Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Hedwig
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby Hedwig » Sat Oct 02, 2010 10:37 pm

Blindc1rca wrote:
eit wrote:
Blindc1rca wrote:I just don't want to see circular linearity. What time gluttons they are for me.


Ahahaha, I might have to write TG beside questions that I don't have time to solve and thus really need to come back to. This might work better than my current system for marking questions to come back to.

See, I get all paranoid during the first questions that I'm getting them all wrong. So I circle at least 5 out of the first 10 to come back and look at. But since I'm fairly sure I can get those right, I do small circles around the question number. If I'm wildly unsure I do a big looping circle. If I'm medium unsure, my circle is in between, haha.


you do this for logic games? or for any section? lol i should probably do something similar. i often get through the first game in like 4 minutes only to find out that my only miss in the section was on one of those first 6. a result of going too fast.

okay so here's my plan then... i'll draw an ankylosaur eating a small casio wristwatch next to all the problems that i'm fairly sure on, a triceratops eating a medium sized grandfather clock (like the one's you would see in a foyer at a bed and breakfast) for problems that i'm medium unsure about, and a spinosaurus taking a chunk out of Big Ben for those on which I have no f*cking clue.


I do it for any section, although I think I do it less for logic games. For me, the only uncertainty in logic games is not eliminating the other answers once I've found my answer (like on a must be true question, I set up a mini diagram and try to adduce what must be true, then if what I wrote on there is on the answer list, I circle it and don't eliminate the others). It's more subjective on RC/LR as to my degree of certainty, so I use it more on those.

JJDancer
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby JJDancer » Sat Oct 02, 2010 10:52 pm

eit wrote:I don't like multiple levels. At all.


I want to become more comfortable with these types. Are there any of these in PT 56 or 57?

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aevea
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby aevea » Sat Oct 02, 2010 11:43 pm

Anecdotes? How about some stats.
From the last 10 published lsats:

Game type..........Count.......Percent.......Test p
basic ordering.......12............30%........... 90%
complex ordering...10............25%........... 80%
dual ordering.........6.............15%............50%
in/out grouping......4.............10%............30%
sorting grouping.....4.............10%............40%
dual grouping........4..............10%...........40%

The count is out of the last 40 published games and the "Test p" is the probability of seeing one or more of the game type on one of the last 10 tests. Past performance is no guarantee...

Hedwig
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby Hedwig » Sat Oct 02, 2010 11:45 pm

I actually really like in/out games now that I've realized how the absence/presence things work. (I.E., watch for absence triggers because that means both can be on, etc).

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catsparka
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby catsparka » Sun Oct 03, 2010 8:06 am

eit wrote:I actually really like in/out games now that I've realized how the absence/presence things work. (I.E., watch for absence triggers because that means both can be on, etc).


I used to HATE in/out games because they were so time consuming for me. But now they're one of my favorites. I think I finally get how to do them.

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Blindc1rca
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby Blindc1rca » Sun Oct 03, 2010 12:28 pm

fuq. just got owned by the LG on PT60. My worst LG score since I can't remember when. -7. I went -3 on the rest of the test. FML FML FML.

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incompetentia
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby incompetentia » Sun Oct 03, 2010 1:12 pm

Games on 60 took me longer than any other PT so far...normally finish LG with 11-15 minutes left, but I looked up after that last game and had only about 2 minutes to spare. The difficult ones for me were #1 and #2, though...

ATR
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby ATR » Sun Oct 03, 2010 9:42 pm

incompetentia wrote:Games on 60 took me longer than any other PT so far...normally finish LG with 11-15 minutes left, but I looked up after that last game and had only about 2 minutes to spare. The difficult ones for me were #1 and #2, though...

I always wonder how people finish games with so much time to spare... I usually finish LG with about 3-4 minutes left and feel comfortable with RC time-wise, but sometimes LG leaves me in a rush.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby whymeohgodno » Sun Oct 03, 2010 10:38 pm

Blindc1rca wrote:fuq. just got owned by the LG on PT60. My worst LG score since I can't remember when. -7. I went -3 on the rest of the test. FML FML FML.

Yeh PT 60 LG was brutal for me also. I got a -5. RC was hard for me also though lol. Only thing that was easy was LR.

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sgtgrumbles
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby sgtgrumbles » Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:50 am

catsparka wrote:
eit wrote:I actually really like in/out games now that I've realized how the absence/presence things work. (I.E., watch for absence triggers because that means both can be on, etc).


I used to HATE in/out games because they were so time consuming for me. But now they're one of my favorites. I think I finally get how to do them.

Please tell. How do you do them?

Hedwig
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby Hedwig » Mon Oct 04, 2010 11:24 am

Here's a bit of knowledge that helped me. I know it's totally basic, but I didn't really get it at first and misdiagrammed/interpreted rules.

If the condition is something like: If x is not chosen, y is chosen. If y is not chosen, x is chosen --> You have an absence as a trigger. Those are always important to pay attention to. Your possibilities are: no x, y. No y, x. X AND Y, since the only thing that triggers anything is the absence. You can't have both x and y off, but you can have them both on. This comes up in the global "which could be all the fruit chosen" or whatever questions.

There's also the reversal of this condition: If y is chosen, x is not chosen. If x is chosen, y is not chosen. In this case, it's not quite so tricky, since it's a presence indicator - however, you can have y and not x. You can have x and not y. You can also have both off (as in not x and not y).

Watch for absence indicators. Thinking in absence helps. I know this game is more like grouping than in/out, but the game with the appetizer and main meal... it's all about figuring out what's going on in the other space. In that case, it was another group. But in this case, it's what's present, what's absent. Say there's w and z as well. We're going with the presence trigger (if x then no y). For a question that goes, what could be a complete and accurate listing of all the fruits in the salad? You can't have just w and z. You have to have one of x or y. BUT if the absence indicator is being used, you COULD have just w and z.

I don't know if that made any sense. But those were little things that helped me.

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catsparka
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby catsparka » Mon Oct 04, 2010 1:03 pm

sgtgrumbles wrote:
catsparka wrote:
eit wrote:I actually really like in/out games now that I've realized how the absence/presence things work. (I.E., watch for absence triggers because that means both can be on, etc).


I used to HATE in/out games because they were so time consuming for me. But now they're one of my favorites. I think I finally get how to do them.

Please tell. How do you do them?


I basically agree with what eit said in the previous post. I make sure that I'm careful with all the conditional rules (especially the absence-triggered ones like eit said) and don't make any unwarranted inferences (e.g. mistaken negation, mistaken reversal). Some games (like the birds in the forest one) used to make me want to cry because I felt overwhelmed by the number of rules and inferences, but now that I have more confidence in my ability to make the correct inferences and keep track of them, they're not so bad.

jarofsoup
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby jarofsoup » Mon Oct 04, 2010 1:25 pm

Expirementals dont show up in the same form. The game will have similar rules and general theory. But if it is musicians the game on test day will be apes. If it is Toy Dinos with colors it will be students grades.

I have taken the test before and have never gotten a expiremental LG. I will probably get on this time

I have gotten RC twice and LR

Hedwig
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby Hedwig » Mon Oct 04, 2010 2:32 pm

Does anyone else love the scenarios they come up with? There was one where it was like a child was eating her last three spoonfuls of alphabet soup and decided to "play a game" with the following rules. I also particularly like it when they do something that involves law. Especially the ones where it's like there are GHKLMNO and they all get paid different salaries, haha. It's like they're trying to motivate us.

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AverageTutoring
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby AverageTutoring » Tue Oct 05, 2010 9:17 am

gdane5 wrote:Theres no use doing this. Youre going to get whatever you get. Youve prepared for everything and you'll be fine. I didnt think a popular culture type question would come up on the LSAT, but it did in February. The infamous Lil Wayne flaw in the reasoning question. It was tough, but Id done a million flaw in the reasoning questions that it wasnt impossible. We'll all be fine.


Nice! Contending that Lil Wayne question appeared in an unreleased LSAT so nobody can disprove your ridiculous claim. Genius! :D

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AverageTutoring
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby AverageTutoring » Tue Oct 05, 2010 9:20 am

eit wrote:I actually really like in/out games now that I've realized how the absence/presence things work. (I.E., watch for absence triggers because that means both can be on, etc).


These are called "place holders." It is most often helpful to deduce from your conditionals and associated contraposatives of what must be in/out.

For example,

If we have the rule that if P is in then H is out. We can diagram that as,

P --> - H
H --> -P

Which means if either one of those guys is IN then one must have to be out. But we can also have BOTH out but not both in. So no matter what we have at least 1 out! Thus, in our diagram we make a special slot for one of these guys! It makes questions like "how many people can there be in the game" so much easiar!

But of course your LSAT skills blow mine out of the water! So...you really should be the one explaining things to me :P

Hedwig
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Re: Anecdotes Abound: Possible LGs on Oct. 9

Postby Hedwig » Tue Oct 05, 2010 9:50 am

That's actually a really smart idea and I'm totally going to start using it, thank you!




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