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becs
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby becs » Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:09 pm

dosto5 wrote:
becs wrote:Uhhh... starting to feel like the only one in this thread that isn't using (or about to start using) LSAT trainer. :oops:

Although, I'm kind of an anomaly in that I'm focusing almost 100% on LG, which I somehow still suck at. Used PS bible, waiting on Blueprint's LG book. Someone please reassure me that this isn't a terrible course of action?


I personally recommend 7sage videos and relentless drilling.


Awesome, I appreciate it. Blueprint won't get here til Monday anyway, so I'll spend between now and then drilling and using the 7sage videos.

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PrizeFighter
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby PrizeFighter » Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:38 pm

buffalo_ wrote:I actually find with RC that the harder I try to find the answer, the more likely I am to get the questions wrong. I used to approach it as just long form LR, and I know a lot of people use this method, but whereas with LR I can isolate specific words or phrases in the mini prompt that make my answer choice absolutely correct, with RC it takes far too long to go back and try and find these bits of evidence in the passage. On recent tests especially, I find that if I read quickly and just pay attention to a few basic things, I rarely need to refer back to the passage. I think of it like this: "these questions are easier than you think they are, just pick the most obvious choice." In LR the answer choices really try to trick you, but I don't see that as much in RC. The questions simply want to know about what you just read. It's like in college when your buddy didn't do the assigned reading and wants you to just give a quick summary. If you can give a quick summary, you should be able to answer the questions. So just read close enough that you can summarize it for your lazy friend.




I'll echo this advice, and I found the bolded to be especially true for me. I started a system where I read the passage deliberately to make sure I understand it well, but I try to get through the questions as quickly as possible. The thing that can really derail an RC section is stressing over similar answer choices, so I started trusting my intuition and just picking one and moving on. This meant I almost never referred back to the passage until the very end when I'd use whatever time was left to go back and check the ones I was unsure about, but I would only change my answer if I found definitive proof in the passage because I found myself changing too many rights into wrongs (which is actually why I started to realize my intuition was better at getting the right answers than if I stressed over it).

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby dosto » Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:38 pm

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Last edited by dosto on Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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mhaas
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby mhaas » Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:49 pm

becs wrote:Uhhh... starting to feel like the only one in this thread that isn't using (or about to start using) LSAT trainer. :oops:

Although, I'm kind of an anomaly in that I'm focusing almost 100% on LG, which I somehow still suck at. Used PS bible, waiting on Blueprint's LG book. Someone please reassure me that this isn't a terrible course of action?


Manhattan LSAT LG + Cambridge packets took me from -9/-11 to consistently hitting -0. I would read a chapter of MLSAT LG then drill ALL of the corresponding LG's from the cambridge packet. If I missed a question on a game or went above 8:30 on it then I would redo it. This is an extremely time consuming process. It took me about 3 weeks at about 6 hours a day every day to finish, but when I finished, LG became my strongest section by far.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby bbkk » Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:54 pm

dosto5 wrote:
yomisterd wrote:Waiting on that Trainer! Should be in Friday.

Took PT46 as a diagnostic to see how rusty I was after a month of no LSAT. With a 173 (RC: -3, LR: -3, LR: -1, LG: -0), I'm definitely ready to PT and drill the hell out of this month!


Let's get you that 175+.



173 looks great! congrats yomisterd. I'm going to do PT 57 tonight and see how rusty I am.

I want to do PT 70 on Sat to see what I can actually get without the anxiety. However, I also want to save it to the week leading to Dec test, since it is the last fresh PT that I haven't reviewed before (besides the Indian ones). Any thoughts on this? When are you guys going to retake Pt 70?

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cheme2014
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby cheme2014 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:57 pm

bbkk wrote:173 looks great! congrats yomisterd. I'm going to do PT 57 tonight and see how rusty I am.

I want to do PT 70 on Sat to see what I can actually get without the anxiety. However, I also want to save it to the week leading to Dec test, since it is the last fresh PT that I haven't reviewed before (besides the Indian ones). Any thoughts on this? When are you guys going to retake Pt 70?


I'm one of the lucky ones and still have quite a bit of fresh PTs left, so I'm gonna save PT 70 for late November. :)

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby dosto » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:01 pm

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Last edited by dosto on Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby lsatyolo » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:03 pm

PrizeFighter wrote:
buffalo_ wrote:I actually find with RC that the harder I try to find the answer, the more likely I am to get the questions wrong. I used to approach it as just long form LR, and I know a lot of people use this method, but whereas with LR I can isolate specific words or phrases in the mini prompt that make my answer choice absolutely correct, with RC it takes far too long to go back and try and find these bits of evidence in the passage. On recent tests especially, I find that if I read quickly and just pay attention to a few basic things, I rarely need to refer back to the passage. I think of it like this: "these questions are easier than you think they are, just pick the most obvious choice." In LR the answer choices really try to trick you, but I don't see that as much in RC. The questions simply want to know about what you just read. It's like in college when your buddy didn't do the assigned reading and wants you to just give a quick summary. If you can give a quick summary, you should be able to answer the questions. So just read close enough that you can summarize it for your lazy friend.




I'll echo this advice, and I found the bolded to be especially true for me. I started a system where I read the passage deliberately to make sure I understand it well, but I try to get through the questions as quickly as possible. The thing that can really derail an RC section is stressing over similar answer choices, so I started trusting my intuition and just picking one and moving on. This meant I almost never referred back to the passage until the very end when I'd use whatever time was left to go back and check the ones I was unsure about, but I would only change my answer if I found definitive proof in the passage because I found myself changing too many rights into wrongs (which is actually why I started to realize my intuition was better at getting the right answers than if I stressed over it).



How much time on average does it take you to read passages?

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby PrizeFighter » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:05 pm

bbkk wrote:
dosto5 wrote:
yomisterd wrote:Waiting on that Trainer! Should be in Friday.

Took PT46 as a diagnostic to see how rusty I was after a month of no LSAT. With a 173 (RC: -3, LR: -3, LR: -1, LG: -0), I'm definitely ready to PT and drill the hell out of this month!


Let's get you that 175+.



173 looks great! congrats yomisterd. I'm going to do PT 57 tonight and see how rusty I am.

I want to do PT 70 on Sat to see what I can actually get without the anxiety. However, I also want to save it to the week leading to Dec test, since it is the last fresh PT that I haven't reviewed before (besides the Indian ones). Any thoughts on this? When are you guys going to retake Pt 70?


I'm going to redo PT 70 right away because I want to see where things went wrong under actual exam conditions and hopefully come away with a plan of attack for this next month.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby 062914123 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:06 pm

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Last edited by 062914123 on Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby buffalo_ » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:14 pm

lsatyolo wrote:
PrizeFighter wrote:
buffalo_ wrote:I actually find with RC that the harder I try to find the answer, the more likely I am to get the questions wrong. I used to approach it as just long form LR, and I know a lot of people use this method, but whereas with LR I can isolate specific words or phrases in the mini prompt that make my answer choice absolutely correct, with RC it takes far too long to go back and try and find these bits of evidence in the passage. On recent tests especially, I find that if I read quickly and just pay attention to a few basic things, I rarely need to refer back to the passage. I think of it like this: "these questions are easier than you think they are, just pick the most obvious choice." In LR the answer choices really try to trick you, but I don't see that as much in RC. The questions simply want to know about what you just read. It's like in college when your buddy didn't do the assigned reading and wants you to just give a quick summary. If you can give a quick summary, you should be able to answer the questions. So just read close enough that you can summarize it for your lazy friend.



I'll echo this advice, and I found the bolded to be especially true for me. I started a system where I read the passage deliberately to make sure I understand it well, but I try to get through the questions as quickly as possible. The thing that can really derail an RC section is stressing over similar answer choices, so I started trusting my intuition and just picking one and moving on. This meant I almost never referred back to the passage until the very end when I'd use whatever time was left to go back and check the ones I was unsure about, but I would only change my answer if I found definitive proof in the passage because I found myself changing too many rights into wrongs (which is actually why I started to realize my intuition was better at getting the right answers than if I stressed over it).



How much time on average does it take you to read passages?


I believe I read very slowly. It usually takes me 3:30-4:00 to read a standard passage. This makes going through the questions quickly very important. On the double passages, I can usually go a good deal quicker, usually about 3 minutes, because I am usually not reading as closely. When I am tight on time, I can run through a passage in about 2:30, but I will miss a lot; e.g. author's tone of voice, specific elements that might be asked in questions. In theses cases I can usually answer half of the questions for that passage, but the other half I will need to refer back. And if I am reading this fast, it means I am probably about to not finish the section.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby dosto » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:15 pm

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Last edited by dosto on Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby snagglepuss » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:17 pm

bee wrote:
mhaas wrote:
becs wrote:Uhhh... starting to feel like the only one in this thread that isn't using (or about to start using) LSAT trainer. :oops:

Although, I'm kind of an anomaly in that I'm focusing almost 100% on LG, which I somehow still suck at. Used PS bible, waiting on Blueprint's LG book. Someone please reassure me that this isn't a terrible course of action?


Manhattan LSAT LG + Cambridge packets took me from -9/-11 to consistently hitting -0. I would read a chapter of MLSAT LG then drill ALL of the corresponding LG's from the cambridge packet. If I missed a question on a game or went above 8:30 on it then I would redo it. This is an extremely time consuming process. It took me about 3 weeks at about 6 hours a day every day to finish, but when I finished, LG became my strongest section by far.

jesus, i wish i had time to do this :| if i could even -3 my lg section, i'd be at 175+


dsfkjsdfkljfkld why must i suck so hard at games :cry:

p.s. to whoever was asking about lg--i did BP lg, 7sage videos, and MLSAT lg before oct, and was PTing at -0 on lg. i ended up with -7 on the real thing due to pure anxiety, and will be starting velocity lg for dec. pm me if you ever want to commiserate about how terrible games are (:

70 PTs * 4 games per = 280 games * very generous 10 minutes per = 2800 minutes / 60 minutes per hour = ~47 hours / 2 hours per day = ~23 days of practice.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby 062914123 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:19 pm

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Last edited by 062914123 on Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby cheme2014 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:21 pm

dosto5 wrote:Do at least 30 minutes of mixed games a day and you will become so used to doing them that the effects of stress on test day will be greatly diminished.


This. My main problem is in LR/RC but I still fit in a few LG games/sections a day to make sure I don't get rusty. I'm weird and enjoy LG ( :oops: ) so I just fit in a LG section between reading the Trainer and doing LR drills or something lol.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby PrizeFighter » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:22 pm

lsatyolo wrote:
PrizeFighter wrote:
buffalo_ wrote:I actually find with RC that the harder I try to find the answer, the more likely I am to get the questions wrong. I used to approach it as just long form LR, and I know a lot of people use this method, but whereas with LR I can isolate specific words or phrases in the mini prompt that make my answer choice absolutely correct, with RC it takes far too long to go back and try and find these bits of evidence in the passage. On recent tests especially, I find that if I read quickly and just pay attention to a few basic things, I rarely need to refer back to the passage. I think of it like this: "these questions are easier than you think they are, just pick the most obvious choice." In LR the answer choices really try to trick you, but I don't see that as much in RC. The questions simply want to know about what you just read. It's like in college when your buddy didn't do the assigned reading and wants you to just give a quick summary. If you can give a quick summary, you should be able to answer the questions. So just read close enough that you can summarize it for your lazy friend.




I'll echo this advice, and I found the bolded to be especially true for me. I started a system where I read the passage deliberately to make sure I understand it well, but I try to get through the questions as quickly as possible. The thing that can really derail an RC section is stressing over similar answer choices, so I started trusting my intuition and just picking one and moving on. This meant I almost never referred back to the passage until the very end when I'd use whatever time was left to go back and check the ones I was unsure about, but I would only change my answer if I found definitive proof in the passage because I found myself changing too many rights into wrongs (which is actually why I started to realize my intuition was better at getting the right answers than if I stressed over it).



How much time on average does it take you to read passages?


Honestly, it's been a while since I've timed how long just the passage takes, and I haven't timed myself at all in this way since starting this approach. One thing I'd recommend is trying two full sections: one reading normally but trying to get through the questions as quickly as possible while timing yourself and another section taking as long as you need to feel like you get every question right. By analyzing how much longer the second approach takes compared to the first compared to which way actually results in more right answers, you can start to develop your optimal pacing.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby 062914123 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:28 pm

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Last edited by 062914123 on Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

dosto
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby dosto » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:29 pm

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Last edited by dosto on Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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lsatyolo
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby lsatyolo » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:31 pm

PrizeFighter wrote:
lsatyolo wrote:
PrizeFighter wrote:
buffalo_ wrote:I actually find with RC that the harder I try to find the answer, the more likely I am to get the questions wrong. I used to approach it as just long form LR, and I know a lot of people use this method, but whereas with LR I can isolate specific words or phrases in the mini prompt that make my answer choice absolutely correct, with RC it takes far too long to go back and try and find these bits of evidence in the passage. On recent tests especially, I find that if I read quickly and just pay attention to a few basic things, I rarely need to refer back to the passage. I think of it like this: "these questions are easier than you think they are, just pick the most obvious choice." In LR the answer choices really try to trick you, but I don't see that as much in RC. The questions simply want to know about what you just read. It's like in college when your buddy didn't do the assigned reading and wants you to just give a quick summary. If you can give a quick summary, you should be able to answer the questions. So just read close enough that you can summarize it for your lazy friend.




I'll echo this advice, and I found the bolded to be especially true for me. I started a system where I read the passage deliberately to make sure I understand it well, but I try to get through the questions as quickly as possible. The thing that can really derail an RC section is stressing over similar answer choices, so I started trusting my intuition and just picking one and moving on. This meant I almost never referred back to the passage until the very end when I'd use whatever time was left to go back and check the ones I was unsure about, but I would only change my answer if I found definitive proof in the passage because I found myself changing too many rights into wrongs (which is actually why I started to realize my intuition was better at getting the right answers than if I stressed over it).



How much time on average does it take you to read passages?


Honestly, it's been a while since I've timed how long just the passage takes, and I haven't timed myself at all in this way since starting this approach. One thing I'd recommend is trying two full sections: one reading normally but trying to get through the questions as quickly as possible while timing yourself and another section taking as long as you need to feel like you get every question right. By analyzing how much longer the second approach takes compared to the first compared to which way actually results in more right answers, you can start to develop your optimal pacing.


I'll definitely give this a shot. RC has always been my bane.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby 062914123 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:32 pm

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Last edited by 062914123 on Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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CookieDough
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby CookieDough » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:34 pm

Anyone else breathe a sigh of relief while reading the Trainer? This is clicking so much easier for me then other methods... Yay hope for Dec! :D

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PrizeFighter
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby PrizeFighter » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:35 pm

bee wrote:
lsatyolo wrote:How much time on average does it take you to read passages?


sorry to butt in, but you should really be aiming to read passages in 2-3 mins (with passages 1/2 nearer to 2 mins than 3). any longer and you risk rushing through passages 3/4 and missing gimmes.


I'd say that sounds about right, but, at the same time, you can only read effectively as quickly as you can read effectively. Trying to speed up reading the passage seems like a recipe for disaster. If you find that you don't have enough time to finish a section, don't go through the passage quicker; go through the questions quicker.

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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby dosto » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:36 pm

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Last edited by dosto on Sun Sep 20, 2015 2:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

062914123
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby 062914123 » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:37 pm

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Last edited by 062914123 on Thu Jul 03, 2014 1:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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CookieDough
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Re: December 2013 Retakers

Postby CookieDough » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:39 pm

PrizeFighter wrote:

Honestly, it's been a while since I've timed how long just the passage takes, and I haven't timed myself at all in this way since starting this approach. One thing I'd recommend is trying two full sections: one reading normally but trying to get through the questions as quickly as possible while timing yourself and another section taking as long as you need to feel like you get every question right. By analyzing how much longer the second approach takes compared to the first compared to which way actually results in more right answers, you can start to develop your optimal pacing.



This is a great timing tip. Thank you! I don't have a problem with running out of time but I definitely read too fast and miss things so I'm definitely going to have to work on this...




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