T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

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red52
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T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby red52 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:40 pm

I've been getting my acceptance letters and I'm beginning to wonder is a Tier 1 school worth it without money? Or should I go to a T2 school that has given me money? All other factors remaining constant (IE: location, etc not being a factor).

I really love the prestige of some of the T1's, but at the same time I feel like I'd be in a good position with relatively low debt.

law2015
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby law2015 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:43 pm

Nobody can give you any advice without more specifics, especially the particular schools that you have been accepted to and also the amount of scholarship money.

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bluepenguin
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby bluepenguin » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:44 pm

Obviously depends on the particular schools in question, your ties/regional preferences, etc. Tiers are general groupings, but when picking a school to actually attend you have to ignore tiering and look at the schools individually on their own merits.

Lord Randolph McDuff
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:49 pm

red52 wrote:I've been getting my acceptance letters and I'm beginning to wonder is a Tier 1 school worth it without money? Or should I go to a T2 school that has given me money? All other factors remaining constant (IE: location, etc not being a factor).

I really love the prestige of some of the T1's, but at the same time I feel like I'd be in a good position with relatively low debt.


You are prototypical TLS dooder for me. Listen, T1 schools are not "prestigious." Most schools enjoy a certain level of "prestige," meaning the look of approval on other peoples faces when they learn where you go to school, in the immediate surrounding area of the school. Tech is a TTT, but people in Lubbock and W. Texas will think your smart and successful for going to law school there, thus it is "prestigious." KU is TT, but people in Kansas will likewise look fondly on the school = prestigious. I go to a T1, but it is only "prestigious" in the area where the school is located, just like the other examples. Assuming a T1 is prestigious is a somewhat logical but faulty assumption that one gets from TLS or USNEWS. If I wanted to work in Lubbock, no one would give a fuck I went to "insert random T1."


TLDR prestige is a function of community.

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red52
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby red52 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:53 pm

Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:
red52 wrote:I've been getting my acceptance letters and I'm beginning to wonder is a Tier 1 school worth it without money? Or should I go to a T2 school that has given me money? All other factors remaining constant (IE: location, etc not being a factor).

I really love the prestige of some of the T1's, but at the same time I feel like I'd be in a good position with relatively low debt.


You are prototypical TLS dooder for me. Listen, T1 schools are not "prestigious." Most schools enjoy a certain level of "prestige," meaning the look of approval on other peoples faces when they learn where you go to school, in the immediate surrounding area of the school. Tech is a TTT, but people in Lubbock and W. Texas will think your smart and successful for going to law school there, thus it is "prestigious." KU is TT, but people in Kansas will likewise look fondly on the school = prestigious. I go to a T1, but it is only "prestigious" in the area where the school is located, just like the other examples. Assuming a T1 is prestigious is a somewhat logical but faulty assumption that one gets from TLS or USNEWS. If I wanted to work in Lubbock, no one would give a fuck I went to "insert random T1."


TLDR prestige is a function of community.



Ok, for example going to Rutgers-Newark with 1/2 tuition vs going to Wisconsin at sticker... just as one example.

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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby francesfarmer » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:57 pm

red52 wrote:
Ok, for example going to Rutgers-Newark with 1/2 tuition vs going to Wisconsin at sticker... just as one example.

Don't pay any money to go to Rutgers-Newark.

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cinephile
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby cinephile » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:59 pm

red52 wrote:
Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:
red52 wrote:I've been getting my acceptance letters and I'm beginning to wonder is a Tier 1 school worth it without money? Or should I go to a T2 school that has given me money? All other factors remaining constant (IE: location, etc not being a factor).

I really love the prestige of some of the T1's, but at the same time I feel like I'd be in a good position with relatively low debt.


You are prototypical TLS dooder for me. Listen, T1 schools are not "prestigious." Most schools enjoy a certain level of "prestige," meaning the look of approval on other peoples faces when they learn where you go to school, in the immediate surrounding area of the school. Tech is a TTT, but people in Lubbock and W. Texas will think your smart and successful for going to law school there, thus it is "prestigious." KU is TT, but people in Kansas will likewise look fondly on the school = prestigious. I go to a T1, but it is only "prestigious" in the area where the school is located, just like the other examples. Assuming a T1 is prestigious is a somewhat logical but faulty assumption that one gets from TLS or USNEWS. If I wanted to work in Lubbock, no one would give a fuck I went to "insert random T1."


TLDR prestige is a function of community.



Ok, for example going to Rutgers-Newark with 1/2 tuition vs going to Wisconsin at sticker... just as one example.


That's absolutely crazy. Either you want to work in NJ or WI. You shouldn't be considering both.

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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby dingbat » Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:59 pm

francesfarmer wrote:
red52 wrote:
Ok, for example going to Rutgers-Newark with 1/2 tuition vs going to Wisconsin at sticker... just as one example.

Don't pay any money to go to Rutgers-Newark.

But if you want to practice in Jersey, it's better than Wisconsin

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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby francesfarmer » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:02 pm

dingbat wrote:
francesfarmer wrote:
red52 wrote:
Ok, for example going to Rutgers-Newark with 1/2 tuition vs going to Wisconsin at sticker... just as one example.

Don't pay any money to go to Rutgers-Newark.

But if you want to practice in Jersey, it's better than Wisconsin

Well it depends what is more important to OP--staying in NJ, or practicing law at all.

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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:03 pm

wait out Wisco for money. double deposit.

Wisco is not prestigious outside of the state, but at least no one makes fun of it. Rutger's rep has taken a hit over the last decade or so.

where do you want to work?

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red52
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby red52 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:04 pm

cinephile wrote:That's absolutely crazy. Either you want to work in NJ or WI. You shouldn't be considering both.



Why not? I applied to schools in areas/states I wouldn't mind living in.


francesfarmer wrote:
dingbat wrote:
francesfarmer wrote:
red52 wrote:
Ok, for example going to Rutgers-Newark with 1/2 tuition vs going to Wisconsin at sticker... just as one example.

Don't pay any money to go to Rutgers-Newark.

But if you want to practice in Jersey, it's better than Wisconsin

Well it depends what is more important to OP--staying in NJ, or practicing law at all.



Ok, point well taken. Thanks for being honest.

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red52
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby red52 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:07 pm

Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:wait out Wisco for money. double deposit.

Wisco is not prestigious outside of the state, but at least no one makes fun of it. Rutger's rep has taken a hit over the last decade or so.

where do you want to work?



What do you mean by double deposit? And as far as waiting them out for money, do you mean like requesting money and seeing if they give it to you to go? Sorry I sound stupid, but I just want to make sure I do it right.



As far as working, I love big cities as I'm a city kid. U Wisconsin has decent job placement in Chi., I've applied schools in TX (been accepted into Baylor), schools in NY, as well as schools in CA (LA area), and Florida State (love tally/orlando). Where I work/live specifically doesn't really matter to me, I have no attachment to any area specifically.

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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:09 pm

Wait out Wisco for money. Think up a decent story about why you want to live and work in Wisconsin. Don't listen to people here who say that going to Wisco is not a sufficient "tie" to the state of Wisconsin. Profit/earn at least some money.

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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:10 pm

red52 wrote:
Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:wait out Wisco for money. double deposit.

Wisco is not prestigious outside of the state, but at least no one makes fun of it. Rutger's rep has taken a hit over the last decade or so.

where do you want to work?



What do you mean by double deposit? And as far as waiting them out for money, do you mean like requesting money and seeing if they give it to you to go? Sorry I sound stupid, but I just want to make sure I do it right.



As far as working, I love big cities as I'm a city kid. U Wisconsin has decent job placement in Chi., I've applied schools in TX (been accepted into Baylor), schools in NY, as well as schools in CA (LA area), and Florida State (love tally/orlando). Where I work/live specifically doesn't really matter to me, I have no attachment to any area specifically.

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red52
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby red52 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:11 pm

Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:
red52 wrote:
Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:wait out Wisco for money. double deposit.

Wisco is not prestigious outside of the state, but at least no one makes fun of it. Rutger's rep has taken a hit over the last decade or so.

where do you want to work?



What do you mean by double deposit? And as far as waiting them out for money, do you mean like requesting money and seeing if they give it to you to go? Sorry I sound stupid, but I just want to make sure I do it right.



As far as working, I love big cities as I'm a city kid. U Wisconsin has decent job placement in Chi., I've applied schools in TX (been accepted into Baylor), schools in NY, as well as schools in CA (LA area), and Florida State (love tally/orlando). Where I work/live specifically doesn't really matter to me, I have no attachment to any area specifically.



I don't understand what you just did there... or why you did it.. please elaborate..

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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:13 pm

red52 wrote:
Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:
red52 wrote:
Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:wait out Wisco for money. double deposit.

Wisco is not prestigious outside of the state, but at least no one makes fun of it. Rutger's rep has taken a hit over the last decade or so.

where do you want to work?



What do you mean by double deposit? And as far as waiting them out for money, do you mean like requesting money and seeing if they give it to you to go? Sorry I sound stupid, but I just want to make sure I do it right.



As far as working, I love big cities as I'm a city kid. U Wisconsin has decent job placement in Chi., I've applied schools in TX (been accepted into Baylor), schools in NY, as well as schools in CA (LA area), and Florida State (love tally/orlando). Where I work/live specifically doesn't really matter to me, I have no attachment to any area specifically.



I don't understand what you just did there... or why you did it.. please elaborate..


I like you.

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red52
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby red52 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:14 pm

Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:
I like you.


sorry im just trying to get clarification... this is a big decision and i know some of you guys know a LOT about this process so I'd really like a straight answer :(

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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby Lord Randolph McDuff » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:15 pm

red52 wrote:
Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:
red52 wrote:
Lord Randolph McDuff wrote:wait out Wisco for money. double deposit.

Wisco is not prestigious outside of the state, but at least no one makes fun of it. Rutger's rep has taken a hit over the last decade or so.

where do you want to work?



What do you mean by double deposit? And as far as waiting them out for money, do you mean like requesting money and seeing if they give it to you to go? Sorry I sound stupid, but I just want to make sure I do it right.



As far as working, I love big cities as I'm a city kid. U Wisconsin has decent job placement in Chi., I've applied schools in TX (been accepted into Baylor), schools in NY, as well as schools in CA (LA area), and Florida State (love tally/orlando). Where I work/live specifically doesn't really matter to me, I have no attachment to any area specifically.



I don't understand what you just did there... or why you did it.. please elaborate..


Because Wisco does not have "decent" placement outside of Wisconsin. You can get a job in Chicago because they have a good alumni base there, but unless your definition of decent is less than 20% chance I'm going to stand by that strike.

I struck Baylor cuz I don't like Waco, TX. Also even if you get a full-ride they have really bad stips ( or at least they used to ).

I struck Tally because Tally sucks. I thought everyone knew this. It is only marginally better than Gainesville. Also the legal economy in Fl may actually be the worst in the country. I have a family member there who is high up in the gov and cannot get me job. No new hires.
Last edited by Lord Randolph McDuff on Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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dingbat
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby dingbat » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:17 pm

red52 wrote:I don't understand what you just did there... or why you did it.. please elaborate..

Saying that Wisconsin doesn't place in chicago, that Baylor sucks and that there are no jobs in Tallahassee

Rutgers has mainly taken a pounding recently not because the school's reputation has dropped, but because employment stats have - there are very few jobs in NJ. NJ law firms get to choose from Jersey kids going to T14s and coming back home or who struck out of NYC or Philly, in addition to state clerks.

Unlike most states, Jersey has a robust state clerkship, and a lot of NJ biglawmidlaw hire state clerks rather than law school grads. This means that state clerkship is a better route than most states, but when looking at employment statistics state clerkships are usually discounted as a bad outcome, making Rutgers appear worse than it is (which, to be fair, isn't good)

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red52
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby red52 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:22 pm

dingbat wrote:
red52 wrote:I don't understand what you just did there... or why you did it.. please elaborate..

Saying that Wisconsin doesn't place in chicago, that Baylor sucks and that there are no jobs in Tallahassee

Rutgers has mainly taken a pounding recently not because the school's reputation has dropped, but because employment stats have - there are very few jobs in NJ. NJ law firms get to choose from Jersey kids going to T14s and coming back home or who struck out of NYC or Philly, in addition to state clerks.

Unlike most states, Jersey has a robust state clerkship, and a lot of NJ biglawmidlaw hire state clerks rather than law school grads. This means that state clerkship is a better route than most states, but when looking at employment statistics state clerkships are usually discounted as a bad outcome, making Rutgers appear worse than it is (which, to be fair, isn't good)


Thanks guys. I appreciate the clarification.

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dingbat
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby dingbat » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:26 pm

red52 wrote:
dingbat wrote:
red52 wrote:I don't understand what you just did there... or why you did it.. please elaborate..

Saying that Wisconsin doesn't place in chicago, that Baylor sucks and that there are no jobs in Tallahassee

Rutgers has mainly taken a pounding recently not because the school's reputation has dropped, but because employment stats have - there are very few jobs in NJ. NJ law firms get to choose from Jersey kids going to T14s and coming back home or who struck out of NYC or Philly, in addition to state clerks.

Unlike most states, Jersey has a robust state clerkship, and a lot of NJ biglawmidlaw hire state clerks rather than law school grads. This means that state clerkship is a better route than most states, but when looking at employment statistics state clerkships are usually discounted as a bad outcome, making Rutgers appear worse than it is (which, to be fair, isn't good)

Please don't let this seem like an endorsement of Rutgers. I'm saying it's not as bad as it appears; that doesn't mean it's not bad
Thanks guys. I appreciate the clarification.

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red52
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby red52 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:35 pm

dingbat wrote:Please don't let this seem like an endorsement of Rutgers. I'm saying it's not as bad as it appears; that doesn't mean it's not bad




Haha yes, I understood. Thank you for the timely responses.

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dirtrida2
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby dirtrida2 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:37 pm

Out of interest, can you tell me exactly what Rutgers gave you?

Was it 12k? I assume, thanks.

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red52
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby red52 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 2:40 pm

dirtrida2 wrote:Out of interest, can you tell me exactly what Rutgers gave you?

Was it 12k? I assume, thanks.


12 or 15k i don't have the letter with me (parents house mailing address).

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twenty
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Re: T1 w/o money Or T2 with money?

Postby twenty » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:20 pm

The posts on this thread are confusing as frack.

Good ideas:

-T14/T14 with money.
-T1 in the region you want to practice in, and wouldn't mind practicing there for the rest of your life AND you get a full ride/almost full ride.
-A T2 that dominates your regional market (i.e, Arkansas or Hawaii). Same rules apply from T1.
-Not going to law school

Bad ideas:

Pretty much anything else.




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