Fordham 2011

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Gemini
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Gemini » Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:35 am

Gotti wrote:
jwmalone87 wrote:To those who have gotten accepted, do you think you'll pay full sticker for it?

I have a decent shot at getting admitted (3.7, 166), but doubtful I'll get any real scholly $. I'd love to go to Fordham and live in NY, but the cost is something I'm seriously grappling with.



+1 ... I'm also having trouble justifying $210k debt from a school not even in the top 30, even though I would LOVE to go there. I'm not going to get any $ with a 164 though (if I even get in.... :?). Any of the current students have any input on this (nygrrrl or H. E. Pennypacker)?


Yea no money for me, either. Don't forget need-based grants and scholarships! There are scholarships out there where you have to apply for them (not just be automatically considered). My parents are totally fine with me going into so much debt because they think it's worth it. They don't seem to understand the huge risk I'm taking. :?

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Gotti
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Gotti » Mon Jan 10, 2011 11:37 am

Gemini Hopeful wrote:
Gotti wrote:
jwmalone87 wrote:To those who have gotten accepted, do you think you'll pay full sticker for it?

I have a decent shot at getting admitted (3.7, 166), but doubtful I'll get any real scholly $. I'd love to go to Fordham and live in NY, but the cost is something I'm seriously grappling with.



+1 ... I'm also having trouble justifying $210k debt from a school not even in the top 30, even though I would LOVE to go there. I'm not going to get any $ with a 164 though (if I even get in.... :?). Any of the current students have any input on this (nygrrrl or H. E. Pennypacker)?


Yea no money for me, either. Don't forget need-based grants and scholarships! There are scholarships out there where you have to apply for them (not just be automatically considered). My parents are totally fine with me going into so much debt because they think it's worth it. They don't seem to understand the huge risk I'm taking. :?


SAME!!! My dad's like..."hey it's law school, it's worth it! You'll come out making $160k and you can pay it off in like two years!"


.......he's an engineer who has never had to take out loans, clearly. -_-

xqhp82
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby xqhp82 » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:13 pm

my status has not been updated with my december LSAT last week...should I wait for a few more days and stop being too demanding?

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H. E. Pennypacker
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby H. E. Pennypacker » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:16 pm

Eugenie Danglars wrote:
Gotti wrote:
jwmalone87 wrote:To those who have gotten accepted, do you think you'll pay full sticker for it?

I have a decent shot at getting admitted (3.7, 166), but doubtful I'll get any real scholly $. I'd love to go to Fordham and live in NY, but the cost is something I'm seriously grappling with.



+1 ... I'm also having trouble justifying $210k debt from a school not even in the top 30, even though I would LOVE to go there. I'm not going to get any $ with a 164 though (if I even get in.... :?). Any of the current students have any input on this (nygrrrl or H. E. Pennypacker)?


+1 to the bolded. I'd love to hear thoughts on this.


Unfortunately I don't have time to go into all my reasons for going to law school, but breifly on the rankings...Fordham was in 20's until US News added the PT program into the calculation, and much liek GW last year, I would not be surprised to see Fordham back in the 20's in April. That being said, it's pretty irrelevent. A move from 34 to 28 (or vice versa) is not going to have an impact on the way NY firms look at Fordham grads (especially when the raw US News score stays the same). Gotti I know it may mean a little more to you since you want to take your JD back to Cali, but for me in NY it wasn't a big issue. And even in Cali, it's a Tier 1 school so if you come here and work hard and do well (easier said than done, I know, and you're the best judge of your capabilities), that's what's going to matter.

Either that or marry a more successful classmate

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Eugenie Danglars
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Eugenie Danglars » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:17 pm

H. E. Pennypacker wrote:
Either that or marry a more successful classmate


Great plan! I'll keep that in mind...

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Gotti
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Gotti » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:32 pm

H. E. Pennypacker wrote:Unfortunately I don't have time to go into all my reasons for going to law school, but breifly on the rankings...Fordham was in 20's until US News added the PT program into the calculation, and much liek GW last year, I would not be surprised to see Fordham back in the 20's in April. That being said, it's pretty irrelevent. A move from 34 to 28 (or vice versa) is not going to have an impact on the way NY firms look at Fordham grads (especially when the raw US News score stays the same). Gotti I know it may mean a little more to you since you want to take your JD back to Cali, but for me in NY it wasn't a big issue. And even in Cali, it's a Tier 1 school so if you come here and work hard and do well (easier said than done, I know, and you're the best judge of your capabilities), that's what's going to matter.

Either that or marry a more successful classmate



So I've actually been really confused about the whole part time affecting the rankings thing...why did GW jump back into the #20 spot from #28 only a year later?

& I'm pretty sure I'll fall so in love with NYC that I won't want to move back to cali, so it'll probably be fine. TLS is just so elitist and reinforces the notion that T14 or bust that I've fed into it a little despite all the reassurances that a JD from Fordham can make me successful. $210k is just a lot of money to gamble with :?


and yes...as far as the more successful classmate thing goes, the boyfriend is applying to better schools than I am :D

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Gemini
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Gemini » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:35 pm

Eugenie Danglars wrote:
H. E. Pennypacker wrote:
Either that or marry a more successful classmate


Great plan! I'll keep that in mind...


+1. Let's hope this works out.

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H. E. Pennypacker
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby H. E. Pennypacker » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:45 pm

Gotti wrote:
So I've actually been really confused about the whole part time affecting the rankings thing...why did GW jump back into the #20 spot from #28 only a year later?

& I'm pretty sure I'll fall so in love with NYC that I won't want to move back to cali, so it'll probably be fine. TLS is just so elitist and reinforces the notion that T14 or bust that I've fed into it a little despite all the reassurances that a JD from Fordham can make me successful. $210k is just a lot of money to gamble with :?


and yes...as far as the more successful classmate thing goes, the boyfriend is applying to better schools than I am :D


Up until a few years ago, the numbers for the PT students were ranked seperately, but now they are combined and most schools take students with lesser numbers for the PT program. So, when you include them with all the others, everything goes down. So GW cut their PT class in half (and prob raised the standards a bit) and moved up 8 spots. Fordham has just done the same. The 2009 entering PT class had 160 spots. In 2010, only 80, the vast majority of which are "true" PT students, meaning they work / have families, etc. So we'll see if it makes any difference.

And 210K is a HUGE amount of money to gamble with and you should be very careful about whatever decision you make. I'm sure you've all read the NY Times article by now, but remember a few key facts: that guy went to Thomas Jefferson Law, he went there because he liked the idea of living in San Diego, and he took summer trips to Europe on borrowed money, etc. That guy didn't have a clue. You all seem much more grounded and knowledgable about the risks.

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Stringer6
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Stringer6 » Mon Jan 10, 2011 12:52 pm

I'm sure you've all read the NY Times article by now, but remember a few key facts: that guy went to Thomas Jefferson Law, he went there because he liked the idea of living in San Diego, and he took summer trips to Europe on borrowed money, etc. That guy didn't have a clue. You all seem much more grounded and knowledgable about the risks.


yea, i loved how they used a complete idiot as their case study.

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Gotti
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Gotti » Mon Jan 10, 2011 1:13 pm

Stringer6 wrote:
I'm sure you've all read the NY Times article by now, but remember a few key facts: that guy went to Thomas Jefferson Law, he went there because he liked the idea of living in San Diego, and he took summer trips to Europe on borrowed money, etc. That guy didn't have a clue. You all seem much more grounded and knowledgable about the risks.


yea, i loved how they used a complete idiot as their case study.



Can someone link me? I feel left out :P

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H. E. Pennypacker
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby H. E. Pennypacker » Mon Jan 10, 2011 1:16 pm

Gotti wrote:
Stringer6 wrote:
I'm sure you've all read the NY Times article by now, but remember a few key facts: that guy went to Thomas Jefferson Law, he went there because he liked the idea of living in San Diego, and he took summer trips to Europe on borrowed money, etc. That guy didn't have a clue. You all seem much more grounded and knowledgable about the risks.


yea, i loved how they used a complete idiot as their case study.



Can someone link me? I feel left out :P


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/business/09law.html

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Lwoods
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Lwoods » Mon Jan 10, 2011 1:42 pm

Stringer6 wrote:
I'm sure you've all read the NY Times article by now, but remember a few key facts: that guy went to Thomas Jefferson Law, he went there because he liked the idea of living in San Diego, and he took summer trips to Europe on borrowed money, etc. That guy didn't have a clue. You all seem much more grounded and knowledgable about the risks.


yea, i loved how they used a complete idiot as their case study.


The NYTimes is notorious for this.

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nygrrrl
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby nygrrrl » Mon Jan 10, 2011 2:15 pm

H. E. Pennypacker wrote:Up until a few years ago, the numbers for the PT students were ranked seperately, but now they are combined and most schools take students with lesser numbers for the PT program. So, when you include them with all the others, everything goes down. So GW cut their PT class in half (and prob raised the standards a bit) and moved up 8 spots. Fordham has just done the same. The 2009 entering PT class had 160 spots. In 2010, only 80, the vast majority of which are "true" PT students, meaning they work / have families, etc. So we'll see if it makes any difference.


THIS. I was fortunate enough to score a brief interview with Dean Brown during my admissions cycle and he was quite blunt about the fact that Fordham was making adjustments to the PT program - as GULC had done - to counteract the USNWR standings. I also agree with HEP that a jump in rankings this spring (as a result) would be unsurprising.
That said, I read the NYT article, marveling at the idiocy of the main character while nodding my head, about the prospects for lawyers. Things is bad, kids - but I knew this, going in. I think that Fordham is in a terrific spot if you want to stay in NYC - it's the #3 school here with a great reputation. Is the degree portable? I honestly don't know. I'm a New Yorker (shocking, I know) and plan to stay. As to the debt? Well... I'm in a unique position. I knew I wanted this and I saved for it, for several years. If my current job continues to go well (and be flexible with my LS schedule!), I will finish with little or no debt. If that were not the case?
Hm. I have no idea what I would do. It's just so much debt. I don't know.

frost
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby frost » Mon Jan 10, 2011 2:37 pm

Gemini Hopeful wrote:
Gotti wrote:
jwmalone87 wrote:To those who have gotten accepted, do you think you'll pay full sticker for it?

I have a decent shot at getting admitted (3.7, 166), but doubtful I'll get any real scholly $. I'd love to go to Fordham and live in NY, but the cost is something I'm seriously grappling with.



+1 ... I'm also having trouble justifying $210k debt from a school not even in the top 30, even though I would LOVE to go there. I'm not going to get any $ with a 164 though (if I even get in.... :?). Any of the current students have any input on this (nygrrrl or H. E. Pennypacker)?


Yea no money for me, either. Don't forget need-based grants and scholarships! There are scholarships out there where you have to apply for them (not just be automatically considered). My parents are totally fine with me going into so much debt because they think it's worth it. They don't seem to understand the huge risk I'm taking. :?


+1. i'm a fordham 2L. during my application cycle, I was set on another school until I received a surprisingly generous need-based aid package from fordham, so there's definitely hope that you guys will get good need-based scholarships in march!

as for justifying $210k in debt, don't underestimate how much debt that is when you graduate. it will require you to pay back over $2000 a month, on top of the costs of living in nyc. I don't want to dampen anyone's mood, but last year and this year, it seems that only about 10-15% of students got biglaw summer associate positions. in other words, 85-90% of students probably won't be making 160k after graduation. it's a pretty big gamble to take on 210k in debt when you may be getting significant scholarships from lower-ranked schools in nyc.

that said, fordham is an amazing school that will open many, many more doors than lower-ranked schools and I am sooo happy that I ended up at fordham. I just wanted to put my word of warning out there. I remember when I was applying, I was more than ready to loan $180k for law school because it seemed like most people are steeped in law school loans anyway. But the fact that I don't have that much in loans has made me feel a lot less pressure knowing that I don't NEED a biglaw job to pay them off, and I can pursue whatever field of law I want.

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Gemini
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Gemini » Mon Jan 10, 2011 2:41 pm

How does one acquire a generous need-based grant (as opposed to like 2,000 a year)?

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JenDarby
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby JenDarby » Mon Jan 10, 2011 2:46 pm

Gemini Hopeful wrote:How does one acquire a generous need-based grant (as opposed to like 2,000 a year)?


+1. Generous need based aid would be lovely.

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Stringer6
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Stringer6 » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:11 pm

it will require you to pay back over $2000 a month, on top of the costs of living in nyc.


i've heard conflicting statements about this. a friend i know took out maximum loans and is paying 1200/month.

i saw that someone else wrote 800-900/month for 25 years.

now you're saying over 2k...

maglialoro
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby maglialoro » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:19 pm

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Last edited by maglialoro on Sat Mar 05, 2011 5:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Gemini
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Gemini » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:22 pm

That's pricey!! I thought govt loans were supposed to be the best!

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Stringer6
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Stringer6 » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:27 pm

2k a month is based on paying back about 200k over 10yr period, which i believe is the term that gov't loans are based on. Maybe your friend has taken out private loans under different terms?



not sure. i obviously need to look into this more, but i thought there was always an option to do repayment plans longer than 10 yrs.

i do know someone else that is doing 2000/month, but i'm not sure what the repayment period is.

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Lwoods
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Lwoods » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:58 pm

Gemini Hopeful wrote:That's pricey!! I thought govt loans were supposed to be the best!


My husband has nearly $250k in student loan debt, all but $3k of which are government loans. A big benefit of government loans is that you can pay them off using IBR (http://www.ibrinfo.org/). His government loan payments are roughly $500/month based on his salary of roughly $50k/year (typical first year resident salary), and we file separately so my income isn't taken into account. If he makes all payments on time for 25 years, any remaining balance is forgiven. If he works for a non-profit, he qualifies for PSLF and his remaining SL debt is forgiven after only 10 years.

That said, since my husband already has a quarter million in student loan debt, I really don't feel comfortable taking on a similar amount.

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Stringer6
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Stringer6 » Mon Jan 10, 2011 4:03 pm

My husband has nearly $250k in student loan debt, all but $3k of which are government loans. A big benefit of government loans is that you can pay them off using IBR (http://www.ibrinfo.org/). His government loan payments are roughly $500/month based on his salary of roughly $50k/year (typical first year resident salary), and we file separately so my income isn't taken into account. If he makes all payments on time for 25 years, any remaining balance is forgiven. If he works for a non-profit, he qualifies for PSLF and his remaining SL debt is forgiven after only 10 years.


thanks for the info. i feel like i hear something new(ish) about this every day.

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Gotti
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Gotti » Mon Jan 10, 2011 4:03 pm

H. E. Pennypacker wrote:
Gotti wrote:
Stringer6 wrote:
I'm sure you've all read the NY Times article by now, but remember a few key facts: that guy went to Thomas Jefferson Law, he went there because he liked the idea of living in San Diego, and he took summer trips to Europe on borrowed money, etc. That guy didn't have a clue. You all seem much more grounded and knowledgable about the risks.


yea, i loved how they used a complete idiot as their case study.



Can someone link me? I feel left out :P


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/business/09law.html



this is the scariest article ever. dude from CLS making $33??? :shock: :? :cry:

maglialoro
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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby maglialoro » Mon Jan 10, 2011 4:06 pm

-
Last edited by maglialoro on Sat Mar 05, 2011 5:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Fordham 2011

Postby Arbiter213 » Mon Jan 10, 2011 4:11 pm

JenDarby wrote:
Gemini Hopeful wrote:How does one acquire a generous need-based grant (as opposed to like 2,000 a year)?


+1. Generous need based aid would be lovely.


I got a very good (by Fordham's standards) scholly and I too would like need based aid. What does one need to qualify for that sort of thing? I have close to no assets (<5k), no real estate, little to no income, and my family has no mortgage-able assets and very low income in an expensive area. I'm not on food stamps or anything, but is that enough to get need based aid? And when would that information be rendered to me after applying?




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