U Washington 2011 Applicants Forum

[geoduck]

Has anyone else received scholarship info yet? I'm thinking about calling just because I figure I shouldn't begin [trying] to negotiate for more blindly.

I did. It was insultingly low.

Ouch. Here's hoping I can at least get in-state out of them.

You just might. I gleemed from my conversation with Mr. Le that a large portion of their scholarship money is reserved for first year in-state equivalence scholarships. They generally are just one year awards since there is already a program for years 2-3. No offensive, but I'm not sure how I feel about my tax money being used to subsidize out-of-state attendants instead of being used to offer proper scholarships to high achievers. They should just make it possible to obtain state residency if you are attending graduate school.

I'm also kind of raging on the Gates PSL, to be honest. The only full-ride available from the school is a full-ride plus stipend... and only if you sign up for a 5 year commitment to public service? That's a field in which you can already get your loans forgiven after 10 years and in which you can often get the federal government to subsidize your loan payments for all of those years. They're giving a free ride to people who already qualify for one federally. They're also giving the only free rides to people in the field least likely to give them the funds to be able to donate back to the school after graduating. Public Service is important, but it shouldn't be the only way to get more than a minuscule scholarship from the biggest university in the Pacific Northwest. That's not how you raise your number of placements in the NLJ250 and secure future donors.

[LPSDBX]

Has anyone else received scholarship info yet? I'm thinking about calling just because I figure I shouldn't begin [trying] to negotiate for more blindly.

I did. It was insultingly low.

Ouch. Here's hoping I can at least get in-state out of them.

You just might. I gleemed from my conversation with Mr. Le that a large portion of their scholarship money is reserved for first year in-state equivalence scholarships. They generally are just one year awards since there is already a program for years 2-3. No offensive, but I'm not sure how I feel about my tax money being used to subsidize out-of-state attendants instead of being used to offer proper scholarships to high achievers. They should just make it possible to obtain state residency if you are attending graduate school.

I'm an out-of-stater. I spoke with someone in the financial aid office about becoming a Washington resident; he mentioned nothing about in-state equivalence scholarships. I did, however, read this on UW's financial aid website:

"To be classified or reclassified as residents, for tuition and fee purposes, students must establish a bona fide domicile in the state of Washington primarily for purposes other than education for the period of one year immediately prior to classification as residents.

Nonresident students who are enrolled for more than 6 credits a quarter will be presumed to be in the state of Washington for primarily educational purposes. Such period of enrollment shall not be counted toward the establishment of a bona fide domicile of one year in this state unless the students prove they have, in fact, established a bona fide domicile in this state primarily for purposes other than education."

Considering the low scholarship offer, I'm not sure I'm going to be able to afford UW.

[zonto]

Considering how ridiculous they've seemed during the whole application process, I'm not sure why you'd want to.

[geoduck]

Ouch. Here's hoping I can at least get in-state out of them.

You just might. I gleemed from my conversation with Mr. Le that a large portion of their scholarship money is reserved for first year in-state equivalence scholarships. They generally are just one year awards since there is already a program for years 2-3. No offensive, but I'm not sure how I feel about my tax money being used to subsidize out-of-state attendants instead of being used to offer proper scholarships to high achievers. They should just make it possible to obtain state residency if you are attending graduate school.

I'm an out-of-stater. I spoke with someone in the financial aid office about becoming a Washington resident; he mentioned nothing about in-state equivalence scholarships. I did, however, read this on UW's financial aid website:

"To be classified or reclassified as residents, for tuition and fee purposes, students must establish a bona fide domicile in the state of Washington primarily for purposes other than education for the period of one year immediately prior to classification as residents.

Nonresident students who are enrolled for more than 6 credits a quarter will be presumed to be in the state of Washington for primarily educational purposes. Such period of enrollment shall not be counted toward the establishment of a bona fide domicile of one year in this state unless the students prove they have, in fact, established a bona fide domicile in this state primarily for purposes other than education."

Considering the low scholarship offer, I'm not sure I'm going to be able to afford UW.

In your acceptance packet on page 1 or 2 of their booklet it directly mentions their program for 2L/3L equivalence. It does not make you a state resident, but you pay the same. Mr. Le, the Director of Admissions and Financial Aid, also told me that they give scholarships to out of state 1Ls that last a single year and are equivalent to the difference between out of state and in state tuition. You cannot become a resident while attending school (which I lamented above) but you can easily pay in-state tuition.

[LPSDBX]

Ouch. Here's hoping I can at least get in-state out of them.

You just might. I gleemed from my conversation with Mr. Le that a large portion of their scholarship money is reserved for first year in-state equivalence scholarships. They generally are just one year awards since there is already a program for years 2-3. No offensive, but I'm not sure how I feel about my tax money being used to subsidize out-of-state attendants instead of being used to offer proper scholarships to high achievers. They should just make it possible to obtain state residency if you are attending graduate school.

I'm an out-of-stater. I spoke with someone in the financial aid office about becoming a Washington resident; he mentioned nothing about in-state equivalence scholarships. I did, however, read this on UW's financial aid website:

"To be classified or reclassified as residents, for tuition and fee purposes, students must establish a bona fide domicile in the state of Washington primarily for purposes other than education for the period of one year immediately prior to classification as residents.

Nonresident students who are enrolled for more than 6 credits a quarter will be presumed to be in the state of Washington for primarily educational purposes. Such period of enrollment shall not be counted toward the establishment of a bona fide domicile of one year in this state unless the students prove they have, in fact, established a bona fide domicile in this state primarily for purposes other than education."

Considering the low scholarship offer, I'm not sure I'm going to be able to afford UW.

In your acceptance packet on page 1 or 2 of their booklet it directly mentions their program for 2L/3L equivalence. It does not make you a state resident, but you pay the same. Mr. Le, the Director of Admissions and Financial Aid, also told me that they give scholarships to out of state 1Ls that last a single year and are equivalent to the difference between out of state and in state tuition. You cannot become a resident while attending school (which I lamented above) but you can easily pay in-state tuition.

Thanks for your suggestion, but my parents listed me as a dependent this year, so I'm not eligible for in-state tution in my 2L year. Also, I'd have to give up my health insurance through my mom's work to be eligible, and I would likely have an impossible time finding any sort of reasonably good insurance on my own as I have a prior condition.

A scholarships for OOS 1Ls is something I haven't heard anything about from anyone at UW, but I'll investigate that further.

[geoduck]

Thanks for your suggestion, but my parents listed me as a dependent this year, so I'm not eligible for in-state tution in my 2L year. Also, I'd have to give up my health insurance through my mom's work to be eligible, and I would likely have an impossible time finding any sort of reasonably good insurance on my own as I have a prior condition.

A scholarships for OOS 1Ls is something I haven't heard anything about from anyone at UW, but I'll investigate that further.

Sadly, I was told it was generally just a one year deal. Sounds like UW won't be cost efficient for either of us!

[jppatt16]

You just might. I gleemed from my conversation with Mr. Le that a large portion of their scholarship money is reserved for first year in-state equivalence scholarships. They generally are just one year awards since there is already a program for years 2-3. No offensive, but I'm not sure how I feel about my tax money being used to subsidize out-of-state attendants instead of being used to offer proper scholarships to high achievers. They should just make it possible to obtain state residency if you are attending graduate school.

I'm also kind of raging on the Gates PSL, to be honest. The only full-ride available from the school is a full-ride plus stipend... and only if you sign up for a 5 year commitment to public service? That's a field in which you can already get your loans forgiven after 10 years and in which you can often get the federal government to subsidize your loan payments for all of those years. They're giving a free ride to people who already qualify for one federally. They're also giving the only free rides to people in the field least likely to give them the funds to be able to donate back to the school after graduating. Public Service is important, but it shouldn't be the only way to get more than a minuscule scholarship from the biggest university in the Pacific Northwest. That's not how you raise your number of placements in the NLJ250 and secure future donors.

Agreed on all points, even as an out-of-stater geared toward public interest (well, JAG, but still).

Still nothing in email or postal form...guess I'll call in the morning. How the hell does one even ask about the status of a scholarship application? I've not made any calls about this sort of thing and it seems an exceedingly awkward topic to broach.

[PinkCow]

You just might. I gleemed from my conversation with Mr. Le that a large portion of their scholarship money is reserved for first year in-state equivalence scholarships. They generally are just one year awards since there is already a program for years 2-3. No offensive, but I'm not sure how I feel about my tax money being used to subsidize out-of-state attendants instead of being used to offer proper scholarships to high achievers. They should just make it possible to obtain state residency if you are attending graduate school.

I'm also kind of raging on the Gates PSL, to be honest. The only full-ride available from the school is a full-ride plus stipend... and only if you sign up for a 5 year commitment to public service? That's a field in which you can already get your loans forgiven after 10 years and in which you can often get the federal government to subsidize your loan payments for all of those years. They're giving a free ride to people who already qualify for one federally. They're also giving the only free rides to people in the field least likely to give them the funds to be able to donate back to the school after graduating. Public Service is important, but it shouldn't be the only way to get more than a minuscule scholarship from the biggest university in the Pacific Northwest. That's not how you raise your number of placements in the NLJ250 and secure future donors.

Agreed on all points, even as an out-of-stater geared toward public interest (well, JAG, but still).

Still nothing in email or postal form...guess I'll call in the morning. How the hell does one even ask about the status of a scholarship application? I've not made any calls about this sort of thing and it seems an exceedingly awkward topic to broach.

This seems appropriate for UW.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAqJHpBmPjE

[geoduck]

You just might. I gleemed from my conversation with Mr. Le that a large portion of their scholarship money is reserved for first year in-state equivalence scholarships. They generally are just one year awards since there is already a program for years 2-3. No offensive, but I'm not sure how I feel about my tax money being used to subsidize out-of-state attendants instead of being used to offer proper scholarships to high achievers. They should just make it possible to obtain state residency if you are attending graduate school.

I'm also kind of raging on the Gates PSL, to be honest. The only full-ride available from the school is a full-ride plus stipend... and only if you sign up for a 5 year commitment to public service? That's a field in which you can already get your loans forgiven after 10 years and in which you can often get the federal government to subsidize your loan payments for all of those years. They're giving a free ride to people who already qualify for one federally. They're also giving the only free rides to people in the field least likely to give them the funds to be able to donate back to the school after graduating. Public Service is important, but it shouldn't be the only way to get more than a minuscule scholarship from the biggest university in the Pacific Northwest. That's not how you raise your number of placements in the NLJ250 and secure future donors.

Agreed on all points, even as an out-of-stater geared toward public interest (well, JAG, but still).

Still nothing in email or postal form...guess I'll call in the morning. How the hell does one even ask about the status of a scholarship application? I've not made any calls about this sort of thing and it seems an exceedingly awkward topic to broach.

This seems appropriate for UW.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UAqJHpBmPjE

I'm just not sure who is doing the beating

It's seriously taking all my willpower to not send the following in response to the offer:

"Re: Scholarship Offer Typo.

I believe there is a typo in my scholarship offer. It seems to be offering $15,000 over three years. I believe you meant to write $15,000 per year. Please let me know when this error has been fixed."

[jppatt16]

I've opted to send them an inquiry/negotiation email. Any veterans care to review it?

[apaint]

I've opted to send them an inquiry/negotiation email. Any veterans care to review it?

Hey Jppatt. If you are a combat veteran you qualify for 50% off of in-state tuition all three years. So if you end up paying OOS tuition your first year you still get about 12,000 off the OOS tuition and then with the in-state waiver for your 2L/3L years combined with the 50% reduction you will pay about 12,000 in tuition each year. I wrote the VA office to get this info. If you want me to PM you the e-mail let me know.

[jppatt16]

I've opted to send them an inquiry/negotiation email. Any veterans care to review it?

Hey Jppatt. If you are a combat veteran you qualify for 50% off of in-state tuition all three years. So if you end up paying OOS tuition your first year you still get about 12,000 off the OOS tuition and then with the in-state waiver for your 2L/3L years combined with the 50% reduction you will pay about 12,000 in tuition each year. I wrote the VA office to get this info. If you want me to PM you the e-mail let me know.

I knew I should have opted for a different word choice there...meant "veterans" of the negotiating process.

My ultimate goal is JAG, but I've not yet had any military service. Thanks for the response though.

[apaint]

Haha, darn...the JAG thing threw me off.

[jcl2]

Has anyone else received scholarship info yet? I'm thinking about calling just because I figure I shouldn't begin [trying] to negotiate for more blindly.

I did. It was insultingly low.

Ouch. Here's hoping I can at least get in-state out of them.

You just might. I gleemed from my conversation with Mr. Le that a large portion of their scholarship money is reserved for first year in-state equivalence scholarships. They generally are just one year awards since there is already a program for years 2-3. No offensive, but I'm not sure how I feel about my tax money being used to subsidize out-of-state attendants instead of being used to offer proper scholarships to high achievers. They should just make it possible to obtain state residency if you are attending graduate school.

I'm also kind of raging on the Gates PSL, to be honest. The only full-ride available from the school is a full-ride plus stipend... and only if you sign up for a 5 year commitment to public service? That's a field in which you can already get your loans forgiven after 10 years and in which you can often get the federal government to subsidize your loan payments for all of those years. They're giving a free ride to people who already qualify for one federally. They're also giving the only free rides to people in the field least likely to give them the funds to be able to donate back to the school after graduating. Public Service is important, but it shouldn't be the only way to get more than a minuscule scholarship from the biggest university in the Pacific Northwest. That's not how you raise your number of placements in the NLJ250 and secure future donors.

If the school could use its scholarship money in any way it wanted, your point about the Gates scholarship would be right, but that isn't the way it works. The Gates Foundation established the scholarship on the condition that it be given to people who will commit to working in public service. Their primary goal is to get talented people to commit to public service legal careers, not to improve UW's USNWR ranking. When someone gives you $15 million (or something close to that) to establish a scholarship, it is usually a good idea to use it as they request.

[geoduck]

If the school could use its scholarship money in any way it wanted, your point about the Gates scholarship would be right, but that isn't the way it works. The Gates Foundation established the scholarship on the condition that it be given to people who will commit to working in public service. Their primary goal is to get talented people to commit to public service legal careers, not to improve UW's USNWR ranking. When someone gives you $15 million (or something close to that) to establish a scholarship, it is usually a good idea to use it as they request.

But that's a false end. My problem isn't that the Gates PSL exists, but that UW has now made it the ONLY full rides they give. According to ABA data, they used to give other large awards. Now, the only way to get full is to get a full plus stipend from Mr. Gates. And notice that I said NLJ250, not USNWR. If they don't devote their resources to getting alumni into high paying jobs as well as the public sector, they aren't going to have much luck with graduate donations. They can't rely on all of their public sector lawyers having billionaire sons.

Again, my problem isn't that the Gates PSL exists, but that the UW is using it as a crutch. I highly doubt that Mr. Gates demanded that his scholarship be the only full ride available.

EDIT: To highlight my point... http://lawschoolnumbers.com/jisaac57

Just last year he got a nearly full ride. Based on my conversation with the new Director of Admissions and Financial Aid, that's not really offered anymore.

[JakeL]

Looking at LSN makes me feel a lot better about my WL. That being said UW, has the most whack admissions I have seen. I am continually wondering how in the hell they are going to attract those that they've admitted w/o scholarship. I guess their plan is to dip heavily into the waitlist this year, but to me, that is a highly antagonizing process. I think there will be some pretty heavy resentment on my end if they call me in June offering a spot, especially if they don't throw any cash my way(which they surely won't). On the other hand, I guess it's just the nature of the game. It just seems to me that typically schools WL borderline candidates as opposed to well or over qualified ones...

[apaint]

Thought this was helpful for calculating total debt if one was to attend UW.

Tuition Increases for Resident Law Students
2000 ‐ 3.4%
2001 ‐ 11.2%
2002 ‐ 48.0%
2003 ‐ 32.1%
2004 ‐ 0.04%
2005 ‐ 9.6%
2006 ‐ 9.8%
2007 ‐ 9.8%
2008 ‐ 9.7%
2009 ‐ 13.7%
2010 - 9.3%

[PinkCow]

Thought this was helpful for calculating total debt if one was to attend UW.

Tuition Increases for Resident Law Students
2000 ‐ 3.4%
2001 ‐ 11.2%
2002 ‐ 48.0%
2003 ‐ 32.1%
2004 ‐ 0.04%
2005 ‐ 9.6%
2006 ‐ 9.8%
2007 ‐ 9.8%
2008 ‐ 9.7%
2009 ‐ 13.7%
2010 - 9.3%

They put the decimal point in the wrong place or something. Geez.

[ScrabbleChamp]

Thought this was helpful for calculating total debt if one was to attend UW.

Tuition Increases for Resident Law Students
2000 ‐ 3.4%
2001 ‐ 11.2%
2002 ‐ 48.0%
2003 ‐ 32.1%
2004 ‐ 0.04%
2005 ‐ 9.6%
2006 ‐ 9.8%
2007 ‐ 9.8%
2008 ‐ 9.7%
2009 ‐ 13.7%
2010 - 9.3%

WTF?

[krad]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that it's 4.8% and 3.21%?

Ohai UW, want to start looking at your WL? Pretty please? No? K thanks anyway

[geoduck]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that it's 4.8% and 3.21%?

Ohai UW, want to start looking at your WL? Pretty please? No? K thanks anyway

You would be incorrect. Those are real numbers. The only reason that 2004 is 0.04% is because they hit the tuition ceiling that year, which was subsequently removed for the 2005 tuition year. My wife went UW undergrad from 04-08. The tuition jumped a lot from when she was looking at the school to when she was attending and continued to make large jumps pretty much every year. UW undergrad now costs more than the 3rd/4th year stafford even allows when it used to be fully covered with room to spare. Washington is really bad with its money and keeps losing revenue from referendums.

[krad]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that it's 4.8% and 3.21%?

Ohai UW, want to start looking at your WL? Pretty please? No? K thanks anyway

You would be incorrect. Those are real numbers. The only reason that 2004 is 0.04% is because they hit the tuition ceiling that year, which was subsequently removed for the 2005 tuition year. My wife went UW undergrad from 04-08. The tuition jumped a lot from when she was looking at the school to when she was attending and continued to make large jumps pretty much every year. UW undergrad now costs more than the 3rd/4th year stafford even allows when it used to be fully covered with room to spare. Washington is really bad with its money and keeps losing revenue from referendums.

Woah, those are huge hikes Thanks for the info!

[apaint]

Yep real numbers folks!!

I should have included this...

http://www.washington.edu/admin/pb/home ... istory.pdf

[ScrabbleChamp]

Yep real numbers folks!!

I should have included this...

http://www.washington.edu/admin/pb/home ... istory.pdf

$6k to $24k in 10 years? Wonder what tuition will be for the 3L class of 2013-2014... $37k for in-state, $51k for OOS.

Edit: Set a reminder and come back to this thread in 3 years and see the prophetic powers I possess.

[zonto]

Posted this in another thread and figured someone here may relate:

Here is a draft of a LOCI I'm working on. You can use all or parts of it if you'd like:

My Most Dearest Mr. Le,

Thank you for running out of brochures the day I attended the local law school fair to find out more about your school. The professor responsible for sparking my interest in law recommended your institution, and I felt bound to honor his suggestion. I also appreciated the somewhat snide comment about being a public school and not having enough money to grant fee waivers when I inquired about the topic. No worries there; I hope you enjoy my 1% contribution to your (supposed) median award amount.

Thank you also for your suggestions about creating effective, rhetorically persuasive resumes and cover letters during the admissions panel. Your suggestions, combined with my life experience and the skills I've learned as a technical communicator, have been a great blessing during the entirety of my application cycle this year. In fact, your suggestions proved so worthwhile that they have secured me admission and substantial scholarship awards at other schools more renowned than your own.

The irony is that you, the very person that finally gave clarity to the jumble of thoughts related to (and pages of free-hand written in preparation for) those important documents, saw fit to waitlist me nearly two months after the jubilant letters started flooding in from admissions deans at these more prestigious schools.

Consider this my Letter of Continued Apathy for you and the entirety of the University of Washington School of Law application process. I may keep myself on the waitlist, hoping that those accepted wise up and withdraw, so when you call in May to offer me a spot I can put you on hold and go take a dump while viewing the physical viewbook of the school I decide to attend.

Good day to you sir,

zonto