LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

User avatar
wtrc
Posts: 2057
Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 9:37 pm

LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby wtrc » Mon Dec 17, 2012 1:56 pm

I guess the question is in the title. Do people recommend the PS Bible for Logic Games, Manhattan, or another book?

I'm scoring -0 or -1 but taking ~40-45 minutes often, and need to cut down on timing. My deductions aren't great, which is causing the timing issue.

Thanks!

User avatar
99.9luft
Posts: 1244
Joined: Wed Nov 10, 2010 4:32 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby 99.9luft » Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:00 pm

practice. over and over. same games, different gams. as fast as you can.

User avatar
hume85
Posts: 675
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2011 5:38 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby hume85 » Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:14 pm

I definitely recommend the LG bible: I got -1 this past Oct., and I was slow like you are before I picked up the LG bible. But I have also heard positive things about Manhattan. You might want to consider both, if you have the money. But if their approaches contrast too much this may be confusing. But I think Noodleyone recommends both. You might want to PM him.

TERS
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 11:29 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby TERS » Mon Dec 17, 2012 6:41 pm

I used methods from both.

What I like about Manhattan guides in general is their relative flexibility; Powerscore tends to have too many categories and subcategories, particularly in their LR and LG guides. I think this is great for those who don't take to the exam, have a lot of time to prepare for the LSAT, or are in general partial to a more structured and mechanical approach.

Keep in mind that you can use methods from both books. For example, I disliked Powerscore's approach to "relative ordering" games, so used Manhattan's method for those game types. For other game types, I mostly used Powerscore's approach (there's of course a lot of overlap between the two anyway).

Test out both books' strategies and see what works best for you.

cslouisck
Posts: 134
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2012 11:59 am

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby cslouisck » Mon Dec 17, 2012 6:50 pm

FWIW, I was in the same situation you were originally and found the LG Bible really helpful but I never looked at Manhattan et al. PowerScore's diagramming made sense to me, and as I recall, the practice games were typically harder than what's been appearing more recently on the test. Started out going -8 to -12 on timed PTs, but ended up going -2 on the October games because of Zones, even though I thought I had it figured out and finished early. Guess I didn't.

User avatar
bobbypin
Posts: 256
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 3:50 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby bobbypin » Tue Dec 18, 2012 3:45 am

I read both. PS didn't work for me. Manhattan did. YMMV.

User avatar
sabanist
Posts: 573
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:48 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby sabanist » Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:03 pm

PS helped me a lot in terms of learning how to approach them, but speed is all about practice. Drilling made a world of difference.
fwiw, I didn't try Manhattan, but I've heard the 3rd edition LG is pretty good.

User avatar
Teflon_Don
Posts: 474
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2012 7:04 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby Teflon_Don » Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:12 pm

Ive used both, Manhattan is better.

User avatar
ScottRiqui
Posts: 3640
Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:09 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby ScottRiqui » Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:17 pm

I just ordered the Velocity LSAT program, mostly for the games. After watching all of their free videos where Dave is working out games, I'm impressed by his techniques, specifically the fact that it doesn't rely on recognizing inferences at all.

It's all very "plug and chug" and direct, but I think with enough practice I'll be able to consistently finish a games section in under 35 minutes. I've only just recently begun prepping in earnest, and I don't run too far over time as it is.

ETA: I've also ordered the Manhattan set of books as well, based largely on recommendations I've seen here.

User avatar
wtrc
Posts: 2057
Joined: Mon May 30, 2011 9:37 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby wtrc » Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:21 pm

Thanks everyone. I think I'll try the LGB and then, if I'm still having issues, order Manhattan.

nedzilla
Posts: 42
Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:41 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby nedzilla » Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:28 pm

Ive used both LG Bible and Manhattan. I think Manhattan is more complete and comprehensive, and i especially like their set up for conditional grouping games (or in/out in Bible) and wished I had known it the first time I took the LSAT.

both are similar enough though that either is good, just put in the work to the point of knowing how approach each game type and be flexible with your set up depending on the game.

User avatar
Cerebro
Posts: 239
Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2012 9:22 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby Cerebro » Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:13 pm

Yeah, but PS LGB has some pretty wacky recommendations. Their method of "diagramming" relative ordering games sucks. Here's my list of Pros and Cons for PS versus Manhattan. Note: My knowledge of Manhattan is limited to their 2nd edition. I have ordered their 3rd edition, but have not completed it.

PowerScore LGB:

Pros
  • Discussion of numerical distribution is top notch; this doesn't seem to be covered as well in any other source, including Manhattan.
  • LGB is more complete from the perspective that it covers more game types, particularly older game types that are less likely to appear on the new tests (but they could), for example: Mapping and pattern games.
  • Seems to provide better guidelines for limited solution games, and I prefer their parenthetical notation for indicating loose placement of variables in comparison with Manhattan's cloud approach.

Cons
  • LGB's method of attacking binary (in/out) grouping games really leaves a lot to be desired. It didn't work for me, ymmv.
  • LGB's method for diagramming relative ordering games really sucks. I prefer Manhattan's "Tree" approach.
  • Undetermined Grouping (Open Board) games are easier with Manhattan's method; ymmv.

Manhattan LG:

Pros
  • Tree approach to relative ordering games is the best
  • After studying Manhattan's methods, my time for grouping games (Open and Closed) improved dramatically.
  • Binary grouping games became more manageable for me with Manhattan's method. Although better that LGB, other options exist which may be superior.
  • Manhattan's focus centers around the more recent (and more likely to appear on your test) games. (but, see cons)

Cons
  • Doesn't really cover the numerical distribution concept as well as PowerScore. Thinking about the numerical distributions has been a key concept to how I attack unbalanced games.
  • It may be hard to categorize some older games, and therefore, their techniques are less applicable to these type of games.
  • The 3rd edition didn't come out until after I had already studied with the 2nd edition. Not really a con for other folks, but I was struggling to find a third bullet point for this list. :)

Regarding Basic and Complex Ordering games, there's not much difference between LGB and MLSAT's approach.

EDIT: Typos
Last edited by Cerebro on Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
PickMe!
Posts: 162
Joined: Mon Nov 12, 2012 1:24 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby PickMe! » Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:17 pm

sabanist wrote:PS helped me a lot in terms of learning how to approach them ( I had to read it twice), but speed is all about practice. Drilling made a world of difference.
fwiw, I didn't try Manhattan, but I've heard the 3rd edition LG is pretty good.


+1

TERS
Posts: 161
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 11:29 pm

Re: LG: Bible, Manhattan, or Something Else?

Postby TERS » Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:47 pm

Cerebro brought up some good points.

I want to expand on my earlier recommendation to read both books.

It is likely that you'll find Powerscore's approach to game type X better than Manhattan's and, at the same time, find Manhattan's approach to game type Y better than Powercore's. But it goes further than that; rule representation methods--something that is not limited to specific game types--differ between the guides. For example, a rule like "F and G finish consecutively" would be diagrammed by Manhattan as a square enclosing "FG", with a double-sided arrow underneath representing that they can either occur together as "FG" or "GF". On the other hand, Powerscore would represent this rule as a circle enclosing "FG". For this example, I found Powerscore's method quicker and no less intuitive than Manhattan's. In the end, I utilized rule representation methods from both books.

My point is that you should combine methods from both guides to develop a set of tactics and strategies that work best for you, personally.

Aside: Understandably, I haven't read every available guide. The two main reasons I recommend reading both Manhattan and Powerscore and nothing else are that these books are generally seen as the best and, obviously, time constraints.




Return to “LSAT Prep and Discussion Forum”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests