October 2010 Test Prep

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CapHillLove
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby CapHillLove » Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:55 pm

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Last edited by CapHillLove on Fri Dec 24, 2010 2:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

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sgtgrumbles
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby sgtgrumbles » Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:09 pm

CapHillLove wrote:How can I be perfect on LR with time to spare and consistently only getting 3 passages done on RC?

Has anyone found a way to increase speed on RC?


We're in the same boat. I'm debating picking up the RC Bible, but the general opinion on here is that it isn't much help. Still, if it can bring my RC average from -4 to -2 it's worth it.

Anyone in NYC have an RCB for sale or to borrow, or know of a bookstore where I can flip through one? Most bookstores only carry the LGB if anything.

RFKScott
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby RFKScott » Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:19 pm

RC Bible is solid when it focuses on Question Types and stuff like that. My biggest problem on RC is speed as I have consistently less than 5 minutes to complete the final passage. I just feel the note taking that the bible suggests is just way to time consuming and I have noticed significant time increases when i just circle names, conclusions, definitions and keep a mental note of structure and viewpoints. Even with this I still need to get faster.

Is it just a matter of taking timed RC section after timed RC section with solid review in order to get faster?

Hedwig
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Hedwig » Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:54 pm

sgtgrumbles wrote:
CapHillLove wrote:How can I be perfect on LR with time to spare and consistently only getting 3 passages done on RC?

Has anyone found a way to increase speed on RC?


We're in the same boat. I'm debating picking up the RC Bible, but the general opinion on here is that it isn't much help. Still, if it can bring my RC average from -4 to -2 it's worth it.

Anyone in NYC have an RCB for sale or to borrow, or know of a bookstore where I can flip through one? Most bookstores only carry the LGB if anything.


How long does it take you to read a passage? Are you marking it up a ton and not using the markings, etc?

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Cromartie
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Cromartie » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:20 pm

CapHillLove wrote:How can I be perfect on LR with time to spare and consistently only getting 3 passages done on RC?

Has anyone found a way to increase speed on RC?


Of the 3 passages that you complete, what's your accuracy rate? I think there is a fine balance to be struck between speed and accuracy. Personally, I strive to read each passage in 2 minutes at the most, keeping track of what each paragraph is generally about, then I refer back to specific paragraphs as I tackle each question.

On my initial read, I really don't pay attention to the details so much as just keep note of the general content of each paragraph and the overall theme of the passage. That way, I know where to look as I respond to each question.

Not sure this approach will suit everyone, but it works very well for me.

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CapHillLove
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby CapHillLove » Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:57 pm

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Last edited by CapHillLove on Fri Dec 24, 2010 2:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

Hedwig
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Hedwig » Wed Aug 18, 2010 3:01 pm

CapHillLove wrote:
Cromartie wrote:
CapHillLove wrote:How can I be perfect on LR with time to spare and consistently only getting 3 passages done on RC?

Has anyone found a way to increase speed on RC?


Of the 3 passages that you complete, what's your accuracy rate? I think there is a fine balance to be struck between speed and accuracy. Personally, I strive to read each passage in 2 minutes at the most, keeping track of what each paragraph is generally about, then I refer back to specific paragraphs as I tackle each question.

On my initial read, I really don't pay attention to the details so much as just keep note of the general content of each paragraph and the overall theme of the passage. That way, I know where to look as I respond to each question.

Not sure this approach will suit everyone, but it works very well for me.


I'm pretty accurate... I miss maybe one or two questions total on the passages that I get to, but I'm not always confident and I don't just knock out the questions like in LR. I actually haaate referring back to the passage, which may be my problem. I'm not very good at reading for detail, especially when RC is at the end of the whole LSAT (I space out a bit). It might be better to do as you do and read for general content, making note of where details are instead of what they are and then referring back when necessary.

I tend to be good on general theme and remembering details but inference questions take forever (even if I do end up getting them right).

I might start forcing myself to go faster and sacrifice accuracy. I'm hoping that I can get LG up to 100%, so I can take a hit on RC and still get 170+. It really does seem like RC is the hardest to improve on.


Sometimes I feel like LR is just one big cost-benefit analysis problem. For example, I feel beholden to point out that going faster and sacrificing accuracy on the first three passages is only going to be a more beneficial strategy if your lower score on the first three + a higher score on the fourth = more points than you'd get if you just focused on accuracy in the first three.

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Anaconda
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Anaconda » Wed Aug 18, 2010 3:07 pm

eit wrote:
CapHillLove wrote:
Cromartie wrote:
CapHillLove wrote:How can I be perfect on LR with time to spare and consistently only getting 3 passages done on RC?

Has anyone found a way to increase speed on RC?


Of the 3 passages that you complete, what's your accuracy rate? I think there is a fine balance to be struck between speed and accuracy. Personally, I strive to read each passage in 2 minutes at the most, keeping track of what each paragraph is generally about, then I refer back to specific paragraphs as I tackle each question.

On my initial read, I really don't pay attention to the details so much as just keep note of the general content of each paragraph and the overall theme of the passage. That way, I know where to look as I respond to each question.

Not sure this approach will suit everyone, but it works very well for me.


I'm pretty accurate... I miss maybe one or two questions total on the passages that I get to, but I'm not always confident and I don't just knock out the questions like in LR. I actually haaate referring back to the passage, which may be my problem. I'm not very good at reading for detail, especially when RC is at the end of the whole LSAT (I space out a bit). It might be better to do as you do and read for general content, making note of where details are instead of what they are and then referring back when necessary.

I tend to be good on general theme and remembering details but inference questions take forever (even if I do end up getting them right).

I might start forcing myself to go faster and sacrifice accuracy. I'm hoping that I can get LG up to 100%, so I can take a hit on RC and still get 170+. It really does seem like RC is the hardest to improve on.


Sometimes I feel like LR is just one big cost-benefit analysis problem. For example, I feel beholden to point out that going faster and sacrificing accuracy on the first three passages is only going to be a more beneficial strategy if your lower score on the first three + a higher score on the fourth = more points than you'd get if you just focused on accuracy in the first three.


That's a great point. If your main problem is time and you simply can't get through all 4 with accuracy, then maybe doing the first 3 in 30 minutes and getting a -3 on those and making educated guesses on the last passage nets you, say a -4, would be a lot better than rushing through the whole thing and getting a -8 or -10.

I'm having trouble once again with time and accuracy after seemingly removing those problems in the past few weeks. It's so frustrating. RC is my most inconsistent section - one week I'm getting -5's, and the next week I'm getting -10's and -12's.

Hedwig
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Hedwig » Wed Aug 18, 2010 3:11 pm

BeachedBrit wrote:
RC: Anyone have a strategy for someone that consistently gets them all right other than the main point question? Pretty ridiculous problem to have.



Main Point Questions:
Especially as the tests get more recent, you'll find that main point (something you THINK you should always know, since you've been reading/comprehending since kindergarten) is sometimes very deceptive. I've noticed that wrong answers frequently feature -
- information from the last paragraph or so of the passage. This one is tricky because a) you've just read it, b) you expect the conclusion to be in the last paragraph, so it seems likely this will be a conclusion. Usually they leave out some key piece of information or only report one side of the argument or don't qualify what they say.
- Description of information but not impact. For example, a passage about how new revelations of how lichen fits into the family tree and the IMPACT of this discovery might have an answer stating what the discovery was. "New research suggests that fungi are not only parasitic but also symbiotic organisms." So you might like this answer or the other similar answers, because they do discuss half the point of the passage - the information. But the actual right answer discusses impact as well. New research has uncovered the lichen's relationship to the fungal family tree. What is the main point? Well, it's not just the information.

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3|ink
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby 3|ink » Wed Aug 18, 2010 3:12 pm

sgtgrumbles wrote:
CapHillLove wrote:How can I be perfect on LR with time to spare and consistently only getting 3 passages done on RC?

Has anyone found a way to increase speed on RC?


We're in the same boat. I'm debating picking up the RC Bible, but the general opinion on here is that it isn't much help. Still, if it can bring my RC average from -4 to -2 it's worth it.

Anyone in NYC have an RCB for sale or to borrow, or know of a bookstore where I can flip through one? Most bookstores only carry the LGB if anything.


Are you guys having trouble answering specific question types or is it evenly distributed?

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northwood
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby northwood » Wed Aug 18, 2010 5:00 pm

ive been debating using highlighters for the RC section, instead of writing down info on the side. I find that i am tkaing too much time to jot notes on the margins, in addition to unerlining and circling. I tend to write out big items on the side and use 2 color highlighters instead. I havent tried this out yet, but i have been thinking it over for the past few days. any thoughts or comments on this method.

I currently get to 3 passages by 30 minutes, and miss 1-2 per passage. The fourth passage i just skim the questions and look for specific lines or questions and guess ( after i bubbled B for the entire section- so i hvae at least 1 answer in for each question)
RC is the section that is currently keeping me down. \ self pep talk I will end up dominating it, and the rest of the lsat./ end self pep talk

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Ford Prefect
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Ford Prefect » Wed Aug 18, 2010 5:29 pm

When I was teaching, many of my slow readers were slow because they were trying to take in every little bit of detail in the first read (the others just couldn't read). They would constantly refer back to earlier parts of the passage in order to make sure everything made sense and they understood what was happening. Not a bad idea when you can read for leisure, but a killer when there is a time frame.

One thing that helped many of my students (and might help some of you) is to break down the reading as you go; that is, read a paragraph (or even 2-3 sentences) and then, in the margins of passage, jot down a small note about what you just read. There's not much room, so keep it short.

Example:

Until about 1970, anyone who wanted to write a comprehensive history of medieval English law as it actually affected women would have found a dearth of published books or articles concerned with the specific legal topics relating to women and derived from extensive research in actual court records. Women medieval law This is a serious deficiency, since court records are of vital importance in discovering how the law actually affected women, as opposed to how the law was intended to affect them or thought to affect them. These latter questions can be answered by consulting such sources as treatises, commentaries, and statutes; such texts were what most scholars of the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries concentrated on whenever they did write about medieval law. But these sources are of little help in determining, for example, how often women's special statutory privileges were thwarted by intimidation or harassment, or how often women managed to evade special statutory limitations. weak info re:women And, quite apart from provisions designed to apply only, or especially, to women, they cannot tell us how general law affected the female half of the population-how women defendants and plaintiffs were treated in the courts in practice when they tried to exercise the rights they shared with men women=men in court?. Only quantitative studies of large numbers of cases would allow even a guess at the answers to these questions, and this scholarly work has been attempted by few.not much scholarship re:women bc little research.

Practice until you can get through an RC passage in 2-3 minutes with annotations, tops. These annotations are not meant to give you maximum info on each section, but to help remind you of where pertinent info is in the passage. Some people can read the passage once and not refer back to it. However, referring back to the passage is not the devil, so long as you know what you're looking for. This method also avoids actually marking the passage, which may get messy unless you're using a highlighter (which is a pretty good idea).

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P. Bateman
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby P. Bateman » Wed Aug 18, 2010 5:49 pm

For RC, I just read thoroughly once and answer the questions. If I read carefully, I don't have to refer back to the passage most of the time. It has been working for me so far.

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Gemini
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Gemini » Wed Aug 18, 2010 9:25 pm

Hiii I did PT 29 today and scored a 169! My highest yet!

I'm so excited, and I sincerely hope that this trend will continue!

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Hannibal
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Hannibal » Wed Aug 18, 2010 10:46 pm

Howww am I getting worse at LR? Most of the time when I see the answer I immediately see how I messed it up and wonder why I made that mistake.

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CapHillLove
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby CapHillLove » Wed Aug 18, 2010 10:53 pm

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Last edited by CapHillLove on Fri Dec 24, 2010 2:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

pinkedelweiss
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby pinkedelweiss » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:01 pm

I'm kind of upset with testmasters and the way they divided all the published LSAT questions into homeworks. (I'm taking the testmasters class) Now I only have 6 supplemental tests and about 5 supplemental sections where I can time myself...
The homeworks are only certain types of questions, so I can't realistically do those timed because it's natural to spend more time on one type of question than another ....sigh...
I have the most problems with logical reasoning, and I literally don't know what to do to improve :( Time is running so low for October and I'm currently getting -10 :( Any suggestions?

Oh and my biggest issue is time, if I did each section untimed I score around -3, but when it's timed my mind just wanders and I have to read each question multiple times...
I get the 5 hour energy drinks I try to everything to stay focused, I just don't knwo what to do. Maybe I need ADD medication...

Hedwig
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Hedwig » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:12 pm

pinkedelweiss wrote:I'm kind of upset with testmasters and the way they divided all the published LSAT questions into homeworks. (I'm taking the testmasters class) Now I only have 6 supplemental tests and about 5 supplemental sections where I can time myself...
The homeworks are only certain types of questions, so I can't realistically do those timed because it's natural to spend more time on one type of question than another ....sigh...
I have the most problems with logical reasoning, and I literally don't know what to do to improve :( Time is running so low for October and I'm currently getting -10 :( Any suggestions?

Oh and my biggest issue is time, if I did each section untimed I score around -3, but when it's timed my mind just wanders and I have to read each question multiple times...
I get the 5 hour energy drinks I try to everything to stay focused, I just don't knwo what to do. Maybe I need ADD medication...


Those make me jittery as all hell. Well, I've never had a specific 5 hour energy drink, but caffeine/energy drinks make my brain feel overheated (lol I know wtf) and make my brain just... check out of the picture. Obviously it doesn't hurt you to that extent or you would have discontinued use already, but try it without a supplement like that and see how you go, it could actually be detrimental to your focus.

Why would your mind wander more if it's timed? Are you feeling pressure or somethign? I know that when I use the LSAT Cacophony the sound of pencils skritching intimidates the hell out of me and it takes a little while before I get used to it and can focus properly again.

You could also try outside activities unrelated to testing in order to focus your mind - yoga, meditation, just exercising more.

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TUP
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby TUP » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:35 pm

Anyone currently in the mid-30s for PTs working your way toward 60 in order? I just did 35 and plan on doing a 4-section and two 5-sections per week until the exam. Just wondering if anyone is on a similar schedule.

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Hannibal
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Hannibal » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:43 pm

TUP wrote:Anyone currently in the mid-30s for PTs working your way toward 60 in order? I just did 35 and plan on doing a 4-section and two 5-sections per week until the exam. Just wondering if anyone is on a similar schedule.


Similar, though I have a gap between 38 and 46. I might buy 42-45 to get more material but I'm pretty much set.

ly2010
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby ly2010 » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:45 pm

TUP wrote:Anyone currently in the mid-30s for PTs working your way toward 60 in order? I just did 35 and plan on doing a 4-section and two 5-sections per week until the exam. Just wondering if anyone is on a similar schedule.


I think a couple of us are doing 30 tonight...and then a few random ones to hold us over until Sept. Starting then we're doing 50-60.

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Anaconda
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby Anaconda » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:49 pm

Doing 37 tomorrow, then 38-60

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3|ink
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby 3|ink » Wed Aug 18, 2010 11:50 pm

pinkedelweiss wrote:I'm kind of upset with testmasters and the way they divided all the published LSAT questions into homeworks. (I'm taking the testmasters class) Now I only have 6 supplemental tests and about 5 supplemental sections where I can time myself...
The homeworks are only certain types of questions, so I can't realistically do those timed because it's natural to spend more time on one type of question than another ....sigh...
I have the most problems with logical reasoning, and I literally don't know what to do to improve :( Time is running so low for October and I'm currently getting -10 :( Any suggestions?

Oh and my biggest issue is time, if I did each section untimed I score around -3, but when it's timed my mind just wanders and I have to read each question multiple times...
I get the 5 hour energy drinks I try to everything to stay focused, I just don't knwo what to do. Maybe I need ADD medication...


I agree entirely. They need to allow for more PTs. I think the class significantly underestimates the importance of stamina.

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sgtgrumbles
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby sgtgrumbles » Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:15 am

3|ink wrote:
sgtgrumbles wrote:
CapHillLove wrote:How can I be perfect on LR with time to spare and consistently only getting 3 passages done on RC?

Has anyone found a way to increase speed on RC?


We're in the same boat. I'm debating picking up the RC Bible, but the general opinion on here is that it isn't much help. Still, if it can bring my RC average from -4 to -2 it's worth it.

Anyone in NYC have an RCB for sale or to borrow, or know of a bookstore where I can flip through one? Most bookstores only carry the LGB if anything.


Are you guys having trouble answering specific question types or is it evenly distributed?


I think the problem for me is timing. My mistakes come from only having enough time to give cursory looks to the last passage's questions. As a result I make a lot of mistakes, but I don't think I could narrow it down to one or two types of questions. I created a breakdown of my LR misses by question type, but I don't have the RCB or any other method of breaking RC questions into type in order to do the same thing. Are there any publicly available lists/explanations of RC question types out there?

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vttran9
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Re: October 2010 Test Prep

Postby vttran9 » Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:23 am

Tried the SOS method on PT 30. Got the exact same questions wrong, timed and untimed. Odd?

On the bright side, I got a 171. 8)




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