The Official September 2017 Study Group

Prepare for the LSAT or discuss it with others in this forum.

Are you ready for tomorrow?!?!?!

FUCK YES
20
43%
Yeah, kind of
8
17%
Ehh, hoping for the best
7
15%
Not prepared but screw it
3
6%
HAHAHA I'M NOT EVEN TAKING THE LSAT, SUCKS FOR YOU GUYS
9
19%
 
Total votes: 47

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abujabal

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby abujabal » Mon Jul 03, 2017 8:15 pm

[quote="digitality"][/quote]

Biggest thing I'd consider is the timing there. For the RC, constant drilling may be your best friend to get your easy questions done in seconds.

On my end today, did a series of 3LGs and 2LRs aimed at getting my LG within 35:00, and my LR fatigue down a bit.

LG1: -5 (-5:16)
LG2: -3 (-0:00)
LG3: -3 (-0:07)
LR1: -4 (-0:00)
LR2: -6 (-0:00)

A little frustrated with the LG score, though happy to have had three in the bounds of the time limit (though #2 I had to make educated guesses on two of the last questions, one of which was wrong. LG1 had me literally count something wrong... For a stupid point loss.

LR is at a concerning place. Looks like my range is -2/-6, and that's not ok. Needs to be consistently around -3 at minimum. So definitely more drilling work to be done there. Not sure if there's anything left but to drill. Definitely think that I can do that, but I'm concerned that we're 10 weeks out and I'm not breaking 170 yet.

PT56 tomorrow, because nothing's more American than an LSAT...

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby Csupo » Mon Jul 03, 2017 8:29 pm

So someone on craigslist is selling a set of Cambridge packets (LR, RC, and LG from PT 41-60) for $150. Condition is "excellent and never used." Do you guys think it's worth it? Or should I just purchase the RC one?

Slippin' Jimmy

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby Slippin' Jimmy » Mon Jul 03, 2017 8:41 pm

Posted this in the June Waiters thread, but since I may be joining you guys in a few days thought I'd post it here.

Anyone have experience with Manhattan Prep? I've tried Powerscore and really hate their methods, while I loved 7sage and the Trainer. I'm pulled towards Manhattan for a possible retake because I've heard it is geared more towards high scorers and one of the Authors is Mike Kim who wrote the Trainer.

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creed

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby creed » Mon Jul 03, 2017 8:57 pm

digitality wrote:Hi guys, newbie here. Do I have time to get to 172?

Wrapped up 4th week on LSAT Trainer 20 test study plan. Enjoying it; much more fun than the MCAT. Cold diagnostic four weeks ago = 162. Just graded my first full PT since then.

PT 63

LR1 -5
LG -5
LR2 -3
RC -1

167

I'm good at RC. Given 42 to 45 minutes I can go —3 to — 0 on games. I can feel myself getting better at LR. Given unlimited time, I feel i can easily hit 172 (so can a lot of people, of course). Right now i'm interpreting that as meaning i have the cognitive ability to answer enough questions correctly, i just need to put in the work to pull it off in time. First, is that a correct assumption? Second, if i am correct, do I have enough time?

One wrinkle: I move on August 15th to start grad school. Idk how much i'll be able to study once I start my masters program. Right now I'm operating under the assumption that between now and test day (~10.5 weeks) I have time for about 7 true weeks of studying. In addition to the Trainer, i have the Manhattan LR, which i plan to break out next week. (The plan is to either leave academia in 2 years with my MA and apply to law school, or, if i have the guts to risk becoming the world's most overqualified barista, stay for the PhD. I gather an MA is a pretty insignificant soft, but I love what I'm studying and maybe it'll make me look good next to K-JD kids.) I do worry that if I don't take in September i will lose any sharpness i've got by the time December rolls around, especially since I'll be grading finals on top of taking my own...

And like everyone and their mother, I'd love to go CCN or even HS, so I'd rather not retake. Thanks, sorry if i've broken any rules! Figured I'd try this existing thread first because newbies are always getting harangued for starting unnecessary threads. But i guess if I don't get many bites i'll have to risk it...


Short answer: you should almost certainly have enough time to get to 172. The conventional wisdom is that you can get to a consistent -0/-1 on LG with the right amount of work, and given your diagnostic, 7 weeks + whatever you can get in during your program should be enough time to get there. (Have you already drilled each type of LG question?) If you can pin down consistent questions you're missing in LR (7sage analytics can help with this), that should help you tighten up those sections as well. RC is my most natural as well-- I consider it to be pretty lucky, given that most of what I've read suggests that improving RC scores isn't nearly as cut and dry as the other sections.

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creed

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby creed » Mon Jul 03, 2017 9:00 pm

Drilled the rest of the advanced linear games today. (God bless 7sage explainers). Was going to hunker down on LR, but I decided to order the Powerscore LR question sets and I'm going to wait until those arrive to dedicate large blocks of time. I feel the Bible is only going to get me so far and that doing full LR sections doesn't allow me to isolate the problems at which I am the weakest.

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digitality

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby digitality » Mon Jul 03, 2017 9:38 pm

creed wrote: Short answer: you should almost certainly have enough time to get to 172. The conventional wisdom is that you can get to a consistent -0/-1 on LG with the right amount of work, and given your diagnostic, 7 weeks + whatever you can get in during your program should be enough time to get there. (Have you already drilled each type of LG question?) If you can pin down consistent questions you're missing in LR (7sage analytics can help with this), that should help you tighten up those sections as well. RC is my most natural as well-- I consider it to be pretty lucky, given that most of what I've read suggests that improving RC scores isn't nearly as cut and dry as the other sections.


Very cool, thanks! I have not drilled all the different LG types yet—only ordering and grouping. That seems to be as far as the Trainer breaks things down (so far I really appreciate Mike's conceptual, ~gestalt view of the test). But i forgot to mention i also purchased the Cambridge Problem-Type Drilling Companion (from what I've read, RIP packets, but this seems pretty solid) and it also has sections on Determined/Undetermined Assignment, Limited Allocations, etc. This week is a games week, so I'll be sure to tie that material in with the Trainer.

I just BR'd LR1 from PT 63 (thanks for that tip, guys!) and I feel so dumb: 3 of my misses were just me biting on an early, appealing choice instead of reading carefully through (E). No excuse for that, especially considering I finished with 2 minutes to spare. But it was encouraging to go -1, even though I'd already seen the material! No trend emerging so far re: specific LRs that trip me up; mostly just carelessness/loss of focus. Still have another section to BR then review, though.

Speaking of BRs, are you guys timing those? I started with a timer, but since I recognized most of the stimuli and knew I had most of the answers cold, it didn't feel like the clock was really going to represent anything meaningful. I felt like it would be more worthwhile to methodically go through every single answer choice—even for qs I had cold—and basically say aloud what was right/wrong about it. And even though i spent an unrealistic amount of time on the handful of more difficult questions, I feel like i learned the flaws better than just trying to tear through them at full speed. Obviously with that approach the whole BR took closer to 50-55 minutes for the section. Thoughts?

Thanks everybody!

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Rupert Pupkin

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby Rupert Pupkin » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:20 pm

littlewing67 wrote:
jagerbom79 wrote:Ayy good stuff! If it makes you feel any better I am at a similar stage (behind where I would like to be but thats Ok)..Staying in on the 4th as well to make up for it.


Aw it does make me feel better especially since everyone ITT is getting a diagnostic of a 180 :lol: No hate I'm just jealous!

You're a retaker right? GL friend, hopefully our hard work pays off!


Yeah Im a retaker from Sept last yr with you 8) . We got it this time!

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Rupert Pupkin

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby Rupert Pupkin » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:21 pm

Slippin' Jimmy wrote:Posted this in the June Waiters thread, but since I may be joining you guys in a few days thought I'd post it here.

Anyone have experience with Manhattan Prep? I've tried Powerscore and really hate their methods, while I loved 7sage and the Trainer. I'm pulled towards Manhattan for a possible retake because I've heard it is geared more towards high scorers and one of the Authors is Mike Kim who wrote the Trainer.


I used Powerscore my first take (and I dont think it was bad), but this time around Im using the Trainer and the MH Series and 7sage LG videos. Love it. The trainer and the MH LR/LG relate so well. It just seems to be sinking into my head more this time around. Could be the better prep company or since i already have a good base. Def would recommend checking out MH

littlewing67

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby littlewing67 » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:52 pm

.
Last edited by littlewing67 on Tue Aug 08, 2017 1:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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creed

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby creed » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:59 pm

Let's all just hope our test doesn't meet the same fate as the June waiters... a quick look at their thread is a real bummer

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby creed » Tue Jul 04, 2017 7:24 pm

Finished drilling Advanced Linear today, then went back and did a second run-through of each basic linear, including underfunded and overloaded. I recorded a significant time improvement on nearly every problem, which was encouraging. I'm going to focus on LG until my LR question packet gets in.

Question: for those who have done comparative reading sections, are they typically easier or harder than a normal single passage? (apologies if this is a reductionist way of asking).

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Rupert Pupkin

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby Rupert Pupkin » Tue Jul 04, 2017 7:32 pm

creed wrote:Finished drilling Advanced Linear today, then went back and did a second run-through of each basic linear, including underfunded and overloaded. I recorded a significant time improvement on nearly every problem, which was encouraging. I'm going to focus on LG until my LR question packet gets in.

Question: for those who have done comparative reading sections, are they typically easier or harder than a normal single passage? (apologies if this is a reductionist way of asking).


I dont think its any harder or easier than normal passages. In some ways easier though, i think, because you have to shortened topics and its easy to wrap your head around every detail. Ultimately, passage difficulty probably fluctuates the same as normal passages

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HesusChrist

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby HesusChrist » Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:34 pm

PT 72 and BR today. Scored 174 (LR: -5, LG: -2, RC: -2). Made a few careless errors that held me back from a 175+. Still struggling to get those last couple LR questions. How fully I'll break the plateau sooner rather than later.

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby Ira Hayes » Tue Jul 04, 2017 11:46 pm

After a long weekend of studying, I decided to take a PT spur of the moment today. Got a 172, but went -6 on a single LR section :roll: Don't know how to mend it, they were all past question 15 I noticed.

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby Impressionist » Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:37 am

digitality wrote:
creed wrote: Speaking of BRs, are you guys timing those? I started with a timer, but since I recognized most of the stimuli and knew I had most of the answers cold, it didn't feel like the clock was really going to represent anything meaningful. I felt like it would be more worthwhile to methodically go through every single answer choice—even for qs I had cold—and basically say aloud what was right/wrong about it. And even though i spent an unrealistic amount of time on the handful of more difficult questions, I feel like i learned the flaws better than just trying to tear through them at full speed. Obviously with that approach the whole BR took closer to 50-55 minutes for the section. Thoughts?

Thanks everybody!


I personally don't time BR. Since I understand most of them from memory I can go through some quickly and timing would definitely not be a useful indicator of anything.

I actually like your idea of explaining why each AC is wrong as you go through them. God knows I need to getting only 178 and 176 on BR. Missing the same question twice... ffs.

Non-BR related, scored my second 172 in a row. Makes me feel better and dispels the creeping thought that the first was a fluke.

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby sodomojo » Wed Jul 05, 2017 4:05 am

Just finished three weeks of going through the LGB and LRB cover to cover and decided to take my first PT today (didn't take a diagnostic).

PT 1
166
RC: -7 (didn't prep for RC at all)
LG: -4 (ran out of time, got every other question)
LR: -3
LR: -5

I went in thinking I'd be happy with a 165 come September, so this was a pleasant surprise. Hopefully it wasn't a fluke. I just have a couple questions...

- How am I looking for a 170 come September? A 167+ should put me in a solid spot given my GPA, so I'm hoping for that at least. I am also prepared to retake in December if necessary.

- Where to go from here? Am I good to start drilling/PTing or would I stand to benefit from some more prep material? I have been considering LSAT Trainer and 7Sage - leaning towards the latter because the video format would be a welcome change of pace and I have heard good things about his LG methods (a bit iffy on how LGB taught grouping/sequencing games).

- Suggestions on prep materials/methods for RC prepping? Is the RCB worth going through?

- How do you guys select which PTs to drill/take in full? I know the general advice of saving the most recent PTs in full for closer to exam day, but I also don't see many people talking about older PTs (e.g. from the single digits), are they not worthwhile or something?

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby AJordan » Wed Jul 05, 2017 4:46 am

jagerbom79 wrote:
creed wrote:Finished drilling Advanced Linear today, then went back and did a second run-through of each basic linear, including underfunded and overloaded. I recorded a significant time improvement on nearly every problem, which was encouraging. I'm going to focus on LG until my LR question packet gets in.

Question: for those who have done comparative reading sections, are they typically easier or harder than a normal single passage? (apologies if this is a reductionist way of asking).


I dont think its any harder or easier than normal passages. In some ways easier though, i think, because you have to shortened topics and its easy to wrap your head around every detail. Ultimately, passage difficulty probably fluctuates the same as normal passages


I definitely noticed an improvement on comparative reading after I started reading the first passage, going through the questions and crossing out wrong answers on the comparative questions (and obviously answering the solo passage A questions) and then moving on to the second passage. It probably took me an extra minute (comparative passages take me about 9 minutes and others 8) but I really felt like I had an easier time with those passages using that method.
Last edited by AJordan on Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby abecker2014 » Wed Jul 05, 2017 10:00 am

Just getting started on this LSAT thing, any recommendations?

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby contrapositivity » Wed Jul 05, 2017 10:25 am

SO I just discovered this forum and could use some advice. I finished the LGB and am almost done with the trainer, so I took my first timed practice test (PT 61) last week and scored a 160. I am super disappointed and want to reach a 170 by September. Logic Games give me the most trouble, even though I've gone through the Cambridge packets and did all the logic game sections up to practice test 61. I am now in the process of going back over previous logic games that took me over 8:45. Any suggestions? I can't seem to improve on logic games! I watch the 7Sage videos for games that give me trouble and redo them. Also, even basic linear games still take me almost the full 8:45. It's the timing that hurts me. Thank you so much! I am sorry for impeding on this forum lol.

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby PrezRand » Wed Jul 05, 2017 10:29 am

contrapositivity wrote:SO I just discovered this forum and could use some advice. I finished the LGB and am almost done with the trainer, so I took my first timed practice test (PT 61) last week and scored a 160. I am super disappointed and want to reach a 170 by September. Logic Games give me the most trouble, even though I've gone through the Cambridge packets and did all the logic game sections up to practice test 61. I am now in the process of going back over previous logic games that took me over 8:45. Any suggestions? I can't seem to improve on logic games! I watch the 7Sage videos for games that give me trouble and redo them. Also, even basic linear games still take me almost the full 8:45. It's the timing that hurts me. Thank you so much! I am sorry for impeding on this forum lol.

repetition man repetition

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby contrapositivity » Wed Jul 05, 2017 10:42 am

PrezRand wrote:
contrapositivity wrote:SO I just discovered this forum and could use some advice. I finished the LGB and am almost done with the trainer, so I took my first timed practice test (PT 61) last week and scored a 160. I am super disappointed and want to reach a 170 by September. Logic Games give me the most trouble, even though I've gone through the Cambridge packets and did all the logic game sections up to practice test 61. I am now in the process of going back over previous logic games that took me over 8:45. Any suggestions? I can't seem to improve on logic games! I watch the 7Sage videos for games that give me trouble and redo them. Also, even basic linear games still take me almost the full 8:45. It's the timing that hurts me. Thank you so much! I am sorry for impeding on this forum lol.

repetition man repetition


I feel like I've been doing repetition (well, I've really just gone over the games that took me over 8:45 until I've gotten them under that) but I'm still not improving overall as each new game feels like a complete different challenge! Argh. Thanks for the reply though!

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby Mikey » Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:21 am

contrapositivity wrote:SO I just discovered this forum and could use some advice. I finished the LGB and am almost done with the trainer, so I took my first timed practice test (PT 61) last week and scored a 160. I am super disappointed and want to reach a 170 by September. Logic Games give me the most trouble, even though I've gone through the Cambridge packets and did all the logic game sections up to practice test 61. I am now in the process of going back over previous logic games that took me over 8:45. Any suggestions? I can't seem to improve on logic games! I watch the 7Sage videos for games that give me trouble and redo them. Also, even basic linear games still take me almost the full 8:45. It's the timing that hurts me. Thank you so much! I am sorry for impeding on this forum lol.

just like rand said, repetition is the biggest factor for LG. I see you've done up to PT61 for LG, so honestly, do those games over again.

what I did to get LG as my best section, was that I did games by game type, then once I got used to them, I did full sections. used a stopwatch to see how long each game took me. when finished with the full section, if it took me longer than 35 mins and/or I got even 1 question wrong on 1 game, I would do the ENTIRE SECTION over again the next day. it was like "punishing myself" so that way I would go a lot faster the next time and actually get none wrong. seems a bit extreme, but this was my method of repetition.

just keep practicing, you'll get it eventually honestly.

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby contrapositivity » Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:29 am

Mikey wrote:
contrapositivity wrote:SO I just discovered this forum and could use some advice. I finished the LGB and am almost done with the trainer, so I took my first timed practice test (PT 61) last week and scored a 160. I am super disappointed and want to reach a 170 by September. Logic Games give me the most trouble, even though I've gone through the Cambridge packets and did all the logic game sections up to practice test 61. I am now in the process of going back over previous logic games that took me over 8:45. Any suggestions? I can't seem to improve on logic games! I watch the 7Sage videos for games that give me trouble and redo them. Also, even basic linear games still take me almost the full 8:45. It's the timing that hurts me. Thank you so much! I am sorry for impeding on this forum lol.

just like rand said, repetition is the biggest factor for LG. I see you've done up to PT61 for LG, so honestly, do those games over again.

what I did to get LG as my best section, was that I did games by game type, then once I got used to them, I did full sections. used a stopwatch to see how long each game took me. when finished with the full section, if it took me longer than 35 mins and/or I got even 1 question wrong on 1 game, I would do the ENTIRE SECTION over again the next day. it was like "punishing myself" so that way I would go a lot faster the next time and actually get none wrong. seems a bit extreme, but this was my method of repetition.

just keep practicing, you'll get it eventually honestly.


Thanks so much.I think I'm too short on time to sort them all by game type and do them that way so I think I'll just go back and redo the sections. I guess I needed to hear it. THANK YOU!!

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby tapenade » Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:01 pm

-2 on PT 45's LG! Both questions were silly mistakes that took 2 minutes to BR.

I think those games were unusually easy, but it still feels great :)

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Re: The Official September 2017 Study Group

Postby Impressionist » Wed Jul 05, 2017 1:00 pm

contrapositivity wrote:
Mikey wrote:
contrapositivity wrote:SO I just discovered this forum and could use some advice. I finished the LGB and am almost done with the trainer, so I took my first timed practice test (PT 61) last week and scored a 160. I am super disappointed and want to reach a 170 by September. Logic Games give me the most trouble, even though I've gone through the Cambridge packets and did all the logic game sections up to practice test 61. I am now in the process of going back over previous logic games that took me over 8:45. Any suggestions? I can't seem to improve on logic games! I watch the 7Sage videos for games that give me trouble and redo them. Also, even basic linear games still take me almost the full 8:45. It's the timing that hurts me. Thank you so much! I am sorry for impeding on this forum lol.

just like rand said, repetition is the biggest factor for LG. I see you've done up to PT61 for LG, so honestly, do those games over again.

what I did to get LG as my best section, was that I did games by game type, then once I got used to them, I did full sections. used a stopwatch to see how long each game took me. when finished with the full section, if it took me longer than 35 mins and/or I got even 1 question wrong on 1 game, I would do the ENTIRE SECTION over again the next day. it was like "punishing myself" so that way I would go a lot faster the next time and actually get none wrong. seems a bit extreme, but this was my method of repetition.

just keep practicing, you'll get it eventually honestly.


Thanks so much.I think I'm too short on time to sort them all by game type and do them that way so I think I'll just go back and redo the sections. I guess I needed to hear it. THANK YOU!!


If you have the PS LG bible it tells you the type of each game for each PT in the back if the book.



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