accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

alienbones
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby alienbones » Sat Nov 21, 2009 7:00 am

LSAC used to deny any accommodations but after recent lawsuits (I love the irony) they have bent and give 1/4 time for many cases and 1/2 time in rare cases. I will probably take the test with accommodations. Honestly, if it gets me the score i need to get into Stanford I don't care if my diagnosis is BS, if my extra time is warranted or about anything except the opportunities I'll have in 4 years. Same thing with people who take Adderal or Ritalin. They are not "brain steroids" they are more like artificial limbs for someone who needs support. And some people need support. I don't get why people get catty about people who use accommodations whether warranted or not. I'm not bitter at the person who's parents paid off a shrink to write a letter encouraging the need for 2x time. Go for it. I'll still rock your score bitch. That's my attitude but at the same rate I'm not going to shove opportunity out of the way when it comes to me. I dunno I'm a competitive athlete so maybe that's why I feel the way I do.

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WhiskeyGuy
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby WhiskeyGuy » Sat Nov 21, 2009 11:23 am

alienbones wrote:LSAC used to deny any accommodations but after recent lawsuits (I love the irony) they have bent and give 1/4 time for many cases and 1/2 time in rare cases. I will probably take the test with accommodations. Honestly, if it gets me the score i need to get into Stanford I don't care if my diagnosis is BS, if my extra time is warranted or about anything except the opportunities I'll have in 4 years. Same thing with people who take Adderal or Ritalin. They are not "brain steroids" they are more like artificial limbs for someone who needs support. And some people need support. I don't get why people get catty about people who use accommodations whether warranted or not. I'm not bitter at the person who's parents paid off a shrink to write a letter encouraging the need for 2x time. Go for it. I'll still rock your score bitch. That's my attitude but at the same rate I'm not going to shove opportunity out of the way when it comes to me. I dunno I'm a competitive athlete so maybe that's why I feel the way I do.


?

angioletto
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby angioletto » Sat Nov 21, 2009 11:45 am

While I don't think anything is wrong with accomodations for those with ADD/dyslexia I do wonder how those students tend to do once they get into law school and accomodations are no longer available.

IBThatGuy
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby IBThatGuy » Sat Nov 21, 2009 12:35 pm

WhiskeyGuy wrote:
alienbones wrote:LSAC used to deny any accommodations but after recent lawsuits (I love the irony) they have bent and give 1/4 time for many cases and 1/2 time in rare cases. I will probably take the test with accommodations. Honestly, if it gets me the score i need to get into Stanford I don't care if my diagnosis is BS, if my extra time is warranted or about anything except the opportunities I'll have in 4 years. Same thing with people who take Adderal or Ritalin. They are not "brain steroids" they are more like artificial limbs for someone who needs support. And some people need support. I don't get why people get catty about people who use accommodations whether warranted or not. I'm not bitter at the person who's parents paid off a shrink to write a letter encouraging the need for 2x time. Go for it. I'll still rock your score bitch. That's my attitude but at the same rate I'm not going to shove opportunity out of the way when it comes to me. I dunno I'm a competitive athlete so maybe that's why I feel the way I do.


?


I know what you're wondering: Is alienbones looking forward to corporate law - or indigent defense? Only time will tell, but I don't think those are water stains on his* copy of The Fountainhead.

*I'm assuming alienbones is a male.

Woozy
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby Woozy » Sat Nov 21, 2009 1:27 pm

alienbones wrote:LSAC used to deny any accommodations but after recent lawsuits (I love the irony) they have bent and give 1/4 time for many cases and 1/2 time in rare cases. I will probably take the test with accommodations. Honestly, if it gets me the score i need to get into Stanford I don't care if my diagnosis is BS, if my extra time is warranted or about anything except the opportunities I'll have in 4 years. Same thing with people who take Adderal or Ritalin. They are not "brain steroids" they are more like artificial limbs for someone who needs support. And some people need support. I don't get why people get catty about people who use accommodations whether warranted or not. I'm not bitter at the person who's parents paid off a shrink to write a letter encouraging the need for 2x time. Go for it. I'll still rock your score bitch. That's my attitude but at the same rate I'm not going to shove opportunity out of the way when it comes to me. I dunno I'm a competitive athlete so maybe that's why I feel the way I do.


A competitive athlete should have a highly developed sense of fair play. You really don't think we should begrudge someone who fakes a disability in order to receive more time on a test? I guess you name is fitting because you clearly don't live on this planet.

There are many things I'd like to say but since this has to be a troll, I'll just leave it at that.

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Trifles
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby Trifles » Sat Nov 21, 2009 4:24 pm

angioletto wrote:While I don't think anything is wrong with accomodations for those with ADD/dyslexia I do wonder how those students tend to do once they get into law school and accomodations are no longer available.


Those accommodations will be available in law school, and someone diagnosed with a learning disability will most likely receive extended time on their law school exams.

alienbones
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby alienbones » Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:06 pm

Woozy wrote:
alienbones wrote:LSAC used to deny any accommodations but after recent lawsuits (I love the irony) they have bent and give 1/4 time for many cases and 1/2 time in rare cases. I will probably take the test with accommodations. Honestly, if it gets me the score i need to get into Stanford I don't care if my diagnosis is BS, if my extra time is warranted or about anything except the opportunities I'll have in 4 years. Same thing with people who take Adderal or Ritalin. They are not "brain steroids" they are more like artificial limbs for someone who needs support. And some people need support. I don't get why people get catty about people who use accommodations whether warranted or not. I'm not bitter at the person who's parents paid off a shrink to write a letter encouraging the need for 2x time. Go for it. I'll still rock your score bitch. That's my attitude but at the same rate I'm not going to shove opportunity out of the way when it comes to me. I dunno I'm a competitive athlete so maybe that's why I feel the way I do.


A competitive athlete should have a highly developed sense of fair play. You really don't think we should begrudge someone who fakes a disability in order to receive more time on a test? I guess you name is fitting because you clearly don't live on this planet.

There are many things I'd like to say but since this has to be a troll, I'll just leave it at that.


Speak your mind idiot. I'm not a troll and I'm not sure why I would be. I was just stating an opinion. Damn I'd love to punch you in the face.

And as for the competitive athlete remark regarding fairness I wonder if you ever played a sport outside your backyard? Nothing is fair right down to referee calls. You can't ASSUME fairness you just have to go out there and take the match or game or whatever you are competing in. Man I bet you are skinny out of shape pencil pusher who whines a lot and studies endlessly then bitches about why pro athletes make a lot of $$ and how beautiful women are all whores. I'm assuming yes. Sue me bitch.

I do think its wrong and unethical for people to do such things as lie about a condition but I don't care either. To everyone their best I'll just up my game that's all.

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WhiskeyGuy
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby WhiskeyGuy » Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:28 pm

alienbones wrote:Speak your mind idiot. I'm not a troll and I'm not sure why I would be. I was just stating an opinion. Damn I'd love to punch you in the face.

And as for the competitive athlete remark regarding fairness I wonder if you ever played a sport outside your backyard? Nothing is fair right down to referee calls. You can't ASSUME fairness you just have to go out there and take the match or game or whatever you are competing in. Man I bet you are skinny out of shape pencil pusher who whines a lot and studies endlessly then bitches about why pro athletes make a lot of $$ and how beautiful women are all whores. I'm assuming yes. Sue me bitch.

I do think its wrong and unethical for people to do such things as lie about a condition but I don't care either. To everyone their best I'll just up my game that's all.


For someone who accuses someone else of being whiny, you sure do whine a lot.

Woozy
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby Woozy » Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:31 pm

alienbones wrote:Speak your mind idiot. I'm not a troll and I'm not sure why I would be. I was just stating an opinion. Damn I'd love to punch you in the face.

And as for the competitive athlete remark regarding fairness I wonder if you ever played a sport outside your backyard? Nothing is fair right down to referee calls. You can't ASSUME fairness you just have to go out there and take the match or game or whatever you are competing in. Man I bet you are skinny out of shape pencil pusher who whines a lot and studies endlessly then bitches about why pro athletes make a lot of $$ and how beautiful women are all whores. I'm assuming yes. Sue me bitch.

I do think its wrong and unethical for people to do such things as lie about a condition but I don't care either. To everyone their best I'll just up my game that's all.


Good news: you've convinced me that you have a mental disability. Now just convince the LSAC and you'll be ready to "rock" those scores.
Last edited by Woozy on Sun Nov 22, 2009 11:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

avacado111
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby avacado111 » Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:32 pm

Trifles wrote:
angioletto wrote:While I don't think anything is wrong with accomodations for those with ADD/dyslexia I do wonder how those students tend to do once they get into law school and accomodations are no longer available.


Those accommodations will be available in law school, and someone diagnosed with a learning disability will most likely receive extended time on their law school exams.


Does extended time help on law school exams?

Oblomov
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby Oblomov » Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:39 pm

avacado111 wrote:
Trifles wrote:
angioletto wrote:While I don't think anything is wrong with accomodations for those with ADD/dyslexia I do wonder how those students tend to do once they get into law school and accomodations are no longer available.


Those accommodations will be available in law school, and someone diagnosed with a learning disability will most likely receive extended time on their law school exams.


Does extended time help on law school exams?


Of course it does.


I suspect your remark was rhetorical, but schools will give you extra time on exams. And unlike LSAC telling the school, I suspect that they're not telling employers.

avacado111
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby avacado111 » Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:49 pm

Oblomov wrote:
avacado111 wrote:
Trifles wrote:
angioletto wrote:While I don't think anything is wrong with accomodations for those with ADD/dyslexia I do wonder how those students tend to do once they get into law school and accomodations are no longer available.


Those accommodations will be available in law school, and someone diagnosed with a learning disability will most likely receive extended time on their law school exams.


Does extended time help on law school exams?


Of course it does.


I suspect your remark was rhetorical, but schools will give you extra time on exams. And unlike LSAC telling the school, I suspect that they're not telling employers.


No, I actually wasn't. I thought exams were more dealing with identifying/interpreting the law and the way you do it. I thought exams were based upon this and timing didn't really matter that much. That was my perception.

Oblomov
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby Oblomov » Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:52 pm

avacado111 wrote:No, I actually wasn't. I thought exams were more dealing with identifying/interpreting the law and the way you do it. I thought exams were based upon this and timing didn't really matter that much. That was my perception.



Ah, the naivete is strong in this one. No, exams are about how much you can spew onto the page in 3 hours; some are even open-book. Obviously you need to know your shit, but when you're dealing with a tight curve, timing is everything.

avacado111
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby avacado111 » Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:57 pm

Oblomov wrote:
avacado111 wrote:No, I actually wasn't. I thought exams were more dealing with identifying/interpreting the law and the way you do it. I thought exams were based upon this and timing didn't really matter that much. That was my perception.



Ah, the naivete is strong in this one. No, exams are about how much you can spew onto the page in 3 hours; some are even open-book. Obviously you need to know your shit, but when you're dealing with a tight curve, timing is everything.


makes sense. thanks for clearing that one up.

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blhblahblah
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby blhblahblah » Mon Nov 23, 2009 2:11 am

alienbones wrote:Speak your mind idiot. I'm not a troll and I'm not sure why I would be. I was just stating an opinion. Damn I'd love to punch you in the face.

And as for the competitive athlete remark regarding fairness I wonder if you ever played a sport outside your backyard? Nothing is fair right down to referee calls. You can't ASSUME fairness you just have to go out there and take the match or game or whatever you are competing in. Man I bet you are skinny out of shape pencil pusher who whines a lot and studies endlessly then bitches about why pro athletes make a lot of $$ and how beautiful women are all whores. I'm assuming yes. Sue me bitch.

I do think its wrong and unethical for people to do such things as lie about a condition but I don't care either. To everyone their best I'll just up my game that's all.


--ImageRemoved--

Thought you might need these, champ.

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nematoad
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby nematoad » Thu Apr 22, 2010 4:47 am

so i've got an eye disease in both eyes called keratoconus and as a result legally blind in the right eye and the best i can get with glasses/contacts in the left is 20/50. The disease disfigures the cornea so as a result glasses/contacts have a minimal affect. Because of my left eye im able to read size 10 font but with difficulty and after 5 sections my eyes are always bloodshot and my heads pounding. I've never had accommodated testing, but the disease has made reading pretty damn difficult as of late since this shits been getting worse by the month, I've got all the forms filled out to send to LSAC for accommodated testing (extra time and larger font) but I'm hesitant to pull the trigger because of the red flag on the score. I already took the lsat and got a 162 w/o accommodations and think I can do better even w/o it, but i feel part of the reason I got that score was cause fuckin eyes. What do you guys think? do it? or nay?

IBThatGuy
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby IBThatGuy » Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:30 am

nematoad wrote:so i've got an eye disease in both eyes called keratoconus and as a result legally blind in the right eye and the best i can get with glasses/contacts in the left is 20/50. The disease disfigures the cornea so as a result glasses/contacts have a minimal affect. Because of my left eye im able to read size 10 font but with difficulty and after 5 sections my eyes are always bloodshot and my heads pounding. I've never had accommodated testing, but the disease has made reading pretty damn difficult as of late since this shits been getting worse by the month, I've got all the forms filled out to send to LSAC for accommodated testing (extra time and larger font) but I'm hesitant to pull the trigger because of the red flag on the score. I already took the lsat and got a 162 w/o accommodations and think I can do better even w/o it, but i feel part of the reason I got that score was cause fuckin eyes. What do you guys think? do it? or nay?


As to whether or not you should go for the extra time: Try taking a practice test with an extra 12 minutes per section. The results won't tell you whether or not you'll get accommodations, but they might point to whether or not it's worth the flag. The consensus is that it's extremely difficult to get extended time. You'd have to show that extra time is the only (maybe most?) appropriate solution.

Worth noting: You can request extra-large font (18-point) and a "nonscannable" answer sheet (scantron-style, but with larger bubbles). If you do take it again, with or without extra time, I would definitely request those. You won't have to go through as much testing if you go for just those.

Probably not worth noting: A lot of people respond to these discussions by challenging other posters' abilities to cut it as lawyers; "You don't get extra time to write memos," and so on. I wouldn't presume for a moment to know whether or not someone else can make it as a lawyer. Assuming you can, though, I would have to think that practice will not be fun for you. Really not trying to jab, be dismissive, or anything like that. If nothing else, I would start looking into long-term solutions (which I assume you have).

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nematoad
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby nematoad » Thu Apr 22, 2010 12:47 pm

IBThatGuy wrote:
nematoad wrote:so i've got an eye disease in both eyes called keratoconus and as a result legally blind in the right eye and the best i can get with glasses/contacts in the left is 20/50. The disease disfigures the cornea so as a result glasses/contacts have a minimal affect. Because of my left eye im able to read size 10 font but with difficulty and after 5 sections my eyes are always bloodshot and my heads pounding. I've never had accommodated testing, but the disease has made reading pretty damn difficult as of late since this shits been getting worse by the month, I've got all the forms filled out to send to LSAC for accommodated testing (extra time and larger font) but I'm hesitant to pull the trigger because of the red flag on the score. I already took the lsat and got a 162 w/o accommodations and think I can do better even w/o it, but i feel part of the reason I got that score was cause fuckin eyes. What do you guys think? do it? or nay?


As to whether or not you should go for the extra time: Try taking a practice test with an extra 12 minutes per section. The results won't tell you whether or not you'll get accommodations, but they might point to whether or not it's worth the flag. The consensus is that it's extremely difficult to get extended time. You'd have to show that extra time is the only (maybe most?) appropriate solution.

Worth noting: You can request extra-large font (18-point) and a "nonscannable" answer sheet (scantron-style, but with larger bubbles). If you do take it again, with or without extra time, I would definitely request those. You won't have to go through as much testing if you go for just those.

Probably not worth noting: A lot of people respond to these discussions by challenging other posters' abilities to cut it as lawyers; "You don't get extra time to write memos," and so on. I wouldn't presume for a moment to know whether or not someone else can make it as a lawyer. Assuming you can, though, I would have to think that practice will not be fun for you. Really not trying to jab, be dismissive, or anything like that. If nothing else, I would start looking into long-term solutions (which I assume you have).


In reagrds to adding on an extra 12 minutes per section, if i did that the only section I'd see a noteworthy difference would be RC, probably up from the -5,6,7 to the -2,3,4 ranger. The problem doesnt come so much from having trouble reading all the material in the alotted time (although I'm slower now than I used to be), it's doing it 5 times over. If i had a break between every section to stretch my eyes, I'd imagine I'd be golden. My timed PTs range from 164-172 but I've never tried it untimed. I think its worth noting that on the december test when I got the 162 I literally missed half my total incorrect answers on the last section.... But I'm sure many people burn out by the end of the exam, so take that for what its worth.
My only fear of just getting the 18font is messing up my rhythm having never seen an 18font lsat. So i dont see myself taking just the font. Ironically I find smaller font much more appealing than large.
My main concern is it even worth having extra time when I'm capable of getting it done w/o. (I'm sure this statement will drive some wild). From what I've heard, if I apply for it, I'll get it. Realistically, the extra time will definitely help the nerves in addition, which may make for an even larger boost in my score.

IBthatguy, I don't imagine any job that would require alot of reading would be that fun for my eyes. Too bad for them, after sex, reading and writing are my favorite things to do. Worst case I'd get a corneal transplant, but that would be when both eyes are shot. I just really can't see myself basing my future career around my eyes, even though that may be the most prudent thing to do. James Joyce was practically blind, but he found a way.

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jpSartre
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby jpSartre » Thu Apr 22, 2010 1:47 pm

Trifles wrote:
angioletto wrote:While I don't think anything is wrong with accomodations for those with ADD/dyslexia I do wonder how those students tend to do once they get into law school and accomodations are no longer available.


Those accommodations will be available in law school, and someone diagnosed with a learning disability will most likely receive extended time on their law school exams.


I think it's important to consider the implications of accommodations.

I think its fair to say that an ADD diagnosis implies that there is some mechanism in your brain that prevents you from focusing normally, relative to the population. So the question is, why should someone with an abnormal mechanism be compensated?

Such compensation seems to make sense if time limits were not a part of law school or being a lawyer. But time limits DO matter in these circumstances.

So unless there is a better way to test for your ability to think logically and on a deadline in the real world (things you have to do as a law student and as a lawyer) other than by directly testing for these factors on the LSAT, it seems LSAC is right on this one and in fact being generous.

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nematoad
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby nematoad » Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:13 pm

bump

IBThatGuy
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby IBThatGuy » Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:14 pm

nematoad wrote:In reagrds to adding on an extra 12 minutes per section, if i did that the only section I'd see a noteworthy difference would be RC, probably up from the -5,6,7 to the -2,3,4 ranger. The problem doesnt come so much from having trouble reading all the material in the alotted time (although I'm slower now than I used to be), it's doing it 5 times over. If i had a break between every section to stretch my eyes, I'd imagine I'd be golden.


1. 162 is a pretty respectable score. Depending on your GPA, you could have some good options.
2. They're apparently really tough on giving extra time. A little break between sections seems like it would absolutely not give you any unfair advantage. What - 2-5 minutes? I would think they'd be pretty hard-pressed to deny that - especially if you don't request extra time. Be careful about stretching your eyes, though. Sounds painful

nematoad wrote:IBthatguy, I don't imagine any job that would require alot of reading would be that fun for my eyes. Too bad for them, after sex, reading and writing are my favorite things to do. Worst case I'd get a corneal transplant, but that would be when both eyes are shot. I just really can't see myself basing my future career around my eyes, even though that may be the most prudent thing to do. James Joyce was practically blind, but he found a way.


3. This, of course, begs the question: What are your favorite things to do before sex? --LinkRemoved--

Metzfan22
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby Metzfan22 » Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:07 am

alienbones wrote:LSAC used to deny any accommodations but after recent lawsuits (I love the irony) they have bent and give 1/4 time for many cases and 1/2 time in rare cases. I will probably take the test with accommodations. Honestly, if it gets me the score i need to get into Stanford I don't care if my diagnosis is BS, if my extra time is warranted or about anything except the opportunities I'll have in 4 years. Same thing with people who take Adderal or Ritalin. They are not "brain steroids" they are more like artificial limbs for someone who needs support. And some people need support. I don't get why people get catty about people who use accommodations whether warranted or not. I'm not bitter at the person who's parents paid off a shrink to write a letter encouraging the need for 2x time. Go for it. I'll still rock your score bitch. That's my attitude but at the same rate I'm not going to shove opportunity out of the way when it comes to me. I dunno I'm a competitive athlete so maybe that's why I feel the way I do.


You really don't get why people would get upset over someone faking a disability to get ahead? So if you get a 165, and I cheat for a 175 and take your spot at the law school of your choice, you'd be OK with that? LOL. Guess you don't have a problem with steroids in baseball either. For a competitive athlete, you've got no sense of fairness.

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Ragged
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby Ragged » Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:19 am

Trifles wrote:
angioletto wrote:While I don't think anything is wrong with accomodations for those with ADD/dyslexia I do wonder how those students tend to do once they get into law school and accomodations are no longer available.


Those accommodations will be available in law school, and someone diagnosed with a learning disability will most likely receive extended time on their law school exams.


Yes and when they enter the professional world they will be able to use their ADD to get extended timelines from their clients and judges as well. :roll:


I would be very disappointed if any of the top schools accepted anyone with special accomodations.

SageD
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby SageD » Mon Dec 13, 2010 3:26 pm

Hm, I have legit bad dysgraphia and mild dyslexia, and it never even occurred to me to request accommodations. Though it was a special ed administrator who diagnosed me, like, 15 years ago, back in Canada. Getting the documentation might be a hassle anyway.

But dysgraphia the whole diagramming-the-games bit a bitch.

Sandro
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Re: accomodated testing time, extra time on LSAT?

Postby Sandro » Mon Dec 13, 2010 6:32 pm

how do blind people take the LSAT?




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