Is graduating at 29 to old?

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typ3
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby typ3 » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:34 am

Bronx Bum wrote:If you get biglaw, I guess not.

If you DON'T get biglaw, yes, its too old.

TITCR

Graduating at 29 for 50k is garbage. It's only worth it if you get 100k+ big law.

I know 19 year old web developers who make more in small markets and plenty of ibanking / finance friends who made 100k+ at 22. Not even making 6 figs at 29 with debt is a life fail and a huge hole that will set you behind peers for years.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:34 am

:|

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DrStudMuffin
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby DrStudMuffin » Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:14 am

typ3 wrote:
Bronx Bum wrote:If you get biglaw, I guess not.

If you DON'T get biglaw, yes, its too old.

TITCR

Graduating at 29 for 50k is garbage. It's only worth it if you get 100k+ big law.

I know 19 year old web developers who make more in small markets and plenty of ibanking / finance friends who made 100k+ at 22. Not even making 6 figs at 29 with debt is a life fail and a huge hole that will set you behind peers for years.


No one gives a shit who you know. What your ibanking friends make is irrelevant to this question.

Lol at the idea that the difference between being 26 and making 50k and 29 making 50k is meaningful in a 30+ year career.

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DrStudMuffin
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby DrStudMuffin » Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:28 am

I'll clarify by saying that being in big debt while making 50k sucks no matter what age you are.

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Holly Golightly
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby Holly Golightly » Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:39 am

I just can't. This discussion is insane. :roll:

I just graduated at 28 and turned 29 this summer. Couldn't be happier about my decision. Law school can be a great or terrible decision at any age. And whoever said that those people saying 29 is too old to graduate are K-JDs who know nothing about career trajectory is right.

Also, I'm pretty sure most NU graduates (at least as of my class) are 27+ when they graduate.

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typ3
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby typ3 » Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:26 am

Well, no one ever said law students were financially literate.

Actually, not working for 3 years and losing out on 3 years of paychecks + going in the hole 100k is a huge deal. People who act like it isn't important from a financial stand point probably have little understanding of compound interest. The point of working or a career is to work to make money so you don't have to. Decisions on the front end of your life / career can disproportionately affect where you end up. Good luck owning assets when you have a mortgagesque size mortgage at 29 making 50k with no assets.

This thread is a flame.

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DrStudMuffin
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby DrStudMuffin » Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:38 am

typ3 wrote:Well, no one ever said law students were financially literate.

Actually, not working for 3 years and losing out on 3 years of paychecks + going in the hole 100k is a huge deal. People who act like it isn't important from a financial stand point probably have little understanding of compound interest. The point of working or a career is to work to make money so you don't have to. Decisions on the front end of your life / career can disproportionately affect where you end up. Good luck owning assets when you have a mortgagesque size mortgage at 29 making 50k with no assets.

This thread is a flame.


You presuppose that they weren't earning money for the three years out of undergrad. What if one of your good ibanker buddies decided to go to law school at 26? Did the 100k+ a year/corresponding savings they made before doing so just evaporate?

Your observation about losing 3 years of paychecks and going into big debt is applicable to both parties. If anything it highlights that law school in general is probably not worth it for most people at any age, which isn't exactly news around here.

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typ3
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby typ3 » Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:48 am

DrStudMuffin wrote:
typ3 wrote:Well, no one ever said law students were financially literate.

Actually, not working for 3 years and losing out on 3 years of paychecks + going in the hole 100k is a huge deal. People who act like it isn't important from a financial stand point probably have little understanding of compound interest. The point of working or a career is to work to make money so you don't have to. Decisions on the front end of your life / career can disproportionately affect where you end up. Good luck owning assets when you have a mortgagesque size mortgage at 29 making 50k with no assets.

This thread is a flame.


You presuppose that they weren't earning money for the three years out of undergrad. What if one of your good ibanker buddies decided to go to law school at 26? Did the 100k+ a year/corresponding savings they made before doing so just evaporate?

Your observation about losing 3 years of paychecks and going into big debt is applicable to both parties. If anything it highlights that law school in general is probably not worth it for most people at any age, which isn't exactly news around here.


Even if they had savings from working for 3 years, they aren't getting paid full salary when in law school. It's a three year vacation. So you have stagnant earnings and you are pissing money down the drain.

FWIW at my law school T-30 during 1-L orientation they told us the highest earners and years before us 1.) owned a cupcake bakery, 2.) sold wedding veils online 3.) was a professional gambler and poker player. I like to think that I was smart enough to do all those things in grade school.

TLDR: Law school told us we were wasting our time at 1L orientation. It's too old to graduate from at any age.

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redsox
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby redsox » Tue Oct 08, 2013 11:52 am

typ3 wrote:People who act like it isn't important from a financial stand point probably have little understanding of compound interest.


What the hell does compound interest have to do with...anyone in their 20s in relation to where they end up? Why would anyone that age have any long-term savings in interest-bearing products? Please enlighten me.

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IAFG
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby IAFG » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:07 pm

NanaP wrote:
Bronx Bum wrote:If you get biglaw, I guess not.

If you DON'T get biglaw, yes, its too old.



Believe it or not, most people do not want to go to BIGLAW....

Lots of people don't want biglaw.

Some have the credentials for biglaw but find out they can't get the legal job they thought they could. Some got frozen out by govt hiring freezes and scrambled for any sort of work. Some sought good mentorship and found out that a stint in biglaw was the best/only wat to get the work they really want. Some don't have the credentials for biglaw OR the job of their dreams and end up working for $20k/yr for a small firm working biglaw hours.

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ManoftheHour
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby ManoftheHour » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:11 pm

Bronx Bum wrote:
Well, define "make money". I'm talking about enough to sustain yourself. $50k when your 29 is difficult to live on if you want to get married, maybe have a family soon, etc. And that's what a lot of people are thinking about at age 29. And that's graduating at 29--you have to take the bar, pass, be admitted.



Lmao...

In this economy you know how many people wish they made 50k at the age of 30? I know a decent amount of 30 year olds that don't even make that now. If you have a wife that pulls in 50k, it's not so bad. 50k is the average US median household annual salary if I'm not mistaken.


jbagelboy wrote:No

TCR

DrStudMuffin wrote:I'll clarify by saying that being in big debt while making 50k sucks no matter what age you are.

This.
Last edited by ManoftheHour on Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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typ3
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby typ3 » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:15 pm

redsox wrote:
typ3 wrote:People who act like it isn't important from a financial stand point probably have little understanding of compound interest.


What the hell does compound interest have to do with...anyone in their 20s in relation to where they end up? Why would anyone that age have any long-term savings in interest-bearing products? Please enlighten me.


I made more than 50k on TSLA and FB alone in the last 12 months with little starting capital and I've already rolled my profits into an equity position in a private company with strong growth and placed a down payment on a house that was undervalued considerably and the housing market / growth in the area has exploded (located in the Midwest) / and it had an unfinished basement that I'm finishing for the equity.

Like I said, compound interest / constantly rolling and using your capital. Compared to my classmates, they are in the hole with 0 return I went to school for undergrad and law for free at medium ranked publics and treat it as a complete 3 year flame because of its focus on the arcane and inane. I am working outside of law in a relatively semi-skilled blue collar industry because it is 1. recession proof 2. solid pay because 3. Americans have forgotten how to use tools so there is a premium on what is charged.

This is the same reason why law students are unemployed but the people who failed out of their high school end up owning a house and being in the green because they realized that what you learn in school is 90% bullshit and no one will pay for it so they became a plumber cleaning up other people's shit. Read the clique theory on JD Underground it has a good explanation of this.

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typ3
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby typ3 » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:16 pm

ManoftheHour wrote:
Bronx Bum wrote:
Well, define "make money". I'm talking about enough to sustain yourself. $50k when your 29 is difficult to live on if you want to get married, maybe have a family soon, etc. And that's what a lot of people are thinking about at age 29. And that's graduating at 29--you have to take the bar, pass, be admitted.



Lmao...

In this economy you know how many people wish they made 50k at the age of 30? I know a decent amount of 30 year olds that don't even make that now. If you have a wife that pulls in 50k, it's not so bad. 50k is the average US median household annual salary if I'm not mistaken.


jbagelboy wrote:No

TCR

DrStudMuffin wrote:I'll clarify by saying that being in big debt while making 50k sucks no matter what age you are.

This.


In my state they are paying 55k+ starting in one of the lowest COL states for people to be electricians etc and can't find anyone. There are not enough people to keep up with the boom in people...

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Holly Golightly
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby Holly Golightly » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:18 pm

Nope, no interest In trying to make myself read that.

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redsox
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby redsox » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:24 pm

typ3 wrote:I made more than 50k on TSLA and FB alone in the last 12 months with little starting capital and I've already rolled my profits into an equity position in a private company with strong growth and placed a down payment on a house that was undervalued considerably and the housing market / growth in the area has exploded (located in the Midwest) / and it had an unfinished basement that I'm finishing for the equity.

Like I said, compound interest / constantly rolling and using your capital.


1) This isn't interest, it's capital gains.
2) Buying individual stocks in operating companies is moronic, unless you know something about them that the market doesn't. Which you don't.

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DrStudMuffin
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby DrStudMuffin » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:28 pm

redsox wrote:
typ3 wrote:I made more than 50k on TSLA and FB alone in the last 12 months with little starting capital and I've already rolled my profits into an equity position in a private company with strong growth and placed a down payment on a house that was undervalued considerably and the housing market / growth in the area has exploded (located in the Midwest) / and it had an unfinished basement that I'm finishing for the equity.

Like I said, compound interest / constantly rolling and using your capital.


1) This isn't interest, it's capital gains.
2) Buying individual stocks in operating companies is moronic, unless you know something about them that the market doesn't. Which you don't.


Look at this guy touting his Tesla and Facebook investments as though he's some sort of shark. Congrats on winning the stock market lottery dude. And believe it or not, some people go to law school with the intention of actually being a lawyer.

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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby ManoftheHour » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:34 pm

typ3 wrote:In my state they are paying 55k+ starting in one of the lowest COL states for people to be electricians etc and can't find anyone. There are not enough people to keep up with the boom in people...


I've said it many times on this forum. If all one wants to do is make money, there are plenty of other ways to do it. Moving away from the coasts is definitely one way. I heard there are jobs in North Dakota that pay pretty decently. Add in cheap COL and you're set.

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northwood
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby northwood » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:38 pm

ManoftheHour wrote:
typ3 wrote:In my state they are paying 55k+ starting in one of the lowest COL states for people to be electricians etc and can't find anyone. There are not enough people to keep up with the boom in people...


I've said it many times on this forum. If all one wants to do is make money, there are plenty of other ways to do it. Moving away from the coasts is definitely one way. I heard there are jobs in North Dakota that pay pretty decently. Add in cheap COL and you're set.



as long as you are okay with being in North Dakota

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ManoftheHour
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby ManoftheHour » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:40 pm

northwood wrote:
ManoftheHour wrote:
typ3 wrote:In my state they are paying 55k+ starting in one of the lowest COL states for people to be electricians etc and can't find anyone. There are not enough people to keep up with the boom in people...


I've said it many times on this forum. If all one wants to do is make money, there are plenty of other ways to do it. Moving away from the coasts is definitely one way. I heard there are jobs in North Dakota that pay pretty decently. Add in cheap COL and you're set.



as long as you are okay with being in North Dakota


Most def. I'm from CA and I never want to leave so that's definitely not an option. Money is pretty damn important, but it's not everything. I'd rather live the apartment life here in SoCal than own a big house in South Bend, Indiana. I looked. You can buy a 4 bedroom 3 bathroom for less than 80k.

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ManoftheHour
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby ManoftheHour » Tue Oct 08, 2013 12:50 pm

typ3 wrote:
Bronx Bum wrote:If you get biglaw, I guess not.

If you DON'T get biglaw, yes, its too old.

TITCR

Graduating at 29 for 50k is garbage. It's only worth it if you get 100k+ big law.

I know 19 year old web developers who make more in small markets and plenty of ibanking / finance friends who made 100k+ at 22. Not even making 6 figs at 29 with debt is a life fail and a huge hole that will set you behind peers for years.


A bit dramatic much. Life fail? Uh, no. Who cares about what your peers make. I know a guy pulling in six figures (he's two years older than me, single and divorced, works 60+ hours a week) and I would not trade my life (living by the beach with my fiancee, getting to hang out with my friends after my 9-5 everyday) for his. And he's balding while I have a full head of beautiful hair. :D More money does not equal more happiness.

Financial fail? Way more defensible. I agree with you that law school is a fail for anyone financially if they don't get big law (even assuming they went to school for free). 3 years of no income is along time.

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Bronx Bum
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby Bronx Bum » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:03 pm

Man, no one is arguing that. A ton of people in this thread said that getting biglaw at age 29 would be fine.

But if someone goes to law school at age 29 and ends up in shitlaw, that's pretty bad. It's pretty bad to be in debt, or even without debt for that matter, making $50k in NYC/probably $30k in another area. It sucks at 25 too.

A lot of olds in this thread shouting "well anyone who feels that way must be K-JD!!!" seem like they're still early in their career/still waiting bar admission.

And LOL if you want to talk about career trajectory and don't believe that late 20's are extremely important.

But law school is a terrible idea regardless--at age 23, 25, 29, 40.

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typ3
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby typ3 » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:24 pm

redsox wrote:
typ3 wrote:I made more than 50k on TSLA and FB alone in the last 12 months with little starting capital and I've already rolled my profits into an equity position in a private company with strong growth and placed a down payment on a house that was undervalued considerably and the housing market / growth in the area has exploded (located in the Midwest) / and it had an unfinished basement that I'm finishing for the equity.

Like I said, compound interest / constantly rolling and using your capital.


1) This isn't interest, it's capital gains.
2) Buying individual stocks in operating companies is moronic, unless you know something about them that the market doesn't. Which you don't.


You don't need to know more about them than the market. The market / banks / funds etc. all rely on analysts for information / predictions about companies. Most of the market is imperfect and is irrational and mostly takes short positions. I am long in all my positions. You only need to be faster to the right conclusion than 51% of people to make a return in the market.

I invest on the side and spend most of my time nightly analyzing public / private eq companies with a group of friends who are all analysts/associates in hedges/AAM's (5-20b AUM funds).

Capital gains = compound interest. The idea of compound interest is that you put your capital to use and as you make gains on your capital you use it to acquire things that give you more returns. I don't know how this could be confusing.

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banjo
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby banjo » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:30 pm

The point is that people who are screwed at 25 have a few cushion years to rebuild their careers. At 30 most of the dateable women (and men) you meet will expect you to have your life together.

I'm a little older than average, btw.

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fundamentallybroken
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby fundamentallybroken » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:37 pm

I like what this thread has become:

- Non-laws who still visit law school forums to complain about what a bad idea law school is
- Young people pretending to know what constitute good career/life choices, livable salaries, etc.

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Bronx Bum
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Re: Is graduating at 29 to old?

Postby Bronx Bum » Tue Oct 08, 2013 1:37 pm

banjo wrote:The point is that people who are screwed at 25 have a few cushion years to rebuild their careers. At 30 most of the dateable women (and men) you meet will expect you to have your life together.

I'm a little older than average, btw.


tcr




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