New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

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New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago?

NYLS
16
64%
John Marshall (6K)
9
36%
 
Total votes: 25

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Helmholtz
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby Helmholtz » Mon Apr 19, 2010 1:47 am

Desert Fox wrote:Where is the option for Powerscore LSAT courses?

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 1:53 am

i took the testmasters course during the spring quarter of my 3rd year. I went from a 135 (my 1st practice test) to a 147 on the actual test. I was taking 3 upper division classes and running my campaign for student body govt. When I think about retaking the LSAT, I know that it will easier for me to kick ass during my 1st year and transfer than to retake the horrific test. I have never been the best test taker, got a 1370/2400 on my sat and finished with a 3.4 gpa undergrad, my major avg is a 3.0

any other thoughts or opinions?

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Helmholtz
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby Helmholtz » Mon Apr 19, 2010 1:55 am

rgucsb wrote:When I think about retaking the LSAT, I know that it will easier for me to kick ass during my 1st year and transfer than to retake the horrific test.


meh, this seems like not such an easy thing to say when you've never actually taken a law school exam

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:00 am

I understand your point but I was referring more to standardized test. Care to share your wisdom and describe a typical law school exam?

I'm assuming its similar to an undergrad one, 3hrs long, about 3-5 essays, 2-5 ID's?

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Helmholtz
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby Helmholtz » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:02 am

rgucsb wrote:I understand your point but I was referring more to standardized test. Care to share your wisdom and describe a typical law school exam?

I'm assuming its similar to an undergrad one, 3hrs long, about 3-5 essays, 2-5 ID's?


Have never taken a law exam, but have talked to plenty of law students about them. My expected performance on them is definitely falling into the "don't count your chickens before they're hatched" category. A lot of people talk about how arbitrary and unexpected some of the grading can be.

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:06 am

Leaving the option of retaking the LSAT out of the equation, what advice can anyone provide on my choice

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rayiner
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rayiner » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:09 am

rgucsb wrote:I understand your point but I was referring more to standardized test. Care to share your wisdom and describe a typical law school exam?

I'm assuming its similar to an undergrad one, 3hrs long, about 3-5 essays, 2-5 ID's?


What is an ID?

A law exam is usually 2-3 essays, but not at all similar to an undergrad exam. You don't argue a point, you spot issues and apply rules. It's much closer to the LSAT conceptually (like a giant logic game with LR elements embedded in a 4 page fact pattern) than any undergrad exam.

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:13 am

an ID is an identification, in a paragraph you discuss the author/ meaning/ significance of a specific term/idea

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:22 am

thanks for the insight on exams, greatly appreciated

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MF248
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby MF248 » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:22 am

Take some time off. Join the Chicago Police Department. Get a free ride to John Marshall. Otherwise retake.

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SanBun
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby SanBun » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:29 am

If I had to pick, New York Law School. It's better ranked and it seems to have a slightly better reputation than John Marshall.


But seriously, I would say take a year off. 3.6 is a really good GPA and by raising your LSAT, say, 5-8 points you can get into MUCH MUCH better schools.

Another option: Hope you get into one of the higher ranked schools.

But really, take a year off.

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:32 am

Thank you, I know that NYLS has a better reputation but I felt more comfortable being in Chicago when I visited. Is it worth picking the lower ranked school if it means living more comfortably/relaxed?

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:41 am

thanks for the advice schneitj

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SanBun
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby SanBun » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:43 am

rgucsb wrote:Thank you, I know that NYLS has a better reputation but I felt more comfortable being in Chicago when I visited. Is it worth picking the lower ranked school if it means living more comfortably/relaxed?


as for the scholarship, you can't know for sure that you'll meet the condition of top 1/3

but yeah, Chicago, I believe, also has a lower cost of living and the scholly might motivate you to do well

i guess it really comes down to which area you feel MORE comfortable in.

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Grizz
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby Grizz » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:46 am

While you're in applications mode, preemptively apply for foodstamps.

But seriously. Retake, reapply. No brainer. Unless you want to end up marginally employed or in document review hell.

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A'nold
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby A'nold » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:48 am

Since you are 100% set no matter what and you are basically saying screw you to everyone trying to help out, I will play this little game and up the ante. If you finish like in the top 3 students at NYLS you could likely get into Columbia as a transfer. You have a 3 in 450 or whatever chance.

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:52 am

your so funny rad law, I bet your humor plays with all the ladies? or bros if your a women

I'm not going into law school with the expectation of making $, regardless if it were Harvard or John Marshall

My legal goal is to work as a lawyer for a District attorney or public defenders office. I've done multiple internships that have really encouraged me to pursue this path.

As for retaking the test, I have become more open to the option but there is just so many complications with choosing the option.

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:56 am

A'nold, thanks for the response, I am not ruling the option out, I'm actually considering it even more now than ever

the issue is
1. my parents are completely against the option and although its my decision, they have offered to pay a portion of my legal debt

2. putting myself through the process of taking an lsat again sounds dreadful

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Grizz
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby Grizz » Mon Apr 19, 2010 3:01 am

rgucsb wrote:your so funny rad law, I bet your humor plays with all the ladies? or bros if your a women

I'm not going into law school with the expectation of making $, regardless if it were Harvard or John Marshall

My legal goal is to work as a lawyer for a District attorney or public defenders office. I've done multiple internships that have really encouraged me to pursue this path.

As for retaking the test, I have become more open to the option but there is just so many complications with choosing the option.


You will have to make money, because you will be firmly into 6 figures worth of debt from either school. Making money is paramount. Why would you not be concerned with making money?

DA and PD offices are no longer sure bets because of the terrible economy and hiring freezes. Competition is intense for these jobs as well as biglaw positions, and just graduation from NYLS is no guarantee of even being competitive for these PI jobs. Better shot you'll be reviewing documents in the basement of a big law firm for $38k a year, no benefits, all with 6 figure debt hanging over you.

What complications could there possibly be that would force you to possibly ruin yourself financially for decades?

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Grizz
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby Grizz » Mon Apr 19, 2010 3:05 am

rgucsb wrote:A'nold, thanks for the response, I am not ruling the option out, I'm actually considering it even more now than ever

the issue is
1. my parents are completely against the option and although its my decision, they have offered to pay a portion of my legal debt

2. putting myself through the process of taking an lsat again sounds dreadful


Tons of people retook, myself included. Just do it. You're life will improve dramatically.

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rgucsb
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby rgucsb » Mon Apr 19, 2010 3:14 am

rad law, thanks for your advice, it is greatly appreciated

If I were to reapply, would you say it would be acceptable to re-use my letters of recommendation?

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somewhatwayward
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby somewhatwayward » Mon Apr 19, 2010 7:14 am

if your LSAT is even five points higher, then, yes, it'll be fine to re-use the letters bc you won't even be applying to the same schools.

taking the LSAT again is stressful but try to think about it like a challenge rather than dreading it.

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TTH
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby TTH » Mon Apr 19, 2010 8:21 am

If you can't stomach prepping for the LSAT, how sure are you that you can handle getting ready for four to five law school finals upon which your entire grade will ride?

If you won't listen to reason, then go to John Marshall. COL is marginally lower in Chicago than NY. Look outside of major cities for jobs.

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trialjunky
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby trialjunky » Mon Apr 19, 2010 10:41 am

Okay, I would strongly advise you to take the year off especially with your GPA. However, you probably should take the following into consideration if you refuse:

John Marshall
Tuition: 37,800 a year
Scholarship: 6,000
Cost of Attendance: 95,400 all three years not including cost of living
Average Salary: 50,000.00

In a look at graduates with the MOST debt, JM came in # 11 with 59% of grads having an average debt of $124,015.


New York Law
Tuition: 43,600 a year
Scholarship: 0.00
Cost of Attendance: 130,800 all three years not including cost of living which is high
Average Salary: 160,000.00 - Only 28% if grads reported

In a look at graduates with the MOST debt, NYLS came in # 2 with 87% of grads having an average debt of $129,410.

Personally, I know alumni from both NYLS and JM. Frankly, NYLS grads were doing better (and can potentially make more $$) but if I had to choose I'd go to JM just due to the immense debt of NYLS. However, if you graduate top of NYLS you could potentially make enough to overcome the debt. Too much risk for me.

Just as a side note, these two schools were both within the top 15 of schools with graduates who had the most debt on average meaning they arent getting good enough jobs to pay off their loans. I would really question attendance.

WAIT A YEAR! RE-APPLY You'll screw yourself going to either.

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holybartender
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Re: New York Law School or John Marshall Chicago? Help

Postby holybartender » Mon Apr 19, 2010 11:10 am

I went to UCSB as well. I'm telling you, take a god damn year off. You probably need a year out of IV to properly get your head out of that mindset anyway.

Don't let your parents make this choice for you by buying you.




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