June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

You step into Ollivander's on Diagon Alley and see an array of wands before you. Which do you pick?

Whichever wand gets me my big law placement.
8
22%
I borrow Dumbledore's wand, in all of its sagacity, pursuing a life dedicated to servicing muggles and wizards alike.
3
8%
I don't choose the wand, the wand chooses me.
21
58%
I don't like wands, I'm a muggle (lurker).
4
11%
 
Total votes: 36

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JackelJ
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby JackelJ » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:13 am

I did a quick forum search but didn't come up with anything great so here's a question for all you smart people:
Talking about LR here. The BP course I took pushed anticipating answers for some question types and it worked well for me as most of the times I was able to anticipate the answer (or some variation of it) and find it in the answer choices. The times when I could't find my anticipated answer or just couldn't anticipate an answer I used other methods to find the correct answer, like POE. (Note: I don't rely on anticipation) Now I'm going through the Trainer thats all about eliminating all incorrect answer choices and confirming the correct one, i.e. NOT anticipating the correct answer for certain question types. The Trainer's method also works for me. So, is one method better than the other? Or what are the pros/cons of anticipating answers, and should I be doing that or not?

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JackelJ
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby JackelJ » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:15 am

zacboro wrote:So what would yinz think if I said I was just gonna drill LR by type and RC passages for the next few weeks instead of full PTs... I would still have four weeks of full timed 5 section PTs before gameday

I'm working on drilling by LR type and RC passages for the next few weeks but I'm also going to start mixing in timed sections of LR and LG and at least 1 PT a week. But it has also been awhile since I've worked on timing or PTing so I want to get started sooner. Are you good on timing and stamina? If so maybe just do a PT a week to stay sharp while you work on drilling?

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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby Blueprint Ben » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:18 am

Re: Zacbro & Jackel

I agree with all that's been said about drilling RC. It's just a matter of getting through as many passages as you can stomach, and internalizing the patterns in the passages, questions, and answer choices so that right-answer-circling is pure instinct.

I'm a slow reader too, and I struggled a lot with timing in the beginning. But I didn't get faster by racing the clock. Or by minimizing subvocalization or whatever voodoo nonsense the speed readers like to spew. I got faster by becoming more efficient. Training my mind to stay focused. Knowing what to look for in my initial read. Knowing how to eliminate wrong answers immediately, without a shadow of a doubt.

You can get all of that training without even glancing at your watch. Just do high volumes of repetition, hundreds of passages, and focus the entire time on efficiency of process. Forget about speed. Slow down, and think long and hard about the right things. The things that will allow you to fly through the questions without waffling back and forth between answer choices. The more you drill, the easier it will be to allocate your time efficiently. That's how you improve on timing in RC.

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Shakawkaw
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby Shakawkaw » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:23 am

zacboro wrote:So what would yinz think if I said I was just gonna drill LR by type and RC passages for the next few weeks instead of full PTs... I would still have four weeks of full timed 5 section PTs before gameday


I would support this. If you spend this month drilling and really getting your skill and accuracy level up, it'll be more effective for you in the long run, and you will see that translated to your PTs. If you leave 4 weeks for PTs, let's say you do 2 per week, at a minimum, you'll still have time during the week to drill and review. When you're drilling RC, if you're working from the Cambridge packets, I would suggest drilling just one passage type (maybe do a section of 5 passages) just so you get used to the structure of each type of passage during your review. After you get comfortable with that, I would do 4 passage drills, using one of each passage type (basically like a makeshift RC section). Regarding timing with drilling: while I do think you should be drilling untimed, you can still practice your timing (for when you take full section PTs) by doing timed sections coupled with drilling by type. By the time you start getting into drilling by type, you'll be so comfortable with the pattern recognition that timing shouldn't be a problem (ideally).

JackelJ wrote:I did a quick forum search but didn't come up with anything great so here's a question for all you smart people:
Talking about LR here. The BP course I took pushed anticipating answers for some question types and it worked well for me as most of the times I was able to anticipate the answer (or some variation of it) and find it in the answer choices. The times when I could't find my anticipated answer or just couldn't anticipate an answer I used other methods to find the correct answer, like POE. (Note: I don't rely on anticipation) Now I'm going through the Trainer thats all about eliminating all incorrect answer choices and confirming the correct one, i.e. NOT anticipating the correct answer for certain question types. The Trainer's method also works for me. So, is one method better than the other? Or what are the pros/cons of anticipating answers, and should I be doing that or not?


I think prephrasing is helpful - it shows that you understand what you're being asked, but it can also be a time saver. However, I do think the Trainer (and the MLSAT LR method emphasizes this as well) does a good job of highlighting the salience of POE. While you have a prephrased answer in the front of your mind, you should always be going through each of the ACs to quickly see if there is a better answer choice that you might not have anticipated. By the time you're done drilling the packets, your recognition of blatantly wrong ACs will be sharp, so doing a cursory read of the ACs and eliminating the wrong ones to make sure you have TCR won't take up too much time.

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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby Blueprint Ben » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:28 am

JackelJ wrote:I did a quick forum search but didn't come up with anything great so here's a question for all you smart people:
Talking about LR here. The BP course I took pushed anticipating answers for some question types and it worked well for me as most of the times I was able to anticipate the answer (or some variation of it) and find it in the answer choices. The times when I could't find my anticipated answer or just couldn't anticipate an answer I used other methods to find the correct answer, like POE. (Note: I don't rely on anticipation) Now I'm going through the Trainer thats all about eliminating all incorrect answer choices and confirming the correct one, i.e. NOT anticipating the correct answer for certain question types. The Trainer's method also works for me. So, is one method better than the other? Or what are the pros/cons of anticipating answers, and should I be doing that or not?

I think you should always be anticipating a little bit, but as you said, you should never rely on it. You absolutely must rely on process of elimination, regardless of whether or not you're anticipating what the right answer should look like. POE is king in LR and RC. Always read all answer choices and eliminate four answers for solid, concrete, logically perfect reasons before you go back to confirm the right answer.

eta: And of course there are certain question types where you absolutely shouldn't anticipate the correct answer, because the set of possibly correct answers is pretty much infinite. Prime example: Necessary assumptions

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Shakawkaw
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby Shakawkaw » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:31 am

BP Ben wrote:
JackelJ wrote:I did a quick forum search but didn't come up with anything great so here's a question for all you smart people:
Talking about LR here. The BP course I took pushed anticipating answers for some question types and it worked well for me as most of the times I was able to anticipate the answer (or some variation of it) and find it in the answer choices. The times when I could't find my anticipated answer or just couldn't anticipate an answer I used other methods to find the correct answer, like POE. (Note: I don't rely on anticipation) Now I'm going through the Trainer thats all about eliminating all incorrect answer choices and confirming the correct one, i.e. NOT anticipating the correct answer for certain question types. The Trainer's method also works for me. So, is one method better than the other? Or what are the pros/cons of anticipating answers, and should I be doing that or not?

I think you should always be anticipating a little bit, but as you said, you should never rely on it. You absolutely must rely on process of elimination, regardless of whether or not you're anticipating what the right answer should look like. POE is king in LR and RC. Always read all answer choices and eliminate four answers for solid, concrete, logically perfect reasons before you go back to confirm the right answer.

eta: And of course there are certain question types where you absolutely shouldn't anticipate the correct answer, because the set of possibly correct answers is pretty much infinite. Prime example: Necessary assumptions


You've been scooped by **~OP~**, BP Ben.

Blueprint Ben
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby Blueprint Ben » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:34 am

Shakawkaw wrote:You've been scooped by **~OP~**, BP Ben.

8) Only partially scooped. I'll leave it up.

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JackelJ
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby JackelJ » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:35 am

Shakawkaw wrote:I think prephrasing is helpful - it shows that you understand what you're being asked, but it can also be a time saver. However, I do think the Trainer (and the MLSAT LR method emphasizes this as well) does a good job of highlighting the salience of POE. While you have a prephrased answer in the front of your mind, you should always be going through each of the ACs to quickly see if there is a better answer choice that you might not have anticipated. By the time you're done drilling the packets, your recognition of blatantly wrong ACs will be sharp, so doing a cursory read of the ACs and eliminating the wrong ones to make sure you have TCR won't take up too much time.


BP Ben wrote:I think you should always be anticipating a little bit, but as you said, you should never rely on it. You absolutely must rely on process of elimination, regardless of whether or not you're anticipating what the right answer should look like. POE is king in LR and RC. Always read all answer choices and eliminate four answers for solid, concrete, logically perfect reasons before you go back to confirm the right answer.

eta: And of course there are certain question types where you absolutely shouldn't anticipate the correct answer, because the set of possibly correct answers is pretty much infinite. Prime example: Necessary assumptions


Okay, so I'll keep anticipating where appropriate and always double check with POE. Thanks for the feedback!
Now that coffee's kicked in its back to drilling for me.

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Shakawkaw
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby Shakawkaw » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:37 am

JackelJ wrote:Okay, so I'll keep anticipating where appropriate and always double check with POE. Thanks for the feedback!Now that coffee's kicked in its back to drilling for me.


I feel like a lot of the time, the prephrasing happens naturally. I'll read a question and be like "Oh, well "x" flaw is just so obvious." I read very critically, so it's not something I do consciously.

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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby Blueprint Ben » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:40 am

Shakawkaw wrote:
JackelJ wrote:Okay, so I'll keep anticipating where appropriate and always double check with POE. Thanks for the feedback!Now that coffee's kicked in its back to drilling for me.


I feel like a lot of the time, the prephrasing happens naturally. I'll read a question and be like "Oh, well "x" flaw is just so obvious." I read very critically, so it's not something I do consciously.

Agreed. POE should be a staple in your process. Anticipation should only happen if it happens.

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NL2424
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby NL2424 » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:43 am

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Last edited by NL2424 on Mon Jul 13, 2015 8:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JackelJ
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby JackelJ » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:51 am

zacbro, have you considered just getting the RC or LR cambridge packets? Instead of a bundle with PTs?

eta: You'll get a lot more RC passages that way. I'm not sure what you're doing for drilling by type but the Cambridge packets made my life so much easier. But, I was basically in the the mindset of "Here take my money, just help me get a better score"

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NL2424
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby NL2424 » Thu Apr 02, 2015 11:57 am

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Last edited by NL2424 on Mon Jul 13, 2015 8:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JackelJ
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby JackelJ » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:06 pm

zacboro wrote:
JackelJ wrote:zacbro, have you considered just getting the RC or LR cambridge packets? Instead of a bundle with PTs?


I have, but I don't have the any money. I have a LR by type packet, from Powerscore not Cambridge though, and I allready have the LSAT bundle of PTs. I'm gonna buy the 3 most recent PTs for my last week of prep ... and that's allready going to cost me like $30. I know there's the whole "the money you spend now is worth it because of how it affects your future" but like the money just doesn't exist for me.

I understand, as long as you have the material it doesn't really matter how its organized. Good luck with drilling!

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Rigo
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby Rigo » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:07 pm

Jackel needs to CHECK HER PRIVILEGE.
Either that or OP needs to add a trigger warning to the thread title.

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JackelJ
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby JackelJ » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:33 pm

Rigo wrote:Jackel needs to CHECK HER PRIVILEGE.
Either that or OP needs to add a trigger warning to the thread title.

I will say what I want Rigo because I'm a privileged STEM major!

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Rigo
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby Rigo » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:40 pm

JackelJ wrote:
Rigo wrote:Jackel needs to CHECK HER PRIVILEGE.
Either that or OP needs to add a trigger warning to the thread title.

I will say what I want Rigo because I'm a privileged STEM major!

Ugh you people

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NL2424
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby NL2424 » Thu Apr 02, 2015 12:49 pm

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Last edited by NL2424 on Mon Jul 13, 2015 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JackelJ
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby JackelJ » Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:08 pm

zacboro wrote:I just wish I would've found TLS before I bought all of my materials. For example, I spent quite a bit of money on the "Powerscore Deconstructed LSAT!" Which is just a PT with explanations for every answer... Which, don't get me wrong, they were very useful and helpful, but watching the free velocity videos or Manhattan explanations would've just as beneficial.. And I definitely could've went without purchasing the RCBible..

I wish this too. I found some threads on TLS when I googled which test prep class to take. I read some things about self studying being better so I was going to do that but when I mentioned self studying to my parents my mom was like "NO! You must take an in class prep course because I know thats best and you will be at a disadvantage if you don't take one." I'm just happy I researched enough to know not to take Kaplan, but I could've definitely gone with a cheaper online prep course option. And I ended up self studying after anyway.
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biggestlawman
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby biggestlawman » Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:08 pm

Rigo wrote:
JackelJ wrote:
Rigo wrote:Jackel needs to CHECK HER PRIVILEGE.
Either that or OP needs to add a trigger warning to the thread title.

I will say what I want Rigo because I'm a privileged STEM major!

Ugh you people


Yo! Salute the STEM majors!

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biggestlawman
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby biggestlawman » Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:11 pm

Alright Babies! I can study throughout the day, but for minor work requests, for the next few weeks! :mrgreen:

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NL2424
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby NL2424 » Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:43 pm

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Last edited by NL2424 on Mon Jul 13, 2015 8:21 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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The Abyss
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby The Abyss » Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:51 pm

zacboro wrote:
JackelJ wrote:
zacboro wrote:I just wish I would've found TLS before I bought all of my materials. For example, I spent quite a bit of money on the "Powerscore Deconstructed LSAT!" Which is just a PT with explanations for every answer... Which, don't get me wrong, they were very useful and helpful, but watching the free velocity videos or Manhattan explanations would've just as beneficial.. And I definitely could've went without purchasing the RCBible..

I wish this too. I found some threads on TLS when I googled which test prep class to take. I read some things about self studying being better so I was going to do that but when I mentioned self studying to my parents my mom was like "NO! You must take an in class prep course because I know thats best and you will be at a disadvantage if you don't take one." I'm just happy I researched enough to know not to take Kaplan, but I could've definitely gone with a cheaper online prep course option. And I ended up self studying after anyway.


My mom's boyfriend is actually dating someone who used to teach LSAT prep courses years ago.. He said basically unless the LSAT has drastically changed the in class courses aren't worth it IF you can force yourself to self study. He said they're great for providing structure, framework, and motivation. But if you can do it on your own they're not going to help much.


What?

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nlee10
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby nlee10 » Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:53 pm

The Abyss wrote:What?

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NL2424
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Re: June 2015 Re-Takers Study Thread

Postby NL2424 » Thu Apr 02, 2015 2:01 pm

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Last edited by NL2424 on Mon Jul 13, 2015 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.




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