Retake? Could use some insight.

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kennethellenparcell
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Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby kennethellenparcell » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:57 am

Hey guys, just wanted to get some insight on what you would do in my situation.
I've taken the LSAT four times over the past three years: . is from the Dec 2010 test. I'm pretty sure I still have room to improve because I didn't give myself enough time to correct my problem areas before I took December. First three times I took the test were out of sheer stupidity and not understanding what it took to do well on the test. For some reason, I just refused to believe I couldn't do well on the test because I'd been a pretty decent test-taker until the LSAT.

Would you apply this year and settle for a #20-50 school with some scholly money? My GPA is , so although I have years WE, I don't think I have a shot at the t14 with a . Or take another year off, I have a decent job, save up more money, and try again in October 2011 for a higher score. I know there are no guarantees, but I'm not afraid to work for it and what's 4 times versus 5 times? Ugh. Wonder how adcomms will view me.
Last edited by kennethellenparcell on Tue Nov 15, 2011 5:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bk1
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby bk1 » Fri Jan 07, 2011 3:12 am

You're right, with a 167 the T14 is out of reach. Did you already apply? If not then scholarship money is probably getting scarcer and scarcer.

Because of that, I vote retake again. You'll be saving more money from your job and either you get a better LSAT or at least give yourself more chances for scholarship money. I don't think adcomms are going to view 4 LSAT's any different from 5 LSAT's.

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kennethellenparcell
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby kennethellenparcell » Fri Jan 07, 2011 3:25 am

I've applied to two safeties already. Was planning on submitting some apps tomorrow for schools that should be safeties given my newest score but not to the t-14, because I think that would be wasting my hard-earned dollars. Thanks - I hadn't thought about the scholarship money drying up due to being a fairly late applicant in the cycle.

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Pleasye
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby Pleasye » Fri Jan 07, 2011 4:03 am

I'm going to disagree with Bk and say that you should just apply with what you have now. I think after a certain point (and I guess I'm making that point 4 LSAT's) schools are just going to be like enough is enough. I just think they may look at your scores differently because it took you that many tries to get them.

I am in no way trying to downplay your accomplishment. A 167 is a great score (one I would be ecstatic to receive) and you should be really proud that you worked so hard to get it. I just think you may be setting yourself up to be seen negatively by adcomms by taking the test another time, especially if you don't improve immensely.

Good luck in whatever you decide.

Sandro
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby Sandro » Fri Jan 07, 2011 4:30 am

apply now. Do not take the LSAT ever again. Please.

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ElvisAaron
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby ElvisAaron » Fri Jan 07, 2011 9:31 am

Someone once told me a characteristic of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and over, each time expecting a different result....
Fuck another lsat. Apply, get on with life and give yourself a chance to be happy doing so!

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kennethellenparcell
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby kennethellenparcell » Fri Jan 07, 2011 9:49 am

Yeah...I know I know I'm probably a little crazy for taking the test that many times. Hasn't been easy. But it seems to be a numbers game, and I know I want to go to law school. However, I want to maximize my career opportunities by going to the best school I can go to, or finish school with as little debt as possible. But it seems that if I don't have the score, I don't get the admission or the money. Do any of your viewpoints change if I told you the first three times I had no idea what I was doing?

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ElvisAaron
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby ElvisAaron » Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:19 am

kennethellenparcell wrote:Yeah...I know I know I'm probably a little crazy for taking the test that many times. Hasn't been easy. But it seems to be a numbers game, and I know I want to go to law school. However, I want to maximize my career opportunities by going to the best school I can go to, or finish school with as little debt as possible. But it seems that if I don't have the score, I don't get the admission or the money. Do any of your viewpoints change if I told you the first three times I had no idea what I was doing?


Nope. You just sound like the kid at the top of the high diving board, fiddling with his swim trunks over and over to make sure everything is just perfect for his dive. Fuckin jump!

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Pleasye
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby Pleasye » Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:22 pm

My opinion doesn't change. Schools are not going to get that from someone who took it 5 times. Taking it once (or maybe even twice) without knowing what you're doing or not being ready is excusable, but after getting a score (or two scores) you should've known you needed to study more/take more tests/wait longer or whatever it was that you needed to score higher. After the third time you should have known that for sure. I think schools will have this kind of thought process when looking at your scores. I don't think they'll be thinking "oh maybe he just didn't know what he was doing the first 4 times".

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JazzOne
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby JazzOne » Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:25 pm

Retake

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bk1
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby bk1 » Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:42 pm

Some kid on here had 7 (I think) LSAT's and got into T14, UVa iirc.

Law schools say they take your highest score and they mean it. Yes, this will give some schools pause, but I stick by what I said earlier: 4 really isn't any different from 5. Schools whore themselves out for high LSAT's and I think that the schools who are easier to predict (UVa/NU/etc) are so because their process is almost more automatic than other schools. Some schools will probably ding you for it or at least look at you less because of it,

I still say that you put your full force behind October and let that final LSAT stand. Make sure your apps are submitted once you have that score. You have a job and are in no hurry, I see no reason to rush now. One more year is easily worth the chance considering you fully believe you can do better on the test.

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JazzOne
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby JazzOne » Fri Jan 07, 2011 5:45 pm

When the ABA started allowing schools to report only the highest LSAT score for each candidate, it became the correct strategy to keep retaking until you get the score you need for T14, a full ride, or preferably both.

IndieTea
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby IndieTea » Fri Jan 07, 2011 6:34 pm

I have a 4.07 GPA according to LSAC...but my scores are 159, 163, 160. Should I both to retake? Or am I just too stupid to get into Berkeley?
And I've been scoring 176 + on my timed PT's, taken in a quiet public library.
Last edited by IndieTea on Fri Jan 07, 2011 6:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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bk1
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby bk1 » Fri Jan 07, 2011 6:37 pm

IndieTea wrote:I have a 4.07 GPA according to LSAC...but my scores are 159, 163, 160. Should I both to retake? Or am I just too stupid to get into Berkeley?
And I've been scoring 176 + on my PT's


You can only take the LSAT 3 times in a 2 year span so retaking a 4th time requires you to wait until 2 years after the first of the three or to get a waiver from a school to allow you to do it.

If you score 176+ on timed PT's and only get around 160 on the actual thing, you need to learn how to deal with the pressure and I would definitely recommend waiting to retake a 4th time.

poi
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby poi » Fri Jan 07, 2011 6:38 pm

.
Last edited by poi on Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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kennethellenparcell
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby kennethellenparcell » Fri Jan 07, 2011 8:01 pm

I guess I should clarify what I said before. When I say I "didn't know what I was doing," I meant I didn't know much about the strategies available to attack the test. I prepared in the best way I knew how. First test I took pretty much cold. Second test I went through the LG Bible thoroughly, part of LR Bible and took some practice tests. Third test I took a bunch of practice tests. Fourth test, I actually picked up a book on logic, took test prep, learned how to diagram questions, and figured out what my weak spots were. Problem is, I never actually strengthened areas where I was weak. But I figured, to hell with it, I'll just take the test and see if I'm really that much of an idiot. I suppose you could say I experimented with a lot of ways to study for the LSAT and failed with many of them. If I knew what I know now about the test, I never would've taken it the first three times.

Silly that it took me four tests to figure out what it takes most people on TLS one to figure out. I think what I'm leaning towards right now is working for another year. More savings, more good WE, I'll take it. I know I want to go to law school. I'll have to think about whether or not I will take the test again (retaking is easier said than done) but I do think applying early in the cycle with my numbers is a good idea.

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kennethellenparcell
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby kennethellenparcell » Fri Jan 07, 2011 8:08 pm

bk1 wrote:Some kid on here had 7 (I think) LSAT's and got into T14, UVa iirc.

Law schools say they take your highest score and they mean it. Yes, this will give some schools pause, but I stick by what I said earlier: 4 really isn't any different from 5. Schools whore themselves out for high LSAT's and I think that the schools who are easier to predict (UVa/NU/etc) are so because their process is almost more automatic than other schools. Some schools will probably ding you for it or at least look at you less because of it,

I still say that you put your full force behind October and let that final LSAT stand. Make sure your apps are submitted once you have that score. You have a job and are in no hurry, I see no reason to rush now. One more year is easily worth the chance considering you fully believe you can do better on the test.


I saw that thread, insane. Kudos to that guy though. My feeling is - HYS aside, multiple LSATs are generally ok with some of the t14 as long as you have a final score above their 75th percentile. Just wanted to confirm if others thought that way. I'm not shooting for HYS though. I think that ship has sailed for me.

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JazzOne
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby JazzOne » Fri Jan 07, 2011 9:07 pm

kennethellenparcell wrote:I guess I should clarify what I said before. When I say I "didn't know what I was doing," I meant I didn't know much about the strategies available to attack the test. I prepared in the best way I knew how. First test I took pretty much cold. Second test I went through the LG Bible thoroughly, part of LR Bible and took some practice tests. Third test I took a bunch of practice tests. Fourth test, I actually picked up a book on logic, took test prep, learned how to diagram questions, and figured out what my weak spots were. Problem is, I never actually strengthened areas where I was weak. But I figured, to hell with it, I'll just take the test and see if I'm really that much of an idiot. I suppose you could say I experimented with a lot of ways to study for the LSAT and failed with many of them. If I knew what I know now about the test, I never would've taken it the first three times.

Silly that it took me four tests to figure out what it takes most people on TLS one to figure out. I think what I'm leaning towards right now is working for another year. More savings, more good WE, I'll take it. I know I want to go to law school. I'll have to think about whether or not I will take the test again (retaking is easier said than done) but I do think applying early in the cycle with my numbers is a good idea.

Sounds about right. That's an intelligent way to proceed. Don't let the LSAT affect your self esteem. We all struggle with different things in life. Study harder and retake.

nbafan135
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Re: Retake? Could use some insight.

Postby nbafan135 » Sat Jan 08, 2011 12:56 pm

i agree, as long as you dont feel like killing yourself because of this, a higher lsat only means more money for you. so think of taking it again as an investment you will get back with scholarship money




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