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Geneva wrote:THis may be a really dumb question: any chance a Stanford acceptance is something Harvard would want to know? I plan to send in a file update since my application is on hold. If I offhandedly mention this, will it backfire/make me a more competitive candidate in their eyes/or have no impact?

So, from what I've heard from my friends who applied in other cycles that this worked for: Telling Stanford/Harvard you got into the other, but will definitely go there if you got in, can help them speed up your decision and get in. "These schools like high yields for them and lower yields for others" was their justification. I don't know if its true or how accurate and prevalent, but just sharing what I've heard from what's helped other people.

anyone know when the seat deposits are due for HLS?

May 1st if I'm not mistaken.

Applied early October, Held Early December. It is now almost April. every day waiting for this day maybe this day I will get a KB/JS/BBY1

goducks01 wrote:I’m (miraculously) in at Harvard, planning to do PI, possibly after a clerkship. However, I am seriously considering CLS and NYU (with no $$ offers yet at either) for one reason- Comparatively, HLS’ LRAP seems to be rather terrible for PI peeps. It’s definitely more flexible, but since I’m certain I want to do PI, I would end up paying a lot more of under LIPP as long as I make more than $45k.

On the other hand, I also hope to go into academia after 10-15 yrs in PI, and Harvard is definitely better for clerkships/professorships. Thoughts and help are much appreciated.

I'm in the same boat. LIPP is wonderful but it sort of punishes the folks who will do PI for 10+ years.

In a hypothetical world where you and your twin make $70k each year in PI (ridiculous, I know), your twin who is enrolled in Chicago's or GULC's LRAP will have never paid a dime, while with your LIPP benefit you will pay ~90k over the course of 10 years.

That said flexibility really cannot be overrated. None of us knows what will befall us over the next 13 years, and here's hoping the terms of LIPP get more generous. When was the last time it was updated, anyway?

OP -- do you know if there is a clerkship benefit to LIPP over other t14 LRAPs?

bogm2012 wrote:

goducks01 wrote:I’m (miraculously) in at Harvard, planning to do PI, possibly after a clerkship. However, I am seriously considering CLS and NYU (with no $$ offers yet at either) for one reason- Comparatively, HLS’ LRAP seems to be rather terrible for PI peeps. It’s definitely more flexible, but since I’m certain I want to do PI, I would end up paying a lot more of under LIPP as long as I make more than $45k.

On the other hand, I also hope to go into academia after 10-15 yrs in PI, and Harvard is definitely better for clerkships/professorships. Thoughts and help are much appreciated.

I'm in the same boat. LIPP is wonderful but it sort of punishes the folks who will do PI for 10+ years.

In a hypothetical world where you and your twin make $70k each year in PI (ridiculous, I know), your twin who is enrolled in Chicago's or GULC's LRAP will have never paid a dime, while with your LIPP benefit you will pay ~90k over the course of 10 years.

That said flexibility really cannot be overrated. None of us knows what will befall us over the next 13 years, and here's hoping the terms of LIPP get more generous. When was the last time it was updated, anyway?

OP -- do you know if there is a clerkship benefit to LIPP over other t14 LRAPs?

I am in the same boat as well. I really wish LIPP was more generous. For me, however, the flexibility is a plus as it allows you to work in any non-profit (not just a legal job). But having to make payments starting at $45k is extremely frustrating, if you ask me. On top of that, they average your income with your spouse's income, so if your spouse makes 100k and you make only 50k, you have to pay up as if your salary was 70k.

Lol at people worrying about spousal income. Good thing I'm forever alone.

soj wrote:Lol at people worrying about spousal income. Good thing I'm forever alone.

Haha, I hear that! Also love your Tar Soj. Loved that show.

fingerscrossedxx wrote:

soj wrote:Lol at people worrying about spousal income. Good thing I'm forever alone.

Haha, I hear that! Also love your Tar Soj. Loved that show.

I just watched the whole series in 10 days. Have you heard Matthew Rhys talk in real life? SWOOOON.

soj wrote:

fingerscrossedxx wrote:

soj wrote:Lol at people worrying about spousal income. Good thing I'm forever alone.

Haha, I hear that! Also love your Tar Soj. Loved that show.

I just watched the whole series in 10 days. Have you heard Matthew Rhys talk in real life? SWOOOON.

OH my I never had, just youtubed it tho and I'm pretty sure I'm dead. WHOA.

Also, talk about derailing the Harvard thread :p

Does anyone feel like their phone interview didn't go well? Or that they "bombed" it. I am sure everyone that is selected is competent enough for the few minute chat. Anyone have any insight on how people don't make it passed the the phone interview?

Dancers4eva wrote:I am sure everyone that is selected is competent enough for the few minute chat.

Disagree. I have met a surprising amount of people at T6 ASW's who have shockingly poor social skills. Despite warnings, on the whole I've found the attendees normal, friendly and fun. However there is a small group who would stand out at an MIT Ph.D orientation for their awkwardness.

But this is more of a general rant than a specific answer to your question. I think the majority of people tend to overly criticize their performance (there are literally dozens of people who thought they shit the bed on their KB/JS1, then got in). If you feel that you bombed it and you're not a particularly histrionic person, then it may be true. But if you think it was just OK or that you messed one little thing up then it probably didn't help or hurt you.

Remember the conventional, almost Calvinist wisdom: if they want you, there's almost nothing you can say that will change their minds; if they never wanted you, but just needed to make sure you weren't the next Louis Brandeis, then there was really nothing you could say to make them accept you.

Dancers4eva wrote:Does anyone feel like their phone interview didn't go well? Or that they "bombed" it. I am sure everyone that is selected is competent enough for the few minute chat. Anyone have any insight on how people don't make it passed the the phone interview?

Sweet Jesus. Lord help us if this is another HLS admit.

AtticusJimbo wrote:

Dancers4eva wrote:Does anyone feel like their phone interview didn't go well? Or that they "bombed" it. I am sure everyone that is selected is competent enough for the few minute chat. Anyone have any insight on how people don't make it passed the the phone interview?

Sweet Jesus. Lord help us if this is another HLS admit.

ughhh

Dancers4eva wrote:Does anyone feel like their phone interview didn't go well? Or that they "bombed" it. I am sure everyone that is selected is competent enough for the few minute chat. Anyone have any insight on how people don't make it passed the the phone interview?

Fwiw, I thought my interview went well, but didn't get a JS/KB2 call. I know several others in the same position. And then, like bogm2012 said, there are people who think their interviews didn't go well but did get the JS/KB2. So you probably shouldn't read too much into it either way.

I do think that it's possible for one to bomb their interview / be denied or waitlisted based on a terrible interview. However, I feel like it's usually the case that the reason(s) for not being accepted have nothing to do with your interview.

We found love in a hopeless place...
We found love in a hopeless placeeee...
We found love in a hopeless place......

Joining the hold club. Given the large number of holds, I'm hesitant to read much into the status. Any TLS wisdom on this issue?

KB2! (or whatever we're calling it now)

This was nine days after my JS1. By that point I'd gone through the hope>despair>moving on stages and was enjoying myself at the CLS ASW (which was really enjoyable, by the way). Hooray!

I was just admitted so I don’t have any info on ASW or my login for the Admitted Students Site. Can someone post the full April 14-16 ASW schedule please? Also, how does the travel stipend work- do you have to apply or is it guaranteed? And do you have to attend all 3 days to get the stipend (I might have to miss the first day).

Much appreciated.

goducks01 wrote:I was just admitted so I don’t have any info on ASW or my login for the Admitted Students Site. Can someone post the full April 14-16 ASW schedule please? Also, how does the travel stipend work- do you have to apply or is it guaranteed? And do you have to attend all 3 days to get the stipend (I might have to miss the first day).

Much appreciated.

MAJOR CONGRATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Currently at the cls asw and I think I just figured out ur identity abba12 =P

Congrats! And abba? Really?

bogm2012 wrote:

goducks01 wrote:I’m (miraculously) in at Harvard, planning to do PI, possibly after a clerkship. However, I am seriously considering CLS and NYU (with no $$ offers yet at either) for one reason- Comparatively, HLS’ LRAP seems to be rather terrible for PI peeps. It’s definitely more flexible, but since I’m certain I want to do PI, I would end up paying a lot more of under LIPP as long as I make more than $45k.

On the other hand, I also hope to go into academia after 10-15 yrs in PI, and Harvard is definitely better for clerkships/professorships. Thoughts and help are much appreciated.

OP -- do you know if there is a clerkship benefit to LIPP over other t14 LRAPs?

From what I understand, not really. If you do PI (or any other qualifying LIPP employment) after clerking, they end up covering you for your clerk year(s), but I think all the better LRAP's do that.

freestallion wrote:I am in the same boat as well. I really wish LIPP was more generous. For me, however, the flexibility is a plus as it allows you to work in any non-profit (not just a legal job). But having to make payments starting at $45k is extremely frustrating, if you ask me. On top of that, they average your income with your spouse's income, so if your spouse makes 100k and you make only 50k, you have to pay up as if your salary was 70k.

Flexibility is definitely a plus. On the minus side, they canned the Public Service Initiative (free 3rd yr tuition for commiting to 5 yrs of PI work) and replaced it with the Public Service Venture Fund. Can anyone explain/understand how this fund would help a PI grad who doesn't start their own non-profit?

http://www.law.harvard.edu/news/2010/02 ... .fund.html

On top of that, they average your income with your spouse's income, so if your spouse makes 100k and you make only 50k, you have to pay up as if your salary was 70k.

How is that different from any other LRAP? I thought it was actually a good thing to consider it 70 instead of 150. After all, you're married.

Also, if you are 100% sure you are going to do public interest for 10 years, you don't need any of these programs. You can just do the government IBR and forgiveness after 10 years.

As far as I'm concerned, the flexibility can't be beat. I've been told that you can't know if you'll really want to be a lawyer until you do law school. HLS and Yale are the only schools with LRAPs that allow you to actually step outside of law if you want to.

For me, I'd much rather have that capability than to get the benefit of saving a little bit more of my 40-60K salary. It doesn't seem like they really ask you for that much--doubt it would make a real difference. It's also based on how much you have in debt. I guess it adds up over time, but again, you could just do IBR if you are set on 10 years.

LIPP actually pays back the loan--it doesn't FORCE you into IBR like so many others do. But yeah, if you are set on 10 years, you could choose to go on IBR. I'm guessing LIPP would be 100% fine with you doing that. LIPP would then cover those payments (which are going to be a fraction of what LIPP would have covered otherwise). The problem with this, of course, is if you end up not doing PI for the 10 years. Then you've made a huge mistake.

And that's sort of what it comes down to. Given the economy and other factors, it's hard to know you'll be doing PI for 10 years (what if you want to stay but get laid off?).

EDIT: Looks like the worst part of LIPP is in factoring in assets (Stanford won't touch anything under 130K), but the whole spousal thing seems to be pretty common across the board.

goducks01 wrote: Flexibility is definitely a plus. On the minus side, they canned the Public Service Initiative (free 3rd yr tuition for commiting to 5 yrs of PI work) and replaced it with the Public Service Venture Fund. Can anyone explain/understand how this fund would help a PI grad who doesn't start their own non-profit?

http://www.law.harvard.edu/news/2010/02 ... .fund.html

At the public service panel during the March ASW, they said that you'll be able to get money to support a self-created fellowship (basically, you get to say to your dream organization, hey, I can work for you full-time for a year for free!). So, I think, sort of like an EJW or Skadden, but exclusive to HLS grads. Apparently they're in the final stages of getting it up and running, but I think they said it'd start being available next year (so, for those graduating in 2013 and after).

As a caveat, Alexa Shabecoff (their head of public interest advising) emphasized that people would need to have a solid plan and demonstrate a clear path to the proposed fellowship - you should be able to point to some relevant experience or demonstrated interest related to the organization you want to work for (class/internship/job etc). She said some people are/will be rejected because their proposals don't seem to be well thought-out or relevant in that sense (like they sort of say, hey, I've never done immigration law before, so I want to try that out). But otherwise, it sounded like it wasn't intended to be overly competitive.