What score do I need to justify a year off?

sabza
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What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby sabza » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:06 pm

Hey all,

I wasn't going to post until the June scores came out, but at this point I am so anxious, that I figure there is no harm.

I should give you all a back story:
I graduated in May with a 3.77, BUT I am a transfer student, who majorly messed up in my first few years. My LSAC GPA is 3.3.

I have a decent explanation (very personal) for my bad grades, and I took three years off from school to volunteer with children with HIV in South Africa. When I returned to finish my studies, I had a 3.77 (major in Political Science, minor in German).

I started studying for the LSAT in late October 2012, and took the exam in December. My diagnostic was 160, I was PTing between 174-176 (highest was 179), and on test day I was sick, stressed, overtired, and scored a 162.

I applied with that score, and my best offer was UC Irvine with a 20k/year scholarship. I feel like that was quite generous considering my numbers, and that they were probably giving me a chance because of my volunteer work, and the upward trend in my grades.

I took the LSAT again in June, and feel much better about it this time. If I don't come back with a significantly better score, I will go to UCI, which I truly believe to be a great school. If however, it comes back significantly higher, I was thinking of trying for a T-14. Since I will never be guaranteed admission, I need to weigh my options. What score would justify a year off to reapply? If any of you have some advice that would be greatly appreciated.

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mindarmed
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby mindarmed » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:11 pm

180

Kool-Aid
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby Kool-Aid » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:15 pm

If you were pting that high, why not retake in October if you don't hit your target?

sabza
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby sabza » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:18 pm

Kool-Aid wrote:If you were pting that high, why not retake in October if you don't hit your target?

I am currently being supported by my father, who has agreed to pay for law school. He wants me in a top 10 school, but also said that he is not willing to risk a year if the score isn't where I want it. He said if it's high this time-great, otherwise, go to UCI. He supported my 3 years in Africa as well...he thinks I just need to get finished with my education at this point.

Kool-Aid
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby Kool-Aid » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:21 pm

sabza wrote:
Kool-Aid wrote:If you were pting that high, why not retake in October if you don't hit your target?

I am currently being supported by my father, who has agreed to pay for law school. He wants me in a top 10 school, but also said that he is not willing to risk a year if the score isn't where I want it. He said if it's high this time-great, otherwise, go to UCI. He supported my 3 years in Africa as well...he thinks I just need to get finished with my education at this point.


It may be none of my business, but what is it that you/he is risking by taking one more year?

sabza
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby sabza » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:23 pm

Kool-Aid wrote:
sabza wrote:
Kool-Aid wrote:If you were pting that high, why not retake in October if you don't hit your target?

I am currently being supported by my father, who has agreed to pay for law school. He wants me in a top 10 school, but also said that he is not willing to risk a year if the score isn't where I want it. He said if it's high this time-great, otherwise, go to UCI. He supported my 3 years in Africa as well...he thinks I just need to get finished with my education at this point.


It may be none of my business, but what is it that you/he is risking by taking one more year?


I guess he figures I would be throwing away a perfectly good offer, and he doesn't think you can ever guarantee a score, regardless of PTs.

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Ded Precedent
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby Ded Precedent » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:26 pm

If 162 is below your capability, just plan on sitting this cycle out and applying next cycle. I don't know much about UC Irvine but I can tell you that if you have the capability to score as high as you have been on your PTs, I'd retake a 3rd time if you score anything less than a 170 in June.

Trust me I understand how hard it can be to set aside your anxiousness to attend law school and an entire year sounds like an eternity when you're ready to go now, but you're selling yourself short with that score. You need to think about your long term goals and your career in the legal field and not let yourself get caught up in your enthusiasm to attend law school immediately this fall.
Last edited by Ded Precedent on Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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mindarmed
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby mindarmed » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:26 pm

UCI is a great school, OP. Its first class had outstanding placement numbers and I think it is a solid option at 20k/yr.

meegee
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby meegee » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:29 pm

180.

If you were PTing that high (under test conditions), you should not even think about accepting a score lower than the low (maybe even mid) 170s.

Not really for me to say but. Why not get a job? If you were PTing that well, it appears you should have the stuff pretty much locked down and may just need to iron out the kinks. Get a job. Practice/review on weekends. With a year, and with where you're currently at, it should be no problem. Worst comes to worst, you just gotta dedicate your week nights to studying as well.

Plus, having work experience gives you a slight advantage when applying (I think.. at least for Northwestern I hear.. from TLS..)

Third times the charm, so I'll say it again. Get a job. I'm serious, work experience (and/or living on your own) will really help you grow as an individual. Even if it's just 6 months.

Daily_Double
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby Daily_Double » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:35 pm

sabza wrote:My LSAC GPA is 3.3.

I have a decent explanation (very personal) for my bad grades, and I took three years off from school to volunteer with children with HIV in South Africa. When I returned to finish my studies, I had a 3.77 (major in Political Science, minor in German).

I started studying for the LSAT in late October 2012, and took the exam in December. My diagnostic was 160, I was PTing between 174-176 (highest was 179), and on test day I was sick, stressed, overtired, and scored a 162.


I don't know much about UCI, other than its location and lack of rank, but I would guess that it places most of its graduates in California and does not possess a strong national base. Do you want to work on the West coast? Do you care? These are some of the questions you should consider.

That being said, one thing sticks out to me here. Your PT scores. If these are a representative sample, meaning that you PTed 174-176 on more than ten, preferably 15, PTs under strictly timed conditions using at least one extra section, then you're selling yourself short by not retaking.

Wackydog
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby Wackydog » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:37 pm

This is not funny when I was 12 I had my first sexual experience. At the time, I lived in a little suburb outside of Cleveland and anyway, the girl next door and I were really good friends. Our parents were both gone for the day and she was over playing Transformers with me. So anyway, we kinda got.. Bored I guess? And we started playing truth or dare, which turned into 'you show me yours, I'll show you mine". So anyway there I Was, 12 years old, heart pounding, blood rushing in my ears, and the chick (who was a year older than me actually) takes off her panties and hikes her little skirt up. So What did I do, you ask? I whistled for a cab, and when it came near, the license plate said "fresh" and there were dice in the mirror. If anything I could say that this cab was rare, but I thought "naw forget it, yo home to bel-air!" I pulled up to the house about seven or eight and I yelled to the cabbie "yo homes smell ya later!" Looked at my kingdom, I was finally there. To settle my throne as the prince of bel-air.

Kool-Aid
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby Kool-Aid » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:39 pm

Wackydog wrote:This is not funny when I was 12 I had my first sexual experience. At the time, I lived in a little suburb outside of Cleveland and anyway, the girl next door and I were really good friends. Our parents were both gone for the day and she was over playing Transformers with me. So anyway, we kinda got.. Bored I guess? And we started playing truth or dare, which turned into 'you show me yours, I'll show you mine". So anyway there I Was, 12 years old, heart pounding, blood rushing in my ears, and the chick (who was a year older than me actually) takes off her panties and hikes her little skirt up. So What did I do, you ask? I whistled for a cab, and when it came near, the license plate said "fresh" and there were dice in the mirror. If anything I could say that this cab was rare, but I thought "naw forget it, yo home to bel-air!" I pulled up to the house about seven or eight and I yelled to the cabbie "yo homes smell ya later!" Looked at my kingdom, I was finally there. To settle my throne as the prince of bel-air.


I hope you used copy and paste.

Kool-Aid
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby Kool-Aid » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:40 pm

sabza wrote:
Kool-Aid wrote:
sabza wrote:
Kool-Aid wrote:If you were pting that high, why not retake in October if you don't hit your target?

I am currently being supported by my father, who has agreed to pay for law school. He wants me in a top 10 school, but also said that he is not willing to risk a year if the score isn't where I want it. He said if it's high this time-great, otherwise, go to UCI. He supported my 3 years in Africa as well...he thinks I just need to get finished with my education at this point.


It may be none of my business, but what is it that you/he is risking by taking one more year?


I guess he figures I would be throwing away a perfectly good offer, and he doesn't think you can ever guarantee a score, regardless of PTs.


My advice would be to retake/reapply. Good luck

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crestor
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby crestor » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:43 pm

Kool-Aid wrote:
Wackydog wrote:This is not funny when I was 12 I had my first sexual experience. At the time, I lived in a little suburb outside of Cleveland and anyway, the girl next door and I were really good friends. Our parents were both gone for the day and she was over playing Transformers with me. So anyway, we kinda got.. Bored I guess? And we started playing truth or dare, which turned into 'you show me yours, I'll show you mine". So anyway there I Was, 12 years old, heart pounding, blood rushing in my ears, and the chick (who was a year older than me actually) takes off her panties and hikes her little skirt up. So What did I do, you ask? I whistled for a cab, and when it came near, the license plate said "fresh" and there were dice in the mirror. If anything I could say that this cab was rare, but I thought "naw forget it, yo home to bel-air!" I pulled up to the house about seven or eight and I yelled to the cabbie "yo homes smell ya later!" Looked at my kingdom, I was finally there. To settle my throne as the prince of bel-air.


I hope you used copy and paste.



you've never heard of the bel-air meme? noob

sabza
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby sabza » Sun Jun 16, 2013 12:39 am

Thanks for the advice guys. I feel good about the June test...never know with reading comp though. There is one principle LR question I think I may have messed up, but other than that I'm thinking I nailed LR and LG. Hopefully retaking won't be an issue :)

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Dog
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby Dog » Sun Jun 16, 2013 4:38 am

Daily_Double wrote:
sabza wrote:My LSAC GPA is 3.3.

I have a decent explanation (very personal) for my bad grades, and I took three years off from school to volunteer with children with HIV in South Africa. When I returned to finish my studies, I had a 3.77 (major in Political Science, minor in German).

I started studying for the LSAT in late October 2012, and took the exam in December. My diagnostic was 160, I was PTing between 174-176 (highest was 179), and on test day I was sick, stressed, overtired, and scored a 162.


That being said, one thing sticks out to me here. Your PT scores. If these are a representative sample, meaning that you PTed 174-176 on more than ten, preferably 15, PTs under strictly timed conditions using at least one extra section, then you're selling yourself short by not retaking.



Heck, even if he scored 174-176 on five recent preptests with slightly lax conditions and only four sections, he's still selling himself short by not retaking. Once you start to get perfect or close to perfect on the sections building up endurance for the realistic conditions isn't entirely difficult to accomplish.

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Clearly
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby Clearly » Sun Jun 16, 2013 4:44 am

Take the LSAT till you hit 173 or better.

bp shinners
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Re: What score do I need to justify a year off?

Postby bp shinners » Mon Jun 17, 2013 11:34 am

Kool-Aid wrote:
Wackydog wrote:To settle my throne as the prince of bel-air.


I hope you used copy and paste.


Since he messed up the lyrics, I doubt it.

To OP - Sounds like your dad just wants you to move forwards with your life. I would sit him down and talk him through the job outcomes for different schools, along with the scholarship offers and what can be expected with your PT-average scores. You can do that well on the test, as you've shown on those PTs. There's no reason, even if your dad is wealthy, to spend money that you don't have to. And there's no reason to sell yourself short if you're interested in a school other than UC-Irvine.

So if you're not in the 170s, I would retake the test. And if you are, I would take the year off.




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