Ultimate California Application Thread

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finalaspects
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby finalaspects » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:25 pm

swheat wrote:1. How many prof's does UCI have right now? 20? 30? 10? I am pretty sure if you took a small sample like that from any other T50 school and looked only at them, you would have a "Top 10 Faculty" as well. Even average schools like USD have a few superstar profs like Yale Kamisar.

2. Not sure about this...there is only so much a careers office can do. Unless you start swapping acceptances for politicians kid's in exchange for biglaw jobs ala Illinois.

3. Agree on this one - UCI will blow away the T2 privates in SoCal at some point.


Yea honestly how much career services can do is up in the air. Hopefully the dean has got guarantees from large law firms in OC/LA to receive OCI and job offers.

UCI only has a dozen or so professors, where most schools are double that. If the next dozen are of lower standard than the first dozen, then yes their quality/ranking will drop. If they can keep up the standard they will be sustain their ranking above Penn, Georgetown, UCLA, Virginia, Cornell, Northwestern, and Texas. If UCI wants to make a big splash, they should try/continue to hire professors of the same quality but whether or not they can do so is another question entirely.

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General Tso
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby General Tso » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:32 pm

finalaspects wrote:
swheat wrote:1. How many prof's does UCI have right now? 20? 30? 10? I am pretty sure if you took a small sample like that from any other T50 school and looked only at them, you would have a "Top 10 Faculty" as well. Even average schools like USD have a few superstar profs like Yale Kamisar.

2. Not sure about this...there is only so much a careers office can do. Unless you start swapping acceptances for politicians kid's in exchange for biglaw jobs ala Illinois.

3. Agree on this one - UCI will blow away the T2 privates in SoCal at some point.


Yea honestly how much career services can do is up in the air. Hopefully the dean has got guarantees from large law firms in OC/LA to receive OCI and job offers.

UCI only has a dozen or so professors, where most schools are double that. If the next dozen are of lower standard than the first dozen, then yes their quality/ranking will drop. If they can keep up the standard they will be sustain their ranking above Penn, Georgetown, UCLA, Virginia, Cornell, Northwestern, and Texas. If UCI wants to make a big splash, they should try/continue to hire professors of the same quality but whether or not they can do so is another question entirely.


But the thing is how will they be able to keep the standard? Most of the guys they have now are there because they are in powerful decision making positions. You think Chemerinsky would leave Duke if not for the prospect of building something new? Once it is an established school it will lost that appeal.

And the thing about top-talent professors is that they expect top talent $$. It won't be financially feasible to attract top profs while giving away half tuition. And while not giving away half tuition you start attracting weaker applicants. So it's a very delicate line UCI will have to walk. I think their best solution may be to stay small for an extended period of time.

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Veritas
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby Veritas » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:36 pm

SW what did you pass up at USD for Hastings, money wise?

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General Tso
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby General Tso » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:37 pm

Veritas wrote:SW what did you pass up at USD for Hastings, money wise?


80 something K. 81 or 84, I dont remember. Passed up a similar amount at Loyola.

finalaspects
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby finalaspects » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:38 pm

swheat wrote:But the thing is how will they be able to keep the standard? Most of the guys they have now are there because they are in powerful decision making positions. You think Chemerinsky would leave Duke if not for the prospect of building something new? Once it is an established school it will lost that appeal.

And the thing about top-talent professors is that they expect top talent $$. It won't be financially feasible to attract top profs while giving away half tuition. And while not giving away half tuition you start attracting weaker applicants. So it's a very delicate line UCI will have to walk. I think their best solution may be to stay small for an extended period of time.


Good idea. They have an excellent student to faculty ratio at that, and with talented professors. They only had 60 students their first year and intend to have 80 for their 2nd. They should try to keep it below 100 until at least being fully accredited (5 years), and US news ranks them. If they keep up the LSAT/GPA range they will rank fairly high, but rankings also depends on the graduates salary and positions, which no one will know for at least 2 more years...

Davis/Hastings at sticker vs. Irvine at half will definitely be a difficult choice. You can transfer out of Davis and Hastings if you do well though, but same cannot be said of Irvine... (without accreditation)

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General Tso
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby General Tso » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:42 pm

finalaspects wrote:Davis/Hastings at sticker vs. Irvine at half will definitely be a difficult choice. You can transfer out of Davis and Hastings if you do well though, but same cannot be said of Irvine... (without accreditation)


I'd probably go with the cheaper option though, unless you have enough money to afford most of D/H. D/H are good schools but I don't think any non-T20 schools are worth 100k+ debt these days.

You need top 5% at Hastings to x-fer to Berkeley/T14. Top 15% for a chance at UCLA.

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Veritas
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby Veritas » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:43 pm

swheat wrote:
Veritas wrote:SW what did you pass up at USD for Hastings, money wise?


80 something K. 81 or 84, I dont remember. Passed up a similar amount at Loyola.

That's a tough decision. I've read your reasoning a couple times on TLS. I'm not sure what I would do in that pickle.

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S de Garmeaux
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby S de Garmeaux » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:43 pm

165/3.3

Applied to

UCLA
Berk
UCI
UC Davis
Hastings
USF (In, no $)
Loyola LA
USD

Did everything on Peppderdine application then never got around to writing my christian values statement

Im realllllly hoping i can sneak into UCI, i know im below their medians, but not far below. Hoping my Tailored LORs OC Judge and Attorney that I worked and my extra effort in my tailored PS and Why UCI can make me that last admit that theyre like "what the hell, lets give this kid a shot"


Also, w/ respect to anyone that thinks UCI wont have good placement in OC/LA, i believe that the generous scholarships last year and this year were funded primarily by OC law firms. Can't speak for LA though

I imagine it could have a strong showing in San Diego market as well

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General Tso
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby General Tso » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:45 pm

Veritas wrote:
swheat wrote:
Veritas wrote:SW what did you pass up at USD for Hastings, money wise?


80 something K. 81 or 84, I dont remember. Passed up a similar amount at Loyola.

That's a tough decision. I've read your reasoning a couple times on TLS. I'm not sure what I would do in that pickle.


I think it depends on your debt level. I have some inheritance from my grandfather that will enable me to keep my debt to around 60-70k at Hastings (even with all the tuition hikes). So I am extremely lucky. If not for this, I probably would have chosen USD.

finalaspects
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby finalaspects » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:49 pm

swheat wrote:I think it depends on your debt level. I have some inheritance from my grandfather that will enable me to keep my debt to around 60-70k at Hastings (even with all the tuition hikes). So I am extremely lucky. If not for this, I probably would have chosen USD.


Damn that means you'll have no debt if you attend Irvine?

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General Tso
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby General Tso » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:50 pm

finalaspects wrote:
swheat wrote:I think it depends on your debt level. I have some inheritance from my grandfather that will enable me to keep my debt to around 60-70k at Hastings (even with all the tuition hikes). So I am extremely lucky. If not for this, I probably would have chosen USD.


Damn that means you'll have no debt if you attend Irvine?


I didn't get in at Irvine. Thanks for reminding me :evil:

Just kidding...they only accepted like 2% last year, so I wasn't too upset about it. I am 1L at Hastings, just finished first semester.

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Veritas
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby Veritas » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:54 pm

maybe ill get a full ride at Irvine and won't have to worry about it :mrgreen:

finalaspects
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby finalaspects » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:54 pm

swheat wrote:I didn't get in at Irvine. Thanks for reminding me :evil:

Just kidding...they only accepted like 2% last year, so I wasn't too upset about it. I am 1L at Hastings, just finished first semester.


Did you get accepted to Davis as well? If so, why hastings over davis since they seem so similar in everything.

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General Tso
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby General Tso » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:58 pm

finalaspects wrote:
swheat wrote:I didn't get in at Irvine. Thanks for reminding me :evil:

Just kidding...they only accepted like 2% last year, so I wasn't too upset about it. I am 1L at Hastings, just finished first semester.


Did you get accepted to Davis as well? If so, why hastings over davis since they seem so similar in everything.


I was accepted at Davis as well. Location, really. My g/f lives and works in the bay area. I am not really fond of the central valley/sacramento anyway. But Davis is a really good school, maybe better than Hastings.

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Faesha
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby Faesha » Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:28 pm

I live in CA so I've applied to most of the schools. So far:

USD - In
Santa Clara - In
UCLA - Waitlisted
Loyola - ?
USC - ?
Davis - ?
Berkeley - ? (not a chance I'll get in)

finalaspects
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby finalaspects » Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:31 pm

swheat wrote:I was accepted at Davis as well. Location, really. My g/f lives and works in the bay area. I am not really fond of the central valley/sacramento anyway. But Davis is a really good school, maybe better than Hastings.


Ah makes sense. yea these two schools seem to only matter where/what type of school you want to be in, with similar rankings, tuition, and placements.

I have not heard back from Irvine, Hastings, or Davis but i hope i get accepted to at least 1 of the 3. sigh.... so far im 0-2-6 (2 waitlists and 6 rejections) 0 acceptances. JfdsjfoJDFLSDf :evil:

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General Tso
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby General Tso » Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:39 pm

finalaspects wrote:
swheat wrote:I was accepted at Davis as well. Location, really. My g/f lives and works in the bay area. I am not really fond of the central valley/sacramento anyway. But Davis is a really good school, maybe better than Hastings.


Ah makes sense. yea these two schools seem to only matter where/what type of school you want to be in, with similar rankings, tuition, and placements.

I have not heard back from Irvine, Hastings, or Davis but i hope i get accepted to at least 1 of the 3. sigh.... so far im 0-2-6 (2 waitlists and 6 rejections) 0 acceptances. JfdsjfoJDFLSDf :evil:


Better to be too aggressive than too conservative. I am sure you will get into a great school...just give it time.

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Quine
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby Quine » Sat Jan 09, 2010 4:06 am

jay115 wrote:Everyone can be paranoid about increasing tuition prices, but no one looks at sticker prices when deciding which law schools to attend - it's price after scholarship/aid, which the tuition increases go towards. Basically, the UCs are raising tuition so that they can fund more scholarships to attract better students. This seems to contradict everyone's prediction that Boalt and UCLA are going to tank off the face of the USWNR.


Did they state that somewhere? In was, and maybe some others as well are, working under the assumption that they are simply trying to become more self-sufficient, and take better advantage of the thousands of people willing to pay higher tuition, given the budget shortfall at the state level.

Could you direct me to whatever source from which you gleaned that information?

sunnygirl
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby sunnygirl » Sat Jan 09, 2010 8:17 am

I applied
UCLA (rejected)
USC (?)
Davis(?)
Hastings(?)
Pepperdine (accepted, maybe with money, but haven't got the package yet)

I noticed the tuition hike, and that's annoying. I am int'l applicant, so I would have to pay the even higher out-of-state tuition. But luckily, I got sponsor from my family, I could finish my law school without debt, as long as those schools take me in. But UCLA has already turn its back on me :(

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ruleser
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby ruleser » Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:53 am

Veritas wrote:Let's play hypos across the board:

UCI (half tuition) versus UCLA sticker?
Man, just a few years back UCLA was about $20K at sticker. This is a toss up to me, but prob go UCLA just because of career ops - then again, extra 70Kish debt when UCI may get you in the same place...

Davis/Hastings sticker versus USD/LLS half tuition?
LLS half-tuition - no question. Davis/Hastings aren't even as prominent here in LA/not nearly as many alum, and tuition there is just ridiculous now.

USC versus UCLA?
Tough call, would visit both - USC has the wealthier alum network, UCLA has location, better rep academically nationally, and still slightly better tuition (40K, 45K, 48K still cheaper than 46K x 3) Then again, UCLA could be 60K by 3L...

LLS sticker versus Southwestern Full ride
Neither. Ok, if I had to choose one, SW. It does still place decently (better than Pepperdine, prob USD, etc in LA) and free doesn't suck.

I will add, it's really rather tragic about Davis/Hastings especially. Those were the perfect inbetweens for instaters like me who don't quite cut UCLA/Berk, very solid T1 schools that were 19K a year. Man...

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Veritas
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby Veritas » Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:35 pm

I'll play my own game :D

Veritas wrote:Let's play hypos across the board:

UCI (half tuition) versus UCLA sticker? This is really tough, when push comes to shove I think I'll choose UCLA
Davis/Hastings sticker versus USD/LLS half tuition? I think I would take Davis at sticker. Give me a full ride at USD and things would be different
USC versus UCLA? UCLA, if all things are even
LLS sticker versus Southwestern Full ride? I wouldn't risk either, but if forced to choose it would be Southwestern

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calgal17
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby calgal17 » Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:27 pm

I'm a CA native, so hoping to stay here at a great school. The fee hikes really suck, but I guess such is life. It's certainly not going to get any cheaper from here on out.

I applied at:

Stanford (not gonna happen)
Berkeley (my alma mater. Most likely not, but i wiiiiiish)
UCLA
USC
Hastings (Just got in!)
Davis
USD (In, waiting on scholarship)
UCI

knola002
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby knola002 » Sat Jan 09, 2010 10:38 pm

Applied to the following, in order of preference:
Stanford
Berkeley
UCLA
USC

Fingers crossed for Stanford.

wired
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby wired » Sat Jan 09, 2010 11:00 pm

swheat wrote:
finalaspects wrote:
Yea honestly how much career services can do is up in the air. Hopefully the dean has got guarantees from large law firms in OC/LA to receive OCI and job offers.

UCI only has a dozen or so professors, where most schools are double that. If the next dozen are of lower standard than the first dozen, then yes their quality/ranking will drop. If they can keep up the standard they will be sustain their ranking above Penn, Georgetown, UCLA, Virginia, Cornell, Northwestern, and Texas. If UCI wants to make a big splash, they should try/continue to hire professors of the same quality but whether or not they can do so is another question entirely.


But the thing is how will they be able to keep the standard? Most of the guys they have now are there because they are in powerful decision making positions. You think Chemerinsky would leave Duke if not for the prospect of building something new? Once it is an established school it will lost that appeal.

And the thing about top-talent professors is that they expect top talent $$. It won't be financially feasible to attract top profs while giving away half tuition. And while not giving away half tuition you start attracting weaker applicants. So it's a very delicate line UCI will have to walk. I think their best solution may be to stay small for an extended period of time.


Have you been in Irvine during Winter? That's how they keep the standard.

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Dignan
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Re: Ultimate California Application Thread

Postby Dignan » Sat Jan 09, 2010 11:40 pm

wired wrote:
Have you been in Irvine during Winter? That's how they keep the standard.

Indeed. The good winter weather will allow Irvine to obtain significant prestige. UCI will dominate the legal world along with the University of Hawaii, Texas Southern University, and Whittier College. Meanwhile, poor Harvard and Yale, both located in areas with tough winters, will toil in TTT territory.

Good winter weather is sort of analogous to applicants' softs in the admissions process. People talk a lot about it, and it surely helps break the occasional tie between two choices, but, when push comes to shove, it usually doesn't have a significant impact on actual decisions.




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