LSAT 'logic game'!

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Scotusnerd
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LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby Scotusnerd » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:17 pm

Ok, quick quiz for y'all that think you are good at LSAT logic games. No time limit. Einstein came up with this one back in the 19th century. He said that 98% of the world's population couldn't answer it. Check it out:

ALBERT EINSTEIN'S RIDDLE

ARE YOU IN THE TOP 2% OF INTELLIGENT PEOPLE IN THE WORLD? SOLVE THE RIDDLE AND FIND OUT.

There are no tricks, just pure logic, so good luck and don't give up.

1. In a street there are five houses, painted five different colours.
2. In each house lives a person of different nationality
3. These five homeowners each drink a different kind of beverage, smoke different brand of cigar and keep a different pet.

THE QUESTION: WHO OWNS THE FISH?

HINTS

1. The Brit lives in a red house.
2. The Swede keeps dogs as pets.
3. The Dane drinks tea.
4. The Green house is next to, and on the left of the White house.
5. The owner of the Green house drinks coffee.
6. The person who smokes Pall Mall rears birds.
7. The owner of the Yellow house smokes Dunhill.
8. The man living in the centre house drinks milk.
9. The Norwegian lives in the first house.
10. The man who smokes Blends lives next to the one who keeps cats.
11. The man who keeps horses lives next to the man who smokes Dunhill.
12. The man who smokes Blue Master drinks beer.
13. The German smokes Prince.
14. The Norwegian lives next to the blue house.
15. The man who smokes Blends has a neighbour who drinks water.



Please don't post the answer in this topic! If you want to check if you're correct, google Einstein's Riddle.

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dingbat
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby dingbat » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:18 pm

Nobody owns the fish, because no fish is mentioned in the hints.

On a separate note, the Prince brand of cigarette didn't come out until after Einstein had died, so there is no way Einstein came up with this riddle
Last edited by dingbat on Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Scotusnerd
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby Scotusnerd » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:22 pm

Cool info! But you're wrong about the answer. 8)

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dingbat
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby dingbat » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:24 pm

Scotusnerd wrote:Cool info! But you're wrong about the answer. 8)

Technically I'm correct.

I've done this logic game before and am too lazy to do it again, but I'm certain more than 2% of the population is capable of completing the puzzle

Edit: this has been shown on TLS before. I'm too lazy to dig up the original post, though

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Scotusnerd
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby Scotusnerd » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:28 pm

Gotta agree about more than 2% of the population doing it. Certaintly more than 2% of the LSAT-taking population.

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Nova
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby Nova » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:40 pm

I cant think right now but I will try it tomorrow :mrgreen:

bhan87
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby bhan87 » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:41 pm

Scotusnerd wrote:Ok, quick quiz for y'all that think you are good at LSAT logic games. No time limit. Einstein came up with this one back in the 19th century. He said that 98% of the world's population couldn't answer it. Check it out:

ALBERT EINSTEIN'S RIDDLE

ARE YOU IN THE TOP 2% OF INTELLIGENT PEOPLE IN THE WORLD? SOLVE THE RIDDLE AND FIND OUT.

There are no tricks, just pure logic, so good luck and don't give up.

1. In a street there are five houses, painted five different colours.
2. In each house lives a person of different nationality
3. These five homeowners each drink a different kind of beverage, smoke different brand of cigar and keep a different pet.

THE QUESTION: WHO OWNS THE FISH?

HINTS

1. The Brit lives in a red house.
2. The Swede keeps dogs as pets.
3. The Dane drinks tea.
4. The Green house is next to, and on the left of the White house.
5. The owner of the Green house drinks coffee.
6. The person who smokes Pall Mall rears birds.
7. The owner of the Yellow house smokes Dunhill.
8. The man living in the centre house drinks milk.
9. The Norwegian lives in the first house.
10. The man who smokes Blends lives next to the one who keeps cats.
11. The man who keeps horses lives next to the man who smokes Dunhill.
12. The man who smokes Blue Master drinks beer.
13. The German smokes Prince.
14. The Norwegian lives next to the blue house.
15. The man who smokes Blends has a neighbour who drinks water.



Please don't post the answer in this topic! If you want to check if you're correct, google Einstein's Riddle.


Disappointing.... New and Used CDs was harder than this...

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ilovelawtays
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby ilovelawtays » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:47 pm

bhan87 wrote:
Scotusnerd wrote:Ok, quick quiz for y'all that think you are good at LSAT logic games. No time limit. Einstein came up with this one back in the 19th century. He said that 98% of the world's population couldn't answer it. Check it out:

ALBERT EINSTEIN'S RIDDLE

ARE YOU IN THE TOP 2% OF INTELLIGENT PEOPLE IN THE WORLD? SOLVE THE RIDDLE AND FIND OUT.

There are no tricks, just pure logic, so good luck and don't give up.

1. In a street there are five houses, painted five different colours.
2. In each house lives a person of different nationality
3. These five homeowners each drink a different kind of beverage, smoke different brand of cigar and keep a different pet.

THE QUESTION: WHO OWNS THE FISH?

HINTS

1. The Brit lives in a red house.
2. The Swede keeps dogs as pets.
3. The Dane drinks tea.
4. The Green house is next to, and on the left of the White house.
5. The owner of the Green house drinks coffee.
6. The person who smokes Pall Mall rears birds.
7. The owner of the Yellow house smokes Dunhill.
8. The man living in the centre house drinks milk.
9. The Norwegian lives in the first house.
10. The man who smokes Blends lives next to the one who keeps cats.
11. The man who keeps horses lives next to the man who smokes Dunhill.
12. The man who smokes Blue Master drinks beer.
13. The German smokes Prince.
14. The Norwegian lives next to the blue house.
15. The man who smokes Blends has a neighbour who drinks water.



Please don't post the answer in this topic! If you want to check if you're correct, google Einstein's Riddle.


Disappointing.... New and Used CDs was harder than this...


I lol'd.

bhan87
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby bhan87 » Sun Jul 22, 2012 11:48 pm

dingbat wrote:Nobody owns the fish, because no fish is mentioned in the hints.

On a separate note, the Prince brand of cigarette didn't come out until after Einstein had died, so there is no way Einstein came up with this riddle


Fish is a random variable, which is very common in Logic Games. The only difference here is the riddle doesn't define the set for you, so you'd need to hunt out the list of variables yourself.

Also, the fact that the question is about the random variable implies that you'll only find a solution once most of the diagram is set up, with the key inference usually being no slots being left for that variable to fit into. (This was the case here).

Btw, I don't agree with the solution that Google turns up. The answer is correct, but the explanation was wrong in concluding that the whole diagram can be filled out. If I'm not mistaken, there are actually two possible setups to this riddle, both of which result in the same person owning the fish.

Edit: Never mind, I see now how they could conclusively reduce it down to one solution.

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NoodleyOne
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby NoodleyOne » Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:44 am

Not hard but time consuming with all of those rules.

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MauveT-Rex
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby MauveT-Rex » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:38 am

dingbat wrote:Nobody owns the fish, because no fish is mentioned in the hints.

On a separate note, the Prince brand of cigarette didn't come out until after Einstein had died, so there is no way Einstein came up with this riddle


What part of, "please don't post the correct answer in this topic" do you not understand jackass? Unless you knew you were incorrect in which case you are a jackass and a troll.

bhan87
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby bhan87 » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:51 am

MauveT-Rex wrote:
dingbat wrote:Nobody owns the fish, because no fish is mentioned in the hints.

On a separate note, the Prince brand of cigarette didn't come out until after Einstein had died, so there is no way Einstein came up with this riddle


What part of, "please don't post the correct answer in this topic" do you not understand jackass? Unless you knew you were incorrect in which case you are a jackass and a troll.


Whoah... calm down... There was no harm done.

JohnV
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby JohnV » Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:13 am

NoodleyOne wrote:Not hard but time consuming with all of those rules.


This. Got the answer, took the a while because there is a lot of information to sift through.


On a separate note, the Prince brand of cigarette didn't come out until after Einstein had died, so there is no way Einstein came up with this riddle

[/quote]

There's several incarnations of this riddle with different items/names in place of the ones given in the OP. Doesn't mean he didn't do it (not sure one way or the other), just means that this version can't be the version he could have come up with if that you said is true.

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dingbat
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby dingbat » Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:18 am

MauveT-Rex wrote:
dingbat wrote:Nobody owns the fish, because no fish is mentioned in the hints.

On a separate note, the Prince brand of cigarette didn't come out until after Einstein had died, so there is no way Einstein came up with this riddle


What part of, "please don't post the correct answer in this topic" do you not understand jackass? Unless you knew you were incorrect in which case you are a jackass and a troll.

It is neither the correct answer, nor the wrong answer.

Technically, my answer is correct, but not the one the game is looking for.
This makes me a wise-ass, not a jackass

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Scotusnerd
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby Scotusnerd » Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:50 am

Or just a smartass. :P Not worried about posting that, though. It's not the 'real' answer.

And yes, I did this puzzle last night before posting it.

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PeanutsNJam
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby PeanutsNJam » Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:43 am

I love how people come up with a puzzle or a quote or a philosophy or whatever and say "Einstein did/said/wrote/made it!" and everybody instantly believes it. Also, 100% of people believe made up statistics ftw.

BrianP
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby BrianP » Mon Jul 23, 2012 10:47 am

LOL I looked through the list twice and didn't see any mention of a fish. Am I part of the 2% or the 98?

Guess I'm in the 98. I don't see how you can figure this out unless you just go with the guy who drinks water. Maybe we can conclude that he's the only one who HAS water? I don't know.

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Scotusnerd
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby Scotusnerd » Mon Jul 23, 2012 11:16 am

BrianP wrote:LOL I looked through the list twice and didn't see any mention of a fish. Am I part of the 2% or the 98?

Guess I'm in the 98. I don't see how you can figure this out unless you just go with the guy who drinks water. Maybe we can conclude that he's the only one who HAS water? I don't know.


The question mentions it. You can figure out what the five pets are via looking through it. For those of you that doubt, here are the variables:

Colors: Green, Red, Blue, Yellow, White
Nationality: German, Norwegian, Dane, Swede, Brit
Smokes: Pall Mall, Dunhill, Blue Master, Prince, Blends
Beverage: Water, Milk, Coffee, Beer, Tea
Pets: Horse, Cat, Dog, Fish, Birds

As to the water...
1. In a street there are five houses, painted five different colours.
2. In each house lives a person of different nationality
3. These five homeowners each drink a different kind of beverage, smoke different brand of cigar and keep a different pet.

bp shinners
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby bp shinners » Mon Jul 23, 2012 11:50 am

This was proven as not to be something that Einstein is associated with (though I'm too lazy to Google it).

However, the original is only 2% of the population can do it IN THEIR HEADS (i.e. without writing anything down). That's the real challenge.

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PeanutsNJam
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby PeanutsNJam » Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:00 pm

bp shinners wrote:This was proven as not to be something that Einstein is associated with (though I'm too lazy to Google it).

However, the original is only 2% of the population can do it IN THEIR HEADS (i.e. without writing anything down). That's the real challenge.


I'm sure anybody can come up with a mathematical problem that a savant can do in his head while an average man can't. Then, calculate the percentage of the population that is savants, and herp-a-derp-derp-sherp, a problem that only X% of the population can do! (X being a small number).

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dingbat
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby dingbat » Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:22 pm

PeanutsNJam wrote:
bp shinners wrote:This was proven as not to be something that Einstein is associated with (though I'm too lazy to Google it).

However, the original is only 2% of the population can do it IN THEIR HEADS (i.e. without writing anything down). That's the real challenge.


I'm sure anybody can come up with a mathematical problem that a savant can do in his head while an average man can't. Then, calculate the percentage of the population that is savants, and herp-a-derp-derp-sherp, a problem that only X% of the population can do! (X being a small number).

Can't or won't?
I probably could do it in my head, but why go through the effort?

JohnV
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby JohnV » Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:23 pm

bp shinners wrote:This was proven as not to be something that Einstein is associated with (though I'm too lazy to Google it).

However, the original is only 2% of the population can do it IN THEIR HEADS (i.e. without writing anything down). That's the real challenge.


That'd be pretty tough.

BrianP wrote:LOL I looked through the list twice and didn't see any mention of a fish. Am I part of the 2% or the 98?

Guess I'm in the 98. I don't see how you can figure this out unless you just go with the guy who drinks water. Maybe we can conclude that he's the only one who HAS water? I don't know.


If you approach it like you would a logic game you'll see that you can place an item/designation with each of the characters and attributes, realizing that the when they ask "who has the fish?" that means someone has the fish. It's not a trick question, they just didn't list the variables out.

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boblawlob
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby boblawlob » Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:32 pm

Well that was disappointing. I was able to solve the riddle, only to discover Einstein didn't make it up. Lame...

Link for those who are interested: Spoiler alert: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zebra_Puzzle

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PeanutsNJam
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby PeanutsNJam » Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:50 pm

dingbat wrote:
PeanutsNJam wrote:
bp shinners wrote:This was proven as not to be something that Einstein is associated with (though I'm too lazy to Google it).

However, the original is only 2% of the population can do it IN THEIR HEADS (i.e. without writing anything down). That's the real challenge.


I'm sure anybody can come up with a mathematical problem that a savant can do in his head while an average man can't. Then, calculate the percentage of the population that is savants, and herp-a-derp-derp-sherp, a problem that only X% of the population can do! (X being a small number).

Can't or won't?
I probably could do it in my head, but why go through the effort?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savant_syndrome

Right... you have not achieved what prodigious savants have simply because you "won't", not because you "can't". You could calculate the approximate time it would take for a non-uniform object such as a HP printer to land and exactly where it lands when it's dropped from a commercial passenger plane moving at 345.675 mph at 12984.56 ft in the air over the equator in your head, you would just prefer not to, right?

I don't even think you could solve the above problem in your head.

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dingbat
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Re: LSAT 'logic game'!

Postby dingbat » Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:18 pm

PeanutsNJam wrote:
dingbat wrote:Can't or won't?
I probably could do it in my head, but why go through the effort?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savant_syndrome

Right... you have not achieved what prodigious savants have simply because you "won't", not because you "can't". You could calculate the approximate time it would take for a non-uniform object such as a HP printer to land and exactly where it lands when it's dropped from a commercial passenger plane moving at 345.675 mph at 12984.56 ft in the air over the equator in your head, you would just prefer not to, right?

I don't even think you could solve the above problem in your head.

I was expecting this.
Won't.

I used to do logic puzzles all the time when I was younger. Practice makes one better at it. When I got to the point that I could solve even the hardest puzzles every time, I started doing them in my head (without scratch paper of any kind) by way of challenge. So, having done these kinds of puzzles in my head before, I see no reason why I can't now.
I can tell you it's a learnable skill. Most people when they first attempt a logic puzzle are struggling, but after some practice can do fairly well. Now imagine doing these puzzles regularly for a few years - they become second nature.

Same with doing puzzles, math or chess in your head - the more you practice, the better you become.

In my opinion people above a certain threshold of ability can learn to do these kinds of puzzles in their head, no extra-special skill required




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