Will a cancel hurt?

Underdog180
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Will a cancel hurt?

Postby Underdog180 » Thu May 19, 2011 3:47 pm

Okay so since the deadline has passed to make any changes and the fact that I'm also a bit hesitant on taking the June LSAT. What are my options? I'm thinking of just taking it for the hell of it and just cancelling the score to gain experience since I won't be able to get a refund at this moment anyway. Bottom line, does a cancel score hurt me? Or should I completely withdraw from the LSAT for a clean record and take it in Oct. (I heard there is a option for this up until June 5th). I already feel bad for wasting money, but I'm not quite sure what to do.

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Icculus
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby Icculus » Thu May 19, 2011 3:52 pm

What schools are you aiming for? Anything outside the T6 and I would recommend taking it and taking the score since most schools don't average but take the highest score.

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Eichörnchen
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby Eichörnchen » Thu May 19, 2011 3:59 pm

Underdog180 wrote:Okay so since the deadline has passed to make any changes and the fact that I'm also a bit hesitant on taking the June LSAT. What are my options? I'm thinking of just taking it for the hell of it and just cancelling the score to gain experience since I won't be able to get a refund at this moment anyway. Bottom line, does a cancel score hurt me? Or should I completely withdraw from the LSAT for a clean record and take it in Oct. (I heard there is a option for this up until June 5th). I already feel bad for wasting money, but I'm not quite sure what to do.

I have the exact same question. I think that I'll take and cancel because I haven't found any info that even HYS frown upon one cancel but if anyone has some extra insight I'd love to know.

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Knock
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby Knock » Thu May 19, 2011 4:00 pm

Not at all, in my experience.

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almightypush
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby almightypush » Thu May 19, 2011 4:07 pm

Knock wrote:Not at all, in my experience.


same here. hell, i had both a cancel and an absence on my record. everything turned out fine.

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Eichörnchen
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby Eichörnchen » Thu May 19, 2011 7:39 pm

almightypush wrote:
Knock wrote:Not at all, in my experience.


same here. hell, i had both a cancel and an absence on my record. everything turned out fine.

Phew. It's a relief to see a HY- accepted person's 1st hand account. I mean, yea, sample size here is pretty small but it makes me feel better about my practice run :)

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cinephile
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby cinephile » Thu May 19, 2011 8:25 pm

I'm not going to a T14 next year, but I don't think my cancel affected my cycle. And it was useful to go through the whole experience and see what it's like under the actual conditions (and ultimately cancel).

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northwood
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby northwood » Thu May 19, 2011 8:36 pm

If you are going to apply to the top 6 law schools then a cancel will be your best option. If you are applying to any school outside the top 6 or so- then keep the score. Only take the test if you feel as though you are prepared for it. If you dont feel confident about your prep work and are going into the test with the plan to cancel anyways- then dont show. An absence will not count agains your 3 tests in 2 years. If you go into the testing center- dedicate your energies to doing well on the test- and keep the score. IF you go in there planning to cancel then you are setting yourself up to do poorly and becomevery frustrated. Best of luck with whatever you decide to do.

Although if you do decide to sit to get actual test day experience ( which is a benefit of taking and cancelling) make sure to cancel before you leave the facility- as its much easier to do. It wont hurt against your score when you post one.

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Eichörnchen
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby Eichörnchen » Thu May 19, 2011 10:05 pm

I don't know about the OP, but I plan on applying to the T6. I was going to take in June, but realized that I haven't yet reached my peak, so I decided I should take in Oct because I didn't want to go into it knowing I could have done better. Right now I'm PTing at about 170, so I will either withdraw from June or take for the experience only and cancel. I am the sort of person who does a lot better knowing the routine of something. I'm not nervous for tests, but I do get kind of anxious when I have to do something important and I'm unfamiliar with the procedure, building, area etc. I don't know if that's weird but hey that's me haha. So I thought June would be a good dry run, but only as long as it doesn't damage my chances at any schools.

delusional
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby delusional » Thu May 19, 2011 10:07 pm

When I canceled, I figured my score would have been 167-170. I did MUCH better with cancel + my one eventual score than I would have with a 167 added to it.

albanach
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby albanach » Thu May 19, 2011 10:11 pm

I would miss the exam rather than cancel.

By not sitting it, you still have three attempts available to you. Sit the exam, knowing you're unlikely to use the score and you've only two shots left.

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Eichörnchen
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby Eichörnchen » Thu May 19, 2011 10:22 pm

albanach wrote:I would miss the exam rather than cancel.

By not sitting it, you still have three attempts available to you. Sit the exam, knowing you're unlikely to use the score and you've only two shots left.

Oct is the only sitting that works for me - if I end up needing more than 3 sittings something has gone terribly wrong.

albanach
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby albanach » Thu May 19, 2011 10:36 pm

Eichörnchen wrote:Oct is the only sitting that works for me - if I end up needing more than 3 sittings something has gone terribly wrong.


I thought that once. I changed my plans after my score and used three sittings, so perhaps I am biased.

Nonetheless, I don't think you gain much advantage in having sat the test. However an absence does I think reflect better than a cancel.

If nothing else, with an absence your October score will look to admissions like a first attempt, and while highest scores are accepted by most schools, there is still undoubtedly a bias towards a strong score at a first attempt, at least in the Deans I spoke to during my cycle.

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almightypush
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby almightypush » Thu May 19, 2011 10:39 pm

northwood wrote:If you are going to apply to the top 6 law schools then a cancel will be your best option. If you are applying to any school outside the top 6 or so- then keep the score. Only take the test if you feel as though you are prepared for it. If you dont feel confident about your prep work and are going into the test with the plan to cancel anyways- then dont show. An absence will not count agains your 3 tests in 2 years. If you go into the testing center- dedicate your energies to doing well on the test- and keep the score. IF you go in there planning to cancel then you are setting yourself up to do poorly and becomevery frustrated.


now having said what i said up above, TITCR.

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Eichörnchen
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby Eichörnchen » Fri May 20, 2011 9:53 am

almightypush wrote:
northwood wrote:If you are going to apply to the top 6 law schools then a cancel will be your best option. If you are applying to any school outside the top 6 or so- then keep the score. Only take the test if you feel as though you are prepared for it. If you dont feel confident about your prep work and are going into the test with the plan to cancel anyways- then dont show. An absence will not count agains your 3 tests in 2 years. If you go into the testing center- dedicate your energies to doing well on the test- and keep the score. IF you go in there planning to cancel then you are setting yourself up to do poorly and becomevery frustrated.


now having said what i said up above, TITCR.

That's weird- I feel like the opposite. I don't imagine myself becoming upset or frusterated on a test that I know is essentially just practice for me. :?. If I take in June, I'm not expecting to or planning to keep the score so why do you think I would come out of it upset? I'd be viewing it as a way to see how my test center works and how the procedure of test day goes. Also, I've heard a few times that cancel > absence, so I don't know. I guess my attitude toward that is that none of us probably really know which adcoms prefer, and if you have a knockout score, the answer is probably that they don't care about one of either.

albanach
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby albanach » Fri May 20, 2011 10:43 am

I dug out the Ivey Guide to remind myself what she says on the subject:

"Admissions officers expect you to do better each additional time you take it - because it's less scary and more familiar when you've taken the real thing before... The think that taking the test and canceling gives you an advantage over someone who doesn't have the benefit of having taken the test before. ...you're better off taking one bite at that apple and showing admissions officers one good score rather than taking it over and over and risking a decline in scores."

I imagine the penalty from a single cancel will be very small. However the margins separating an admit from a non-admit to a T6 school can also be very small.

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Eichörnchen
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby Eichörnchen » Fri May 20, 2011 11:42 am

albanach wrote:I dug out the Ivey Guide to remind myself what she says on the subject:

"Admissions officers expect you to do better each additional time you take it - because it's less scary and more familiar when you've taken the real thing before... The think that taking the test and canceling gives you an advantage over someone who doesn't have the benefit of having taken the test before. ...you're better off taking one bite at that apple and showing admissions officers one good score rather than taking it over and over and risking a decline in scores."

I imagine the penalty from a single cancel will be very small. However the margins separating an admit from a non-admit to a T6 school can also be very small.

Thanks for taking the time to put that up. It's good food for thought. On the one hand, the "over and over" part makes me think a one time cancel is probaby no big deal, but on the other, I already have mediocre softs and no great PS ideas, so I'd rather avoid another negative on my app. I'm glad we have until the day before to decide. :)

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northwood
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby northwood » Fri May 20, 2011 10:31 pm

if you cancel- then the next test you cant cancel, because 2 cancels will make you seem as though you dont have it to finish the test, or some other thing. 2 absences will make you seem like a flake. One absence or cancel is fine- because a lot of things can go wrong ( you get sick, get a horrible case of the nerves, something goes wrong, etc). But 2 of them may raise an issue- and you should explain why.

It doesnt hurt you- but IMO its much easier to explain an absence as " I did not feel as though I was adequately prepared for the test so that the score would reflect my abilities" and then have 3 more attempts, where an epic bubbling fail or a horrendous case of the nerves ( or an illness- which is another good reason for being absent) would then give you the 2 back up attempts. A cancel can be explained well the first time- the second one, not so much ( and if you cancel keep the score, re take and cancel again- then the 3rd would be explained by you stating that you felt as though you did not do better than your first score).

SO either way- be absent or cancel- this test it doesn't hurt much. Just remember that whatever you do, you cant do in October.

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angua
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby angua » Sat May 21, 2011 2:06 am

northwood wrote:if you cancel- then the next test you cant cancel, because 2 cancels will make you seem as though you dont have it to finish the test, or some other thing. 2 absences will make you seem like a flake. One absence or cancel is fine- because a lot of things can go wrong ( you get sick, get a horrible case of the nerves, something goes wrong, etc). But 2 of them may raise an issue- and you should explain why.

It doesnt hurt you- but IMO its much easier to explain an absence as " I did not feel as though I was adequately prepared for the test so that the score would reflect my abilities" and then have 3 more attempts, where an epic bubbling fail or a horrendous case of the nerves ( or an illness- which is another good reason for being absent) would then give you the 2 back up attempts. A cancel can be explained well the first time- the second one, not so much ( and if you cancel keep the score, re take and cancel again- then the 3rd would be explained by you stating that you felt as though you did not do better than your first score).

SO either way- be absent or cancel- this test it doesn't hurt much. Just remember that whatever you do, you cant do in October.


+1

If you feel that you need realistic test conditions for practice purposes, most facilities will let you come in on your own and take a PT in the actual room. Time yourself strictly and it will feel pretty damn close, with no blemish on your record.

rubydandun
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby rubydandun » Sat May 21, 2011 5:18 pm

ive canceled twice...i called law schools in the top 14 to ask if they cared and they DO NOT. Some will ask for an addendum but generally all they care about is ONE high score. Theyre not going to hold it against you - if you're within range, you should be okay.

theaether
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Re: Will a cancel hurt?

Postby theaether » Sun May 22, 2011 12:45 am

don't even have to be absent anymore if you don't want to cancel. Just withdraw and an 'absence' won't even show up on your record.




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