Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

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jwinaz
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Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby jwinaz » Thu May 09, 2013 12:11 am

I'm officially out of UG (although I was a non-traditional student to begin with) and am working full-time, while attending post-bac classes part-time (for a variety of non-degree purposes).

How much rust do you guys think that being out of school and doing heavy reading (don't do that on my job, which is more computer-based) and essay writing (don't do that at all...my only writing consists of short business memos and creative writing I do for fun) accumulates on those skills that are important for law school?

Would a person be able to round back into form simply within the time frame of the first semester? Or, do you think that a full semester or more of classes prior to law school would be needed to get a person back into the grind and feel of things.

I took my first class this past semester that required a paper and found that it took me 13.5 hours to write a 10 page paper. I felt very rusty.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu May 09, 2013 12:29 am

jwinaz wrote:I'm officially out of UG (although I was a non-traditional student to begin with) and am working full-time, while attending post-bac classes part-time (for a variety of non-degree purposes).

How much rust do you guys think that being out of school and doing heavy reading (don't do that on my job, which is more computer-based) and essay writing (don't do that at all...my only writing consists of short business memos and creative writing I do for fun) accumulates on those skills that are important for law school?

Would a person be able to round back into form simply within the time frame of the first semester? Or, do you think that a full semester or more of classes prior to law school would be needed to get a person back into the grind and feel of things.

I took my first class this past semester that required a paper and found that it took me 13.5 hours to write a 10 page paper. I felt very rusty.

13.5 hours to write a 10 page paper is NOT a lot of time.

NoWorries
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby NoWorries » Thu May 09, 2013 1:45 am

13.5 hours for a 10 pager is amazing timing. Even if you were just ranting that's fine.

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jrsbaseball5
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby jrsbaseball5 » Thu May 09, 2013 2:56 am

NoWorries wrote:13.5 hours for a 10 pager is amazing timing. Even if you were just ranting that's fine.


I think it would depend on the type of paper don't you? If it is a research paper or something along those lines I think its great timing. Something with more fluff it seems a bit long to me. Maybe I'm crazy though.

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ManOfTheMinute
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby ManOfTheMinute » Thu May 09, 2013 3:44 am

NoWorries wrote:13.5 hours for a 10 pager is amazing timing. Even if you were just ranting that's fine.


Thats some pretty specific timing... shit

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Dr. Dre
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby Dr. Dre » Thu May 09, 2013 4:03 am

ManOfTheMinute wrote:
NoWorries wrote:13.5 hours for a 10 pager is amazing timing. Even if you were just ranting that's fine.


Thats some pretty specific timing... shit

jwinaz
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby jwinaz » Thu May 09, 2013 11:37 am

It was a research paper that I had a brief outline for already (so that helps), but I forgot to mention that it was double-spaced.

So, 5-pages single-spaced. ...Now, how do you guys rate my speed? :)

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Thu May 09, 2013 12:09 pm

jwinaz wrote:It was a research paper that I had a brief outline for already (so that helps), but I forgot to mention that it was double-spaced.

So, 5-pages single-spaced. ...Now, how do you guys rate my speed? :)

Still fast. In fact, I'd say you should probably spend *more* time on a double-spaced 10 pp research paper if you want it to be any good, but I'm a former teacher so I'm cranky about stuff like that. (But then, I'd include the time spent researching and writing that outline - it's not just about how long it takes you to physically put words on the page, how long does it take you to get to the point where you have words to begin with?)

eric922
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby eric922 » Thu May 09, 2013 1:44 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:
jwinaz wrote:It was a research paper that I had a brief outline for already (so that helps), but I forgot to mention that it was double-spaced.

So, 5-pages single-spaced. ...Now, how do you guys rate my speed? :)

Still fast. In fact, I'd say you should probably spend *more* time on a double-spaced 10 pp research paper if you want it to be any good, but I'm a former teacher so I'm cranky about stuff like that. (But then, I'd include the time spent researching and writing that outline - it's not just about how long it takes you to physically put words on the page, how long does it take you to get to the point where you have words to begin with?)

This is really important. I'm a journalism student and it has made me a very fast writer. Once I get all my research done, I can knock out about four pages an hour if I push myself. It's the research and self-editing that the OP may need to put some more time into. That's always the hardest part for me anyway.

Lumieres
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby Lumieres » Thu May 09, 2013 2:26 pm

I don't think anyone has responded to OP's actual question...

I'll be starting in the fall, with 5 years since graduating college. Not sure how I'll do yet but one thing I do know is that I'll be trying harder and taking classes more seriously.

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Tiago Splitter
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby Tiago Splitter » Thu May 09, 2013 2:37 pm

Lumieres wrote:I don't think anyone has responded to OP's actual question...

I'll be starting in the fall, with 5 years since graduating college. Not sure how I'll do yet but one thing I do know is that I'll be trying harder and taking classes more seriously.

You'll be fine.

SFSpartan
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby SFSpartan » Thu May 09, 2013 2:39 pm

My UG was pretty heavy on research, and I wrote pretty fast as compared to my friends. It took me about an hour and a half of research and one hour of writing for each page of text in my paper. That comes out to 25 hours for a 10 page paper. 13.5 hours is by no means slow, though at that speed I'd be more worried about the quality of my research than anything else.

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JamMasterJ
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby JamMasterJ » Thu May 09, 2013 2:51 pm

any rust is more than made up for by the fact that people a few years out tend to be better at staying on track and getting shit done before finals crunch than younger students.

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oldhippie
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby oldhippie » Thu May 09, 2013 3:19 pm

JamMasterJ wrote:any rust is more than made up for by the fact that people a few years out tend to be better at staying on track and getting shit done before finals crunch than younger students.



truth. i was 12+ years out of school and came back for law school. doing darned well if i do say so myself. time management is KEY, so if you've learned how to get shit done without wasting too much time on facebook and places like TLS ( :oops: ) or having extended social hours with friends in the middle of the day, you will be in better shape than a lot of your classmates. and i still manage to be done with schoolwork by 6 or 7 every night and then do whatever i want to recharge for the next workday...

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TheBiggerMediocre
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby TheBiggerMediocre » Thu May 09, 2013 7:18 pm

I suck at time management and so do some friends I have in decent law schools you should be fine. Usually people don't change. They just adapt as I am sure you will too.

jwinaz
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby jwinaz » Fri May 17, 2013 5:22 pm

eric922 wrote:
A. Nony Mouse wrote:
jwinaz wrote:It was a research paper that I had a brief outline for already (so that helps), but I forgot to mention that it was double-spaced.

So, 5-pages single-spaced. ...Now, how do you guys rate my speed? :)

Still fast. In fact, I'd say you should probably spend *more* time on a double-spaced 10 pp research paper if you want it to be any good, but I'm a former teacher so I'm cranky about stuff like that. (But then, I'd include the time spent researching and writing that outline - it's not just about how long it takes you to physically put words on the page, how long does it take you to get to the point where you have words to begin with?)

This is really important. I'm a journalism student and it has made me a very fast writer. Once I get all my research done, I can knock out about four pages an hour if I push myself. It's the research and self-editing that the OP may need to put some more time into. That's always the hardest part for me anyway.


That's the part I didn't time.

My outline was the result of my research, which took several months (maybe a few hours a week looking stuff up, reading, and thinking about it).

But once my outline was produced, I had to put it into research paper format. Here's the thing that makes this maybe a tough question. It's the level of detail and organization of the line.

I've known some people whose version of an outline is practically the entire paper written out, but simply done in bulleted outlined form. That's how they think of outlines. And I can see the usefulness of that. But I don't go that far. I think it feels slightly redundant to me, b/c I figure I'll eventually have to write the paper anyways, so why go so much into detail. That's not to say the very detailed type of outlines don't require some translation and styling work when it comes to putting into paper form (they still have to make sure it flows well with transitional sentences and reword things here and there) - just less of it.

My outline was sort of rough outline of what I thought should be in the paper. I had it orgnizd by section and threw in bullet points for each section. So when it came time to write the paper, I still needed to write in a paper that had proper grammar and diction and also add extra sentences to flesh out the outline points. That process took me close to 13.5 hours (I timed it, because I was at my desk doing it in one sitting, while taknig a break here and there for food and to check ESPN).

The main difference here would be that law school exams in the first year don't seem to require research. And considering you won't know what will be on a law exam, whereas I had an outline to work with and "sort of" knew what I wanted to say (in terms of argument that is...not necessarily the exact wording), I wondered if my speed was too slow. Most of the "work" of writing my paper (once the research/outline was complete) was thinking of how to word it (with a few rare moments of analysis).

Not sure if that changes anyone's assessment.

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laxbrah420
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby laxbrah420 » Fri May 17, 2013 5:40 pm

My multivariate analysis of this question has concluded the following about page per min velocities measured the summer before 1L year*
*based on a minimum of 7 pages

≤60 mins/pg: σ = -.6
60-74 mins/pg: σ = +.2
≥75min/pg: σ = -.3

What these stats indicate is that almost everyone writes between 60 and 74 mins per page. Your 81 mins/pg is concerning. Also, there is a strange donut effect here, perhaps indicating that those who write at a hugely frantic pace are worse off than the tortoises.

Good luck.

gregfootball2001
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby gregfootball2001 » Sat May 18, 2013 3:10 pm

I was 10 years out of UG during 1L. I did fine. Just study. A lot.

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Dr. Dre
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby Dr. Dre » Sat May 18, 2013 5:48 pm

"Studying a lot" is ambiguous as fuck. Be more specific.

gregfootball2001
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby gregfootball2001 » Sat May 18, 2013 6:56 pm

Dr. Dre wrote:"Studying a lot" is ambiguous as fuck. Be more specific.

Gosh, I'm so sorry. Study enough so that you understand the material better than your fellow students. Was that more helpful?

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Dr. Dre
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby Dr. Dre » Sat May 18, 2013 6:58 pm

not good enough.

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tony2167
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby tony2167 » Tue May 21, 2013 10:07 am

13.5 hours for a ten pager does seem a little long. I can remember routinely cranking out ten page papers in 6 or 7 hours on Saturday afternoons during undergrad.

bananapeanutbutter
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Re: Will 3 Years Out of UG Mean Being Rusty at School?

Postby bananapeanutbutter » Tue May 21, 2013 10:43 am

The more years out the better if you weren't a 4.0. Real life begets a real schedule, and real discipline. For me, undergrad was only about trying to get drunk and laid. At 22, I'm positive I would be very bottom of the curve at any respectable school.




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