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Any WL movement? Hope is slowly dying for me...tell me I'm not the only one...

Will be withdrawing later today. Best of luck to you WL peeps and those requesting more scholly funds.

MalachiConstant wrote:Will be withdrawing later today. Best of luck to you WL peeps and those requesting more scholly funds.

Where ya heading if you dont mind me askin'?

Just got off Hastings WL yesterday. I love LA but the family ties in the bay area are too strong of a pull. Plus the grant money is making up for the loss of Loyola's nice merit scholy.

Congrats man! thats awesome...now give me your damn spot lol.

hey guys, applying this year with a 158/3.6, lots of WE and strong softs. According to LSN, i'll be most likely waitlisted (since there was one 3.7/158 who got in last year). Say if waitlist it is, what is the longest someone can stay on it (at Loyola specifically) from your collective experiences? In other words, when do you withdraw, if at all? Thanks in advance

99.9luft wrote:hey guys, applying this year with a 158/3.6, lots of WE and strong softs. According to LSN, i'll be most likely waitlisted (since there was one 3.7/158 who got in last year). Say if waitlist it is, what is the longest someone can stay on it (at Loyola specifically) from your collective experiences? In other words, when do you withdraw, if at all? Thanks in advance

IIRC, at least one person got in off the waitlist last week. So I guess some people don't withdraw because they can be admitted on the later side.

99.9luft wrote:hey guys, applying this year with a 158/3.6, lots of WE and strong softs. According to LSN, i'll be most likely waitlisted (since there was one 3.7/158 who got in last year). Say if waitlist it is, what is the longest someone can stay on it (at Loyola specifically) from your collective experiences? In other words, when do you withdraw, if at all? Thanks in advance

Did you retake?

Danteshek wrote:

99.9luft wrote:hey guys, applying this year with a 158/3.6, lots of WE and strong softs. According to LSN, i'll be most likely waitlisted (since there was one 3.7/158 who got in last year). Say if waitlist it is, what is the longest someone can stay on it (at Loyola specifically) from your collective experiences? In other words, when do you withdraw, if at all? Thanks in advance

Did you retake?

I know retaking the LSAT wasn't part of your question(s), but if you have the time/energy/motivation to retake, it might be worthwhile for you to consider. If you do even a little better (meaning, crack the 160s), you'll definitely be in at LLS. Also, with your GPA, if you get enough of an increase you'll have a shot at even higher-ranked schools. I assume you know all this already though if you have been browsing this cycle's results on LSN.

Judge Philip Banks wrote:

Danteshek wrote:

99.9luft wrote:hey guys, applying this year with a 158/3.6, lots of WE and strong softs. According to LSN, i'll be most likely waitlisted (since there was one 3.7/158 who got in last year). Say if waitlist it is, what is the longest someone can stay on it (at Loyola specifically) from your collective experiences? In other words, when do you withdraw, if at all? Thanks in advance

Did you retake?

I know retaking the LSAT wasn't part of your question(s), but if you have the time/energy/motivation to retake, it might be worthwhile for you to consider. If you do even a little better (meaning, crack the 160s), you'll definitely be in at LLS. Also, with your GPA, if you get enough of an increase you'll have a shot at even higher-ranked schools.

It's the only question worth asking of this person. There was an interesting article on ATL the other day about the delusion of personal exceptionalism.
http://abovethelaw.com/2011/08/inside-s ... tionalism/
Those numbers are perfect for Southwestern's day program.

I think with that strong GPA you would do yourself a huge favor by retaking the LSAT. If you are counting on getting in off the waitlist in literally a year plus 2 weeks from now, that's PLENTY of time to make a huge change in your application by getting a higher score.

david, Judge Philip Banks, and danteshek,

thanks for your responses. Yes, I have retaken and yes I will retake (but only in the June of 2012 as I maxed out on attempts and was denied the 4th attempt). Basically, if i score 165+ in June of 2012, I will withdraw from the loyola waitlist and re-apply to higher-ranked schools next fall. But, if god forbid, i score in the same 158-162 range again, I'd rather stay on the loyola waitlist to hope to be admitted in time for fall 2012 school year. I hope that makes sense. So in asking my question i was hoping to know if strong softs and 4+ years of work experience is strong enough to get me off the waitlist (and when that would happen - before i find out my june 2012 score or closer to Sept.).

speedyj88 wrote:

Hannibal wrote:

speedyj88 wrote:

jamiLAW wrote:In via snail mail!! Post-marked 12/21 (I live in LA lol)

Scholarship info included...$90000 here!!

Congrats!

Just got my letter, as well. $69,000 scholarship.

+1 to the acceptance, 69k

Are both of your scholarships contingent on top 30% grade? That seems like bullcrap.

+1, definitely disappointed with that part of it.

I'm wondering, all of you who received your acceptance letters in December, does this mean you guys took the LSAT no later than October? If that's the case, seems like it must really pay off to get applications in early. Congratulations!

99.9luft wrote:david, Judge Philip Banks, and danteshek,

thanks for your responses. Yes, I have retaken and yes I will retake (but only in the June of 2012 as I maxed out on attempts and was denied the 4th attempt). Basically, if i score 165+ in June of 2012, I will withdraw from the loyola waitlist and re-apply to higher-ranked schools next fall. But, if god forbid, i score in the same 158-162 range again, I'd rather stay on the loyola waitlist to hope to be admitted in time for fall 2012 school year. I hope that makes sense. So in asking my question i was hoping to know if strong softs and 4+ years of work experience is strong enough to get me off the waitlist (and when that would happen - before i find out my june 2012 score or closer to Sept.).

Your work experience is a weak soft. It won't affect the decision.

99.9luft wrote:david, Judge Philip Banks, and danteshek,

thanks for your responses. Yes, I have retaken and yes I will retake (but only in the June of 2012 as I maxed out on attempts and was denied the 4th attempt). Basically, if i score 165+ in June of 2012, I will withdraw from the loyola waitlist and re-apply to higher-ranked schools next fall. But, if god forbid, i score in the same 158-162 range again, I'd rather stay on the loyola waitlist to hope to be admitted in time for fall 2012 school year. I hope that makes sense. So in asking my question i was hoping to know if strong softs and 4+ years of work experience is strong enough to get me off the waitlist (and when that would happen - before i find out my june 2012 score or closer to Sept.).

The truth about WLs is that it depends on what they need. If they need to admit more students with 160+ LSAT scores to help their median, then you're just SOL. If their LSAT median looks good and they need to shore up their GPA median, then they might consider you. Softs matter, but only once they're looking past the numbers. If they're at a point where they need to admit some folks with a good GPA, then yes, your 4 years of WE will help you stand out.

When it would get you in off the WL is entirely dependent on when they would need you. They might have fewer people put down seat deposits than expected and need more people right away. They may have someone withdraw a week before classes start and decide to admit someone then. Your strategy doesn't sound that bad, and is better IMO than simply settling for lower-ranked schools that would be even less likely to find you a job.

vanwinkle wrote:

99.9luft wrote:david, Judge Philip Banks, and danteshek,

thanks for your responses. Yes, I have retaken and yes I will retake (but only in the June of 2012 as I maxed out on attempts and was denied the 4th attempt). Basically, if i score 165+ in June of 2012, I will withdraw from the loyola waitlist and re-apply to higher-ranked schools next fall. But, if god forbid, i score in the same 158-162 range again, I'd rather stay on the loyola waitlist to hope to be admitted in time for fall 2012 school year. I hope that makes sense. So in asking my question i was hoping to know if strong softs and 4+ years of work experience is strong enough to get me off the waitlist (and when that would happen - before i find out my june 2012 score or closer to Sept.).

The truth about WLs is that it depends on what they need. If they need to admit more students with 160+ LSAT scores to help their median, then you're just SOL. If their LSAT median looks good and they need to shore up their GPA median, then they might consider you. Softs matter, but only once they're looking past the numbers. If they're at a point where they need to admit some folks with a good GPA, then yes, your 4 years of WE will help you stand out.

When it would get you in off the WL is entirely dependent on when they would need you. They might have fewer people put down seat deposits than expected and need more people right away. They may have someone withdraw a week before classes start and decide to admit someone then. Your strategy doesn't sound that bad, and is better IMO than simply settling for lower-ranked schools that would be even less likely to find you a job.

^What he said. However, one way I could see your work experience giving you a little boost is the fact that most people applying with WE have 1-2 years, whereas you have >4 years. But, on the other hand, you also have to consider that there are going to be some non-traditional applicants who have 5-9 or more years of WE. The nature of your WE might make a difference though. You never know what can happen... You can't change your WE, but the only variable that you have control over at this point is your LSAT score (and app submission timing, PS, and choosing good LOR writers, to varying degrees). I agree with vanwinkle in that your strategy sounds pretty good to me.

GueritaPeloChino wrote: I'm wondering, all of you who received your acceptance letters in December, does this mean you guys took the LSAT no later than October? If that's the case, seems like it must really pay off to get applications in early. Congratulations!

If you received an acceptance letter in December, you applied before Thanksgiving, and in some cases, much earlier than Thanksgiving. So yes, October is the latest LSAT you could take for such a result.

Judge Philip Banks wrote:

vanwinkle wrote:

99.9luft wrote:david, Judge Philip Banks, and danteshek,

thanks for your responses. Yes, I have retaken and yes I will retake (but only in the June of 2012 as I maxed out on attempts and was denied the 4th attempt). Basically, if i score 165+ in June of 2012, I will withdraw from the loyola waitlist and re-apply to higher-ranked schools next fall. But, if god forbid, i score in the same 158-162 range again, I'd rather stay on the loyola waitlist to hope to be admitted in time for fall 2012 school year. I hope that makes sense. So in asking my question i was hoping to know if strong softs and 4+ years of work experience is strong enough to get me off the waitlist (and when that would happen - before i find out my june 2012 score or closer to Sept.).

The truth about WLs is that it depends on what they need. If they need to admit more students with 160+ LSAT scores to help their median, then you're just SOL. If their LSAT median looks good and they need to shore up their GPA median, then they might consider you. Softs matter, but only once they're looking past the numbers. If they're at a point where they need to admit some folks with a good GPA, then yes, your 4 years of WE will help you stand out.

When it would get you in off the WL is entirely dependent on when they would need you. They might have fewer people put down seat deposits than expected and need more people right away. They may have someone withdraw a week before classes start and decide to admit someone then. Your strategy doesn't sound that bad, and is better IMO than simply settling for lower-ranked schools that would be even less likely to find you a job.

^What he said. However, one way I could see your work experience giving you a little boost is the fact that most people applying with WE have 1-2 years, whereas you have >4 years. But, on the other hand, you also have to consider that there are going to be some non-traditional applicants who have 5-9 or more years of WE. The nature of your WE might make a difference though. You never know what can happen... You can't change your WE, but the only variable that you have control over at this point is your LSAT score (and app submission timing, PS, and choosing good LOR writers, to varying degrees). I agree with vanwinkle in that your strategy sounds pretty good to me.

Thank you both. You've reassured me and what Vanwinkle said about them needing more LSAT or GPA at a given point makes sense. If I go the Loyola route, then i'd wanna transfer. i'd love to get the data on transfers out of Loyola - anyone knows where to get that? (i tried TLS but all i found was transfers INTO loyola). Also, is Loyola to t14 feasible or is it less likely than loyola to UCLA law?

99.9luft wrote:

Judge Philip Banks wrote:

vanwinkle wrote:

99.9luft wrote:david, Judge Philip Banks, and danteshek,

thanks for your responses. Yes, I have retaken and yes I will retake (but only in the June of 2012 as I maxed out on attempts and was denied the 4th attempt). Basically, if i score 165+ in June of 2012, I will withdraw from the loyola waitlist and re-apply to higher-ranked schools next fall. But, if god forbid, i score in the same 158-162 range again, I'd rather stay on the loyola waitlist to hope to be admitted in time for fall 2012 school year. I hope that makes sense. So in asking my question i was hoping to know if strong softs and 4+ years of work experience is strong enough to get me off the waitlist (and when that would happen - before i find out my june 2012 score or closer to Sept.).

The truth about WLs is that it depends on what they need. If they need to admit more students with 160+ LSAT scores to help their median, then you're just SOL. If their LSAT median looks good and they need to shore up their GPA median, then they might consider you. Softs matter, but only once they're looking past the numbers. If they're at a point where they need to admit some folks with a good GPA, then yes, your 4 years of WE will help you stand out.

When it would get you in off the WL is entirely dependent on when they would need you. They might have fewer people put down seat deposits than expected and need more people right away. They may have someone withdraw a week before classes start and decide to admit someone then. Your strategy doesn't sound that bad, and is better IMO than simply settling for lower-ranked schools that would be even less likely to find you a job.

^What he said. However, one way I could see your work experience giving you a little boost is the fact that most people applying with WE have 1-2 years, whereas you have >4 years. But, on the other hand, you also have to consider that there are going to be some non-traditional applicants who have 5-9 or more years of WE. The nature of your WE might make a difference though. You never know what can happen... You can't change your WE, but the only variable that you have control over at this point is your LSAT score (and app submission timing, PS, and choosing good LOR writers, to varying degrees). I agree with vanwinkle in that your strategy sounds pretty good to me.

Thank you both. You've reassured me and what Vanwinkle said about them needing more LSAT or GPA at a given point makes sense. If I go the Loyola route, then i'd wanna transfer. i'd love to get the data on transfers out of Loyola - anyone knows where to get that? (i tried TLS but all i found was transfers INTO loyola). Also, is Loyola to t14 feasible or is it less likely than loyola to UCLA law?

You are getting ahead of yourself. You have a 50% chance of being in the bottom half.

99.9luft wrote:Thank you both. You've reassured me and what Vanwinkle said about them needing more LSAT or GPA at a given point makes sense. If I go the Loyola route, then i'd wanna transfer. i'd love to get the data on transfers out of Loyola - anyone knows where to get that? (i tried TLS but all i found was transfers INTO loyola). Also, is Loyola to t14 feasible or is it less likely than loyola to UCLA law?

No. Go directly to "retake". Do not attend Loyola. Do not collect $200.

To even have a chance of transferring from Loyola to T14/UCLA, you'd need to be in the top 10% of your class or better, with emphasis on the "better". That means you have less than 10% odds of being able to, or in other words, more than 90% odds of not being able to. Let me be as clear as possible: Your plan is more than 90% likely to fail.

Your only realistic option for getting into a T14, as a 0L, is retaking the LSAT, getting a 170+, and reapplying. If your plan is based on getting into T14, or even schools just below it like UCLA, then Loyola should not be part of your plan at all.

vanwinkle wrote:

99.9luft wrote:Thank you both. You've reassured me and what Vanwinkle said about them needing more LSAT or GPA at a given point makes sense. If I go the Loyola route, then i'd wanna transfer. i'd love to get the data on transfers out of Loyola - anyone knows where to get that? (i tried TLS but all i found was transfers INTO loyola). Also, is Loyola to t14 feasible or is it less likely than loyola to UCLA law?

No. Go directly to "retake". Do not attend Loyola. Do not collect $200.

To even have a chance of transferring from Loyola to T14/UCLA, you'd need to be in the top 10% of your class or better, with emphasis on the "better". That means you have less than 10% odds of being able to, or in other words, more than 90% odds of not being able to. Let me be as clear as possible: Your plan is more than 90% likely to fail.

Your only realistic option for getting into a T14, as a 0L, is retaking the LSAT, getting a 170+, and reapplying. If your plan is based on getting into T14, or even schools just below it like UCLA, then Loyola should not be part of your plan at all.

Yeah, you're right. Emphasis on the retake. I just wanted to know that even if go to Loyola it won't be the end of the world, but that's wishful thinking apparently - it will be that (in the employment realm at least). Sigh.

If you think Loyola is the end of the world, I strongly suggest you withdraw from the waitlist.

Danteshek wrote:If you think Loyola is the end of the world, I strongly suggest you withdraw from the waitlist.

well, not by itself it is not. I have many friends who graduated from here and some transferred and some stayed and got prestigious jobs. I thought transferring (being in top 10%) is doable and was ready to do it, but looking at it with 90% of certainty of failure (like vanwinkle mentioned) is pretty end-of-the-world-ish, don't you think? This is if i only want LA biglaw litigation.

Anyway, I know i'll bust my ass no matter where i go. Just wanted to be safe knowing that i could be one of those 30-40 ppl who transfer to ucla law every year.

All I can say is that I know people on academic probation (GPA below 2.33) who "busted their asses." I wonder why you think you are so special.

Danteshek wrote:All I can say is that I know people on academic probation (GPA below 2.33) who "busted their asses." I wonder why you think you are so special.

well, not sure how much those ppl really busted their ass that they ended up on ac. probation...I just know that i am not a fresh-out of college bar review enthusiast. I'll be taking LS more seriously than many ppl there (resulting in little socializing and a shitload of studying), esp given the overabundance of advice re LS from friends and family. I guess that's why i feel special

but yes, i understand your general point. Everyone thinks they can and will do well.