Debunking the auto-reject theory

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geoduck
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby geoduck » Fri May 06, 2011 5:44 pm

ProfitsProphets wrote:While many of you "bright, articulate future lawyers of America," who parade around with your lofty goals and stellar grades, I don't think you realize how childish and immature your responses are to me. Apparently, having a strong GPA and amazing LSAT does nothing for your character flaws and lack of real life experience. I imagine most of you are barely older than my daughter, yet still function in society closely resembling a toddler's reaction.

Keep laughing while I continue to patiently await my decision.


Hi there. I've been working for the last three years and managed to find time to study for the LSAT. I guess it must be harder when you're unemployed.

TheOcho
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby TheOcho » Fri May 06, 2011 5:52 pm

geoduck wrote:
ProfitsProphets wrote:While many of you "bright, articulate future lawyers of America," who parade around with your lofty goals and stellar grades, I don't think you realize how childish and immature your responses are to me. Apparently, having a strong GPA and amazing LSAT does nothing for your character flaws and lack of real life experience. I imagine most of you are barely older than my daughter, yet still function in society closely resembling a toddler's reaction.

Keep laughing while I continue to patiently await my decision.


Hi there. I've been working for the last three years and managed to find time to study for the LSAT. I guess it must be harder when you're unemployed.


+1

Let me translate his post:

You think yer smarter than me with yer book-learnin'?

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law4vus
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby law4vus » Fri May 06, 2011 6:01 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:
ProfitsProphets wrote:While many of you "bright, articulate future lawyers of America," who parade around with your lofty goals and stellar grades, I don't think you realize how childish and immature your responses are to me. Apparently, having a strong GPA and amazing LSAT does nothing for your character flaws and lack of real life experience. I imagine most of you are barely older than my daughter, yet still function in society closely resembling a toddler's reaction.

Keep laughing while I continue to patiently await my decision.


At least we can score better than a chimpanzee with a pencil.


:shock:

Seriously guys, the thread was poorly advised but this is ridiculous.

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geoduck
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby geoduck » Fri May 06, 2011 6:05 pm

law4vus wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:
ProfitsProphets wrote:While many of you "bright, articulate future lawyers of America," who parade around with your lofty goals and stellar grades, I don't think you realize how childish and immature your responses are to me. Apparently, having a strong GPA and amazing LSAT does nothing for your character flaws and lack of real life experience. I imagine most of you are barely older than my daughter, yet still function in society closely resembling a toddler's reaction.

Keep laughing while I continue to patiently await my decision.


At least we can score better than a chimpanzee with a pencil.


:shock:

Seriously guys, the thread was poorly advised but this is ridiculous.


That one is certainly uncalled for. Possible racist connotations aside, we've already vaguely proved that random guessing can't really break 130. I think you have to get what... 25% right to get a 136? 20%? Something in that neighborhood.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby whymeohgodno » Fri May 06, 2011 6:10 pm

geoduck wrote:
law4vus wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:
ProfitsProphets wrote:While many of you "bright, articulate future lawyers of America," who parade around with your lofty goals and stellar grades, I don't think you realize how childish and immature your responses are to me. Apparently, having a strong GPA and amazing LSAT does nothing for your character flaws and lack of real life experience. I imagine most of you are barely older than my daughter, yet still function in society closely resembling a toddler's reaction.

Keep laughing while I continue to patiently await my decision.


At least we can score better than a chimpanzee with a pencil.


:shock:

Seriously guys, the thread was poorly advised but this is ridiculous.


That one is certainly uncalled for. Possible racist connotations aside, we've already vaguely proved that random guessing can't really break 130. I think you have to get what... 25% right to get a 136? 20%? Something in that neighborhood.


LOL. I only used a chimpanzee because it's the first animal that came to mind that can grip a pencil. Stop being so overly sensitive.

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geoduck
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby geoduck » Fri May 06, 2011 6:18 pm

TheOcho wrote:
geoduck wrote:
ProfitsProphets wrote:While many of you "bright, articulate future lawyers of America," who parade around with your lofty goals and stellar grades, I don't think you realize how childish and immature your responses are to me. Apparently, having a strong GPA and amazing LSAT does nothing for your character flaws and lack of real life experience. I imagine most of you are barely older than my daughter, yet still function in society closely resembling a toddler's reaction.

Keep laughing while I continue to patiently await my decision.


Hi there. I've been working for the last three years and managed to find time to study for the LSAT. I guess it must be harder when you're unemployed.


+1

Let me translate his post:

You think yer smarter than me with yer book-learnin'?


Seriously, if he completely skipped all of the LG section and just did the stuff requiring reason and reading comprehension, he still would've broken into the 150s. I'm sorry OP that we're being so harsh, but the legal system's currently in trouble in part because far too many lawyers are being pumped out there. When you have people scoring in the top 5% of the country not being able to get work after school, it seems ridiculous for people in the bottom 30% of the country to expect all too much.

I'm especially having trouble respecting OP because of the fact that he has a 15 year old daughter and is ready to take on ridiculous debt in order to go to law school to get a meager chance to graduate with a job that will do anything to help pay off his school loans while supporting his family. When I took the test, I decided ahead of time that if I didn't score well enough to get merit aid and acceptance to a school that would give me work opportunities upon graduation, I wouldn't put my wife through the pain of my quitting my job and burying us in debt. I know the job market sucks right now and that SF is an expensive place to live, but hiding in academic pursuit is not even close to the best option for someone with a family.

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geoduck
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby geoduck » Fri May 06, 2011 6:19 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:LOL. I only used a chimpanzee because it's the first animal that came to mind that can grip a pencil. Stop being so overly sensitive.


I said possible. No way of knowing for sure on the internetz. And I figured my weak evidence of the inability of random guessing to beat OP's score would show that I wasn't being very serious.

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PinkCow
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby PinkCow » Fri May 06, 2011 6:22 pm

A 137 is about 8th percentile, which is about 33% correct. Assuming roughly equal probabilities of a-e, pure guessing gives you an expected value of about 20% correct, or about a 125 (demonstrated earlier). So, OP answered about 13 more questions right than the average random algorithm. While certainly awful, at least he didn't do WORSE than guessing.


Also,

--ImageRemoved--

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northwood
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby northwood » Fri May 06, 2011 6:23 pm

shocked that this thread hasnt been locked yet


op study till october then try again. only take the test when you have prepped enough.

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Kabuo
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby Kabuo » Fri May 06, 2011 6:26 pm

I was shocked and relieved that he didn't get the splitters application thread locked when he basically took over 4 pages there about the SAME thing when he thought he was a splitter.

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romothesavior
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby romothesavior » Fri May 06, 2011 6:35 pm

136!?!? Sweet Mary and Joseph... I think I could have gotten better than that if I took a nap through the first three sections and only tried after the break. It would be a sad day for the entire profession if someone with a 136 could get into law school (not that the profession's entry standards aren't already pathetic). Glad to hear OP is going to re-take.

And +1 to geoduck. Taking out huge debt to go to a law school which offers poor job prospects when you have a child to support is a really horrible idea.

And this thread is silly willy. Debunking the auto-reject theory?

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Kabuo
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby Kabuo » Fri May 06, 2011 6:37 pm

If I remember correctly, you almost certainly did score better than a 136 just counting your last 2 sections. You'd only have had to answer 2/3 of the questions right for the last 2 sections, while not even filling out the first 2.

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romothesavior
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby romothesavior » Fri May 06, 2011 6:43 pm

OP, if you can afford it, I'd recommend taking an LSAT class. Classes aren't right for everyone, but they are especially helpful for low-scorers. I have a friend who scored in the 140 range the first time and was able to improve 15 or so points. 150s is still not a great score, but he was able to go to a decent, cheap local T3, so maybe it will work out for him. With your URM status, a score in the 150s would give you some okay (albeit still not very good) options.

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dr123
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby dr123 » Fri May 06, 2011 7:00 pm

beachbum wrote:
Come back when you get a decision.


Seriously WTF? No decision isn't any sort of victory duder

bellamy
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby bellamy » Fri May 06, 2011 7:03 pm

Eponymous wrote:exceptio regulam probat.

Nice. The classics live on.

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Stringer Bell
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby Stringer Bell » Fri May 06, 2011 7:09 pm

dr123 wrote:
beachbum wrote:
Come back when you get a decision.


Seriously WTF? No decision isn't any sort of victory duder


Seriously, the point made in this thread is somewhat comparable to a guy going out to a bar, talking about hitting on a hot chick, his friends telling him that he can't get a date with her, him asking her for a phone number, then getting a number and calling "scoreboard" on everybody before actually calling and making sure it was legit.

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dr123
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby dr123 » Fri May 06, 2011 7:12 pm

northwood wrote:shocked that this thread hasnt been locked yet


op study till october then try again. only take the test when you have prepped enough.


On a more constructive note, I'd say to aim for December or February, if you're at a 137 right now. The more your score goes up the harder it is to improve. Personally I started at 145 diag and I am now consistently getting around 160 and the amount of time it took me to improve from 155 to 160 was considerably longer than 145 to 155.

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Kabuo
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby Kabuo » Fri May 06, 2011 7:15 pm

Stringer Bell wrote:
dr123 wrote:
beachbum wrote:
Come back when you get a decision.


Seriously WTF? No decision isn't any sort of victory duder


Seriously, the point made in this thread is somewhat comparable to a guy going out to a bar, talking about hitting on a hot chick, his friends telling him that he can't get a date with her, him asking her for a phone number, then getting a number and calling "scoreboard" on everybody before actually calling and making sure it was legit.


I think it would be more like the guy turning around calling "scoreboard" if she didn't immediately turn around and ignore him. Not sure OP has gotten a fake number.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby whymeohgodno » Fri May 06, 2011 7:16 pm

dr123 wrote:
northwood wrote:shocked that this thread hasnt been locked yet


op study till october then try again. only take the test when you have prepped enough.


On a more constructive note, I'd say to aim for December or February, if you're at a 137 right now. The more your score goes up the harder it is to improve. Personally I started at 145 diag and I am now consistently getting around 160 and the amount of time it took me to improve from 155 to 160 was considerably longer than 145 to 155.


I'd take October at the latest. Prepping for 3 months should be more than enough...and December/Feb is just too late. Also you want to give yourself time to retake if something goes wrong.

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northwood
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby northwood » Fri May 06, 2011 9:23 pm

Op if you start prepping now for October- you should have enough time to get ready for the test. If your personal situtation wont allow it- then aim for October, and keep December ready as a back up- and be prepared and willing to wait until the fall of 2012 to apply. ( worst case scenario is you arent ready by october- decide to postpone unitl december and use feb or june of 2012 as your back up). Once you get the foundations and start fine tuning your section pacing - you should see a solid score increase. However, like a poster before me said- the higher your scaled score- the more work you have to do to increase your scaled score- so be prepared to put in a lot of work and not see a huge gain. While 3-4 months of solid prep may do the trick, if you are not happy with where you are- then you may need to spend more time. That being said- I personally believe that everyone has a maximum score they can get- be it a 152- 164 or in the 170s. There may come a time where you will hit that score- and after a lot more work not see a gain- so be prepared for that as well, and be willing to respond to that situtation, whatever it may be.


best of luck- use this website as there are tons of good study guides, tips, and helpful posters who will help you.

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Lawquacious
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby Lawquacious » Fri May 06, 2011 9:42 pm

I've tried to lay off because I think OP may be for real, but at the same time I really hope this thread is a flame.. And yet that would make me uneasy as well, because it would mean that whoever is behind 'red_altertz' isn't the only fully-dedicated elaborate (i.e. hundreds of posts) TLS flamer... But then maybe red_altertz is for real....

ARRRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHH
:?

In any case OP, good luck with your retake, and let us know if you do happen to make it into Hastings with your 136. I imagine there are plenty of people on here who would be happy to give you congrats if it happens.

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tea_drinker
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby tea_drinker » Fri May 06, 2011 9:52 pm

I don't know how this thread can go up to 4 pages.

OP: even if you are accepted into Hastings with your LSAT, you still cannot reject the auto-deny theory because you are only one applicant and you only apply to one school with a special admission program.


Lawquacious wrote:
In any case OP, good luck with your retake, and let us know if you do happen to make it into Hastings with your 136. I imagine there are plenty of people on here who would be happy to give you congrats if it happens.

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ProfitsProphets
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby ProfitsProphets » Wed May 11, 2011 4:35 am

Thank you to the posters who turned this thread back to a positive note. I was actually contacted via email notifying me of a WL. However, with much consideration and thought, I declined the offer (W my app), so that I can give myself a fair chance at retaking the LSAT. I did myself a disservice scoring as bad as I did. Whether or not I actually got off the WL doesn't matter. What matters is I WANT to retake, score better, and put myself in position to earn scholarships.

All the negative feedback, references to guessing, chimps, etc., only highlights the problems in our society: one group of people think they are smarter than another group, basically Eugenics (go ahead, look it up for those who haven't a clue). But more importantly, we are slowly etching toward equality, special app or not.

My Soc background taught me a lot about American society, the inherent racism and discrimination that plagues this great nation, and I discovered how we got to this point: Redlining (go ahead clueless, look that up too). So please, stop referring to URMs, the surrounding area of schools like Hastings as ghetto. There's a specific reason why us minorities come from disadvantaged backgrounds, while the affluent (ORMs, dare I say white) enjoy the spoils of proper rearing, resources, safe neighborhoods, and turn out to excel in academia and the labor force. But don't throw it in our faces with your ignorance, or shrug things off like it's no big deal.

Brush up on your history, particularly American history, before you spout off with such hurtful, ignorant statements.

God willing, we are breaking down barriers, like the LSAT.

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Ty Webb
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby Ty Webb » Wed May 11, 2011 4:46 am

ProfitsProphets wrote:Thank you to the posters who turned this thread back to a positive note. I was actually contacted via email notifying me of a WL. However, with much consideration and thought, I declined the offer (W my app), so that I can give myself a fair chance at retaking the LSAT. I did myself a disservice scoring as bad as I did. Whether or not I actually got off the WL doesn't matter. What matters is I WANT to retake, score better, and put myself in position to earn scholarships.

All the negative feedback, references to guessing, chimps, etc., only highlights the problems in our society: one group of people think they are smarter than another group, basically Eugenics (go ahead, look it up for those who haven't a clue). But more importantly, we are slowly etching toward equality, special app or not.

My Soc background taught me a lot about American society, the inherent racism and discrimination that plagues this great nation, and I discovered how we got to this point: Redlining (go ahead clueless, look that up too). So please, stop referring to URMs, the surrounding area of schools like Hastings as ghetto. There's a specific reason why us minorities come from disadvantaged backgrounds, while the affluent (ORMs, dare I say white) enjoy the spoils of proper rearing, resources, safe neighborhoods, and turn out to excel in academia and the labor force. But don't throw it in our faces with your ignorance, or shrug things off like it's no big deal.

Brush up on your history, particularly American history, before you spout off with such hurtful, ignorant statements.

God willing, we are breaking down barriers, like the LSAT.


I think the "groups" that you are referring to here are smart people and not smart people.

HTH.

OP - half of the people in my state (white and black) have more toes than teeth and the education system is as shitty as any inner city. I qualified for a LSAC fee waiver (hard as shit to get). Don't make excuses for yourself and you'll be in a better place.

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Kabuo
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Re: Debunking the auto-reject theory

Postby Kabuo » Wed May 11, 2011 5:46 am

Ty Webb wrote:
I think the "groups" that you are referring to here are smart people and not smart people.



Yeah, I didn't think anyone actually thought everyone was equally smart.




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