Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

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PLATONiC
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby PLATONiC » Wed May 19, 2010 4:43 am

BigA wrote:
PLATONiC wrote:Have you already taken a test at Yonsei before? I'm really curious about how the test center is and what not. Well, I could technically visit the university on my breakday from work, which I will do, but that's still very different from how testday would be. Could you please tell me about it?


No. I haven't taken it. But if I need to re-take, which I expect I will, I will take it in Hong Kong because that will be the closest center to me in October. I'd just like to know how it goes for you. Someone on these boards SWORE that games are harder in Asia, because Asians are so good at them. It's probably retarded, but still makes me nervous


That sounds very stupid. But it gets to me.

Exactly how do Asia LSATs work? Do they specifically make different LSATs just for non-U.S. test takers??? But to be completely honest, the games that I see on the mid-forties are ridiculously easy. Or at least on PT 43, I mean. I finished with five minutes remaining.... and I know that I'll get even faster eventually.

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bk1
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby bk1 » Wed May 19, 2010 4:46 am

Yeah, my low UGPA terrifies me and after making a bunch of stupid decisions regarding last cycle (applying late, not putting enough effort in, etc) I realized my stupidity and resolved myself to doing everything in my power to push as I high as I can for the 2010-2011 cycle.

My goals are:

LR + LR: -3
RC: -0
LG: -0


If you can hit your target it seems like -5 is usually a 175-178. Here's to hoping for that generous curve on test day :).

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BigA
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby BigA » Wed May 19, 2010 4:49 am

PLATONiC wrote:Exactly how do Asia LSATs work? Do they specifically make different LSATs just for non-U.S. test takers???


I don't know exactly. But yes, that is correct. Each continent gets a different test that is undisclosed I believe (kinda like the Feb. tests in U.S.)

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MURPH
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby MURPH » Wed May 19, 2010 4:51 am

d34dluk3 wrote:
PLATONiC wrote:I think the self-medicating approach (i.e. 1600mg) would be interesting. I have a feeling that the recommended dose might be much lower than what an extremely risky dose would be.

But for what it's worth, I hit 171 once again yesterday. I'm feeling good about that, but just like any PT'er, I feel like it might be a fluke. I'll ahve to get 170+ a good ten more times to feel secure.

Dude, don't take more than the recommended dose without talking to your doctor. Seriously, it's a terrible idea.

Also, grats on the 171!

+1. I've been a nurse for 12 years. you'll give yourself a bleeding ulcer if you take that dose too often. 200 mg is the usual over the counter dose. 1600 mg is 8 tablets at a time. That is a lot. MDs prescribe 800mg but usually only for a few days. Maybe you could get a muscle relaxant that doesn't have narcotics in it for the test. Or something else. But don't experiment too much without some professional advice.

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PLATONiC
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby PLATONiC » Wed May 19, 2010 8:28 pm

bk1 wrote:Yeah, my low UGPA terrifies me and after making a bunch of stupid decisions regarding last cycle (applying late, not putting enough effort in, etc) I realized my stupidity and resolved myself to doing everything in my power to push as I high as I can for the 2010-2011 cycle.

My goals are:

LR + LR: -3
RC: -0
LG: -0


If you can hit your target it seems like -5 is usually a 175-178. Here's to hoping for that generous curve on test day :).


My GPA isn't all that stellar either. But I noticed that if I set my personal expectations too high, I feel miserable after each practice test. I only started to score well after I realized that it's okay for me not to get high 170's. My GPA, 3.4 and a 175 seems to give me a really good chance at getting into a T10 program, since I'll be applying as soon as apps open. But my ultimate goal is to get 173... because it's the 99th percentile... -0RC is impossible for me. I'll be taking another PT tomorrow, so let's just hope that I get 170s again... or else my heart'll sink.

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PLATONiC
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby PLATONiC » Sat May 22, 2010 2:28 am

urgh.... my last two PTs:

PT44: 168
PT45: 169

Damnit! Good news is that I actually got a doctor to fix my problem for me today. I'm not sure if it's "fixed," but he claims that he fixed it; apparently one of my discs were knocked off to the side and he placed it back into where it should be. We'll see if he's BSing, and if he's not, whether or not my improved physical condition will reflect upon my score.

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bk1
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby bk1 » Sat May 22, 2010 5:36 am

PLATONiC wrote:urgh.... my last two PTs:

PT44: 168
PT45: 169

Damnit! Good news is that I actually got a doctor to fix my problem for me today. I'm not sure if it's "fixed," but he claims that he fixed it; apparently one of my discs were knocked off to the side and he placed it back into where it should be. We'll see if he's BSing, and if he's not, whether or not my improved physical condition will reflect upon my score.


I dipped as well. I'm gonna take a couple day break. Hope your health stays better.

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hemm
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby hemm » Sat May 22, 2010 5:55 am

PLATONiC wrote:Have you already taken a test at Yonsei before? I'm really curious about how the test center is and what not. Well, I could technically visit the university on my breakday from work, which I will do, but that's still very different from how testday would be. Could you please tell me about it?


I'm taking the June test at Yonsei. I went there yesterday to check out the testing center, but it was closed due to the holiday. The building itself was easy to find, though. It's just a big classroom building, pretty standard stuff by the looks of it. There's a review somewhere on the net from someone who took the test at Yonsei and they said it was fine - proctors were good, desks big enough, etc.

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PLATONiC
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby PLATONiC » Sun May 23, 2010 3:32 am

Do you happen to know if the Yonsei proctors are fine with people smoking during the break??? I've been chewing nicotine gum during the break for ten minutes, but I noticed the cigarette gives a far better "punch."

Does it really take an hour and a half just to get the test sheets out?

halfwaygone
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby halfwaygone » Sun May 23, 2010 6:12 am

I took at Yonsei, and it was a hassle for me because I live outside of Seoul. The testing site itself was fine. A little hot for me, but it was winter and I forgot to layer properly. Desks, proctors… that was all fine. I got lost finding the school, but I get lost everywhere here.

I didn’t find the Logic Games particularly difficult compared to what I’d practiced. My final score was considerably lower than my average towards the end (Range between 176-180, but more that were close to the higher range, with 2 perfect tests), but I still got a 172 on 3 hours sleep. I might re-take in October and try for closer to that 180, but I’m undecided. Depends on where I decide to apply.

Also, the logic of the LGs being harder because Asians are so good at them (eh, partly true) is silly. Asians – at least the Korean system I know – employ a lot less LSAT style logical reasoning (condition statements, etc) in their educational programs than the U.S., so does that mean LR is easier? The Asians (who actually are citizens, not Asian descent) taking it – not me – will all be ESL as well. Does that mean the RC will be easier? So silly.

OP, if you had time, I would recommend reading obscure English passages – historical, science based, politically based – to improve your RC. I'm not saying your English isn't excellent, but these subject-matter passages are things abroad-ESL students rarely read, and thus even top students lack exposure to certain vocabulary/styles of writing that top U.S. students will get naturally. Vocabulary plays a large role in the RC, I think, as does ability to spot tone in writing. Both of those are where I've noticed ESL students -- even the very advanced, seemingly fluent ones -- have the greatest deficits. It's completely learn-able, though.

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PLATONiC
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby PLATONiC » Sun May 23, 2010 8:06 pm

halfwaygone wrote:I took at Yonsei, and it was a hassle for me because I live outside of Seoul. The testing site itself was fine. A little hot for me, but it was winter and I forgot to layer properly. Desks, proctors… that was all fine. I got lost finding the school, but I get lost everywhere here.

I didn’t find the Logic Games particularly difficult compared to what I’d practiced. My final score was considerably lower than my average towards the end (Range between 176-180, but more that were close to the higher range, with 2 perfect tests), but I still got a 172 on 3 hours sleep. I might re-take in October and try for closer to that 180, but I’m undecided. Depends on where I decide to apply.

Also, the logic of the LGs being harder because Asians are so good at them (eh, partly true) is silly. Asians – at least the Korean system I know – employ a lot less LSAT style logical reasoning (condition statements, etc) in their educational programs than the U.S., so does that mean LR is easier? The Asians (who actually are citizens, not Asian descent) taking it – not me – will all be ESL as well. Does that mean the RC will be easier? So silly.

OP, if you had time, I would recommend reading obscure English passages – historical, science based, politically based – to improve your RC. I'm not saying your English isn't excellent, but these subject-matter passages are things abroad-ESL students rarely read, and thus even top students lack exposure to certain vocabulary/styles of writing that top U.S. students will get naturally. Vocabulary plays a large role in the RC, I think, as does ability to spot tone in writing. Both of those are where I've noticed ESL students -- even the very advanced, seemingly fluent ones -- have the greatest deficits. It's completely learn-able, though.


Thank you for your input about the testing sites. I noticed that I've been side-tracking by not reading as much lately, and I think that could have an impact. I'll have to go back to reading science passages as well as uninteresting anthropology passages in the Smithsonian to stay sharp... gragh...

But were the desks sufficiently large for both answer sheeets and test booklet plus pencils to be placed on them?

joonhp
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby joonhp » Sun May 23, 2010 8:14 pm

Good luck man. 5 weeks left! I'll be taking it at Yonsei too. I have 25 PT's to go and my weakness is in games so hopefully I can nail it down by test day.

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PLATONiC
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby PLATONiC » Sun May 23, 2010 8:37 pm

I've got 15 PT's remaining, but that's with a terrible 55-hour workweek!

If you've got 25 PTs remaining, that means that you're currently going through the PTs in the 30s. The LGs in those PTs are unrepresentative of the type of games on the more recent PTs. If you can pull off -5 or less on LG for those PTs, you could probably get -0 on the more recent ones. Well, that's the case for me, and I actually have five minutes remaining at the end of each game now.

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BigA
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby BigA » Mon May 24, 2010 1:19 am

halfwaygone wrote:I took at Yonsei, and it was a hassle for me because I live outside of Seoul. The testing site itself was fine. A little hot for me, but it was winter and I forgot to layer properly. Desks, proctors… that was all fine. I got lost finding the school, but I get lost everywhere here.

I didn’t find the Logic Games particularly difficult compared to what I’d practiced. My final score was considerably lower than my average towards the end (Range between 176-180, but more that were close to the higher range, with 2 perfect tests), but I still got a 172 on 3 hours sleep. I might re-take in October and try for closer to that 180, but I’m undecided. Depends on where I decide to apply.

Also, the logic of the LGs being harder because Asians are so good at them (eh, partly true) is silly. Asians – at least the Korean system I know – employ a lot less LSAT style logical reasoning (condition statements, etc) in their educational programs than the U.S., so does that mean LR is easier? The Asians (who actually are citizens, not Asian descent) taking it – not me – will all be ESL as well. Does that mean the RC will be easier? So silly.

OP, if you had time, I would recommend reading obscure English passages – historical, science based, politically based – to improve your RC. I'm not saying your English isn't excellent, but these subject-matter passages are things abroad-ESL students rarely read, and thus even top students lack exposure to certain vocabulary/styles of writing that top U.S. students will get naturally. Vocabulary plays a large role in the RC, I think, as does ability to spot tone in writing. Both of those are where I've noticed ESL students -- even the very advanced, seemingly fluent ones -- have the greatest deficits. It's completely learn-able, though.


Yeah, that guy I talked to thought games were harder but RC and LR were the same. Doesn't make sense. I think he was flying back to U.S. to take it a third time actually

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savagedm
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby savagedm » Mon May 24, 2010 3:14 am

Honestly if you want to get into that score range (and this advice is coming from an LSAT instructor), find the question types that you are hurting most in and figure out what seems to be the problem. Keep drilling other question types to keep the skills sharp, but focus on your problem areas most. Keep taking a couple full length tests a week and at least one section every other day. Just know you can do this and dont worry about the pressure of the test, most adcoms take your highest score now so you can always retake (I HIGHLY advise this because you really have nothing to lose and everything to gain).

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PLATONiC
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby PLATONiC » Mon May 24, 2010 3:25 am

savagedm wrote:Honestly if you want to get into that score range (and this advice is coming from an LSAT instructor), find the question types that you are hurting most in and figure out what seems to be the problem. Keep drilling other question types to keep the skills sharp, but focus on your problem areas most. Keep taking a couple full length tests a week and at least one section every other day. Just know you can do this and dont worry about the pressure of the test, most adcoms take your highest score now so you can always retake (I HIGHLY advise this because you really have nothing to lose and everything to gain).

Based on my spreadsheet analysis, roughly 75% of all the questions that I get wrong are Flaw in the Reasoning and Parallel Reasoning question types. I couldn't believe my eyes when I learned of this weakness. I can say that I would have never known unless I recorded this.

Considering the fact that pretty much all of my expendable income has been going into my LSAT study regimen, I had no problem today with purchasing the PT 1-38 Flaw in the Reasoning bundle from Cambridge LSAT. Despite the fact that I've already done all of these PTs, I feel that I can benefit alot by focusing on Flaw questions by going over them slowly, and learning to describe the flaws in abstract terms as presented on the answer choices. I'm hopeful of improvements in this area by the end of this week.

Parallel Reasoning is a completely different animal, however. I noticed that PR questions have slightly changed. They're different from the older versions; I used to be able to cross out more than half of the answer choices just by taking a look at the conclusions, but that trick doesn't work as well anymore. Savagedm, do you have any suggestions for me when it comes to this? I readily admit, however, that it is a timing issue as well, so I'm afraid there really isn't much I can do!

kenbear
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby kenbear » Mon May 24, 2010 3:39 am

PLATONiC wrote:Are you taking the test too??

Well, I've been studying for a reaaaallly long time. Nine months, almost. This is because I have a full time job that consists of 55+ hours a week, and I sort of had to study at a slower pace. Lately, for the past three weeks, I've been taking three practice tests a week.

The biggest CHALLENGE to my entire LSAT prep regimen is my health. I'm developing a kind of neck pain that almost seems chronic. And it's worrying me. Despite the fact that I wear glasses, and have been told that the prescription I have is at the optimal level by various optometrists, I have a difficult time reading the small fonts on preptest. I have no choice but to curl my neck face down on the paper. The stress/pain has accumulated and now it hurts. So when my neck/shoulder pain isn't too bad, I hit high 160s (I've been scoring in this range for the past frour weeks), but if my physical condition is horrible, I get about 165.

I almost see the LSAT as a concentration test. I almost understand all of the material, but if I'm in bad shape, then I fail to see certain logical gaps in LR passages.

Oh yeah: my most recent PT raw score:

PT 40
LR: -1
LR: -1
LG: -2
RC: -5



How could you get 48/50 in LR? I cannot barely finish LR on time,pfffff :( .

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PLATONiC
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Re: Going from 165-171 to 170s in Six Weeks... Possible? Help!!

Postby PLATONiC » Mon May 24, 2010 4:05 am

kenbear wrote:
PLATONiC wrote:Are you taking the test too??

Well, I've been studying for a reaaaallly long time. Nine months, almost. This is because I have a full time job that consists of 55+ hours a week, and I sort of had to study at a slower pace. Lately, for the past three weeks, I've been taking three practice tests a week.

The biggest CHALLENGE to my entire LSAT prep regimen is my health. I'm developing a kind of neck pain that almost seems chronic. And it's worrying me. Despite the fact that I wear glasses, and have been told that the prescription I have is at the optimal level by various optometrists, I have a difficult time reading the small fonts on preptest. I have no choice but to curl my neck face down on the paper. The stress/pain has accumulated and now it hurts. So when my neck/shoulder pain isn't too bad, I hit high 160s (I've been scoring in this range for the past frour weeks), but if my physical condition is horrible, I get about 165.

I almost see the LSAT as a concentration test. I almost understand all of the material, but if I'm in bad shape, then I fail to see certain logical gaps in LR passages.

Oh yeah: my most recent PT raw score:

PT 40
LR: -1
LR: -1
LG: -2
RC: -5



How could you get 48/50 in LR? I cannot barely finish LR on time,pfffff :( .


Well, to be completely honest, after checking my answers, this -2 on LR was a complete FLUKE. I should have gotten -3 and -2. I got lucky with some answer choices. But my LRs nowdays (at least for the past eight to nine PTs) have never gone more than -4 per section.

All I can say is that the familiarity that I've gained as a result of taking a bunch of PTs contributed most to LR speed and accuracy. Practice practice and practice.




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