bankruptcy and law school

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poorgeorge09
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bankruptcy and law school

Postby poorgeorge09 » Wed Dec 24, 2008 1:11 pm

i believe i may have to file bankruptcy prior to beginning law school. (this is due to my business going under)

how would this affect a law career and job placement after law school.

any information would be very helpful

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gpb19
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby gpb19 » Wed Dec 24, 2008 1:14 pm

I don't know the answer to this, but I'm thinking it might make a difference what type of bankruptcy. Since it is due to your business, is it a chapter 11, or are you filing personally? If it's personal, it may be viewed differently if it is a 7 instead of a 13.

Take this with a grain of salt, because as I said I do not know the answer. But I do know bankruptcy, and it seems logical that the type could influence a decision, if the decision isn't completely black and white.

Also keep in mind that many people have to take out private loans to finance LS since the gov. loans have a cap. If you are unable to obtain financing, obviously that would make LS problematic.

poorgeorge09
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby poorgeorge09 » Wed Dec 24, 2008 1:18 pm

Well it would have to be a ch7 personal as I was a sole proprietor.

I am not really worried about financing law school; what my main worry is what the effect will be post-law school

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wes_henricksen
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby wes_henricksen » Wed Dec 24, 2008 4:35 pm

You should not worry about it too much. Upon graduation, when you apply for admission to a state bar, you will have to fill out a moral character application (it has different names in different states, but it's the same thing everywhere). These applications are not normally rejected. Things that you have to worry about are criminal convictions, particularly for crimes that evidence poor moral character. Traffic tickets or misdemeanors should not pose too much of a problem. But the important thing is--and this is VERY important--make sure you answer the moral character application questions completely and truthfully. Do not hide information about your bankruptcy. If they find out you lied on the application, that gives them grounds to deny your application to the state bar. They're probably more likely to deny your good moral character application for lying on it than for disclosing your checkered past.

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dextermorgan
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby dextermorgan » Wed Dec 24, 2008 4:38 pm

poorgeorge09 wrote:Well it would have to be a ch7 personal as I was a sole proprietor.

I am not really worried about financing law school; what my main worry is what the effect will be post-law school

Your best bet is to call the C&F board in a few states where you see yourself practicing and asking their opinion.

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sirhitch
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby sirhitch » Wed Dec 24, 2008 4:44 pm

dextermorgan wrote:
poorgeorge09 wrote:Well it would have to be a ch7 personal as I was a sole proprietor.

I am not really worried about financing law school; what my main worry is what the effect will be post-law school

Your best bet is to call the C&F board in a few states where you see yourself practicing and asking their opinion.

yeah because theyll give you that clear it up, definitive answer youre looking for. heres what theyll say, "i cant tell you how this will impact you. youre evaluated at the time you sit for the exam." unless you are a chronic breaker of the law, or have killed or raped someone, u can be an attorney.

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dextermorgan
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby dextermorgan » Wed Dec 24, 2008 5:11 pm

sirhitch wrote:
dextermorgan wrote:
poorgeorge09 wrote:Well it would have to be a ch7 personal as I was a sole proprietor.

I am not really worried about financing law school; what my main worry is what the effect will be post-law school

Your best bet is to call the C&F board in a few states where you see yourself practicing and asking their opinion.

yeah because theyll give you that clear it up, definitive answer youre looking for. heres what theyll say, "i cant tell you how this will impact you. youre evaluated at the time you sit for the exam." unless you are a chronic breaker of the law, or have killed or raped someone, u can be an attorney.


Asking a specific question such as "is there a certain amount of time that must have passed after a bankruptcy before somone can sit for the bar exam?" will get a general but helpful answer. This will vary state to state of course.

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Dick Whitman
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby Dick Whitman » Wed Dec 24, 2008 5:20 pm

poorgeorge09 wrote:Well it would have to be a ch7 personal as I was a sole proprietor.

I am not really worried about financing law school; what my main worry is what the effect will be post-law school


If you have enough money to write a check for law school, then you have no business filing bankruptcy. If you do not, then financing most certainly is a concern.

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gpb19
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby gpb19 » Wed Dec 24, 2008 6:23 pm

Dick Whitman wrote:
poorgeorge09 wrote:Well it would have to be a ch7 personal as I was a sole proprietor.

I am not really worried about financing law school; what my main worry is what the effect will be post-law school


If you have enough money to write a check for law school, then you have no business filing bankruptcy. If you do not, then financing most certainly is a concern.


+1 I didn't reply again because I couldn't think of a remotely polite way to say that. If you are coming out the other side of Chapter 7 with the ability fo self-finance LS, there is something seriously wrong with your disclosures. I'd be really interested to see how you passed the Chapter 7 means test.

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sirhitch
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby sirhitch » Wed Dec 24, 2008 11:40 pm

Asking a specific question such as "is there a certain amount of time that must have passed after a bankruptcy before somone can sit for the bar exam?" will get a general but helpful answer. This will vary state to state of course.

i can answer this right now. No, there is not a statutory period of time in any state that must expire before you can sit for the bar exam and pass after declaring bankruptcy.

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Wes Henricksen
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby Wes Henricksen » Fri Dec 26, 2008 1:55 pm

You all seem to assume that Poor George will pay for law school up front, when in fact he may very likely be planning on taking out loans to pay for it. Just like the majority of law students do.

dooder
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby dooder » Mon Dec 29, 2008 12:59 pm

Wes Henricksen wrote:You all seem to assume that Poor George will pay for law school up front, when in fact he may very likely be planning on taking out loans to pay for it. Just like the majority of law students do.

Yes, but when OP says that he isn't worried about paying for school, he is insinuating that he will not be taking out private loans as it is universally understood that it would be substantially more difficult if not impossible to take out private loans for school when you have a recent bankruptcy on your file, hence the confusion....

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OssumPossum
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby OssumPossum » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:14 pm

I think the financing questions assume that OP is paying for law school. Full tuition at TTT? Not unheard of. Even full tuition anywhere.

As for sitting for the Bar, I can't imagine how this would be viewed negatively, as there is nothing legally or morally wrong with filing bankruptcy. It's legal, and there's a reason it's legal. OP found out he's no good at running a business, so he's going to law school instead :P

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ac1317
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby ac1317 » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:17 pm

On a related note, is there any way to default on student loans? What about leaving the country can they track you?

dooder
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby dooder » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:34 pm

ac1317 wrote:On a related note, is there any way to default on student loans? What about leaving the country can they track you?

Student loans are not covered under bankruptcy or anything else like that, so yes, it will go to collections and they will hunt you down...

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OssumPossum
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby OssumPossum » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:47 pm

If you have some degenerative diseases that impair your work, you can have student loans discharged. Also in cases of extreme ridicupoverty, I've seen student loans discharged in bankruptcy. A woman was a single mother of 4 kids with a shit job. One of the kids also had some kind of disability requiring gobs of money.

Anyway, I wouldn't wish that on anyone. Considering the depth of the shithole your life has to be in before your student loans can be discharged, I would sooner thank god for my shithole being so shallow that I can't have my loans discharged.

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uvalaw4l
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby uvalaw4l » Mon Dec 29, 2008 6:43 pm

I've read instances where where declaring bankruptcy prevented an applicant from passing the C&F, but it's the underlying reason for the bankruptcy that matters. In the particular case I'm thinking of, the guy knew he was going to file bankruptcy and still ran up ridiculous debts with no intention of paying it back. It wasn't the bankruptcy that caused him to fail the C&F, but it did flag attention to him. There are plenty of other examples but that's the one that sticks out in my head.

As long as your reasons for filing are legit and not immoral and aren't a sign of severe financial irresponsibility, you'll be fine. Be prepared to be closely examined though.

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lawcat
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby lawcat » Mon Dec 29, 2008 6:49 pm

wes_henricksen wrote:You should not worry about it too much. Upon graduation, when you apply for admission to a state bar, you will have to fill out a moral character application (it has different names in different states, but it's the same thing everywhere). These applications are not normally rejected. Things that you have to worry about are criminal convictions, particularly for crimes that evidence poor moral character. Traffic tickets or misdemeanors should not pose too much of a problem. But the important thing is--and this is VERY important--make sure you answer the moral character application questions completely and truthfully. Do not hide information about your bankruptcy. If they find out you lied on the application, that gives them grounds to deny your application to the state bar. They're probably more likely to deny your good moral character application for lying on it than for disclosing your checkered past.


One day I was tokin' on a blunt and I called the CA BAR, they said bankruptcy doen't hurt as long as it was filed in "good faith". Do you have good faith that you don't want to pay your bills? lol! You should be fine. Bankruptcy is your legal right.

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worldtraveler
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby worldtraveler » Tue Dec 30, 2008 10:39 am

ac1317 wrote:On a related note, is there any way to default on student loans? What about leaving the country can they track you?


I know some people working in a foreign country specifically so they don't have to pay back their students loans. Now that the visa requirements have changed, they have to go back and visit the USA to keep working here. They've pretty much screwed themselves into either paying back thousands of dollars in interest or trying to flee to a new country to see if that works out. Not the brightest plan ever.

michel-laws
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby michel-laws » Fri Aug 13, 2010 11:24 am

ITS VERY DIFFICULT

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Fri Aug 13, 2010 1:01 pm

Isn't bankruptcy a reason to be denied for grad plus loans? Just sayin'.

ScaredWorkedBored
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby ScaredWorkedBored » Tue Aug 17, 2010 12:03 pm

Recent bankruptcy is an automatic denial.

And the means test does not apply to business debts. Still not exactly sure how a massively indebted sole proprietorship (i.e. you, no legal asset shield) would have hundreds of thousands in liquid assets left, though...

voltline
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby voltline » Sat Sep 25, 2010 10:11 am

Can we really help bankruptcy if we will go to counseling? What is the best way to prevent bankruptcy?

SPAM

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vanwinkle
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby vanwinkle » Sat Sep 25, 2010 10:18 am

voltline wrote:Can we really help bankruptcy if we will go to counseling? What is the best way to prevent bankruptcy?

SPAM

Image

I hate spammers (though I love editing their URLs out).

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2014
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Re: bankruptcy and law school

Postby 2014 » Sat Sep 25, 2010 10:40 am

ToTransferOrNot wrote:Isn't bankruptcy a reason to be denied for grad plus loans? Just sayin'.

I think it will just require you to have a solid cosigner.
As long as someone is on that loan who has not declared bankruptcy or defaulted, they don't care.




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