagine that's pretty rare, but it sounds like there are some firms that are more pro bono-focused than others. I think having the opportunity to do more than a nominal amount of pro bono work at a firm would be a good fit for me.

How do firms typically treat you pro bono work? I know that you have a target amount of hours and that a certain number of pro bono hours can count towards that. But say you're on track to hit the billable hours requirement and you're on track to quickly use up your countable pro bono hours. Can you use the firm's resources to pursue extra pro bono work or is it something you have to do completely on your own? Also, do they treat different kinds of pro bono work differently? My biggest interest doesn't fall under one of the bleeding heart categories (though I'd like to assist those causes in some way), so would firms be pressuring me towards a certain type of pro bono?

This is going to be essentially entirely dependent on the firm's policies. You are right that firms who allow for PI billing will give you a certain number of hours that you can bill for pro bono work.

One thing, although it depends on the firm, I would not plan on hitting billable hours "early" or having lots of extra work time to devote to something else. For one thing, going past the minimum billables might be essentially be required to stay with the firm, get on partner track, or get a bigger bonu$.

But again, this is something that is too specific to really understand without talking to someone who knows about the specific firm.

anewaphorist
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby anewaphorist » Thu Dec 15, 2011 4:59 pm

Also updated to 12/14. I will be in Chicago this weekend and Monday, so things just might be set up for a dream acceptance :)

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skers
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby skers » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:04 pm

How accurate are tales of Chicago's legendary social awkwardness?

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Samara
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Samara » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:04 pm

Haymarket wrote:
Samara wrote:Thanks for the response! This is very helpful. I talked to Dany and beezy on chat last night about this too. Beezy said that someone was even given a budget for PI at their biglaw firm. I imagine that's pretty rare, but it sounds like there are some firms that are more pro bono-focused than others. I think having the opportunity to do more than a nominal amount of pro bono work at a firm would be a good fit for me.

How do firms typically treat you pro bono work? I know that you have a target amount of hours and that a certain number of pro bono hours can count towards that. But say you're on track to hit the billable hours requirement and you're on track to quickly use up your countable pro bono hours. Can you use the firm's resources to pursue extra pro bono work or is it something you have to do completely on your own? Also, do they treat different kinds of pro bono work differently? My biggest interest doesn't fall under one of the bleeding heart categories (though I'd like to assist those causes in some way), so would firms be pressuring me towards a certain type of pro bono?

This is going to be essentially entirely dependent on the firm's policies. You are right that firms who allow for PI billing will give you a certain number of hours that you can bill for pro bono work.

One thing, although it depends on the firm, I would not plan on hitting billable hours "early" or having lots of extra work time to devote to something else. For one thing, going past the minimum billables might be essentially be required to stay with the firm, get on partner track, or get a bigger bonu$.

But again, this is something that is too specific to really understand without talking to someone who knows about the specific firm.

Thanks for the help again! I'm certainly not planning on having lots of extra time, because I have no idea at this point what my competency level is or what my goals in biglaw would be. But I'm trying to understand what the "ground rules" are and how everything works. It was more for an understanding of how it's treated than an actual hypothetical playing out. I guess at this point it I should just keep my eyes and ears open.

How much do you get to choose the firm you want as a UChi student? If you are at the median, are you just taking whatever NLJ250 firm will have you or is there still choice available? How does that ability to choose compare to a student's ability at a school like Northwestern? (If it makes a difference, I am all in on the Chicago market, for better or for worse. I assume that outside of YHS, UChi and Northwestern have the strongest placement in the Chicago market?)

anewaphorist
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby anewaphorist » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:11 pm

No, UChicago has the strongest placement in the Chicago market if we're talking strictly gross numbers. Of course, the percentage of Yale or Harvard grads getting turned down at those firms is less than the percentage of UChicago grads that do, but the feeder network is there for K&E, Sidley Austin, etc. Median or above at UChicago would probably place just about as well as median at HYS, but a lot of aspiring Chicago BigLawyers from the university are below median; thus, UChicago sends far more lawyers to Chicago BigLaw than do any of Y, H, or S, but the percentage of these latter grads striking out in the windy city is likely lower, because firms love to diversify their attorneys' experiences/schools.

Themaddh
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Themaddh » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:22 pm

What is placement like for NY firms?

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Bildungsroman
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Bildungsroman » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:23 pm

TemporarySaint wrote:How accurate are tales of Chicago's legendary social awkwardness?

So far the tales seem to be a gross exaggeration. Sure there are some awkward people, but only about as many as you'd expect from any given group of people. The stories I hear from students at other law schools lead me to believe that Chicago is no worse an offender than a lot of other elite schools.

But my experiences could be unrepresentative since I'm so good at making social situations flow. :wink:

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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Curious1 » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:28 pm

The recent discussion is really interesting to me. I have absolutely no interest whatsoever in PI/Government. Going strictly biglaw (as prestigious as possible) or killself.

Would Chicago be better for this than Columbia? Obviously if I get HYS by the grace of God this becomes a non-question, but my most likely scenario has me choosing between Columbia and Chicago. Here are my thoughts:

Most of the best firms are in New York, but that market is incredibly competitive with HYS, NYU, Columbia, lower T-14s all scrambling for the best jobs. Chicago, on the other hand, has fewer uber-prestigious firms but seems to be generally neglected by east coast schools, leaving lots of opportunities for UChicago grads, who could get first pick (whereas Columbia would get like 4th pick at the best jobs in NY)

Any number crunching on this?

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Nelson
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Nelson » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:34 pm

Curious1 wrote:Most of the best firms are in New York, but that market is incredibly competitive with HYS, NYU, Columbia, lower T-14s all scrambling for the best jobs. Chicago, on the other hand, has fewer uber-prestigious firms but seems to be generally neglected by east coast schools, leaving lots of opportunities for UChicago grads, who could get first pick (whereas Columbia would get like 4th pick at the best jobs in NY)

This is silly. At that point grades matter more than range of school. Columbia and Chicago are peers.

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blank403
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby blank403 » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:36 pm

So it seems like the consensus is decisions (acceptances, anyway) either tomorrow or monday, yes?

Please please please Chicago?!?

Curious1
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Curious1 » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:36 pm

Nelson wrote:
Curious1 wrote:Most of the best firms are in New York, but that market is incredibly competitive with HYS, NYU, Columbia, lower T-14s all scrambling for the best jobs. Chicago, on the other hand, has fewer uber-prestigious firms but seems to be generally neglected by east coast schools, leaving lots of opportunities for UChicago grads, who could get first pick (whereas Columbia would get like 4th pick at the best jobs in NY)

This is silly. At that point grades matter more than range of school. Columbia and Chicago are peers.


Ok that also brings in questions of grading systems, curves, class sizes, and whatnot. What you're saying is, a person at median at Columbia has the same opportunities as a person at median at Chicago, placing into respective markets?

Curious1
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Curious1 » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:37 pm

blank403 wrote:So it seems like the consensus is decisions (acceptances, anyway) either tomorrow or monday, yes?

Please please please Chicago?!?


Would that be RD or ED?

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Bildungsroman
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Bildungsroman » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:38 pm

Curious1 wrote:
blank403 wrote:So it seems like the consensus is decisions (acceptances, anyway) either tomorrow or monday, yes?

Please please please Chicago?!?


Would that be RD or ED?

ED.

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Haymarket
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Haymarket » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:41 pm

At Chicago, your job choices are going to be a function of your grades and regional ties, especially the former.

That being said, go look around Law School Transparency if you want some general numbers.

--LinkRemoved--

Curious1
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Curious1 » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:42 pm

Haymarket wrote:At Chicago, your job choices are going to be a function of your grades and regional ties, especially the former.

That being said, go look around Law School Transparency if you want some general numbers.

--LinkRemoved--


The recent comprehensive employment data for Chicago is certainly VERY promising. Plus a salary can stretch much further in Chicago...

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Nelson
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Nelson » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:43 pm

Curious1 wrote:
Nelson wrote:
Curious1 wrote:Most of the best firms are in New York, but that market is incredibly competitive with HYS, NYU, Columbia, lower T-14s all scrambling for the best jobs. Chicago, on the other hand, has fewer uber-prestigious firms but seems to be generally neglected by east coast schools, leaving lots of opportunities for UChicago grads, who could get first pick (whereas Columbia would get like 4th pick at the best jobs in NY)

This is silly. At that point grades matter more than range of school. Columbia and Chicago are peers.


Ok that also brings in questions of grading systems, curves, class sizes, and whatnot. What you're saying is, a person at median at Columbia has the same opportunities as a person at median at Chicago, placing into respective markets?


Yes. Grades are everything. You want to work at an elite firm or be an A3 clerk? Get high grades at a T14.

Curious1
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Curious1 » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:44 pm


Yes. Grades are everything. You want to work at an elite firm or be an A3 clerk? Get high grades at a T14.



That's the plan. We'll see if it works out.

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Dany
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Dany » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:54 pm

I think when it comes down to Chicago v. Columbia, you're not really going to have an opportunity for jobs at one that you couldn't have gotten with the same grades at the other. When you're looking at peer schools like CC, just go where you'll be happiest (and/or where the money is).

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Haymarket
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Haymarket » Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:55 pm

Bildungsroman wrote:
TemporarySaint wrote:How accurate are tales of Chicago's legendary social awkwardness?

So far the tales seem to be a gross exaggeration. Sure there are some awkward people, but only about as many as you'd expect from any given group of people. The stories I hear from students at other law schools lead me to believe that Chicago is no worse an offender than a lot of other elite schools.

But my experiences could be unrepresentative since I'm so good at making social situations flow. :wink:

I agree with this experience.

Then again, I just realized how many Chicago people are on this website so.....that might also tell you something.

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Danny Mothers
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Danny Mothers » Thu Dec 15, 2011 7:24 pm

So, looking back again to last year's thread, the Chicago admissions twitter seemed to be quite a bit more active during last year's cycle. Is there any reason why they don't seem to be using it much this year (hasn't updated in a month)?

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Haymarket
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Haymarket » Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:10 pm

Danny Mothers wrote:So, looking back again to last year's thread, the Chicago admissions twitter seemed to be quite a bit more active during last year's cycle. Is there any reason why they don't seem to be using it much this year (hasn't updated in a month)?

Twitter is a dying medium that's becoming too mainstream. Ann Perry is on reddit and 4chan now instead.

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thelawyler
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby thelawyler » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:00 pm

Updated again. Second UR 12/15. RD. Early Oct submitted.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby JamMasterJ » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:08 pm

Dany wrote:I think when it comes down to Chicago v. Columbia, you're not really going to have an opportunity for jobs at one that you couldn't have gotten with the same grades at the other. When you're looking at peer schools like CC, just go where you'll be happiest (and/or where the money is).

yeah, if you like one of Chi or NYU more than the other, or if the money is really different, go with that one

Curious1
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby Curious1 » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:21 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:
Dany wrote:I think when it comes down to Chicago v. Columbia, you're not really going to have an opportunity for jobs at one that you couldn't have gotten with the same grades at the other. When you're looking at peer schools like CC, just go where you'll be happiest (and/or where the money is).

yeah, if you like one of Chi or NYU more than the other, or if the money is really different, go with that one


But I love both cities so much!!!!!! :( :(

roserdozer
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Re: Chicago c/o 2015 Applicants (2011-2012 cycle)

Postby roserdozer » Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:41 pm

Curious1 wrote:
JamMasterJ wrote:
Dany wrote:I think when it comes down to Chicago v. Columbia, you're not really going to have an opportunity for jobs at one that you couldn't have gotten with the same grades at the other. When you're looking at peer schools like CC, just go where you'll be happiest (and/or where the money is).

yeah, if you like one of Chi or NYU more than the other, or if the money is really different, go with that one


But I love both cities so much!!!!!! :( :(


I encourage you to visit Hyde Park before you make your decision (if you haven't already)...




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