The Official September 2014 Study Group Forum

vracovino · Post by **vracovino** » Tue Jul 22, 2014 8:57 pm

danmcc413 wrote:Just finished up PT40 and the results were definitely mixed. On one hand, I managed to -0 my first ever LG section with time to spare, too, which is really encouraging, and I also got -1 on the first LR section. However, on the second LR, I really messed up and got -8. RC is usually my strongest and I got -1 which is about the average. So all together, I'm happy with the results - I got a 170 which is right around my average, but that huge drop off in LR scares me. I definitely am about to start really drilling my weakness areas with LR because I've been pretty inconsistent with it. I've gone -3 total LR for a test before and then today I went -8 so I feel like I've got some definite strengths and weaknesses to keep in mind. Hope everyone else is doing well, on to PT41 tomorrow!

Awesome score. PT 40 is the only PT i've done (albeit it in individual sections rather than a full timed test) and I totally bombed the LG. I found that third game (connecting flights) to be brutal. How does that section stack up to your average LG section in terms of difficulty?

NotASpecialSnowflake · Post by **NotASpecialSnowflake** » Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:25 pm

I did the December 2006 LSAT. It was fresh and I got a 169 (-13). Which is encouraging because that is on the lower end of where I'm doing on the PT's I've seen before. So they're fairly accurate, at least for me. I also killed LG (only one bubbling error

) and RC -3

But LR was an issue. -4, -5 and -7 (exp. but still

)

I hate this part of LSAT prep. Anyone else feel like they're playing section whack-a-mole? I'll get one section fixed, and then another section will become a problem.

My LR problems are also mostly in MBT and similar reasoning/flaw types. Anyone got any good references for those? I love the LSAT Trainer for flaw, but I wish it spend more time on MBT and similar reasoning questions.

chimera · Post by **chimera** » Tue Jul 22, 2014 10:22 pm

NotASpecialSnowflake wrote:I hate this part of LSAT prep. Anyone else feel like they're playing section whack-a-mole? I'll get one section fixed, and then another section will become a problem.

Ya, I'm playing whack-a-mole right now, but mostly within LR. I'll shore up one question type and get crushed up by another. Flaw, and especially Sufficient Assumption questions are killing me. Not sure what's going on with flaw because I'm nailing Strengthen, Weaken and other similar questions. I plan on drilling these two plus Conditional Reasoning questions the rest of the week and then take another PT. Last one (40) was a 166. -3/7 LR(

), -4 LG, -2 RC, -3 on experimental LR (PT9).

kbrizz · Post by **kbrizz** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 2:18 am

Getting my wisdom teeth out tomorrow, so I expect I'll be out of commission for at least 1 day.

jmjm · Post by **jmjm** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 2:47 am

bound wrote:
valen wrote:My second PT (PT B from superprep) untimed:

LR: -4
LG: -3
RC: -1
LR: -1
Converted score: 175

Looks like there was a serious curve on this exam. You could get up to 4 wrong and still get a 180. I'm guessing because the first LR seemed super tricky.

Will I naturally get better at timing with more practice? If this was timed I probably would have gotten a 150.

Timing gets easier with practice yes, but the biggest step to getting there is actually timing yourself. How many querstions have you finished after the 35 minutes are up? 23/25? 20/25? 15/25?

Drilling helped me get A LOT faster. For example, I always try to get through the first 14 questions in LR on PT's in about 14-15minutes. That way, I have much more time to complete the more difficult questions (15-22.) When drilling, I would take 14-15 lower difficulty questions and attempt to complete them in 10-12 minutes. That way on PT's, attempting to complete them in 14minutes felt like a breeze.

Is there a reason that you don't aim for 15 Qs in 15-16 minutes? 15 in 15 seems to be a sort of a benchmark. Do you have to force yourself to hit timing on these early questions compared to later questions? I end up getting easy questions wrong if I go fast trying to get timing right for these early questions.

danmcc413 · Post by **danmcc413** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:28 am

Awesome score. PT 40 is the only PT i've done (albeit it in individual sections rather than a full timed test) and I totally bombed the LG. I found that third game (connecting flights) to be brutal. How does that section stack up to your average LG section in terms of difficulty?

Thanks a lot. I thought that the three games other than that one were pretty average difficulty and nothing crazy at all, but the third one definitely took a lot of mental juggling because I wasn't sure how to properly diagram it. That game was definitely pretty difficult but overall I didn't think it was too bad if you just tried to actually reason through it instead of getting stuck on which LGB method to use and wasting time. That's happened to me in the past so I try to rely less heavily on outside methodologies and have tailored my approach to be more compatible with my thinking and it has worked well. Hope this helps!

bondja · Post by **bondja** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 11:12 am

Did a PT66 this past weekend with decent results. I originally took the actual administration of PT66 in June 2012 and got a horrendous score. This was the first PT I took this study session so I had a couple things going on.

1) First full PT I've taken so my endurance isn't as sharp.
2) I took it in my house on purpose - a lot of distractions so I wasn't as sharp on purpose
3) I knew going into the test my RC wasn't where it needs to be and I'm not done going through Manhattan LG

So, my expectations were to grow from my June 2012 test and give myself a great jumping board back into full PT's and drilling.

I scored +15 points from when I took in June in 2012 which made me very happy. Still not anywhere close to where I need to be. I think I went -9 RC, -1 LR, -5 LG, -3 LR, or something similar to those numbers. I have a great foundation and I can't wait to hone in on my goal of 173+. I actually did NOT go over what I got wrong on purpose. I chose to leave this test a my bench mark for when I leave on vacation in August to see where my score is from when I took it in June 2012 as well as this past weekend. I don't want to go through the answers and know the test inside out.

Louis1127 · Post by **Louis1127** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 11:43 am

h3jk5h wrote:How come you are always so positive, Louis? I almost always feel like crying when my score does not live up to expectation.

Haha, I just know that I'm giving my best effort, and that even if I don't get the score I want, I'm doing my best. Sounds cheesy as hell, but it's true. I'm not going to be mad if my best is a 156 (although I doubt it is). But if my best is a 156, then I'm not going to be mad about it, because I can't change it.

Also, I think sometimes we forget to see how far we've come, just because lots of people on TLS score 170 +, almost to the point where it seems common. It may be common on TLS, but a 170+ score is super uncommon! But anyway back to the point. The point is everything that could have gone wrong went wrong on that PT and I still did 11 points better than my original diagnostic. Also, I hit 165 before this PT. So even though a 156 on this PT is disappointing, I've come along way.

I think it would be helpful if you thought about how far you have come since you started, wherever you started from.

diiggidy · Post by **diiggidy** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 1:48 pm

Just took PT 54.

RC (-6)
LR (-3)
LG (-3)
LR (-3)

Scaled: 165

I've decided that I need to spend significantly more time drilling RC sections. Other than that LG was a bit disappointing, but I made two silly mistakes. However, -15 for a 165 seems pretty harsh to me. There were 101 total questions, but from the past tests I've taken this is appears to be a much more severe curve. Any thoughts?

vracovino · Post by **vracovino** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 2:32 pm

I plan on starting full PTs in a few days because I've just about finished up drilling most of the LR questions from tests 1-38 and I'm feeling a lot more confident about RC. Am I really cheating myself if I being by using 4 section PTs instead of 5 section PTs? Is the score disparity usually pretty severe?

h3jk5h · Post by **h3jk5h** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 5:32 pm

I'm noticing that the only people who are posting on this thread (and their PT scores) are those who are scoring at least 160 (many above 170). Do 140s and 150s scorers don't exist on TLS?

I don't feel very intelligent reading this thread.

Irish11 · Post by **Irish11** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:43 pm

chimera wrote:
NotASpecialSnowflake wrote:I hate this part of LSAT prep. Anyone else feel like they're playing section whack-a-mole? I'll get one section fixed, and then another section will become a problem.
Ya, I'm playing whack-a-mole right now, but mostly within LR. I'll shore up one question type and get crushed up by another. Flaw, and especially Sufficient Assumption questions are killing me. Not sure what's going on with flaw because I'm nailing Strengthen, Weaken and other similar questions. I plan on drilling these two plus Conditional Reasoning questions the rest of the week and then take another PT. Last one (40) was a 166. -3/7 LR( ), -4 LG, -2 RC, -3 on experimental LR (PT9).

Yes! I took PT 53 today and did my best ever in LR: -2, -0. In every other test I've missed at least two per section. I was so excited that I might top my best score - and I ended up doing really badly in RC.

I think that it can be encouraging, though, even if it's frustrating on the surface. I'm generally very good at RC, and have been studying and drilling a lot to fix my LR problems. So I think/hope that the bad RC is more likely to be a fluke than the good LR.

kbrizz wrote:Getting my wisdom teeth out tomorrow, so I expect I'll be out of commission for at least 1 day.

Get well soon! Might be an interesting experiment to take a PT while on painkillers and see how it goes

. Would certainly help with stress haha

gnomgnomuch · Post by **gnomgnomuch** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:55 pm

danmcc413 wrote:Just finished up PT40 and the results were definitely mixed. On one hand, I managed to -0 my first ever LG section with time to spare, too, which is really encouraging, and I also got -1 on the first LR section. However, on the second LR, I really messed up and got -8. RC is usually my strongest and I got -1 which is about the average. So all together, I'm happy with the results - I got a 170 which is right around my average, but that huge drop off in LR scares me. I definitely am about to start really drilling my weakness areas with LR because I've been pretty inconsistent with it. I've gone -3 total LR for a test before and then today I went -8 so I feel like I've got some definite strengths and weaknesses to keep in mind. Hope everyone else is doing well, on to PT41 tomorrow!

That PT was weird for me (and I think Loui) as well. I got a perfect score on the first LR and went -7 on the second LR. (I got screwed by the games section, and also went -5 on RC, so my score was a 161 - nowhere near your 170.)

gnomgnomuch · Post by **gnomgnomuch** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:01 pm

h3jk5h wrote:I'm noticing that the only people who are posting on this thread (and their PT scores) are those who are scoring at least 160 (many above 170). Do 140s and 150s scorers don't exist on TLS?

I don't feel very intelligent reading this thread.

TLS is a vacuum. When I took my first diagnostic I had a 146. I almost never posted during those days, however I followed almost every thread on the LSAT. Once I started hitting higher scores (really only a couple weeks now) I started posting more often for two reasons:

1) I feel like I can now actually offer some help to people - be it in actual study habits/work-school-LSAT balance/just cheering them up.
2) I also felt that now that I'm posting constantly, It would motivate me to study even on days when all I wanted to do was sleep.

Finally, the posters on here who are in the 160's and 170's have been studying and prepping for months. Also, the LSAT is not an indication of your intelligence overall, its just an indication of your intelligence in certain areas of life. I have friends who are 4.0 Bio majors who wouldn't be able to handle the LSAT. Never forget that this is JUST a test, and getting a 170 or higher will not ruin your life. There are plenty of paths for everyone, this is just one of them.

rebexness · Post by **rebexness** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:02 pm

vracovino wrote:I plan on starting full PTs in a few days because I've just about finished up drilling most of the LR questions from tests 1-38 and I'm feeling a lot more confident about RC. Am I really cheating myself if I being by using 4 section PTs instead of 5 section PTs? Is the score disparity usually pretty severe?

If you are just starting PTs, I would highly recommend starting with 4 sections. Personally, I did about 2 months of 4 sections and 2 months of 5 sections. Ideally, you would throw in a 6th section at some point to really improve stamina and/or see how you react under pressure.

No point in "wasting" a 5th section that you could use later when you know your mind isn't quite up to 2 hrs + of logic.

Louis1127 · Post by **Louis1127** » Wed Jul 23, 2014 10:45 pm

Loooong day at work today. I only had time to go over the LR questions I missed from my last PT (which was alot unfortunately). Luckily I had my pile of questions and hand-written explanations cut out already. Anyhow, time to get some sleep and do PT 45 tomorrow before work.

ultraman · Post by **ultraman** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:45 am

Super excited! Got my first 170 on PT 41!

Breakdown:

LR: #20 #22
LG: #18 #20 #22 #24 thanks to the circle game
LR: #5 (I misbubbled this one) #14 #17
RC: #4 #22 #23 after blind review I missed only #22

raw score: 89 translated to 170

after blind review raw score 91 translated to 171

I missed questions I felt really confident about. These questions should be taken very seriously.

Time to review!

bondja · Post by **bondja** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:06 am

h3jk5h wrote:I'm noticing that the only people who are posting on this thread (and their PT scores) are those who are scoring at least 160 (many above 170). Do 140s and 150s scorers don't exist on TLS?

I don't feel very intelligent reading this thread.

140s and 150s exist! I scored a 147 on my initial LSAT in June of 2012. I've been on the grind since and have worked my way up into the mid 160's and still climbing. The LSAT is not indicative the the type of lawyer you'll be. One of the associates in my firm scored a 152 or something very close, and he's one of the best criminal defense attorneys in the area.

mornincounselor · Post by **mornincounselor** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 10:09 am

Post removed.

brooklynboy · Post by **brooklynboy** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 12:05 pm

I've been following this thread intermittently and it's reassuring that the themes of discussion seem to line up with some of my experiences.

I am using sections of PT40 for drills, and I did the first LR section last night. I was going to ask if everyone else also found it absurdly easy. Given how much higher people seem to have scored on it than on the second LR section, it seems like that was the case. I haven't done the second yet but I look forward to doing it tonight and seeing how different it was from section 1.

valen · Post by **valen** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:25 pm

h3jk5h wrote:I'm noticing that the only people who are posting on this thread (and their PT scores) are those who are scoring at least 160 (many above 170). Do 140s and 150s scorers don't exist on TLS?

I don't feel very intelligent reading this thread.

It's a standardized test like any other and doesn't indicate intelligence at all. Some people are just naturally better test takers. But luckily for ALL of us, the reasoning ability needed to do well on the test is definitely learnable! Keep studying and keep your head up, if you work consistently and diligently you'll do well

vracovino · Post by **vracovino** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:51 pm

Just took my first timed (4 section) test:

PT 44

RC: -6
LR: -3
LG-3
LR-7

Score: 163

Pleasantly surprised by the games score but devastated by that last LR section. Wow. I did not expect to ever see a -7 tbh after all the drilling I've done. I didn't actually take note of which ones I got wrong so I can still properly blind review. I was just curious about the score.

Anyway, feeling underwhelmed by this but at least it wasn't all bad. I just need to get better with timing on the LR and RC sections- a lot better.

mornincounselor · Post by **mornincounselor** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:40 pm

Post removed.

Louis1127 · Post by **Louis1127** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:59 pm

I'm going to wait to post my results form PT 45 as to not mess with you, mornin

But now I'm going to work

ilikebaseball · Post by **ilikebaseball** » Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:43 pm

Just did an untimed section of the RC using Voyager's RC guide. Holy crap guys. I mean, I took it slower (probably 38-40 minutes) but I only did that so I could get all of the markings down to habit. For two of the passages I didn't even have to look back at the passage one time, I immediately knew the answer from the answer choices. I went from a -6 to a -1 in one try. Now I just have to keep doing it to make it more efficient. What a fantastic find that is. I'm so happy haha. I was expecting like a slight increase. Like a -5. Especially on the first try. Wow