Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1? Forum
- nipplehead09
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Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Would it be better to go to a highly ranked law school and graduate in the bottom 25% of the class or to go to a lower ranked school and graduate in the top 25% of the class? Just to give an example, let's say we're talking about a school in the high teens (like UCLA) vs a school in the high 50s (like Tennessee). And just assume that the person is willing to live and work in the area, the job markets are equal, etc. I'm not trying to say that people that go to lower ranked schools aren't as smart, but I'm guessing that the people at the higher ranked schools are pretty intense about getting good grades and what not.
- Knock
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
You can't make that assumption, for a number of reasons.nipplehead09 wrote:Would it be better to go to a highly ranked law school and graduate in the bottom 25% of the class or to go to a lower ranked school and graduate in the top 25% of the class? Just to give an example, let's say we're talking about a school in the high teens (like UCLA) vs a school in the high 50s (like Tennessee). And just assume that the person is willing to live and work in the area, the job markets are equal, etc. I'm not trying to say that people that go to lower ranked schools aren't as smart, but I'm guessing that the people at the higher ranked schools are pretty intense about getting good grades and what not.
- nipplehead09
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Let's just assume that this is what's going to happen. For a number of reasons. Also, do you play fantasy baseball?
- Knock
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Personally, i'd rather be top 25% at Tennessee than bottom 25% at UCLA, especially if I got scholarship money from Tennessee.nipplehead09 wrote:Let's just assume that this is what's going to happen. For a number of reasons. Also, do you play fantasy baseball?
Last edited by Knock on Fri Apr 29, 2011 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Top 25% at T1. But that's not how it'd work out.
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- 98234872348
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
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Last edited by 98234872348 on Sat Aug 20, 2011 10:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Good resume might work too.mistergoft wrote:top 25% at a T1 and bottom 25% at a school in the teens are both going to have to get a job through networking or being a really excellent interviewer. There's really no difference. Maybe the school with the larger alumni network?
- red_alertz
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
how abt top 10% from a lower T2 school or solid T3 school, say chapman or indianapolis?
- 98234872348
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
r.
Last edited by 98234872348 on Sat Aug 20, 2011 10:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
- nipplehead09
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
My previous careers have been at an amusement park, a Chuck E Cheese's, and an AMC. Nothing I'm in a hurry to return to lol.mistergoft wrote:I was assuming the person with a good resume would have enough sense to give up on law and go back to their previous career.Desert Fox wrote:Good resume might work too.mistergoft wrote:top 25% at a T1 and bottom 25% at a school in the teens are both going to have to get a job through networking or being a really excellent interviewer. There's really no difference. Maybe the school with the larger alumni network?
- voice of reason
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
This has been studied and there is good reason to believe it is better to go to the lower ranked school and graduate toward the top of the class (assuming the gap between the schools isn't too huge).nipplehead09 wrote:Would it be better to go to a highly ranked law school and graduate in the bottom 25% of the class or to go to a lower ranked school and graduate in the top 25% of the class? ....
Here's the study: --LinkRemoved--#
Here's a nugget (p. 35): "A graduate from 40th ranked George Mason with high law school grades is likely to earn as much as an average graduate from Stanford." The reason is that law school performance is a stronger predictor of career success than school prestige/rank.
A key question, then, is whether the "average" graduate from Stanford could/would have gotten "high law school grades" at George Mason. The answer is maybe; the authors discuss the evidence that people do tend to get better grades at lower-ranked schools than they would at higher-ranked schools.
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
top 25% at 50 is much better than bottom 25% at top 20. however, this is a big difference and hard to predict as others said. remember the difference between those schools is about 5 LSAT points, which in that range is about 5 questions.
- YourCaptain
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Why is this even a question there are too many poor assumptions
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
If you believe that LSAT score and GPA combined are heavily correlated to success in law school, it would seem to follow that a student would generally preform better at the school in the 50s all other things being equal.
- Grizz
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
There are over 9000 threads like this one and each one sucks.
- swc65
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Voltaire wrote:If you believe that LSAT score and GPA combined are heavily correlated to success in law school, it would seem to follow that a student would generally preform better at the school in the 50s all other things being equal.
Oh no. Please not this again. Please!!!!!!!!!!! This never ends well and it is NOT fun to watch.
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Voltaire wrote:If you believe that LSAT score and GPA combined are heavily correlated to success in law school, it would seem to follow that a student would generally preform better at the school in the 50s all other things being equal.
The correlation is known, but it's not high. It's just above the cut off from low to moderately correlated. But going from bottom to top with only a couple LSAT point difference would not happen under the known correlation. This isn't even a debate.
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- Perch
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Very enjoyable read, thanks for the link.voice of reason wrote:This has been studied and there is good reason to believe it is better to go to the lower ranked school and graduate toward the top of the class (assuming the gap between the schools isn't too huge).nipplehead09 wrote:Would it be better to go to a highly ranked law school and graduate in the bottom 25% of the class or to go to a lower ranked school and graduate in the top 25% of the class? ....
Here's the study: --LinkRemoved--#
Here's a nugget (p. 35): "A graduate from 40th ranked George Mason with high law school grades is likely to earn as much as an average graduate from Stanford." The reason is that law school performance is a stronger predictor of career success than school prestige/rank.
A key question, then, is whether the "average" graduate from Stanford could/would have gotten "high law school grades" at George Mason. The answer is maybe; the authors discuss the evidence that people do tend to get better grades at lower-ranked schools than they would at higher-ranked schools.
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
This.rad law wrote:There are over 9000 threads like this one and each one sucks.
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
My guess is to be in the top 25% at a top school. Then, you can't go wrong
- rayiner
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
If measure U and measure V are correlated with a coefficient of A (where A is [0.0, 1.0]), then doing 1 standard deviation better than someone else on measure U will tend to imply on average doing A * 1 standard deviations better on measure V. If class rank follows a Gaussian distribution, then a 170 will tend to do 0.6 * 0.34 = 0.20 better than a 160. So if a 160 got median, then a 170 would get top 30%. Now this math is highly simplified (I totally ignored the actual distribution of LSATs at a typical school which is non-Gaussian) but it should illustrate the simple fact that the difference is smaller than your hypo suggests.
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
TKOrayiner wrote:If measure U and measure V are correlated with a coefficient of A (where A is [0.0, 1.0]), then doing 1 standard deviation better than someone else on measure U will tend to imply on average doing A * 1 standard deviations better on measure V. If class rank follows a Gaussian distribution, then a 170 will tend to do 0.6 * 0.34 = 0.20 better than a 160. So if a 160 got median, then a 170 would get top 30%. Now this math is highly simplified (I totally ignored the actual distribution of LSATs at a typical school which is non-Gaussian) but it should illustrate the simple fact that the difference is smaller than your hypo suggests.
- romothesavior
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
This. The average student at a T10 would probably perform a little better at a T20, but it wouldn't be a 50%ile difference. The kid with the 173 in the bottom quarter at MVP wouldn't magically become top 25% at a T20. Or even a T50. I agree with DF, this isn't debatable and it is a dead horse.Desert Fox wrote:Voltaire wrote:If you believe that LSAT score and GPA combined are heavily correlated to success in law school, it would seem to follow that a student would generally preform better at the school in the 50s all other things being equal.
The correlation is known, but it's not high. It's just above the cut off from low to moderately correlated. But going from bottom to top with only a couple LSAT point difference would not happen under the known correlation. This isn't even a debate.
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
Gotcha. I'm half-drunk and was just playing devil's advocate. I can see you guys have had this discussion before though. Nevamind.Desert Fox wrote:Voltaire wrote:If you believe that LSAT score and GPA combined are heavily correlated to success in law school, it would seem to follow that a student would generally preform better at the school in the 50s all other things being equal.
The correlation is known, but it's not high. It's just above the cut off from low to moderately correlated. But going from bottom to top with only a couple LSAT point difference would not happen under the known correlation. This isn't even a debate.
- 98234872348
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Re: Bad grades at T14 vs good grades at low tier 1?
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Last edited by 98234872348 on Sat Aug 20, 2011 10:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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