Will Lawyers' Employment Prospects Ever Pick Up?

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Stinson
Posts: 257
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:01 am

Re: Will Lawyers' Employment Prospects Ever Pick Up?

Postby Stinson » Sat Jul 06, 2013 1:41 pm

Desert Fox wrote:Law firm hiring isn't really THAT much different than it was during boom times. Only now the shitty market of the market hits students who go to elite schools so the WSJ gives a shit enough to write about it.

Shitlaw wasn't born in 2008. Everyone other than top students at T1 schools, have always had dogshit returns on investments for law.

There are way too many law grads for the number of jobs the economy has. It's been that way for a very long time, and untill law schools close en masse, it'll stay that way.


I think this is key. The private market hasn't changed tremendously if you view a period of a few years right before the crash as a bubble-fed illusion, rather than "normal." We have way, way, way, way too many schools, most of which cost way too much. That's it. Case closed. We can talk about jobs, or we can talk about the fact that we have a ludicrously large number of law graduates that no conceivable legal market could absorb. Even 2007-8 level hiring would leave debt-ridden misery at dozens of schools, but it would be gangbusters at the T20 again, which is all NYT/WSJ would notice.

People are right about government hiring though. I don't see that going anywhere soon. A long period of Democratic government - House and Senate, not just Hillary - might move the meter, but many local governments will be strapped for a long time regardless and that's going to kill opportunities for things like state/local prosecuting/government positions that have, in the past, given opportunities to people with demonstrated interest and experience rather than prestige and grades.

09042014
Posts: 18282
Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 10:47 pm

Re: Will Lawyers' Employment Prospects Ever Pick Up?

Postby 09042014 » Sat Jul 06, 2013 1:53 pm

Stinson wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:Law firm hiring isn't really THAT much different than it was during boom times. Only now the shitty market of the market hits students who go to elite schools so the WSJ gives a shit enough to write about it.

Shitlaw wasn't born in 2008. Everyone other than top students at T1 schools, have always had dogshit returns on investments for law.

There are way too many law grads for the number of jobs the economy has. It's been that way for a very long time, and untill law schools close en masse, it'll stay that way.


I think this is key. The private market hasn't changed tremendously if you view a period of a few years right before the crash as a bubble-fed illusion, rather than "normal." We have way, way, way, way too many schools, most of which cost way too much. That's it. Case closed. We can talk about jobs, or we can talk about the fact that we have a ludicrously large number of law graduates that no conceivable legal market could absorb. Even 2007-8 level hiring would leave debt-ridden misery at dozens of schools, but it would be gangbusters at the T20 again, which is all NYT/WSJ would notice.

People are right about government hiring though. I don't see that going anywhere soon. A long period of Democratic government - House and Senate, not just Hillary - might move the meter, but many local governments will be strapped for a long time regardless and that's going to kill opportunities for things like state/local prosecuting/government positions that have, in the past, given opportunities to people with demonstrated interest and experience rather than prestige and grades.


I think gov might bounce back with a Republican president oddly enough. They don't really give a fuck about spending.

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stillwater
Posts: 3811
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2011 2:59 pm

Re: Will Lawyers' Employment Prospects Ever Pick Up?

Postby stillwater » Sat Jul 06, 2013 1:57 pm

Desert Fox wrote:
Stinson wrote:
Desert Fox wrote:Law firm hiring isn't really THAT much different than it was during boom times. Only now the shitty market of the market hits students who go to elite schools so the WSJ gives a shit enough to write about it.

Shitlaw wasn't born in 2008. Everyone other than top students at T1 schools, have always had dogshit returns on investments for law.

There are way too many law grads for the number of jobs the economy has. It's been that way for a very long time, and untill law schools close en masse, it'll stay that way.


I think this is key. The private market hasn't changed tremendously if you view a period of a few years right before the crash as a bubble-fed illusion, rather than "normal." We have way, way, way, way too many schools, most of which cost way too much. That's it. Case closed. We can talk about jobs, or we can talk about the fact that we have a ludicrously large number of law graduates that no conceivable legal market could absorb. Even 2007-8 level hiring would leave debt-ridden misery at dozens of schools, but it would be gangbusters at the T20 again, which is all NYT/WSJ would notice.

People are right about government hiring though. I don't see that going anywhere soon. A long period of Democratic government - House and Senate, not just Hillary - might move the meter, but many local governments will be strapped for a long time regardless and that's going to kill opportunities for things like state/local prosecuting/government positions that have, in the past, given opportunities to people with demonstrated interest and experience rather than prestige and grades.


I think gov might bounce back with a Republican president oddly enough. They don't really give a fuck about spending.


dat deficit spending.

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scifiguy
Posts: 575
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2012 2:41 pm

Re: Will Lawyers' Employment Prospects Ever Pick Up?

Postby scifiguy » Mon Jul 08, 2013 5:17 am

Not necessarily representative of the whole biglaw community, but ATL had this piece recently:
http://abovethelaw.com/2013/07/nationwi ... t-layoffs/
Nationwide Layoff Watch

There are separate stories for WilmerHale and WeilGotshal.




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