Law school or become a cop??

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Chickensoup
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby Chickensoup » Sat Nov 03, 2012 10:02 am

Sorry to necro this but this is an interesting thread.

A lot of the information about compensation is wrong. In my town (NY Metro Area), the median compensation for a cop is 148K. For money like that, it sure sounds like a great profession. That said, I know several people who are trying to become cops and have had no luck at all.

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John Mill
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby John Mill » Sat Nov 03, 2012 1:41 pm

lukebyalibi wrote:
Yeah I think they were just generalizing that some people hate cops/lawyers until they actually need one.

Actually when somebody needs a lawyer, it's usually when they hate them the most.

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Lawquacious
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby Lawquacious » Sat Nov 03, 2012 2:07 pm

Chickensoup wrote:
In my town (NY Metro Area), the median compensation for a cop is 148K


Lolwut. Post stats or I'm not even close to buying it. Even if you're in Manhattan I have a hard time believing median for cops is anywhere close to what many mid-career MDs earn. 148k median for a cop. No, not without proof. I think you got the stats for Police Commissioners (i.e. state-wide directors) confused with the salaries of beat cops.

Even if somehow you are correct--which I entirely doubt--for a very limited geographic area, the overall median for a cop nationally is about 48k (without the 1 in front). See http://www1.salary.com/police-officer-Salary.html. Additionally, the compensation itself doesn't account for the extreme danger this job often involves, especially in urban settings.

That said, I think being a cop could be a very rewarding job and it is an important service position. I also think that normatively there are plenty of arguments that cops should get paid better than the 48k or so that most of them make in mid-career.
Last edited by Lawquacious on Sat Nov 03, 2012 2:21 pm, edited 4 times in total.

someguy55
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby someguy55 » Sat Nov 03, 2012 2:08 pm

cop

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Chickensoup
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby Chickensoup » Sat Nov 03, 2012 5:40 pm

Lawquacious wrote:
Chickensoup wrote:
In my town (NY Metro Area), the median compensation for a cop is 148K


Lolwut. Post stats or I'm not even close to buying it. Even if you're in Manhattan I have a hard time believing median for cops is anywhere close to what many mid-career MDs earn. 148k median for a cop. No, not without proof. I think you got the stats for Police Commissioners (i.e. state-wide directors) confused with the salaries of beat cops.

Even if somehow you are correct--which I entirely doubt--for a very limited geographic area, the overall median for a cop nationally is about 48k (without the 1 in front). See http://www1.salary.com/police-officer-Salary.html. Additionally, the compensation itself doesn't account for the extreme danger this job often involves, especially in urban settings.

That said, I think being a cop could be a very rewarding job and it is an important service position. I also think that normatively there are plenty of arguments that cops should get paid better than the 48k or so that most of them make in mid-career.


REDACTED -- don't want to out myself

I was wrong--it's the mean compensation, not the median. Still 148K though. The key is that this is a cookie-cutter suburb with no crime whatsoever and these cops are making a killing.

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Chickensoup
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby Chickensoup » Sat Nov 03, 2012 5:47 pm

Didn't want to out my town, but here is an article about the salaries in NJ (not my state).

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2010/0 ... ighes.html

One town, Rochelle Park, has a median pay of 134K. There are towns in NY with higher salaries than this.

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Lawquacious
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby Lawquacious » Sat Nov 03, 2012 6:36 pm

Chickensoup wrote:Didn't want to out my town, but here is an article about the salaries in NJ (not my state).

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2010/0 ... ighes.html

One town, Rochelle Park, has a median pay of 134K. There are towns in NY with higher salaries than this.


:? The 90k this link shows is a heck of a lot different than 148k, but even the 90k figure is well into the top 10% of earnings for police officers (at least for median earnings, which is what your initial post focused on, and what you again mention as being the metric in the post quoted above using a 134k figure--again without providing a link demonstrating the larger claim, but don't bother because my points still generally withstand).

If you are talking about a small, very affluent town, then I can see how this info could be so out of line with what most cops make. Some very wealthy small towns probably have no more than 10 cops, and the mean would include the Chief and other high positions in the small force.

Not trying to just be difficult or to single you out--it's just that the figure you gave is WAY out of of line with what 99% of cops will ever see per year, and therefore seemed a misleading reason to me for saying someone should consider being a cop (for compensation reasons). That said, by all means, for someone living in your town, be a cop for the money! :D

someguy55
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby someguy55 » Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:26 am

professional poker player > cop > lawyer

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PDaddy
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby PDaddy » Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:38 am

lukebyalibi wrote:I am almost done with undergrad and need to decide if I should settle for a cop job, or attend law school? Both have obvious pros and cons, but what would be the best decision?

p.s. not going to get into anything spactacular law school wise, nothing worse then TT


Either way, somebody will want to kill you, so do what will make you happier. I will say that law school will always be around, and cops with at least five years of service typically get an admissions boost. You say you aren't going to attend a spectacular school if you apply now; law school will always be here.

If you do 5-10 years on the force, it could help you change your profile. If you want to be a cop, go be a cop. Make some coin (I suggest doing it in $$$eattle, http://www.seattle.gov/police/jobs/benefits/salary.htm), take some evening post-graduate courses to improve your academic profile, retake the LSAT in 6-10 years, and get into a T14. Also, the University of Washington is a top-25 school that holds down the Seattle biglaw market with the T14 and gives admissions boosts to military vets and ex-police officers.

Seattle is one of the best places in the country in which to live, and I know people on the force pulling down six figures yearly with a little experience, overtime and off-duty work (club or school security, etc.)

See this also:

http://www.police-officer-pages.com/sea ... z2BKBsxTTL

Seattle Police Salary

The Seattle Police Salary starts at $25.15 per hour, while at the Police Academy.

Once successful, and sworn in as an Officer, the pay increases to $30.80, or the equivalent of $64,310.40 annually.

Seattle Police Salary increases incrementally in the following steps:

Sworn: $30.80 hourly / $64,310.40 annually

6 months: $33.02 / $68,945.76 annually

18 Months: $34.52 hourly / $72,077.76 annually

30 Months: $35.86 hourly / $74,875.68 annually

42 Months: $37.64 hourly / $78,592.32 annually

54 Months: $40.33 hourly / $84,209.04 annually

Officers also earn a Yearly uniform allowance of $550.

As for benefits, Seattle Police Officers receive:

-10 Paid Holidays plus 16 hours Personal Holiday

-12 Days paid Vacation

-12 Days paid Sick Leave (can be used for spouse/domestic partner, child or parent with unlimited accrual)

-Enrollment in Washington State LEOFF2 Retirement

-Deferred Compensation Plan (Optional) (City Matches up to $2780.40 a year)

Applicants to the Seattle Police Department must be a minimum of 20.5 years of age when they take the written exam. Applicants must be a US citizen, have a high school diploma, a valid Washington State Driver's licence.

You may be disqualified from the process if your driving record shows one or more of the following:

-Driving While Intoxicated (DWI)

-Reckless Driving

-Hit & Run Driving

-Suspension of your driver's license within five years of the date of application

-Three or more moving violations (speeding, negligent driving, etc.) in the past five years of the date of application will be carefully reviewed.

-Two or more accidents within five years of the date of application, wherein applicant was judged to be at fault and/or charged with a moving violation.

Seattle Police Officers work 4 days in a row, 9 hours shifts. They are assigned to a watch where they remain unless they request to be moved to one of the others. There is no mandatory rotating schedule.

The three watches consist of:

First Watch: 0300-1200 or 0330 - 1230

Second Watch: 1100-2000 or 1130 - 2030

Third Watch: 1900-0400 or 1930 - 0430

Read from original website: http://www.police-officer-pages.com/sea ... z2BKCEI33Q

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ddacey
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby ddacey » Sat Nov 10, 2012 4:19 pm

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Last edited by ddacey on Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PDaddy
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby PDaddy » Sat Nov 10, 2012 4:39 pm

ddacey wrote:Becoming a Firefighter is a better deal, at least where I am from.

2 24 hour shifts a week. Sleep half the time you're on the job, complete job security, health benefits, and pension. Hell if you really wanted to you could probably set up your shifts so that you work 4 days a week M-F as an attorney.

I think I will be taking the exam next time it is offered.


This is also a great idea. No bullets, but it is still a very dangerous job. I wonder which job is more dangerous. My friends actually say that firefighters face more risk to their lives when they get a big call. Robbery suspects and drug dealers can always give up - especially when they see 50 guns pointed at them - but fires and chemical spills do what they want to do and don't care who shows up. On a day-to-day basis,neither one actually faces that much danger.

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ddacey
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby ddacey » Sun Nov 11, 2012 9:14 am

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Last edited by ddacey on Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JCFindley
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby JCFindley » Sun Nov 11, 2012 9:52 am

Most dangerous jobs.

1. Fishermen
2. Loggers
3. Pilots (specifically military or Alaska bush pilots)
4. Sanitation workers
5. Roofers
6. Iron workers
7. Farmers/Ranchers
8. Truckers / Delivery Man
9. Electric Power Line worker
10.Taxi Driver

http://money.cnn.com/gallery/pf/2012/09/20/most-dangerous-jobs/10.html

You will note that cop and firefighter are not on the list.

BUT, with the exception of military pilots none of the above put their life on the line for the public good. Cops and firefighters DO and not just to make a buck which makes them heroes IMO. (especially firefighters which can't really abuse power.)

Want something REALLY fun and dangerous, join the military and go into special ops, SEALS, SF, Delta, Rangers, PJs, CCTs, Marine Corps Recon and probably a few I am missing.

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ddacey
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby ddacey » Sun Nov 11, 2012 10:50 am

.
Last edited by ddacey on Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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ChikaBoom
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby ChikaBoom » Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:00 am

There are plenty of ways to make an average cop's salary without putting your life on the line. I think a lot of them do it for reasons other than the income, because, to be honest it doesn't sound like that much even in the higher paying cities. What a lot of people ITT are not taking into account is cost of living in these areas. Northern VA? High cost of living. I don't know about Seattle and I am too lazy to look it up, but likely expensive enough to justify those salaries. When you factor in all the stuff you would have to deal with in these professions and the cost of living, I find it hard to believe that many people do it solely for the money.

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JCFindley
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby JCFindley » Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:00 pm

ddacey wrote:
JCFindley wrote:Most dangerous jobs.

1. Fishermen
2. Loggers
3. Pilots (specifically military or Alaska bush pilots)
4. Sanitation workers
5. Roofers
6. Iron workers
7. Farmers/Ranchers
8. Truckers / Delivery Man
9. Electric Power Line worker
10.Taxi Driver

http://money.cnn.com/gallery/pf/2012/09/20/most-dangerous-jobs/10.html

You will note that cop and firefighter are not on the list.

BUT, with the exception of military pilots none of the above put their life on the line for the public good. Cops and firefighters DO and not just to make a buck which makes them heroes IMO. (especially firefighters which can't really abuse power.)

Want something REALLY fun and dangerous, join the military and go into special ops, SEALS, SF, Delta, Rangers, PJs, CCTs, Marine Corps Recon and probably a few I am missing.


I think cops and firefighters become cops and firefighters for the income and benefits. I imagine that neither would have a fully employed force if it wasn't for the benefits.

I dont know enough about what you're talking about. But aren't they specifically for 18 year olds? Because of training time required?


If you mean spec ops then no. All of the above have officers in their units and thus you have to be a college grad or ~ 22 and older. Same group generally looking at LS.

Jas
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Re: Law school or become a cop??

Postby Jas » Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:12 pm

ChikaBoom wrote:There are plenty of ways to make an average cop's salary without putting your life on the line. I think a lot of them do it for reasons other than the income, because, to be honest it doesn't sound like that much even in the higher paying cities. What a lot of people ITT are not taking into account is cost of living in these areas. Northern VA? High cost of living. I don't know about Seattle and I am too lazy to look it up, but likely expensive enough to justify those salaries. When you factor in all the stuff you would have to deal with in these professions and the cost of living, I find it hard to believe that many people do it solely for the money.


"I think a lot of them do it for reasons other than the income..."

Maybe, maybe not. Nonetheless, it is a foreign concept on TLS. That's right, TLSers, there are other reasons to do things.




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