The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread (GREY DEY 7/1)

What now?

See you in a "personal statements" thread
35
26%
Applying this cycle, but done with TLS
6
4%
Retake in October
58
43%
Indefinite retake
10
7%
I'm gonna make a "should I retake?" thread
12
9%
Change of career choice
4
3%
Other
10
7%
 
Total votes: 135

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Oskosh
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby Oskosh » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:42 pm

Lillet71 wrote:
Oskosh wrote:
Lillet71 wrote:
Oskosh wrote:
Lillet71 wrote:
AbbeyS wrote:So about the optional diversity statement...who all is writing one that isn't about racial/cultural diversity?

is it possible for a diversity statement to hurt your chances? Let's say if you aren't culturally diverse but have had some experience that you label diverse? Idk if I'm making sense


I wrote a diversity statement in addition to my personal statement, it included my upbringing and unusual work experience. I was later told by Adcom that it was quite helpful in the admissions process. Fwiw I'm white.

I was also told that even the slightest error in grammatical structure or spelling or misuse of words will cause an otherwise outstanding applicant to be tossed into the reject pile - so I would have as many people as possible read and reread any written submissions you include with your file - these were both things I learned at ASW at two different schools this past spring - I hope that's helpful! :D

That's not always the case. I made a flagrant grammatical mistake in my PS, because I was too afraid to re-read it several times, and I was still admitted to T6 schools.


That's awesome! Just trying to pass along what I was told at ASW - are you attending this fall?

Nope. I decided to sit out to see if I could crack the T3.

I mean, I do believe that in some cases this does apply. I think it might depend on the severity of the mistake, or how consistently you are making them in the PS.


I tend to agree - that's really amazing about the T3! I hope you killed it on the LSAT :)

I hope so, too, because I am tired of this test haha. What are your plans? Are you just popping into the June waiters thread to wish people good fortune, or did you re-take the LSAT for negotiating purposes?

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JaimeD15
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby JaimeD15 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:42 pm

ruizdaw wrote:Our first club meeting will revolve around our plan to exterminate all the reverse splitters (high GPA low lsat).


I will step up as the reverse splitter Club President.

One F in my first semester (damn you College Algebra!) and As through the rest of upper level, brought me to a 3.5.

Not a super high GPA, but it works.

My LSAT will be weaker. I can't handle test anxiety. Or "waiting anxiety" either.

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JaimeD15
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby JaimeD15 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:43 pm

Two more to 100!

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JaimeD15
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby JaimeD15 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:44 pm

Yaasssssss! I have arrived. Lol

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jumbo2016
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby jumbo2016 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:44 pm

Ok. Went back as far as I could. Could only see tweets to October 2013. Here is when Dave Killoran tweeted about the scores:
February 2015 - 7:25pm (and it looks like the waiter's thread first spotted grey at exactly 8:00pm)
December 2014 - 8:11pm
September 2014 - 5:17pm for grey and 1:15pm he announced they would be released today
June 2014 - 9:05 (not really an announcement but a discussion of the curve)
December 2013 - 4:43 pm "scores will come out today"
October 2013 - 4:24 pm "scores will come out today"

From what I could see, all the people in the the Feb 2015 Waiter's forum had all pretty much given up on their scores being released that day, when they spotted grey at 8:00pm. So it doesn't always go grey at night but it doesn't look likely that we'll receive scores before noon. I think what this data 100% says is that we shouldn't be discouraged if we don't see scores by COB EST. And what it sort of says is that they can come out at pretty much any time regardless of business hours, but it is more likely that they will come out later than in the morning, since that hasn't happened once over the past 6 administrations. But nothing is impossible.

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AbbeyS
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby AbbeyS » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:45 pm

Does writing style matter on the PS?

I majored in journalism so I typically write in AP style. So someone who's used to seeing like Chicago or another style might think I'm making grammatical errors if they aren't used to AP.

I'm probably thinking about this too much, but I want to be sure. Do you think it matters the style as long as we're consistent throughout?

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Oskosh
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby Oskosh » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:45 pm

placeholder wrote:
ruizdaw wrote:
Seamus887 wrote:You don't think they would be like this guy isn't dedicated to the corporate business sell your soul life so he may not put forth all the effort in law school or even work in law afterwards?


God no. That's what the firms want to hear but absolutly not what will make you a noticeable future "academic" at the schools.
They want a unique diverse student body.
They eat up all that unique special snowflake bullshit like hotcakes.

yea i agree. Top law schools don't want to hear you are trying to get some high paying paper pusher. They are looking for those who look like leaders that they can see execute on all career paths. It's kind of a tell by how yale and standford take kids that I think want leadership position that are well connected than some guy who wants to do go to big law. IF you wanted to go corporate business world you should do investment banking.

If anything they want to know how law and humanity are related.

plus, don't get me wrong, but it's kind of stupid to do big law + t3. Unless your parents are paying for it, you could always just enroll in NYU/Columbia/Chicago with a substantial scholarship. Yale, Stanford, Harvard only give out need based aid, and even then it doesn't cover all of the debt one incurs in law school.

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Oskosh
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby Oskosh » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:46 pm

AbbeyS wrote:Does writing style matter on the PS?

I majored in journalism so I typically write in AP style. So someone who's used to seeing like Chicago or another style might think I'm making grammatical errors if they aren't used to AP.

I'm probably thinking about this too much, but I want to be sure. Do you think it matters the style as long as we're consistent throughout?

You're making too much of it. I wrote mine as a narrative.

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jumbo2016
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby jumbo2016 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:48 pm

Oskosh wrote:
AbbeyS wrote:Does writing style matter on the PS?

I majored in journalism so I typically write in AP style. So someone who's used to seeing like Chicago or another style might think I'm making grammatical errors if they aren't used to AP.

I'm probably thinking about this too much, but I want to be sure. Do you think it matters the style as long as we're consistent throughout?

You're making too much of it. I wrote mine as a narrative.


I'm pretty sure it's supposed to be narrative style. It's a two page story

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Oskosh
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby Oskosh » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:48 pm

jumbo2016 wrote:Ok. Went back as far as I could. Could only see tweets to October 2013. Here is when Dave Killoran tweeted about the scores:
February 2015 - 7:25pm (and it looks like the waiter's thread first spotted grey at exactly 8:00pm)
December 2014 - 8:11pm
September 2014 - 5:17pm for grey and 1:15pm he announced they would be released today
June 2014 - 9:05 (not really an announcement but a discussion of the curve)
December 2013 - 4:43 pm "scores will come out today"
October 2013 - 4:24 pm "scores will come out today"

From what I could see, all the people in the the Feb 2015 Waiter's forum had all pretty much given up on their scores being released that day, when they spotted grey at 8:00pm. So it doesn't always go grey at night but it doesn't look likely that we'll receive scores before noon. I think what this data 100% says is that we shouldn't be discouraged if we don't see scores by COB EST. And what it sort of says is that they can come out at pretty much any time regardless of business hours, but it is more likely that they will come out later than in the morning, since that hasn't happened once over the past 6 administrations. But nothing is impossible.

Yep. Like I said, Dec scores came out New Year's day. It's possible that they come out July 4, although improbable.

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placeholder
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby placeholder » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:48 pm

AbbeyS wrote:
placeholder wrote:
AbbeyS wrote:
placeholder wrote:
AbbeyS wrote:So about the optional diversity statement...who all is writing one that isn't about racial/cultural diversity?

is it possible for a diversity statement to hurt your chances? Let's say if you aren't culturally diverse but have had some experience that you label diverse? Idk if I'm making sense


i wouldn't unless its about being religion/belief or you had some disease. If you have one experience that you think makes you unique i'm sorry to say that should just be a personal statement. You have to remember they are gonna read a lot of diversity experiences and if yours comparably seem like "white people" enlightenment they are gonna roll their eyes at you.

I would write out a rough outline and think is this belittling someone's experience who has faced discrimination if i told them "oh i know how you feel bc this happened..." That's what really a diversity statement is how society sees you and how you dealt with it.


It wouldn't be anything about "white people problems" lol...I wasn't planning to take it from a cultural standpoint at all. I figured there were more ways to be diverse aside from just being a different race

I'm trying to be realistic like diversity means you are not of the norm and how to experience the norm will be different. You need express how that changes your relationship to the norm

That's why race/ religion/ sexual orientation/ expate/ disease/ losing of limbs are most power widely and read about diversity issues you see in the paper. B/c your relationship in society has changed.

Having a experience but no one would see you significantly different is like those light hearted soft news stories.


Yeah I see what you're saying. Just the experience I was talking about is a physical thing. I was just brainstorming anyway. I probably won't end up writing one


Honestly i'm not trying to put your idea down. Like is your physical thing like a car crash. B/c that can work. I watched a TED talk of a women who was a in an elite setting and then got into a car crash and lost a lot of mental capabilities. She felt discriminated because her speech was slower and she herself knew she wasn't as smart as she use to be.

People treated her differently because they thought she wasn't as smart as them and her confidence in herself dropped. Like the main criteria is really does society treat you different. . surviver of brain dmg is def diverse

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AbbeyS
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby AbbeyS » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:49 pm

Oskosh wrote:
AbbeyS wrote:Does writing style matter on the PS?

I majored in journalism so I typically write in AP style. So someone who's used to seeing like Chicago or another style might think I'm making grammatical errors if they aren't used to AP.

I'm probably thinking about this too much, but I want to be sure. Do you think it matters the style as long as we're consistent throughout?

You're making too much of it. I wrote mine as a narrative.


You're probably right but I heard grammar can hurt you so just wanted to be sure, ya know

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jumbo2016
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby jumbo2016 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:50 pm

jumbo2016 wrote:Ok. Went back as far as I could. Could only see tweets to October 2013. Here is when Dave Killoran tweeted about the scores:
February 2015 - 7:25pm (and it looks like the waiter's thread first spotted grey at exactly 8:00pm)
December 2014 - 8:11pm
September 2014 - 5:17pm for grey and 1:15pm he announced they would be released today
June 2014 - 9:05 (not really an announcement but a discussion of the curve)
December 2013 - 4:43 pm "scores will come out today"
October 2013 - 4:24 pm "scores will come out today"

From what I could see, all the people in the the Feb 2015 Waiter's forum had all pretty much given up on their scores being released that day, when they spotted grey at 8:00pm. So it doesn't always go grey at night but it doesn't look likely that we'll receive scores before noon. I think what this data 100% says is that we shouldn't be discouraged if we don't see scores by COB EST. And what it sort of says is that they can come out at pretty much any time regardless of business hours, but it is more likely that they will come out later than in the morning, since that hasn't happened once over the past 6 administrations. But nothing is impossible.


He didn't say anything about the february 2014 LSAT weirdly enough

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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby placeholder » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:51 pm

jumbo2016 wrote:
Oskosh wrote:
AbbeyS wrote:Does writing style matter on the PS?

I majored in journalism so I typically write in AP style. So someone who's used to seeing like Chicago or another style might think I'm making grammatical errors if they aren't used to AP.

I'm probably thinking about this too much, but I want to be sure. Do you think it matters the style as long as we're consistent throughout?

You're making too much of it. I wrote mine as a narrative.


I'm pretty sure it's supposed to be narrative style. It's a two page story

you should check out the TLS personal essay they actually give great example and why they think they are great. http://www.top-law-schools.com/personal ... mples.html

This one shows no fucks are given really:I am a thinker, but not one to think out loud. I love myself, but am not in love with the sound of my own voice. I want to be loved, but not at the cost of not loving myself. I want to know everything, but realize that nothing can ever be known for sure. I believe that nothing is absolute, but I can absolutely defend my beliefs. I understand that chance is prevalent in all aspects of life, but never leave anything important to chance. I am skeptical about everything, but realistic in the face of my skepticism. I base everything on probability, but so does nature...probably.

I believe that all our actions are determined, but feel completely free to do as I choose. I do not believe in anything resembling a God, but would never profess omniscience with regard to such issues. I have faith in nothing, but trust that my family and friends will always be faithful. I feel that religion is among the greatest problems in the world, but also understand that it is perhaps the ultimate solution. I recognize that many people derive their morals from religion, but I insist that religion is not the only fountainhead of morality. I respect the intimate connection between morality and law, but do not believe that either should unquestioningly respect the other.

I want to study the law and become a lawyer, but I do not want to study the law just because I want to become a lawyer. I am aware that the law and economics cannot always be studied in conjunction, but I do not feel that either one can be properly studied without an awareness of the other. I recognize there is more to the law than efficiency, but believe the law should recognize the importance of efficiency more than it does. I love reading about law and philosophy, but not nearly as much as I love having a good conversation about the two. I know that logic makes an argument sound, but also know that passion makes an argument sound logical. I have philosophical beliefs informed by economics and economic beliefs informed by philosophy, but I have lost track of which beliefs came first. I know it was the egg though.

I always think very practically, but do not always like to think about the practical. I have wanted to be a scientist for a while now, but it took me two undergraduate years to figure out that being a scientist does not necessarily entail working in a laboratory. I play the saxophone almost every day, but feel most like an artist when deduction is my instrument. I spent one year at a college where I did not belong and two years taking classes irrelevant for my major, but I have no regrets about my undergraduate experience. I am incredibly passionate about my interests, but cannot imagine being interested in only one passion for an entire lifetime.

I love the Yankees, but do not hate the Red Sox. I love sports, but hate the accompanying anti-intellectual culture. I may read the newspaper starting from the back, but I always make my way to the front eventually. I am liberal on some issues and conservative on others, but reasonable about all of them. I will always be politically active, but will never be a political activist. I think everything through completely, but I am never through thinking about anything.

I can get along with almost anyone, but there are very few people without whom I could not get along. I am giving of my time, but not to the point of forgetting its value. I live for each moment, but not as much as I worry about the next. I consider ambition to be of the utmost importance, but realize that it is useless without the support of hard work. I am a very competitive person, but only when competing with myself. I have a million dreams, but I am more than just a dreamer. I am usually content, but never satisfied.

I am a study in contradiction, but there is not an inconsistency to be found.

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AbbeyS
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby AbbeyS » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:58 pm

^^wow. That was really good. Really creative yet simple. Kinda mad I didn't think of it first lol

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Li'l Sebastian
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby Li'l Sebastian » Sun Jun 28, 2015 3:59 pm

If there is absolutly anything about you that could in any conceivable universe could qualify as a diversity statement that makes sense, you should write a damn diversity statement.

If you can write a diversity statement write a diversity statement.

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Li'l Sebastian
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby Li'l Sebastian » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:02 pm

I'm probably weird but I actively cringe into oblivion reading overly flowery personal statements.

Lillet71
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby Lillet71 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:03 pm

Oskosh wrote:
Lillet71 wrote:
Oskosh wrote:
Lillet71 wrote:
Oskosh wrote:
Lillet71 wrote:
AbbeyS wrote:So about the optional diversity statement...who all is writing one that isn't about racial/cultural diversity?

is it possible for a diversity statement to hurt your chances? Let's say if you aren't culturally diverse but have had some experience that you label diverse? Idk if I'm making sense


I wrote a diversity statement in addition to my personal statement, it included my upbringing and unusual work experience. I was later told by Adcom that it was quite helpful in the admissions process. Fwiw I'm white.

I was also told that even the slightest error in grammatical structure or spelling or misuse of words will cause an otherwise outstanding applicant to be tossed into the reject pile - so I would have as many people as possible read and reread any written submissions you include with your file - these were both things I learned at ASW at two different schools this past spring - I hope that's helpful! :D

That's not always the case. I made a flagrant grammatical mistake in my PS, because I was too afraid to re-read it several times, and I was still admitted to T6 schools.


That's awesome! Just trying to pass along what I was told at ASW - are you attending this fall?

Nope. I decided to sit out to see if I could crack the T3.

I mean, I do believe that in some cases this does apply. I think it might depend on the severity of the mistake, or how consistently you are making them in the PS.


I tend to agree - that's really amazing about the T3! I hope you killed it on the LSAT :)

I hope so, too, because I am tired of this test haha. What are your plans? Are you just popping into the June waiters thread to wish people good fortune, or did you re-take the LSAT for negotiating purposes?


Definitely a little of both, and I hear you - I took it the max times this cycle - Sept, Feb, and June - I'm attending this fall (class of 2018) and thankfully secured a good scholarship, now trying to grab a few more points from the June test to hopefully increase to full tuition - and pass on anything helpful I learned durning my cycle to fellow waiters!

I don't normally post, just lurk, bc I'm married and have 3 little boys, but my husband is home today so I had a few minutes to myself and I chose to spend it here posting!

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AbbeyS
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby AbbeyS » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:05 pm

ruizdaw wrote:I'm probably weird but I actively cringe into oblivion reading overly flowery personal statements.


Did you think that one up there was flowery?

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Li'l Sebastian
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby Li'l Sebastian » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:12 pm

AbbeyS wrote:
ruizdaw wrote:I'm probably weird but I actively cringe into oblivion reading overly flowery personal statements.


Did you think that one up there was flowery?


Yeah.

I'm an embittered science major though so don't read too much into my writing criteria.

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AbbeyS
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby AbbeyS » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:14 pm

ruizdaw wrote:
AbbeyS wrote:
ruizdaw wrote:I'm probably weird but I actively cringe into oblivion reading overly flowery personal statements.


Did you think that one up there was flowery?


Yeah.

I'm an embittered science major though so don't read too much into my writing criteria.


I kind of agree. I just think the idea was unique but it did come across a little pretentious lol

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Postby whacka » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:22 pm

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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby cdotson2 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:24 pm

jumbo2016 wrote:
jumbo2016 wrote:Ok. Went back as far as I could. Could only see tweets to October 2013. Here is when Dave Killoran tweeted about the scores:
February 2015 - 7:25pm (and it looks like the waiter's thread first spotted grey at exactly 8:00pm)
December 2014 - 8:11pm
September 2014 - 5:17pm for grey and 1:15pm he announced they would be released today
June 2014 - 9:05 (not really an announcement but a discussion of the curve)
December 2013 - 4:43 pm "scores will come out today"
October 2013 - 4:24 pm "scores will come out today"

From what I could see, all the people in the the Feb 2015 Waiter's forum had all pretty much given up on their scores being released that day, when they spotted grey at 8:00pm. So it doesn't always go grey at night but it doesn't look likely that we'll receive scores before noon. I think what this data 100% says is that we shouldn't be discouraged if we don't see scores by COB EST. And what it sort of says is that they can come out at pretty much any time regardless of business hours, but it is more likely that they will come out later than in the morning, since that hasn't happened once over the past 6 administrations. But nothing is impossible.


He didn't say anything about the february 2014 LSAT weirdly enough

that's because it came out on a weekend.

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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby WiscRu2 » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:28 pm

ruizdaw wrote:If there is absolutly anything about you that could in any conceivable universe could qualify as a diversity statement that makes sense, you should write a damn diversity statement.

If you can write a diversity statement write a diversity statement.


If you have something utterly unique that defines you, your experiences, your upbringing, etc. is there any particular reason to make that a diversity statement and not just be your PS?

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Li'l Sebastian
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Re: The Official June 2015 Waiter's Thread

Postby Li'l Sebastian » Sun Jun 28, 2015 4:30 pm

Just be genuine.

Write it as though you were saying it out loud to your mother. I think that would make for a great tone and you would be sure that it wouldn't come off as pretentious or full of too much fluff.

Definitely begin and end with fluff but don't stuff it with fluff otherwise the fluff sandwich loses its force.

Fluff beginning
Content middle
Fluff end.




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