mrwarre85 wrote:hmm yeah I guess like how big is the class and will all the other kids in there have junk GPA's like myself? confused on whether this was a probationary status program or not.. Also whats the curve at OU and will this class be curved any different becuase it is meant to be a confidence booster (according to phone call) for those that are enrolled? I want to try for high grades and hope we wouldn't all get B's in this class.. (from the guy who made C's in undergrad).
But it sounds great because i'd like to get started this summer and getting five credits out of the way sounds nice.
Full disclaimer: First, I did NOT enter through the EAP program. Second, the following is based on what I've heard from other students who did go through the program, and observed on my own. Please take the anecdotal information for what it is: anecdotal information. Like everything regarding law school (and life?), do your own research and make an informed decision.
First, I'd like to give a shout out to any admissions committee/admissions staff members who might be reading this. Feel free to jump in and fix any incorrect information. This forum works best with input and participation from both sides to increase the accuracy and transparency of the admissions process. Link to the official information from OU on the EAP programClass size.
It varies. A couple years ago it was around 15; last year almost 30 started.It is not a "probationary status program,"
as you are not required to do anything specific during the summer to continue during the fall. However, the LSAT/GPAs from EAP kids are not reported for rankings purposes. Also, you are limited to taking two courses: one has a reputation for being a joke, the other is a legitimate full-fledged criminal law course, taught the last several years by one of the best professors at OU (very much not a joke).Who do they offer the program to?
My understanding is that the program offers three recruiting tools: an early entry program for students who want to start in May as opposed to August (similar to Baylor, but without some important aspects); a way to bring in students who could not otherwise make the cut (see below); and (Full disclosure again: this third one is just my personal plug for the program, not sure if the school actually uses this) a relatively low risk option for those who want to test law school out and not be locked into an entire year of classes.Curve.
The long and short of it is that there is no established curve at OU. This evidently causes problems every year, as it apparently creates disparities among section representation in class rank. For instance, last year, there were four sections of ~50 students. Of the top 10 people overall in the class, my section represented as few as 3, or as many as 6, depending on whose word you took. Since we're not supposed to talk about grades, and since curves are not published, it's useless to argue. Either way, it led to some (not atypical) bickering from sections whose professors allegedly graded on a harder curve. Not sure what to make of it, but that's the word on the street.
Next, a caveat. I took your comment specifically about getting Bs v. Cs to mean that you would be gunning for As in law school. While this is a laudable goal, it's a bit of a laughable one, also. The cutoff for making the Dean's List at OU is a B average. Last year's Fall Dean's List encompassed ~37% of the class. Translation: A- average puts you in about the top 5-7% of the class. That's tough to do, and as the Transfer Forum will tell you, not something you should plan on when making a law school admissions decision.
As for the EAP curve, the professor who taught the course last the couple years applied a pretty lenient curve, IIRC. Keep in mind, though, that your competition in the EAP program is allegedly less intense. My understanding is that most EAP students are usually splitters, reverse splitters, or borderline candidates for admission, though I don't think the school publishes that information. This can translate into a rude awakening when your competition increases during the fall and your grades reflect that.Overall EAP stuff.
The school will be quick to tell you several things about the program. First, they love it. The perception among at least some of the professors is that the EAP provides admission for students who would not otherwise have had the opportunity to go to OU. Depending on what you think personally about increasing access to legal education (a topic well-covered on this forum a million times over), this is either a very good thing, or a very bad thing.
Second, the school points out that you find EAP students at all points on the curve after first year grading is done. I'm sure this is technically true; as they would seemingly have no reason to lie about it. However, I am aware of only a limited number of EAP students on the dean's list from my 1L year. None in the top 10 students overall were EAP, to my recollection. No EAP students AmJur-ed (top score) a class during 1L year, that I know of. Also, I don't remember seeing many EAP kids interview on campus. Again, just observations, no hard facts to back them up (other than the dean's list bit, which is published here
Finally, the only real negative stigma for EAP kids among fall matriculants is that EAP students have one fewer class/exam in the spring, since they take one additional class/exam the summer before. I personally think this is petty, but some students think this "makes it easier" for EAP students during the spring semester when everyone is doing graded LRW, brief-writing, moot court, classes, trying to find a summer internship, etc. Like I said in the previous paragraph, the unofficial anecdotal numbers don't seem to back up any significant advantage, but it's there nonetheless.
If anyone has more specific questions about the program, feel free to fire away or PM me and I'll do my best and/or try to find someone willing to answer them who actually went through the program.