U Penn WAITLIST 2010

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Litigious
Posts: 20
Joined: Sun May 09, 2010 4:04 pm

Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby Litigious » Thu May 20, 2010 10:56 am

Lawschoolll,

Regarding the numbers I provided, they are more accurate than LSN but just by how much we cannot say. Let me explain briefly how I estimated/extrapolated:

Used LSN as a baseline

Reconciled last year's application numbers as part of the sample to provide a ratio. (6000+ apps, 800 accepts or whatever the data was..I'd need to go back)

Referenced the LSN data and compared it to the actual data of the whole provided by Penn.

Believe me, I want nothing more than to be dead wrong on the Penn WL stats as we all shout in unison we got calls from Dean Post. Nonetheless, I'm pretty confident that my WL size calcluations conservative/liberal and the number of withdraws are reasonable.

If we really want to be kind to the next year's applicants, we should follow the stats until the end of the cycle and then let someone give the actual Penn vs. LSN variance. If we knew approximately how LSN deviates from reality and in what ways, it would make things a lot easier. The areas in which I already noticed abnormalities in the data are as follows:


-A decent subset of Penn applicants on LSN do not update their info if it is going from pending to reject
-A decent subset of Penn applicants on LSN do not update their status to withdraw from accepted
-A decent subset of Penn applicants on LSN intentionally lie

lawschoollll
Posts: 468
Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2009 2:57 pm

Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby lawschoollll » Thu May 20, 2010 1:15 pm

Litigious wrote:Lawschoolll,

Regarding the numbers I provided, they are more accurate than LSN but just by how much we cannot say. Let me explain briefly how I estimated/extrapolated:

Used LSN as a baseline

Reconciled last year's application numbers as part of the sample to provide a ratio. (6000+ apps, 800 accepts or whatever the data was..I'd need to go back)

Referenced the LSN data and compared it to the actual data of the whole provided by Penn.

Believe me, I want nothing more than to be dead wrong on the Penn WL stats as we all shout in unison we got calls from Dean Post. Nonetheless, I'm pretty confident that my WL size calcluations conservative/liberal and the number of withdraws are reasonable.

If we really want to be kind to the next year's applicants, we should follow the stats until the end of the cycle and then let someone give the actual Penn vs. LSN variance. If we knew approximately how LSN deviates from reality and in what ways, it would make things a lot easier. The areas in which I already noticed abnormalities in the data are as follows:


-A decent subset of Penn applicants on LSN do not update their info if it is going from pending to reject
-A decent subset of Penn applicants on LSN do not update their status to withdraw from accepted
-A decent subset of Penn applicants on LSN intentionally lie

Thanks for explaining the methodology, and I do understand how you parsed the data, but the underlying problem is this: last year's WL pull is not necessarily indicative or predictive of this year's WL pull, especially if anecdotes, which suggest that last year was an abnormality and that Penn usually pulls liberally from its WL, are to be believed.

Then again, I'm just another sucker trying to convince myself that I'll be moving to Philly in August.

krj02004
Posts: 158
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 2:33 pm

Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby krj02004 » Thu May 20, 2010 1:41 pm

Just randomly met a person at a hair shop who was waitlisted 2 weeks ago and got in within 1 week :(.

I'm trying to keep positive here....

aerose
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Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 1:00 am

Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby aerose » Thu May 20, 2010 2:15 pm

you've got to be joking me. did you get his/her stats or softs? why can't one of us be that lucky. i had a girlfriend who got held then wailisted and then in at northwestern all in the span of one week. some people just have all the luck.

lawschoollll
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby lawschoollll » Thu May 20, 2010 3:13 pm

krj02004 wrote:Just randomly met a person at a hair shop who was waitlisted 2 weeks ago and got in within 1 week :(.

I'm trying to keep positive here....

You should've tried to convince him that Penn was a terrible, dangerous, hostile place and that he should withdraw immediately.

krj02004
Posts: 158
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 2:33 pm

Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby krj02004 » Thu May 20, 2010 3:52 pm

aerose wrote:you've got to be joking me. did you get his/her stats or softs? why can't one of us be that lucky. i had a girlfriend who got held then wailisted and then in at northwestern all in the span of one week. some people just have all the luck.



Your girlfriend sounds suscpiciously like the brother of my hairstylist....lol. Same thing happened to him.

Seriously though... I HAVE to get in at UPenn... sure, Vanderbilt is not bad back-up, but Penn is my dream! And my parents would only be 1 1/2 hourse away... as a single mom that's just too good to be true :)

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Lurkster
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby Lurkster » Thu May 20, 2010 3:59 pm

If it is true that Penn's waitlist is not ranked, I don't like my chances of getting off of it. What I think that means is they try to find a similar person to the person that they lose, and really, what's the likelihood of a low GPA/high LSAT splitter having better options than Penn at this stage in the game? It seems like most successful splitters went ED this cycle anyway, forgoing the opportunity to make choices.

krj02004
Posts: 158
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby krj02004 » Thu May 20, 2010 6:00 pm

I spoke to Dean Post today, and she said that they've already let go people on the waitlist and that they were notified by now. So we still have a chance!

Litigious
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Joined: Sun May 09, 2010 4:04 pm

Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby Litigious » Thu May 20, 2010 7:37 pm

I find that statement ascribed to Dean Post interesting considering the following:

1/8th of all Penn Law applicants use LSN

Of approximately 800 applicants that identified WL status, only 2 in 800 stated: "Waitlisted, then rejected". This is rather suspect considering they were waitlisted and rejected over two months ago. I think more likely, these 2 people were held for further review (I was myself) and then they were rejected whereas I was offered a chance at the waitlist.

Of course, the other reason for the disconnected stats vs your account is that people don't rush home jumping for their PC to log onto LSN and brag "yes, yes, I've been rejected from my dream school!". -In other words, maybe people aren't reporting their waitlist rejections.

Litigious
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby Litigious » Thu May 20, 2010 7:42 pm

Here's a new question for the Penn Waitlist crowd:

How many of you were "held for further review" before being offered a shot at the waitlist?

I'm wondering if it makes any difference? I went "under review" according to the status checker 3x and then I was emailed a notice that I was held for further review, then I was emailed the offer to join the waitlist. (all in the March-April timeframes)

caneman13
Posts: 54
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby caneman13 » Thu May 20, 2010 7:44 pm

Litigious wrote:Here's a new question for the Penn Waitlist crowd:

How many of you were "held for further review" before being offered a shot at the waitlist?

I'm wondering if it makes any difference? I went "under review" according to the status checker 3x and then I was emailed a notice that I was held for further review, then I was emailed the offer to join the waitlist. (all in the March-April timeframes)



I was held from early decision in mid december, then wait listed in late march.

BuckNuts
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby BuckNuts » Thu May 20, 2010 10:53 pm

Held in December and "offered" the waitlist today.

tram988
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby tram988 » Fri May 21, 2010 12:03 am

BuckNuts wrote:Held in December and "offered" the waitlist today.

via phone call? Did you accept?

Litigious
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Joined: Sun May 09, 2010 4:04 pm

Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby Litigious » Fri May 21, 2010 10:36 am

Bucknuts is an odd statistic....Only person on LSN in months to go from Pending -> Anything else at Penn.

They must have really agonized over your scores if indeed you were 170 and 4.0.

I wish you much luck.

BuckNuts
Posts: 35
Joined: Wed Sep 16, 2009 5:37 pm

Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby BuckNuts » Fri May 21, 2010 12:00 pm

My entire experience with Penn has been strange. The offer for the waitlist came via e-mail...three weeks after a short phone conversation with one of the Deans.

I honestly think it was my personal statement. I had a standard one that I used for most schools and received full rides at most and a generous $75K from UVA. Then I had a "hail mary" that I used at Harvard, Yale, and Penn. Rejected, rejected, and then a painstakingly slow decision/non-decision/waitlist from Penn. Oh well. Should have just used the one statement for all, but I figured "what the hell."

sdv
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby sdv » Fri May 21, 2010 12:12 pm

got WL in April with a 174/3.76 - and I'm an alumni. Actually preferred Vandy anyway because of what I want to do (Entertainment Law) and location, but still! Best of luck.

(and no I didn't rob a bank or write my personal statement in crayon)

MayGem
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby MayGem » Fri May 21, 2010 12:56 pm

I'm a first time TLS poster, usually I just lurk, but I wanted to share that I just in off the waitlist! Needless to say, I'm estatic!

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jpthomes
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Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 8:58 pm

Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby jpthomes » Fri May 21, 2010 12:57 pm

Congratulations - I've given up on all of my wait lists.

RhubarbPie
Posts: 207
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby RhubarbPie » Fri May 21, 2010 1:15 pm

Joining this thread. I sent a LOCI in April, and just sent another one with my final GPA.

I have a seat deposit at Michigan (and fell in love with the school when I visited...it was a good start that my hotel room was surprisingly paid for by the law school upon arriving in AA), but I currently live in Philly and would stay if admitted to Penn (esp for my fiancee's work situation). Good luck to everyone.

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pertristis
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby pertristis » Fri May 21, 2010 1:19 pm

MayGem wrote:I'm a first time TLS poster, usually I just lurk, but I wanted to share that I just in off the waitlist! Needless to say, I'm estatic!


Congratulations! Would you mind sharing your numbers with us?

MayGem
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby MayGem » Fri May 21, 2010 1:44 pm

Sure, 3.96/165. 2 years of relevant/semi-unique work experience, a couple of academic awards, interesting experiences growing up and several non-traditional reasons for attending law school. Non-URM.

I sent a loci a few weeks ago and submitted a well thought-out "Why Penn" essay with my original application.

lawschoollll
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby lawschoollll » Fri May 21, 2010 2:02 pm

MayGem wrote:Sure, 3.96/165. 2 years of relevant/semi-unique work experience, a couple of academic awards, interesting experiences growing up and several non-traditional reasons for attending law school. Non-URM.

I sent a loci a few weeks ago and submitted a well thought-out "Why Penn" essay with my original application.

Damn. Was hoping they needed high lsats.

Flanker1067
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby Flanker1067 » Fri May 21, 2010 2:07 pm

lawschoollll wrote:
MayGem wrote:Sure, 3.96/165. 2 years of relevant/semi-unique work experience, a couple of academic awards, interesting experiences growing up and several non-traditional reasons for attending law school. Non-URM.

I sent a loci a few weeks ago and submitted a well thought-out "Why Penn" essay with my original application.

Damn. Was hoping they needed high lsats.


Same here. Congrats to MayGem, but I hate you.

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pertristis
Posts: 374
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby pertristis » Fri May 21, 2010 2:15 pm

MayGem wrote:Sure, 3.96/165. 2 years of relevant/semi-unique work experience, a couple of academic awards, interesting experiences growing up and several non-traditional reasons for attending law school. Non-URM.

I sent a loci a few weeks ago and submitted a well thought-out "Why Penn" essay with my original application.


This bodes poorly for those of us who are traditional splitters. I by no means want to minimize your softs, as there were probably others with similar numbers who were not pulled, but if they're taking high GPAs, I am out of luck. Damn.

kissmysass
Posts: 10
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Re: U Penn WAITLIST 2010

Postby kissmysass » Fri May 21, 2010 2:22 pm

MayGem wrote:Sure, 3.96/165. 2 years of relevant/semi-unique work experience, a couple of academic awards, interesting experiences growing up and several non-traditional reasons for attending law school. Non-URM.

I sent a loci a few weeks ago and submitted a well thought-out "Why Penn" essay with my original application.


Congrats MayGem! How were you notified? Email or phone call?




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