Logic Games -- Inferences?

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Mr.Binks
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Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby Mr.Binks » Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:00 pm

Evening mates,

So I've noticed that the recent LG are a bit more difficult (i.e., 60+) in that they are much less susceptible to quick plug-and-chug. I'm assuming that some of these games are exceptionally difficult because I tend to miss a major/minor inference that would allow the game to be solved much quicker.

My question is, then, what questions do you ask yourself when making these major, yet subtle, inferences? I seem to struggle in that regard in many cases, which slows me down a TOOONN for the section, effectively making me guess on like.. 2-3 questions at the end. :-(

Any tips on making inferences?

Thanks guys!

iamrobk
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby iamrobk » Thu Dec 01, 2011 12:16 pm

Just make sure to write out all the rules and see if there's any way to link them together, or if they severely limit the possibilities, or whatever. Hard for me to describe, honestly.

jlhero
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby jlhero » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:11 pm

on my pts, i could finish lg without trying to get inferences first. but i do go back to draw them when i am stuck.

unfortunately, that strategy didnt work out on the real deal.

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gaud
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby gaud » Thu Dec 01, 2011 4:15 pm

iamrobk wrote:Just make sure to write out all the rules and see if there's any way to link them together, or if they severely limit the possibilities, or whatever. Hard for me to describe, honestly.



^ this is correct. look for variables that are in multiple rules and see how you can link them together. also, look for 'blocks' or variables as they can severly limit the placement of the remaining variables (you may notice that there are a limited amount of spots they can be placed which could constrain the entire game to one or two diagrams)

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Mr.Binks
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby Mr.Binks » Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:40 pm

gaud wrote:
iamrobk wrote:Just make sure to write out all the rules and see if there's any way to link them together, or if they severely limit the possibilities, or whatever. Hard for me to describe, honestly.



^ this is correct. look for variables that are in multiple rules and see how you can link them together. also, look for 'blocks' or variables as they can severly limit the placement of the remaining variables (you may notice that there are a limited amount of spots they can be placed which could constrain the entire game to one or two diagrams)


For the blocks (e.g., [A/B_ _B/A] block), would you recommend that I draw out some hypotheticals if I can't immediately find a severe limitation for the rest of the variables?

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JamMasterJ
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby JamMasterJ » Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:43 pm

iamrobk wrote:Just make sure to write out all the rules and see if there's any way to link them together, or if they severely limit the possibilities, or whatever. Hard for me to describe, honestly.

linked rules is the biggest time-saving device on LG. That and using these linked rules to rule out options is the best way to work through games quickly

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gaud
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby gaud » Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:47 pm

Mr.Binks wrote:
gaud wrote:
iamrobk wrote:Just make sure to write out all the rules and see if there's any way to link them together, or if they severely limit the possibilities, or whatever. Hard for me to describe, honestly.



^ this is correct. look for variables that are in multiple rules and see how you can link them together. also, look for 'blocks' or variables as they can severly limit the placement of the remaining variables (you may notice that there are a limited amount of spots they can be placed which could constrain the entire game to one or two diagrams)


For the blocks (e.g., [A/B_ _B/A] block), would you recommend that I draw out some hypotheticals if I can't immediately find a severe limitation for the rest of the variables?



most of the time, yes. if you're skills are developed enough to the point where you believe this will be an easier way to go about it then by all means do so. i would just hate to give you advice that is going to make you waste too much time creating hypotheticals. if you are going to create such hypothetical to try and discover a limitation... use the block with the other rules and try and create the most 'restrictive' hypothetical you can create (one that will force other variables into slots)


in general though, let's say you had that a/b _ _ b/a block on a game with only 6 slots. with a block like that, from the beginning you could infer that there are only a few possibilities (a/b _ _ b/a _ _ ) (_ a/b _ _ b/a _) (_ _ a/b _ _ b/a) so from here you could draw all three hypotheticals out and use the other rules you're given to make some valuable deductions. in a case like this, with only three possibilities, it would be beneficial to draw all of them out I believe. any more than three seems to be 'pushing it' to me.

iamrobk
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby iamrobk » Thu Dec 01, 2011 8:05 pm

Mr.Binks wrote:
gaud wrote:
iamrobk wrote:Just make sure to write out all the rules and see if there's any way to link them together, or if they severely limit the possibilities, or whatever. Hard for me to describe, honestly.



^ this is correct. look for variables that are in multiple rules and see how you can link them together. also, look for 'blocks' or variables as they can severly limit the placement of the remaining variables (you may notice that there are a limited amount of spots they can be placed which could constrain the entire game to one or two diagrams)


For the blocks (e.g., [A/B_ _B/A] block), would you recommend that I draw out some hypotheticals if I can't immediately find a severe limitation for the rest of the variables?

I think it's best to draw them out if there's 2 or 3 possibilities (not of everything, but of the main deductions... if that makes sense), but any more and it's not worth it.

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Campagnolo
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby Campagnolo » Thu Dec 01, 2011 8:08 pm

All the logic games, even on 60+, are in some ways a re-hashing of older games. There just isn't really anything new.

When I attack a game, I try to think, "where have I seen this before?" If you've done enough games, I guarantee you'll get to the point where you know what inferences to look for based on previous work.

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Mr.Binks
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby Mr.Binks » Thu Dec 01, 2011 10:59 pm

Thanks all! I wasn't doing particularly poorly on games, but when I ran into a more difficult one (like the damned stained glass game in PT 62), I tend to struggle a bit and lose a lot of valuable time.

Anyway, thanks again.

It Depends
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Re: Logic Games -- Inferences?

Postby It Depends » Thu Dec 01, 2011 11:14 pm

try to time yourself on individual games and see what game type in particular is slowing you down. focus on learning the typical kinds of inferences needed to quickly move thru that game type--go over the same games again and again for practice if necessary. once you get in the habit of this particular type of thinking, you will see new games of the type you practiced and naturally make the necessary inferences. with enough practice, it is possible to finish all the games with time to spare. good luck!




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