Really Sad, Depressed, and Crying Over Today's LSAT

[RodneyRuxin]

Hey man. Almost everyone I talked to think they did bad on test day, myself included.


Don't cancel. School's don't average scores.

Definitely don't listen to the 0Ls telling you to take a year off to "clear your head."

Get your score. Is it great? Perfect, send out the apps and enjoy.

Is it not-so-great? That's okay. Get your apps ready to be shipped out (LORs, personal statement, actually fill out the app, etc) and take the December test.

A URM with grades of someone who would get in without the boost isn't going to get hit that hard from applying late December. Now, if you were between medians and maybe had a shot, that's different.

173+3.7+URM I don't know of a school that wouldn't salivate over accepting you (Maybe one or two of HYS).

Edit: Bad Score/Good Score would set you back a little, but from your description it sounds like Okay Score/Good Score. Look for yourself at lawschoolnumbers.com and find people who got into HYS with two scores. Many 165/175 3.7's get in while most 170/3.7's won't(non-URM).

[Eberry]

Hey man. Almost everyone I talked to think they did bad on test day, myself included.


Don't cancel. School's don't average scores.

Definitely don't listen to the 0Ls telling you to take a year off to "clear your head."

Get your score. Is it great? Perfect, send out the apps and enjoy.

Is it not-so-great? That's okay. Get your apps ready to be shipped out (LORs, personal statement, actually fill out the app, etc) and take the December test.

A URM with grades of someone who would get in without the boost isn't going to get hit that hard from applying late December. Now, if you were between medians and maybe had a shot, that's different.

173+3.7+URM I don't know of a school that wouldn't salivate over accepting you (Maybe one or two of HYS).

Lol at quoting out of context.

[RodneyRuxin]

Hey man. Almost everyone I talked to think they did bad on test day, myself included.


Don't cancel. School's don't average scores.

Definitely don't listen to the 0Ls telling you to take a year off to "clear your head."

Get your score. Is it great? Perfect, send out the apps and enjoy.

Is it not-so-great? That's okay. Get your apps ready to be shipped out (LORs, personal statement, actually fill out the app, etc) and take the December test.

A URM with grades of someone who would get in without the boost isn't going to get hit that hard from applying late December. Now, if you were between medians and maybe had a shot, that's different.

173+3.7+URM I don't know of a school that wouldn't salivate over accepting you (Maybe one or two of HYS).

Lol at quoting out of context.

I'd recommend putting the LSAT off a year, clearing your head, and preparing like crazy for the next one.

There's your context.


This is stupid 0L advice that stems from a fundamental misunderstanding of the all too common "take a year off and retake" sentiment on TLS.

Why in the hell would you need to take a year off to "clear your head" when you can retake a month after and get in this cycle?

People suggest taking a year off when it's too late. This is a URM with a good GPA. With a good LSAT he can apply in December and be fine.

This is a year of someone's life we're talking about. Don't give advice when you don't know what the hell you are talking about.

[CalAlumni]

I remember your success' from the study thread. We pt'd around the same for the whole cycle.

I had a lot of trouble with LG zoning but besides that nothing too out of the ordinary. I say this, because, while it is my experience and not yours, I feel that I might have scratched a 170 and I have faith in you too. Nothing too crazy from what we had been doing, and we have been doing quite well.

The next few weeks will be brutal, but wait it out. Worst case scenario is you peak in the high 160's and you retake and kill it like our noodleyone surely did.

Best

Thanks toothbrush! I wish you the best of luck; you deserve 170+ for all the work you put in.

Hey man. Almost everyone I talked to think they did bad on test day, myself included.

Don't cancel. School's don't average scores.

Definitely don't listen to the 0Ls telling you to take a year off to "clear your head."

Get your score. Is it great? Perfect, send out the apps and enjoy.

Is it not-so-great? That's okay. Get your apps ready to be shipped out (LORs, personal statement, actually fill out the app, etc) and take the December test.

A URM with grades of someone who would get in without the boost isn't going to get hit that hard from applying late December. Now, if you were between medians and maybe had a shot, that's different.

173+3.7+URM I don't know of a school that wouldn't salivate over accepting you (Maybe one or two of HYS).

I've ultimately decided not to cancel. Thanks so much for the reply.

As I told someone else, the first LG rocked me....then the last LG, ZONES, caught me with my chin out and knocked me the f*ck out. That, plus already not being confident with my LG performance really shook me hard.

Really disappointed in myself.

God Bless this site. I'd be a complete wreck without it.

[RodneyRuxin]

Best of luck to you.

Remember that last October you could miss 7 and still get a 175 (11 for a 170, 20 for a 165). It sounds like this zones question screwed a lot of people up, the curve could help you out.

Even so, if you missed every single question of the last logic game and your estimations of the other sections pan out, you're still looking to score above a 165.

Keep calm when everyone you know asks you how the LSAT went (they will). I just replied "not bad enough to cancel my score so we'll see." Most people will reply with something along the lines of "I'm sure you did fine." IMO that's the best way that conversation can go when you're a nervous wreck.

[Eberry]

Hey man. Almost everyone I talked to think they did bad on test day, myself included.


Don't cancel. School's don't average scores.

Definitely don't listen to the 0Ls telling you to take a year off to "clear your head."

Get your score. Is it great? Perfect, send out the apps and enjoy.

Is it not-so-great? That's okay. Get your apps ready to be shipped out (LORs, personal statement, actually fill out the app, etc) and take the December test.

A URM with grades of someone who would get in without the boost isn't going to get hit that hard from applying late December. Now, if you were between medians and maybe had a shot, that's different.

173+3.7+URM I don't know of a school that wouldn't salivate over accepting you (Maybe one or two of HYS).

Lol at quoting out of context.

I'd recommend putting the LSAT off a year, clearing your head, and preparing like crazy for the next one.

There's your context.


This is stupid 0L advice that stems from a fundamental misunderstanding of the all too common "take a year off and retake" sentiment on TLS.

Why in the hell would you need to take a year off to "clear your head" when you can retake a month after and get in this cycle?

People suggest taking a year off when it's too late. This is a URM with a good GPA. With a good LSAT he can apply in December and be fine.

This is a year of someone's life we're talking about. Don't give advice when you don't know what the hell you are talking about.

Again, not really in context if you chop off where I elaborate that the course of action you quoted out of context should perhaps only be pursued if OP really thought they performed terribad and wanted to cancel/retake. Also, I did not see that Cal really wanted to attend ASAP (as that detail was posted after). Regardless, my opinion isn't without merit. If OP wasn't intent on applying this cycle, waiting, studying, etc.. for a year or so wouldn't be a ridiculous proposition, especially if Cal thought the additional time would be incredibly beneficial to LSAT performance. Obviously OP has the potential to retake in December and still have a great cycle, especially with that GPA and URM status. Take a chill pill, bro. You and I both wanted her to not cancel. I would just prefer to wait a year in that situation if I did think I needed to cancel or thought i got awful score, and you wouldn't. Neither is a wrong course of action, especially with OPs intangibles.

[Eberry]

I remember your success' from the study thread. We pt'd around the same for the whole cycle.

I had a lot of trouble with LG zoning but besides that nothing too out of the ordinary. I say this, because, while it is my experience and not yours, I feel that I might have scratched a 170 and I have faith in you too. Nothing too crazy from what we had been doing, and we have been doing quite well.

The next few weeks will be brutal, but wait it out. Worst case scenario is you peak in the high 160's and you retake and kill it like our noodleyone surely did.

Best

Thanks toothbrush! I wish you the best of luck; you deserve 170+ for all the work you put in.

Hey man. Almost everyone I talked to think they did bad on test day, myself included.

Don't cancel. School's don't average scores.

Definitely don't listen to the 0Ls telling you to take a year off to "clear your head."

Get your score. Is it great? Perfect, send out the apps and enjoy.

Is it not-so-great? That's okay. Get your apps ready to be shipped out (LORs, personal statement, actually fill out the app, etc) and take the December test.

A URM with grades of someone who would get in without the boost isn't going to get hit that hard from applying late December. Now, if you were between medians and maybe had a shot, that's different.

173+3.7+URM I don't know of a school that wouldn't salivate over accepting you (Maybe one or two of HYS).

I've ultimately decided not to cancel. Thanks so much for the reply.

As I told someone else, the first LG rocked me....then the last LG, ZONES, caught me with my chin out and knocked me the f*ck out. That, plus already not being confident with my LG performance really shook me hard.

Really disappointed in myself.

God Bless this site. I'd be a complete wreck without it.

Best of luck, cal. I hope you get a tremendous score come the end of October (and hopefully we all receive the benefit of a generous curve).

[Lawquacious]

Well, sounds like you made your decision to wait it out, which I agree (with many of the posters here) is the better approach. Good luck.

[mvpforme]

Missed 0 on games on my last 10 PTs before missing 6 on real thing. But went -1 on RC when I usually went -4 to -6. Got 170+. You're gonna be ok.

[Hoocheez]

.

[20121109]

You're a URM....get a 150. you good.

Just stop.

[honeybadger12]

Hey man. Almost everyone I talked to think they did bad on test day, myself included.


Don't cancel. School's don't average scores.

Definitely don't listen to the 0Ls telling you to take a year off to "clear your head."

Get your score. Is it great? Perfect, send out the apps and enjoy.

Is it not-so-great? That's okay. Get your apps ready to be shipped out (LORs, personal statement, actually fill out the app, etc) and take the December test.

A URM with grades of someone who would get in without the boost isn't going to get hit that hard from applying late December. Now, if you were between medians and maybe had a shot, that's different.

173+3.7+URM I don't know of a school that wouldn't salivate over accepting you (Maybe one or two of HYS).

Edit: Bad Score/Good Score would set you back a little, but from your description it sounds like Okay Score/Good Score. Look for yourself at lawschoolnumbers.com and find people who got into HYS with two scores. Many 165/175 3.7's get in while most 170/3.7's won't(non-URM).

If you feel good about not cancelling, go for it. But this idea that schools don't average scores is straight wrong. Some don't, but you should totally be shooting for HYS, and those schools consider all scores. He's right that a 165/175 is better than a 170, but C/175 is better than 165/175. A 165/175 is something you might write an addendum for. Just want you to have full info - but again, if you want to keep the score, keep it.

[NoodleyOne]

Not true.

Not true.

Not true.

Edit: Let me expand. It's pretty much guaranteed that the majority of schools don't average. There are a couple that *may* average, although that theory just comes from how out of whack their admittance standards are to the rest (Referring to YS here). Most evidence supports that all other schools don't average, and it's not confirmed that those two do average.

So keep your score and ignore the above poster.

[honeybadger12]

Not true.

Not true.

Not true.

Edit: Let me expand. It's pretty much guaranteed that the majority of schools don't average. There are a couple that *may* average, although that theory just comes from how out of whack their admittance standards are to the rest (Referring to YS here). Most evidence supports that all other schools don't average, and it's not confirmed that those two do average.

So keep your score and ignore the above poster.

I said nothing untrue. All I said is HYS consider all scores. They do (unless you believe they are lying to applicants). It's certainly debatable how much difference it makes.

[beautyistruth]

Considering all scores is pretty significantly different from averaging. 165/175 with a 10 point improvement isn't the same as a straight-up average, where the schools will count you as a 170.

[hookem7]

OP, a good friend of mine who is URM (Mex-Am) retook his 165 for a 174. Granted, his GPA was 3.8 and a little change, but he had all of HYS acceptances to choose from. Even if you didn't crush it this time around, try try again my friend. Might as well see what you got, idk if I could live with not knowing but that's just me.

[carboncopyx]

Yeah, if you're shooting for HYS, I've talked to both Stanford and Harvard's Deans of Admissions, and they both say that they prefer one score only. A C/175 trumps a 165/175 for them, hands down. However, if you're not aiming for HYS, just seeing how you did on this test won't hurt you and might save you the trouble of having to sit for the test again. It just depends on your end goal!

[SantIvo]

Considering all scores is pretty significantly different from averaging. 165/175 with a 10 point improvement isn't the same as a straight-up average, where the schools will count you as a 170.

Moreover, why would H or any other school regard a "C" as some sort of nonentity? Couldn't it be that a cancel suggests a score even lower than a 165? If that's the case a 165/175 would be considered -- at worst -- equivalent to a cancel/175. Or am I missing something?

[honeybadger12]

Considering all scores is pretty significantly different from averaging. 165/175 with a 10 point improvement isn't the same as a straight-up average, where the schools will count you as a 170.

Great point. Some schools (maybe outside HYS?) use the word "average" while others (I think all of HYS) use the term "consider all scores." I shouldn't have used them interchangeably.

SantIvo, they def wouldn't regard a C as a nonentity, but from what I've learned, it's much better than e.g. a 160. I'm not an admissions officer so idk exactly why they view things like they do, but unless I'm badly misinformed, you write an addendum for a 165/175 and you don't for a C/175 (if I'm wrong, someone please tell me so I can add an addendum haha).

[LexLeon]

I would highly recommend that you do not cancel. What's the worst case scenario, that you end up with a score that's better than 90% of other scores?
If you get a 165, at least your foot will be in the door for the Top Tier.

You can always retake, and I genuinely believe a school would rather see a huge improvement from a good score.

[soj]

Yeah, if you're shooting for HYS, I've talked to both Stanford and Harvard's Deans of Admissions, and they both say that they prefer one score only. A C/175 trumps a 165/175 for them, hands down. However, if you're not aiming for HYS, just seeing how you did on this test won't hurt you and might save you the trouble of having to sit for the test again. It just depends on your end goal!

Did they really say that, or did they punt the question like all adcoms do, saying something like "we consider all the scores holistically"? Disfavoring retakers is, even at HYS, largely a flame designed to make the admissions process seem more holistic and less numbers-driven.

[honeybadger12]

Yeah, if you're shooting for HYS, I've talked to both Stanford and Harvard's Deans of Admissions, and they both say that they prefer one score only. A C/175 trumps a 165/175 for them, hands down. However, if you're not aiming for HYS, just seeing how you did on this test won't hurt you and might save you the trouble of having to sit for the test again. It just depends on your end goal!

Did they really say that, or did they punt the question like all adcoms do, saying something like "we consider all the scores holistically"? Disfavoring retakers is, even at HYS, largely a flame designed to make the admissions process seem more holistic and less numbers-driven.

Hmm that makes me want to retake my 174 for Yale

[soj]

Shit that makes me want to retake my 174 for Yale ha

I know you're kidding, but no one should retake a 173+ unless they're a splitter and need a better score to get into HLS/CLS/NYU.

[CalAlumni]

Thanks for being here for me guys, it means more to me than you'll ever know.

What also fucked with me during the LSAT was the guy next to me, he was a nice guy, but I don't know if he had a different exam or what, but every time I was trying to focus on a passage or LR he was LOUDLY diagraming or crossing out answers or something OBNOXIOUSLY which led to me plugging my ears for every section except LG. I couldn't even diagram conditional LR or underline conclusions due to his incessant scribbling.

Everything that could go wrong for me...went wrong.

I know in my heart that HYS is my dream, and I will not be happy anywhere else. If I retake and get 170+, I'm still not a lock at one of HYS due to having to apply late in the cycle.

I think my best bet is to go to the highest ranked school I can get into--maybe Cornell, but with the sole intent of transferring to HYS. Seems like from what I've been researching, a top 5% at Cornell or similar ranked school would get me one of H/S--according to the empirical data on here.

I know common wisdom on TLS is don't go to a law school with the intent of transferring, but I KNOW I can get top 5% or better. My biggest weakness is standardized testing, while my biggest strength is in-class exams. My ADHD will also get me extra time as I understand it.

I'm sad, depressed, confused, after prepping 171-174 consistently to have my law school cycle come down to this...I'm so ashamed and embarrassed...I can hardly look myself in the mirror. I think I need to regroup, collect myself, go to the best school I get into and prep for my ultimate battle...my one last stand...transfer to HYS......or die trying.

[soj]

I know common wisdom on TLS is don't go to a law school with the intent of transferring, but I KNOW I can get top 5% or better. My biggest weakness is standardized testing, while my biggest strength is in-class exams. My ADHD will also get me extra time as I understand it.

What, no. You don't know you can get top 5% or better. Just suck it up and retake for a score you need to get into your dream schools.