After thrice attempts....lost

fire_fried_rice
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Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:06 am

After thrice attempts....lost

Postby fire_fried_rice » Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:25 am

This june test was my thrice attempt at lsat and of course I have yet again failed to get that dream score. The first two attempts, I admit that I was unprepared. I prepared for the test while at undergrad doing 18 credit + some extra works and that sure didn't work out (not to mention I only spent three to four months preparing for it). This time though (and this is after I graduated), I devoted about 6 hours per day and took my time to do the BR. And I actually felt I was improving. I started off with somewhere around low 160s to high 160s and occasional low 170s. Two month before the actual exam, I understood what the questions were asking me to find and I understood how to approach the questions to answer it. I came to the point where when I was doing the BR, most of the questions that I got wrong in the first place were due to some foolish mistakes or some misunderstanding of the answer choices. After doing the BR, the only questions that I really had difficulty were three or four. Thus, I kept on trying not to make those silly mistakes, but PT after PT, I could not close that gap. The actual exam day came and the score came out as 163, so far beneath what I was usually averaging when doing practice test. Frankly, I feel quite beaten down. I just don't know how to actually improve 'another level'. People say that lsat is learnable, and to a certain degree I do agree with that. But there is this big wall that seems to be blocking my way and I don't have the faintest clue as to how to overcome that.

"just keep on practicing and you'll get it'. No. I don't get it. Maybe I'm doing BR the wrong way or maybe I'm just not quite capable to answer questions correctly. Sigh..would love advice or help or actual experience of overcoming the barrier to higher score.

Oh, I was aiming for T3, I was hoping to get 178, but pfff...163 is far far down in the abyss compared to 178. As if I could ever get that score. Seems like that score isn't just the thing for me.

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Walliums
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby Walliums » Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:12 pm

fire_fried_rice wrote:This june test was my thrice attempt at lsat and of course I have yet again failed to get that dream score. The first two attempts, I admit that I was unprepared. I prepared for the test while at undergrad doing 18 credit + some extra works and that sure didn't work out (not to mention I only spent three to four months preparing for it). This time though (and this is after I graduated), I devoted about 6 hours per day and took my time to do the BR. And I actually felt I was improving. I started off with somewhere around low 160s to high 160s and occasional low 170s. Two month before the actual exam, I understood what the questions were asking me to find and I understood how to approach the questions to answer it. I came to the point where when I was doing the BR, most of the questions that I got wrong in the first place were due to some foolish mistakes or some misunderstanding of the answer choices. After doing the BR, the only questions that I really had difficulty were three or four. Thus, I kept on trying not to make those silly mistakes, but PT after PT, I could not close that gap. The actual exam day came and the score came out as 163, so far beneath what I was usually averaging when doing practice test. Frankly, I feel quite beaten down. I just don't know how to actually improve 'another level'. People say that lsat is learnable, and to a certain degree I do agree with that. But there is this big wall that seems to be blocking my way and I don't have the faintest clue as to how to overcome that.

"just keep on practicing and you'll get it'. No. I don't get it. Maybe I'm doing BR the wrong way or maybe I'm just not quite capable to answer questions correctly. Sigh..would love advice or help or actual experience of overcoming the barrier to higher score.

Oh, I was aiming for T3, I was hoping to get 178, but pfff...163 is far far down in the abyss compared to 178. As if I could ever get that score. Seems like that score isn't just the thing for me.


I know the feeling of scoring far beneath your PT average! But I have been really honest with myself and evaluated my prep before and I was really deficient in on key area. I am focusing on that now. Curious if you would share your score breakdown and what prep materials you have used?

fire_fried_rice
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:06 am

Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby fire_fried_rice » Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:24 pm

I took the test in a country outside U.S, so I can't really give you a breakdown. But for past exams, perfect game but heavy damage in LR(think it was -15 combined together) and -8 on reading.

for the past practice test, LR was -3/-2, game was -1 or 0 and reading was -4

Walliums wrote:
fire_fried_rice wrote:This june test was my thrice attempt at lsat and of course I have yet again failed to get that dream score. The first two attempts, I admit that I was unprepared. I prepared for the test while at undergrad doing 18 credit + some extra works and that sure didn't work out (not to mention I only spent three to four months preparing for it). This time though (and this is after I graduated), I devoted about 6 hours per day and took my time to do the BR. And I actually felt I was improving. I started off with somewhere around low 160s to high 160s and occasional low 170s. Two month before the actual exam, I understood what the questions were asking me to find and I understood how to approach the questions to answer it. I came to the point where when I was doing the BR, most of the questions that I got wrong in the first place were due to some foolish mistakes or some misunderstanding of the answer choices. After doing the BR, the only questions that I really had difficulty were three or four. Thus, I kept on trying not to make those silly mistakes, but PT after PT, I could not close that gap. The actual exam day came and the score came out as 163, so far beneath what I was usually averaging when doing practice test. Frankly, I feel quite beaten down. I just don't know how to actually improve 'another level'. People say that lsat is learnable, and to a certain degree I do agree with that. But there is this big wall that seems to be blocking my way and I don't have the faintest clue as to how to overcome that.

"just keep on practicing and you'll get it'. No. I don't get it. Maybe I'm doing BR the wrong way or maybe I'm just not quite capable to answer questions correctly. Sigh..would love advice or help or actual experience of overcoming the barrier to higher score.

Oh, I was aiming for T3, I was hoping to get 178, but pfff...163 is far far down in the abyss compared to 178. As if I could ever get that score. Seems like that score isn't just the thing for me.


I know the feeling of scoring far beneath your PT average! But I have been really honest with myself and evaluated my prep before and I was really deficient in on key area. I am focusing on that now. Curious if you would share your score breakdown and what prep materials you have used?

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Experiment626
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby Experiment626 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:33 pm

Just wondering, have you been doing blind reviews after you take a practice test? If so, what was your score range?

YinFireHare
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby YinFireHare » Thu Jul 13, 2017 12:45 pm

fire_fried_rice wrote:This june test was my thrice attempt at lsat and of course I have yet again failed to get that dream score. The first two attempts, I admit that I was unprepared. I prepared for the test while at undergrad doing 18 credit + some extra works and that sure didn't work out (not to mention I only spent three to four months preparing for it). This time though (and this is after I graduated), I devoted about 6 hours per day and took my time to do the BR. And I actually felt I was improving. I started off with somewhere around low 160s to high 160s and occasional low 170s. Two month before the actual exam, I understood what the questions were asking me to find and I understood how to approach the questions to answer it. I came to the point where when I was doing the BR, most of the questions that I got wrong in the first place were due to some foolish mistakes or some misunderstanding of the answer choices. After doing the BR, the only questions that I really had difficulty were three or four. Thus, I kept on trying not to make those silly mistakes, but PT after PT, I could not close that gap. The actual exam day came and the score came out as 163, so far beneath what I was usually averaging when doing practice test. Frankly, I feel quite beaten down. I just don't know how to actually improve 'another level'. People say that lsat is learnable, and to a certain degree I do agree with that. But there is this big wall that seems to be blocking my way and I don't have the faintest clue as to how to overcome that.

"just keep on practicing and you'll get it'. No. I don't get it. Maybe I'm doing BR the wrong way or maybe I'm just not quite capable to answer questions correctly. Sigh..would love advice or help or actual experience of overcoming the barrier to higher score.

Oh, I was aiming for T3, I was hoping to get 178, but pfff...163 is far far down in the abyss compared to 178. As if I could ever get that score. Seems like that score isn't just the thing for me.


Honestly, if we keep in mind that a little under 3% of LSAT test takers attain a score of 170+, that brings the odds into perspective in that some people simply will not achieve that mark. These are the facts.

I have gone through some things in my personal life and experienced several failures. However, as I am working through that, one thing that halts progress is Denial. It is very important to accept your reality and then do your best with what you have to work with, at any given time.

Eleanor Roosevelt once said, "You have to accept whatever comes and the only important thing is that you meet it with courage and with the best that you have to give."

fire_fried_rice
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:06 am

Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby fire_fried_rice » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:03 pm

Experiment626 wrote:Just wondering, have you been doing blind reviews after you take a practice test? If so, what was your score range?


yeah, I have doing BR after I took the practice tests. normally it was 167~ 169 and the highest was 174

fire_fried_rice
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:06 am

Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby fire_fried_rice » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:04 pm

YinFireHare wrote:
fire_fried_rice wrote:This june test was my thrice attempt at lsat and of course I have yet again failed to get that dream score. The first two attempts, I admit that I was unprepared. I prepared for the test while at undergrad doing 18 credit + some extra works and that sure didn't work out (not to mention I only spent three to four months preparing for it). This time though (and this is after I graduated), I devoted about 6 hours per day and took my time to do the BR. And I actually felt I was improving. I started off with somewhere around low 160s to high 160s and occasional low 170s. Two month before the actual exam, I understood what the questions were asking me to find and I understood how to approach the questions to answer it. I came to the point where when I was doing the BR, most of the questions that I got wrong in the first place were due to some foolish mistakes or some misunderstanding of the answer choices. After doing the BR, the only questions that I really had difficulty were three or four. Thus, I kept on trying not to make those silly mistakes, but PT after PT, I could not close that gap. The actual exam day came and the score came out as 163, so far beneath what I was usually averaging when doing practice test. Frankly, I feel quite beaten down. I just don't know how to actually improve 'another level'. People say that lsat is learnable, and to a certain degree I do agree with that. But there is this big wall that seems to be blocking my way and I don't have the faintest clue as to how to overcome that.

"just keep on practicing and you'll get it'. No. I don't get it. Maybe I'm doing BR the wrong way or maybe I'm just not quite capable to answer questions correctly. Sigh..would love advice or help or actual experience of overcoming the barrier to higher score.

Oh, I was aiming for T3, I was hoping to get 178, but pfff...163 is far far down in the abyss compared to 178. As if I could ever get that score. Seems like that score isn't just the thing for me.


Honestly, if we keep in mind that a little under 3% of LSAT test takers attain a score of 170+, that brings the odds into perspective in that some people simply will not achieve that mark. These are the facts.

I have gone through some things in my personal life and experienced several failures. However, as I am working through that, one thing that halts progress is Denial. It is very important to accept your reality and then do your best with what you have to work with, at any given time.

Eleanor Roosevelt once said, "You have to accept whatever comes and the only important thing is that you meet it with courage and with the best that you have to give."


true, very true...maybe law school isn't the life for me.. but at the same time, it's very hard to accept denial...haha

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Experiment626
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby Experiment626 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:07 pm

fire_fried_rice wrote:
Experiment626 wrote:Just wondering, have you been doing blind reviews after you take a practice test? If so, what was your score range?


yeah, I have doing BR after I took the practice tests. normally it was 167~ 169 and the highest was 174


So, I would say it sounds like there might be one or two things left that you might need to focus on. Until your BR is consistently in the mid 170's it shows there's something that you might need to strengthen. Unless the questions you're missing are all different types and then it might just be a how you're understanding the questions/ACs. After that it's just an issue of timing and test day anxiety. Timing can be solved via timed drills. Test day anxiety and the usual 2-3 point drop people experience is all about dealing with the stress and pressure. That's harder to deal with. There was a book recommended by someone else which I'm reading through: https://www.amazon.com/Performing-Under ... r+pressure

YinFireHare
Posts: 67
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby YinFireHare » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:23 pm

Experiment626 wrote:
fire_fried_rice wrote:
Experiment626 wrote:Just wondering, have you been doing blind reviews after you take a practice test? If so, what was your score range?


yeah, I have doing BR after I took the practice tests. normally it was 167~ 169 and the highest was 174


So, I would say it sounds like there might be one or two things left that you might need to focus on. Until your BR is consistently in the mid 170's it shows there's something that you might need to strengthen. Unless the questions you're missing are all different types and then it might just be a how you're understanding the questions/ACs. After that it's just an issue of timing and test day anxiety. Timing can be solved via timed drills. Test day anxiety and the usual 2-3 point drop people experience is all about dealing with the stress and pressure. That's harder to deal with. There was a book recommended by someone else which I'm reading through: https://www.amazon.com/Performing-Under ... r+pressure


Very cool idea.

For someone who has taken the exam thrice, you can always take the exam again and make a case to law schools that this exam was particularly challenging for you and what you did to master it. Alternately, you can also wait some years for the score to expire.

If you are interested to apply now, lay out your options in terms of schools and tuition and employment prospects - and go from there. The decision is yours. If you remember that and that this is YOUR game to play, you might feel better.

YinFireHare
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Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 8:31 am

Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby YinFireHare » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:23 pm

YinFireHare wrote:
Experiment626 wrote:
fire_fried_rice wrote:
Experiment626 wrote:Just wondering, have you been doing blind reviews after you take a practice test? If so, what was your score range?


yeah, I have doing BR after I took the practice tests. normally it was 167~ 169 and the highest was 174


So, I would say it sounds like there might be one or two things left that you might need to focus on. Until your BR is consistently in the mid 170's it shows there's something that you might need to strengthen. Unless the questions you're missing are all different types and then it might just be a how you're understanding the questions/ACs. After that it's just an issue of timing and test day anxiety. Timing can be solved via timed drills. Test day anxiety and the usual 2-3 point drop people experience is all about dealing with the stress and pressure. That's harder to deal with. There was a book recommended by someone else which I'm reading through: https://www.amazon.com/Performing-Under ... r+pressure


Very cool idea.

To the OP,
For someone who has taken the exam thrice, you can always take the exam again and make a case to law schools that this exam was particularly challenging for you and what you did to master it. Alternately, you can also wait some years for the score to expire.

If you are interested to apply now, lay out your options in terms of schools and tuition and employment prospects - and go from there. The decision is yours. If you remember that and that this is YOUR game to play, you might feel better.

mcmand
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby mcmand » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:23 pm

fire_fried_rice wrote:true, very true...maybe law school isn't the life for me.. but at the same time, it's very hard to accept denial...haha


Your score does not mean law school/being a lawyer isn't for you. 163 is not a terrible score. You may have to recalibrate your goals, and if what's possible isn't what you want, then maybe it's not right for you, but the score itself is not everything.

There's a fine line between emphasizing the importance of doing well on the LSAT and overloading all your expectations and dreams into it. Try to separate those out and relax. In fact, relaxing may be your best advice. You're doing well on your PT's but not so hot on test day, which might speak to test anxiety, not lack of prep or capability.

AJordan
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby AJordan » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:46 pm

Have you had a session with a competent tutor? If you're at 163 on test day you're failing some pretty basic things. I feel like people misinterpret BR. It's useful to find deficiencies, but it doesn't teach in the moment thinking. I think someone in your shoes needs an outside perspective. In some ways we are all lying to ourselves. Find someone reputable and have him/her give you a session. You've already failed enough doing it your way.

darthlawyer
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby darthlawyer » Thu Jul 13, 2017 1:51 pm

you got a good score, dogg.

mcmand
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby mcmand » Thu Jul 13, 2017 2:24 pm

AJordan wrote:Have you had a session with a competent tutor? If you're at 163 on test day you're failing some pretty basic things. I feel like people misinterpret BR. It's useful to find deficiencies, but it doesn't teach in the moment thinking. I think someone in your shoes needs an outside perspective. In some ways we are all lying to ourselves. Find someone reputable and have him/her give you a session. You've already failed enough doing it your way.


Maybe ease up on the language? He's not failing. 163 isn't a bad score. He can improve, he can do better, but he clearly gets the test on some basic level.

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Walliums
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby Walliums » Thu Jul 13, 2017 2:45 pm

fire_fried_rice wrote:I took the test in a country outside U.S, so I can't really give you a breakdown. But for past exams, perfect game but heavy damage in LR(think it was -15 combined together) and -8 on reading.

for the past practice test, LR was -3/-2, game was -1 or 0 and reading was -4

Walliums wrote:
fire_fried_rice wrote:This june test was my thrice attempt at lsat and of course I have yet again failed to get that dream score. The first two attempts, I admit that I was unprepared. I prepared for the test while at undergrad doing 18 credit + some extra works and that sure didn't work out (not to mention I only spent three to four months preparing for it). This time though (and this is after I graduated), I devoted about 6 hours per day and took my time to do the BR. And I actually felt I was improving. I started off with somewhere around low 160s to high 160s and occasional low 170s. Two month before the actual exam, I understood what the questions were asking me to find and I understood how to approach the questions to answer it. I came to the point where when I was doing the BR, most of the questions that I got wrong in the first place were due to some foolish mistakes or some misunderstanding of the answer choices. After doing the BR, the only questions that I really had difficulty were three or four. Thus, I kept on trying not to make those silly mistakes, but PT after PT, I could not close that gap. The actual exam day came and the score came out as 163, so far beneath what I was usually averaging when doing practice test. Frankly, I feel quite beaten down. I just don't know how to actually improve 'another level'. People say that lsat is learnable, and to a certain degree I do agree with that. But there is this big wall that seems to be blocking my way and I don't have the faintest clue as to how to overcome that.

"just keep on practicing and you'll get it'. No. I don't get it. Maybe I'm doing BR the wrong way or maybe I'm just not quite capable to answer questions correctly. Sigh..would love advice or help or actual experience of overcoming the barrier to higher score.

Oh, I was aiming for T3, I was hoping to get 178, but pfff...163 is far far down in the abyss compared to 178. As if I could ever get that score. Seems like that score isn't just the thing for me.


I know the feeling of scoring far beneath your PT average! But I have been really honest with myself and evaluated my prep before and I was really deficient in on key area. I am focusing on that now. Curious if you would share your score breakdown and what prep materials you have used?


And what prep materials have you used? I'm thinking you need to sit down with a good book for LR. The Trainer is a great resource for both LR and RC.

AJordan
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby AJordan » Thu Jul 13, 2017 3:15 pm

mcmand wrote:
AJordan wrote:Have you had a session with a competent tutor? If you're at 163 on test day you're failing some pretty basic things. I feel like people misinterpret BR. It's useful to find deficiencies, but it doesn't teach in the moment thinking. I think someone in your shoes needs an outside perspective. In some ways we are all lying to ourselves. Find someone reputable and have him/her give you a session. You've already failed enough doing it your way.


Maybe ease up on the language? He's not failing. 163 isn't a bad score. He can improve, he can do better, but he clearly gets the test on some basic level.


I do believe someone scoring 15 points below their targeted score on test day is a failure. Now, yes, you're right, probably not the best way to communicate that. Tempered expectation may be (probably are) the correct antidote here. Certainly I agree that low 160s is a fine maxed score for someone who has PTed in that range and is hoping for that range. For someone going in thinking 178 though, it's a failure.

fire_fried_rice
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby fire_fried_rice » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:05 pm

AJordan wrote:
mcmand wrote:
AJordan wrote:Have you had a session with a competent tutor? If you're at 163 on test day you're failing some pretty basic things. I feel like people misinterpret BR. It's useful to find deficiencies, but it doesn't teach in the moment thinking. I think someone in your shoes needs an outside perspective. In some ways we are all lying to ourselves. Find someone reputable and have him/her give you a session. You've already failed enough doing it your way.


Maybe ease up on the language? He's not failing. 163 isn't a bad score. He can improve, he can do better, but he clearly gets the test on some basic level.


I do believe someone scoring 15 points below their targeted score on test day is a failure. Now, yes, you're right, probably not the best way to communicate that. Tempered expectation may be (probably are) the correct antidote here. Certainly I agree that low 160s is a fine maxed score for someone who has PTed in that range and is hoping for that range. For someone going in thinking 178 though, it's a failure.



no, I completely agree with you. It was a failure and it is a failure. I thought about the tutor session, but I have some doubts with it as well. I feel that the tutor would teach the test the way he or she sees it and I might have hard time coping with the 'new' way of seeing the test.

So, BR isn't the gold key, is that what you are saying? I thought all along that with good and steady BR, I can master the test.

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Experiment626
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby Experiment626 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 7:17 pm

fire_fried_rice wrote:
AJordan wrote:
mcmand wrote:
AJordan wrote:Have you had a session with a competent tutor? If you're at 163 on test day you're failing some pretty basic things. I feel like people misinterpret BR. It's useful to find deficiencies, but it doesn't teach in the moment thinking. I think someone in your shoes needs an outside perspective. In some ways we are all lying to ourselves. Find someone reputable and have him/her give you a session. You've already failed enough doing it your way.


Maybe ease up on the language? He's not failing. 163 isn't a bad score. He can improve, he can do better, but he clearly gets the test on some basic level.


I do believe someone scoring 15 points below their targeted score on test day is a failure. Now, yes, you're right, probably not the best way to communicate that. Tempered expectation may be (probably are) the correct antidote here. Certainly I agree that low 160s is a fine maxed score for someone who has PTed in that range and is hoping for that range. For someone going in thinking 178 though, it's a failure.



no, I completely agree with you. It was a failure and it is a failure. I thought about the tutor session, but I have some doubts with it as well. I feel that the tutor would teach the test the way he or she sees it and I might have hard time coping with the 'new' way of seeing the test.

So, BR isn't the gold key, is that what you are saying? I thought all along that with good and steady BR, I can master the test.


Good BR will help show what you're getting wrong in test situations but if you're not getting in the 170's with no time pressure then there's a fundamental issue that you need to identify. A good tutor doesn't force their methods, they identify the issues and help you figure out a way that works best for you.

I wouldn't say total failure yet, it would be failure if you were PTing in your target range and didn't perform. Honestly if your goal was 178, you shouldn't have even taken the test with your PT range.

fire_fried_rice
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby fire_fried_rice » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:00 pm

Walliums wrote:
fire_fried_rice wrote:I took the test in a country outside U.S, so I can't really give you a breakdown. But for past exams, perfect game but heavy damage in LR(think it was -15 combined together) and -8 on reading.

for the past practice test, LR was -3/-2, game was -1 or 0 and reading was -4

Walliums wrote:
fire_fried_rice wrote:This june test was my thrice attempt at lsat and of course I have yet again failed to get that dream score. The first two attempts, I admit that I was unprepared. I prepared for the test while at undergrad doing 18 credit + some extra works and that sure didn't work out (not to mention I only spent three to four months preparing for it). This time though (and this is after I graduated), I devoted about 6 hours per day and took my time to do the BR. And I actually felt I was improving. I started off with somewhere around low 160s to high 160s and occasional low 170s. Two month before the actual exam, I understood what the questions were asking me to find and I understood how to approach the questions to answer it. I came to the point where when I was doing the BR, most of the questions that I got wrong in the first place were due to some foolish mistakes or some misunderstanding of the answer choices. After doing the BR, the only questions that I really had difficulty were three or four. Thus, I kept on trying not to make those silly mistakes, but PT after PT, I could not close that gap. The actual exam day came and the score came out as 163, so far beneath what I was usually averaging when doing practice test. Frankly, I feel quite beaten down. I just don't know how to actually improve 'another level'. People say that lsat is learnable, and to a certain degree I do agree with that. But there is this big wall that seems to be blocking my way and I don't have the faintest clue as to how to overcome that.

"just keep on practicing and you'll get it'. No. I don't get it. Maybe I'm doing BR the wrong way or maybe I'm just not quite capable to answer questions correctly. Sigh..would love advice or help or actual experience of overcoming the barrier to higher score.

Oh, I was aiming for T3, I was hoping to get 178, but pfff...163 is far far down in the abyss compared to 178. As if I could ever get that score. Seems like that score isn't just the thing for me.


I know the feeling of scoring far beneath your PT average! But I have been really honest with myself and evaluated my prep before and I was really deficient in on key area. I am focusing on that now. Curious if you would share your score breakdown and what prep materials you have used?


And what prep materials have you used? I'm thinking you need to sit down with a good book for LR. The Trainer is a great resource for both LR and RC.


I did use the The Trainer :D but when you use the book, how do you actually utilize it? I read it, did the questions and with some understanding of it, moved on to the practice test

fire_fried_rice
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Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby fire_fried_rice » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:02 pm

Experiment626 wrote:
fire_fried_rice wrote:
AJordan wrote:
mcmand wrote:
AJordan wrote:Have you had a session with a competent tutor? If you're at 163 on test day you're failing some pretty basic things. I feel like people misinterpret BR. It's useful to find deficiencies, but it doesn't teach in the moment thinking. I think someone in your shoes needs an outside perspective. In some ways we are all lying to ourselves. Find someone reputable and have him/her give you a session. You've already failed enough doing it your way.


Maybe ease up on the language? He's not failing. 163 isn't a bad score. He can improve, he can do better, but he clearly gets the test on some basic level.


I do believe someone scoring 15 points below their targeted score on test day is a failure. Now, yes, you're right, probably not the best way to communicate that. Tempered expectation may be (probably are) the correct antidote here. Certainly I agree that low 160s is a fine maxed score for someone who has PTed in that range and is hoping for that range. For someone going in thinking 178 though, it's a failure.



no, I completely agree with you. It was a failure and it is a failure. I thought about the tutor session, but I have some doubts with it as well. I feel that the tutor would teach the test the way he or she sees it and I might have hard time coping with the 'new' way of seeing the test.

So, BR isn't the gold key, is that what you are saying? I thought all along that with good and steady BR, I can master the test.


Good BR will help show what you're getting wrong in test situations but if you're not getting in the 170's with no time pressure then there's a fundamental issue that you need to identify. A good tutor doesn't force their methods, they identify the issues and help you figure out a way that works best for you.

I wouldn't say total failure yet, it would be failure if you were PTing in your target range and didn't perform. Honestly if your goal was 178, you shouldn't have even taken the test with your PT range.


that fundamental issue. I had the same feeling that I was missing something, since if everything was perfect and ready to go, I should be getting all the questions right during the BR. Is there a way to fix that fundamental issue? Of course, the issue could vary from person to person and question by question, but if I were to identify the problem, what would be the general approach?

fire_fried_rice
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:06 am

Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby fire_fried_rice » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:04 pm

AJordan wrote:Have you had a session with a competent tutor? If you're at 163 on test day you're failing some pretty basic things. I feel like people misinterpret BR. It's useful to find deficiencies, but it doesn't teach in the moment thinking. I think someone in your shoes needs an outside perspective. In some ways we are all lying to ourselves. Find someone reputable and have him/her give you a session. You've already failed enough doing it your way.


does tutor really help? I was always skeptic about doing session, especially if it's an on-line one. Or do you have some experience with having a session with someone reputable?

YinFireHare
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu Sep 03, 2015 8:31 am

Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby YinFireHare » Thu Jul 13, 2017 8:24 pm

fire_fried_rice wrote:
AJordan wrote:Have you had a session with a competent tutor? If you're at 163 on test day you're failing some pretty basic things. I feel like people misinterpret BR. It's useful to find deficiencies, but it doesn't teach in the moment thinking. I think someone in your shoes needs an outside perspective. In some ways we are all lying to ourselves. Find someone reputable and have him/her give you a session. You've already failed enough doing it your way.


does tutor really help? I was always skeptic about doing session, especially if it's an on-line one. Or do you have some experience with having a session with someone reputable?


I don't think you need a tutor in the traditional sense as much as someone with whom you can discuss your mistakes/flawed reasoning. Help you figure out the correct logic so you can get the next similar question correct.

fire_fried_rice
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:06 am

Re: After thrice attempts....lost

Postby fire_fried_rice » Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:21 pm

YinFireHare wrote:
fire_fried_rice wrote:
AJordan wrote:Have you had a session with a competent tutor? If you're at 163 on test day you're failing some pretty basic things. I feel like people misinterpret BR. It's useful to find deficiencies, but it doesn't teach in the moment thinking. I think someone in your shoes needs an outside perspective. In some ways we are all lying to ourselves. Find someone reputable and have him/her give you a session. You've already failed enough doing it your way.


does tutor really help? I was always skeptic about doing session, especially if it's an on-line one. Or do you have some experience with having a session with someone reputable?


I don't think you need a tutor in the traditional sense as much as someone with whom you can discuss your mistakes/flawed reasoning. Help you figure out the correct logic so you can get the next similar question correct.


but if that person is a test taker like me, isn't there the danger of in correcting assuming the logic of the question? For me, I feel this some sort of barrier . Some of the questions, I can say with 100% confidence that this answer choice is correct for this reason, but there are some questions where I'm not so sure on the correct answer, but only to circle it as correct because the other four is wrong or seems less wrong than the other four choices. At this point, I feel that I can easily get over 170, but when doing the practice test, I consistently get between 67, 68, 69. The silly mistakes are pulling down and I can't find the solution to get over them.




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