Is it ever worth it to delay for several years law school?

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IAFG
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Re: Is it ever worth it to delay for several years law school?

Postby IAFG » Sat Jul 09, 2011 12:31 pm

Holly Golightly wrote:
bk1 wrote:
Holly Golightly wrote:I don't get K-JDs. I don't understand how anyone who has had no real life experiences whatsoever could possibly make that type of decision. I'm with Renzo.


I think I side with ToTransfer that if someone has worked their way through high school and/or college they have already gotten that life experience.

Eh, I also worked through both. Still needed actual experience on my own to make such a huge decision.

Plus, you need to stare the desperation of "real world work" in the face, or you will think you hate law, just just staring into the abyss of the working world.

Renzo
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Re: Is it ever worth it to delay for several years law school?

Postby Renzo » Sat Jul 09, 2011 6:15 pm

IAFG wrote:
Holly Golightly wrote:Eh, I also worked through both. Still needed actual experience on my own to make such a huge decision.

Plus, you need to stare the desperation of "real world work" in the face, or you will think you hate law, just just staring into the abyss of the working world.


This is crucial. A part time job in HS/college isn't the same as 2 years realizing the rest of your life is going to suck because most of it will be spent at work.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: Is it ever worth it to delay for several years law school?

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Sat Jul 09, 2011 7:27 pm

FWIW, when I say "work through UG," I mean full-time. I basically worked full-time in HS, too, but I know that's the exception (the whole illegality bit...). And I consider UG to be "on one's own," but I acknowledge people have vastly different experiences there.

I honestly think worldview/maturity is the deciding factor. There are plenty of very mature K-JDs (or K-UG 1-year off JDs). Different life experiences can gives people pretty clear perspective. I've also met plenty of people who took several years off and still went into LS with the blinders on/are incredibly immature/are going to be screwed.

You honestly think waiting tables etc. for 40/50/60 hours a week - in any circumstance - can give good insight into the real "working world"? If you're just taking some time off and doing those things to fill the gap, you know you are doing it just to fill the gap, and I'm not sure it gives much perspective. I run into this with TFA folks all the time. TFA is a great program, and teaching for two years in the inner-city will give anyone a new perspective on life. But if you know you're going to get out of teaching after the two years is up, for many people it's not really going to bring about more maturity etc., and may actually delay it (because you have essentially postponed your life for two years).

I agree that many more people should probably take time off between UG and LS (frankly, I think more people should take time off before starting UG,) but to say there isn't a significant number of people for whom K-JD makes sense is oversimplifying things.

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IAFG
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Re: Is it ever worth it to delay for several years law school?

Postby IAFG » Sat Jul 09, 2011 8:27 pm

ToTransferOrNot wrote:FWIW, when I say "work through UG," I mean full-time. I basically worked full-time in HS, too, but I know that's the exception (the whole illegality bit...). And I consider UG to be "on one's own," but I acknowledge people have vastly different experiences there.

I honestly think worldview/maturity is the deciding factor. There are plenty of very mature K-JDs (or K-UG 1-year off JDs). Different life experiences can gives people pretty clear perspective. I've also met plenty of people who took several years off and still went into LS with the blinders on/are incredibly immature/are going to be screwed.

You honestly think waiting tables etc. for 40/50/60 hours a week - in any circumstance - can give good insight into the real "working world"? If you're just taking some time off and doing those things to fill the gap, you know you are doing it just to fill the gap, and I'm not sure it gives much perspective. I run into this with TFA folks all the time. TFA is a great program, and teaching for two years in the inner-city will give anyone a new perspective on life. But if you know you're going to get out of teaching after the two years is up, for many people it's not really going to bring about more maturity etc., and may actually delay it (because you have essentially postponed your life for two years).

I agree that many more people should probably take time off between UG and LS (frankly, I think more people should take time off before starting UG,) but to say there isn't a significant number of people for whom K-JD makes sense is oversimplifying things.

I agree with you (especially the TFA part... hoo boy do I agree with you) but that doesn't mean that I agree that those people should go to LS anyway. Smacks of the "don't know what to do, oh okay law" thing. I think you should get a real, soul-crushing entry level job first, in an industry you find interesting.

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dailygrind
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Re: Is it ever worth it to delay for several years law school?

Postby dailygrind » Sat Jul 09, 2011 8:29 pm

IAFG wrote:I agree with you (especially the TFA part... hoo boy do I agree with you) but that doesn't mean that I agree that those people should go to LS anyway. Smacks of the "don't know what to do, oh okay law" thing. I think you should get a real, soul-crushing entry level job first, in an industry you find interesting.


When the economy was really deep in the shitter, that was really hard to do, especially if you were a splitter. Sometimes you just gotta put it all on black and let it ride.

ToTransferOrNot
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Re: Is it ever worth it to delay for several years law school?

Postby ToTransferOrNot » Sat Jul 09, 2011 8:49 pm

IAFG wrote:
ToTransferOrNot wrote:FWIW, when I say "work through UG," I mean full-time. I basically worked full-time in HS, too, but I know that's the exception (the whole illegality bit...). And I consider UG to be "on one's own," but I acknowledge people have vastly different experiences there.

I honestly think worldview/maturity is the deciding factor. There are plenty of very mature K-JDs (or K-UG 1-year off JDs). Different life experiences can gives people pretty clear perspective. I've also met plenty of people who took several years off and still went into LS with the blinders on/are incredibly immature/are going to be screwed.

You honestly think waiting tables etc. for 40/50/60 hours a week - in any circumstance - can give good insight into the real "working world"? If you're just taking some time off and doing those things to fill the gap, you know you are doing it just to fill the gap, and I'm not sure it gives much perspective. I run into this with TFA folks all the time. TFA is a great program, and teaching for two years in the inner-city will give anyone a new perspective on life. But if you know you're going to get out of teaching after the two years is up, for many people it's not really going to bring about more maturity etc., and may actually delay it (because you have essentially postponed your life for two years).

I agree that many more people should probably take time off between UG and LS (frankly, I think more people should take time off before starting UG,) but to say there isn't a significant number of people for whom K-JD makes sense is oversimplifying things.

I agree with you (especially the TFA part... hoo boy do I agree with you) but that doesn't mean that I agree that those people should go to LS anyway. Smacks of the "don't know what to do, oh okay law" thing. I think you should get a real, soul-crushing entry level job first, in an industry you find interesting.


I guess I don't have a huge problem with the "don't know what to do, oh okay law" angle. A job's a job. If you're not going to be able to get a job with your undergrad credentials (or you're not going to be able to get a job you want that pays moderately well - I had a music education degree in wisconsin, I'd currently be taking out a mortgage on my cardboard box by the river had I stuck with that,) and you get into a law school that has the right cost/benefit calculus, it can make a lot of sense. 80 hours a week of multiple part times jobs or 80 hours a week at a desk job, it's still 80 hours a week - and biglaw pays better.

Renzo
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Re: Is it ever worth it to delay for several years law school?

Postby Renzo » Sat Jul 09, 2011 9:18 pm

dailygrind wrote:
IAFG wrote:I agree with you (especially the TFA part... hoo boy do I agree with you) but that doesn't mean that I agree that those people should go to LS anyway. Smacks of the "don't know what to do, oh okay law" thing. I think you should get a real, soul-crushing entry level job first, in an industry you find interesting.


When the economy was really deep in the shitter, that was really hard to do, especially if you were a splitter. Sometimes you just gotta put it all on black and let it ride.


This is marginal. If a person really, really couldn't find an entry level job--not "can't find a good/interesting/decent paying job," but really not any entry-level job--then I'd probably excuse hiding from the recession in law school in some few cases. But, as you say, for a lot of people it's doubling down on a bad bet.




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