Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

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gdane
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby gdane » Thu Sep 16, 2010 8:10 pm

I definitely believe that the system should be revamped. I think a URM boost is nice since theres no doubting that growing up around certain socioeconomic factors do negatively affect certain people, but to give everyone a boost solely because of the color of their skin isnt just.

I personally believe that URM status should be tied to socioeconomic status. As I said before, there is a big difference between a poor black kid and a rich black kid. More than likely that rich black kid had access to lots of resources that positively affected his learning ability/"intelligence", while the poor black kid probably spent his days worrying if he was even going to graduate from high school. Extreme examples, but they encapsulate the gist of what Im saying. :mrgreen:

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bk1
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby bk1 » Thu Sep 16, 2010 8:26 pm

I hate you all.

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gdane
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby gdane » Thu Sep 16, 2010 8:31 pm

bk1 wrote:I hate you all.


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DreamShake
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby DreamShake » Thu Sep 16, 2010 8:48 pm

Whoa, URM debate. :oops: I had a RC fail and initially misread a post as saying he had no shot at T14 with a 160.


However, this did make me literally lol:
whymeohgodno wrote:
bk1 wrote:... Really guys?


Are you not entertained? :D

masterthearts
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby masterthearts » Thu Sep 16, 2010 9:36 pm

I'm Hispanic, but also white. These apps ask for your race. For college apps, they stated that these were optional questions. They don't say it's optional on the law school apps.
I am white and Hispanic. A person can be of any race and be Hispanic
So, I guess I will need to check white, hispanic. But, I am bilingual and very tied to my culture. Hope it gives me a boost. There is a Chinatown in Argentina. Chinese people who are also Hispanic..i kid you not. You can be of any race and be hispanic. HOpe the adcoms know this...I'm sure they must.

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3|ink
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby 3|ink » Thu Sep 16, 2010 9:39 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:
Jeffort wrote:
masterthearts wrote:3.85 LSAC GPA from an Ivy, URM, bilingual
This is it. I studied my butt off this summer for the lsat and went from a 153 (pre-Kaplan course) to anywhere from a 159-164 post course. I studied my brains out and did a lot of studying on my own with the Bible books,etc. Over the 5-6 practice exams I took, I didn't score lower than a 159. But my hiighest was only 164.
The lsat will probably say these scores are not statistically significant, but for the schools, I'm sure it will make me or break me.
Well, should I hope I get lucky on the actual test and get my 164?
Anyone think I can get into the lower of the T-14?


No offense intended but SERIOUSLY? With a 3.85 from an Ivy you are asking a bunch of strangers with pretty much zero information about you to pull out crystal balls and predict your future in terms of getting lucky? The question itself shows that you know how silly it is since the basis of your inquiry is luck rather than merit combined with dreams of T14's and sugarplums and candy and all that.

Really, do you have a legit question other than "Can I get lucky and land in a T14 cuz of magic fortune that suddenly boosts my score all the sudden?" High LSAT scores are earned, nobody 'lucks' into a high score, everyone that gets one earns it.


I fail to comprehend how a 3.85 at an Ivy is impressive enough to warrant certain assumptions.

I'd say a 3.85 at a crappy school as a pre-med student is much more impressive than a 3.85 at Harvard as an English major.

What's wrong with English?

bigben
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby bigben » Thu Sep 16, 2010 9:48 pm

NOPE. It takes these:

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whymeohgodno
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby whymeohgodno » Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:03 pm

3|ink wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:
Jeffort wrote:
masterthearts wrote:3.85 LSAC GPA from an Ivy, URM, bilingual
This is it. I studied my butt off this summer for the lsat and went from a 153 (pre-Kaplan course) to anywhere from a 159-164 post course. I studied my brains out and did a lot of studying on my own with the Bible books,etc. Over the 5-6 practice exams I took, I didn't score lower than a 159. But my hiighest was only 164.
The lsat will probably say these scores are not statistically significant, but for the schools, I'm sure it will make me or break me.
Well, should I hope I get lucky on the actual test and get my 164?
Anyone think I can get into the lower of the T-14?


No offense intended but SERIOUSLY? With a 3.85 from an Ivy you are asking a bunch of strangers with pretty much zero information about you to pull out crystal balls and predict your future in terms of getting lucky? The question itself shows that you know how silly it is since the basis of your inquiry is luck rather than merit combined with dreams of T14's and sugarplums and candy and all that.

Really, do you have a legit question other than "Can I get lucky and land in a T14 cuz of magic fortune that suddenly boosts my score all the sudden?" High LSAT scores are earned, nobody 'lucks' into a high score, everyone that gets one earns it.


I fail to comprehend how a 3.85 at an Ivy is impressive enough to warrant certain assumptions.

I'd say a 3.85 at a crappy school as a pre-med student is much more impressive than a 3.85 at Harvard as an English major.

What's wrong with English?


Nothing wrong with it. It's just an easy major in general.

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SplitterPride
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby SplitterPride » Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:18 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:
You check URM box. You get boost.

Poor white people growing up in poverty don't get boosts that are even comparable to the ones that rich URM's get.

It's the skin color that matters. Not the socioeconomic factors.

Socioeconomic factors makes for a good personal statement. At best it's a weak soft.

Being a URM is on a completely different level.


What she is saying (quite blatantly, without exception) is that if you are URM, you did not earn your spot. Its a cakewalk argument. Finito.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby whymeohgodno » Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:26 pm

SplitterPride wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:
You check URM box. You get boost.

Poor white people growing up in poverty don't get boosts that are even comparable to the ones that rich URM's get.

It's the skin color that matters. Not the socioeconomic factors.

Socioeconomic factors makes for a good personal statement. At best it's a weak soft.

Being a URM is on a completely different level.


What she is saying (quite blatantly, without exception) is that if you are URM, you did not earn your spot. Its a cakewalk argument. Finito.


Read the bold. Did I say every URM checked the box? Nope. I never mentioned or suggested anything about "deserve" either.

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beachbum
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby beachbum » Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:35 pm

...but what do you think about the blue people of Kentucky? Super URMs?

whymeohgodno
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby whymeohgodno » Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:38 pm

beachbum wrote:...but what do you think about the blue people of Kentucky? Super URMs?


Sadly they are not considered URM's. Don't ask me why. They should be.

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SplitterPride
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby SplitterPride » Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:51 pm

The problem with your line of thinking, and here is my contention, is the perception it creates. When you sit across the classroom with a brown/black person, some classmates will assume, that he/she is a beneficiary of the system whose numbers otherwise does not hold water. Is it an unfair label? yes. Will everyone bother to ask if that person checked/unchecked a box in their app? No. Will they brand them somehow knowingly/unknowingly? Yes. Does that create a healthy environment for the minority or his/her classmates? No. Its a form of victimization one cannot escape...[i]because[i] it is so color intense. You check or uncheck, people will still assume you gamed the system.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby whymeohgodno » Thu Sep 16, 2010 10:59 pm

SplitterPride wrote:The problem with your line of thinking, and here is my contention, is the perception it creates. When you sit across the classroom with a brown/black person, some classmates will assume, that he/she is a beneficiary of the system whose numbers otherwise does not hold water. Is it an unfair label? yes. Will everyone bother to ask if that person checked/unchecked a box in their app? No. Will they brand them somehow knowingly/unknowingly? Yes. Does that create a healthy environment for the minority or his/her classmates? No. Its a form of victimization one cannot escape...[i]because[i] it is so color intense. You check or uncheck, people will still assume you gamed the system.


Most URM's are beneficiary of the system. How many URM's do you know that didn't check the URM box when they could have?

Does that mean I pass a value judgment on whether or not they deserve to be there? That's a faulty assumption you are making.

I also had to lol for a moment there. Victimization. Yes, getting a huge boost in admissions by being born from a lineage that happened to contain some ethnic blood...when can these people ever escape this vicious system of victimization!?!

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ShuckingNotJiving
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby ShuckingNotJiving » Thu Sep 16, 2010 11:24 pm

wow. where are the mods. the level of ignorance has reached a point that is no longer funny.

This is it. I studied my butt off this summer for the lsat and went from a 153 (pre-Kaplan course) to anywhere from a 159-164 post course


What is it? The entire post makes little sense. So, you improved almost ten points. I fail to see what the problem is.

2011Law
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby 2011Law » Thu Sep 16, 2010 11:46 pm

Jeffort wrote:The posts scream of an intention to churn up a bunch of nasty AA debates/arguments.


lol, read this after I read the AA debates that were to come.

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bk1
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby bk1 » Thu Sep 16, 2010 11:50 pm

2011Law wrote:
Jeffort wrote:The posts scream of an intention to churn up a bunch of nasty AA debates/arguments.


lol, read this after I read the AA debates that were to come.


Ironically I thought Jeffort was being overly worrisome. I was wrong.

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MysticalWheel
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby MysticalWheel » Fri Sep 17, 2010 12:57 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:
I fail to comprehend how a 3.85 at an Ivy is impressive enough to warrant certain assumptions.

I'd say a 3.85 at a crappy school as a pre-med student is much more impressive than a 3.85 at Harvard as an English major.


Hmmm...I would disagree. "Pre-med" can entail any number of majors, along with the requisite science courses. I know of 3 individuals, history, psychology, and economics majors, respectively, that have not had too much of an increase in workload and effort due to their pre-med statuses than others I know who have, arguably, more involved social science majors (e.g., political science) without the pre-med status.

But...I guess whatever makes you feel better in your head, right? lol

czelede
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby czelede » Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:20 pm

MysticalWheel wrote:
whymeohgodno wrote:
I fail to comprehend how a 3.85 at an Ivy is impressive enough to warrant certain assumptions.

I'd say a 3.85 at a crappy school as a pre-med student is much more impressive than a 3.85 at Harvard as an English major.


Hmmm...I would disagree. "Pre-med" can entail any number of majors, along with the requisite science courses. I know of 3 individuals, history, psychology, and economics majors, respectively, that have not had too much of an increase in workload and effort due to their pre-med statuses than others I know who have, arguably, more involved social science majors (e.g., political science) without the pre-med status.

But...I guess whatever makes you feel better in your head, right? lol


Poster was probably thinking of traditional pre-med tracks, aka MCB - and medical school is even pickier about numbers (MCATs can't compensate the way LSATs can), so those majors need REALLY high grades, research experience, etc. It's competitive and not easy in the least.

EDIT: Also, this whole "I know people in this major who spent this much time..." is a pointless argument. Some people will waltz through hard science (some people just waltz through everything) and others can turn a poli-sci major into something extremely rigorous (I had a friend who graduated with a masters in poli sci and two bachelors in the time it took me to earn one four-year bachelors). On average, pre-med is a lot harder and a lot more time consuming than English.

d34d9823
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby d34d9823 » Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:30 pm

SplitterPride wrote:The problem with your line of thinking, and here is my contention, is the perception it creates. When you sit across the classroom with a brown/black person, some classmates will assume, that he/she is a beneficiary of the system whose numbers otherwise does not hold water. Is it an unfair label? yes. Will everyone bother to ask if that person checked/unchecked a box in their app? No. Will they brand them somehow knowingly/unknowingly? Yes. Does that create a healthy environment for the minority or his/her classmates? No. Its a form of victimization one cannot escape...[i]because[i] it is so color intense. You check or uncheck, people will still assume you gamed the system.

And this is why affirmative action fosters racism.

Whose fault is it? Damned if I know. It's not an easy problem.

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acrossthelake
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby acrossthelake » Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:35 pm

Image

d34d9823
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby d34d9823 » Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:37 pm

acrossthelake wrote:[gif]

Yeah, that too.

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acrossthelake
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby acrossthelake » Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:38 pm

d34dluk3 wrote:
acrossthelake wrote:[gif]

Yeah, that too.


This one's my fav actually:

--ImageRemoved-- (LinkRemoved)

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paratactical
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Re: Does scoring within ones high range on the LSAT take luck?

Postby paratactical » Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:53 pm

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