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[warandpeace]

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[kwais]

get that 3.6, get a 170+ and you will be fine. I have a 3.6 and got into a bunch of the schools you mentioned, some with $. If you are sub-170, then think about ED.

[warandpeace]

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[kwais]

thanks, that's comforting. but i'm feeling like my 4.0 every semester is unrealistic. wondering now if having a 3.5 will still be okay.

It's not an exact science, but for every .1 drop in GPA, you will want a point or two on the LSAT. Also, since you have time, cultivate strong relationships with professors for LORs. But most people will tell you (and they are right), destroy the LSAT. Like, take it only after you consistently practice in the 170's. It can open a ton of doors.

[bhan87]

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[mi-chan17]

Another question..is my cal state school going to ruin all my chances at a good school?

I attended a CSU, and cracked the T-14 and got money from T20 schools. The school won't stand in your way, as long as your GPA and LSAT are what the LS is looking for.

[kwais]

I agree with most of bhan's post, but I just want to point out that I got into columbia with a 3.6/173, no URM and average soft factors. But he/she is right that it's not the norm. It is however, worth the app fee.

[warandpeace]

thanks for all the great advice. i guess columbia and nyu aren't really my priorities, i want michigan the most, but i don't know how finding a job in la will work out.

one more thing: the semester i got my 2 c's (the 2.6), someone in my family passed away. i feel now, looking back on it, that it affected me deeply but i didn't realize it at the time. is this something that should be addressed in a personal statement, or no?

and how big are softs? i held a secretary position in my freshman year, and i worked for 6 months in my fall fresh year and 3 months in my fall soph year. i also write short stories, but not published. just curious.

[bhan87]

I agree with most of bhan's post, but I just want to point out that I got into columbia with a 3.6/173, no URM and average soft factors. But he/she is right that it's not the norm. It is however, worth the app fee.

Congrats man! Are you going to be at the March 30/31 ASP?

kwais brings up a very good point: APPLY BROADLY. You never know what schools will bite and what schools will give you unexpected $$ to negotiate with.

[bhan87]

thanks for all the great advice. i guess columbia and nyu aren't really my priorities, i want michigan the most, but i don't know how finding a job in la will work out.

one more thing: the semester i got my 2 c's (the 2.6), someone in my family passed away. i feel now, looking back on it, that it affected me deeply but i didn't realize it at the time. is this something that should be addressed in a personal statement, or no?

and how big are softs? i held a secretary position in my freshman year, and i worked for 6 months in my fall fresh year and 3 months in my fall soph year. i also write short stories, but not published. just curious.

Grade dips are not good topics for personal statements, but should be mentioned in an addendum. I'm really sorry for your loss (I also lost a very close family member while in college).

Typically softs don't contribute very much to your application unless it's something substantially significant, such as: Olympic medalist, best-selling author, founder of a multi-million dollar company, etc. Even then, it's very difficult to overcome hard numbers.

[warandpeace]

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[warandpeace]

Hi everyone, it's my first post so play nice..haha

I read tons of posts, so I'm slightly informed, but not completely. Please correct me whenever needed. I'm going to ask a ton of random questions so I apologize in advance.

I go to a cal state and I've had a sad gpa for most of college (3.4, 2.6, 3.52) and right now I have a 3.22. I'm an english major (not sure if that matters) in my 2nd year, 5th semester. I know I have to get a 4.0 for this semester and the next two semesters in order to get a gpa that I want (3.6ish). I'm planning to take the LSAT this December because I heard about the point boost, and I'm going to dedicate my summer to LSAT prep (no classes). Wondering if that's too early for LSAT?

Welcome! For now, you don't want to worry about the LSAT and you want to direct your focus towards your classes (like you're planning to do). Typically, people recommend at least 3 months to prepare for the LSAT, but with the number of preptests you have at your disposal, I think you want to give yourself 5-6 months to give ample time to fully prepare. Most people try to shoot for the June / October administration of the year before entering law school (typically a student's senior year). This allows you to apply earlier (which is always a good idea) or retake in December if things go poorly. This upcoming December would be your 3rd year I presume. I think it's a bit too early to worry about the LSAT, and instead you should focus on getting A's. Take a few community college courses if you can over summer (they WILL count towards your LSDAS GPA)

I guess my main question here is if I can even hope for any schools in the T14-T20. My preferred choices are UCLA, USC, University of Michigan, Columbia, and NYU. I want to get into the entertainment law industry and I really want to be based in LA. Do the non LA schools I mentioned have internships in LA? Is this a possibility or..

There are people who get into NYU / Columbia with a 3.6 GPA, but these applicants either have an amazing LSAT score (175+) or are URM. That being said, it's not impossible. A 3.6 is not a terrible GPA by any means, but for the T-14 it's not very competitive. To offset this you need to score a 170+ to have a shot at a T-14. I think a plain 170 should be enough for UCLA / USC, but it'll still be iffy. The best thing you can do is first maximize your GPA as much as possible (straight 4.0s till the end of senior year would certainly help). Later, when you're studying for the LSAT, don't be afraid to take a year off to give yourself more time to prepare if your scores aren't hitting the range you need.

I'm also curious about ED. Does it really help, and is it worth the risk?

I'm not a big fan of ED. It automatically shuts you out of merit aid consideration and you can't negotiate up your financial aid with other scholarship offers. If you manage to raise your GPA to a 3.6 and hit a 170+ LSAT, I don't see that you'll need to ED.

I've gotten a C and a C+ before in 2 G.E. classes. Should I retake these over summer? Another question..is my cal state school going to ruin all my chances at a good school?

DON'T retake them. Even if you did, your LSDAS GPA will just reflect both classes. Retaking will only risk that you'll get another C. Just suck it up and move on.

Also, just curious to how everyone feels about this forum vs. the college confidential law school forums? is there a big difference?

You guys thanks so much, I just have so many random questions, I apologize again. It would be really helpful if people with experience with any of these schools dropped by and gave their two cents. Thanks again!

I always got the impression that this forum attracts students with higher ambitions than you would typically find in other forums. For instance, a score in the 160s is often frowned upon around these parts.

i was really set on taking the december lsat this year, because i heard there was a few extra points to be given for the dec test. so this is a no no?

[warandpeace]

I agree with most of bhan's post, but I just want to point out that I got into columbia with a 3.6/173, no URM and average soft factors. But he/she is right that it's not the norm. It is however, worth the app fee.

what were some of the other schools you got into? were you waitlisted at all? i'm very jealous, congrats!

[bhan87]

Addenda:

Addenda are additional statements that you can add to your application that explain something that isn't evident in the application proper. For instance, a family death being the cause for a semester of poor grades could be explained in such a statement.

http://www.top-law-schools.com/guide-to ... ments.html
http://www.top-law-schools.com/appendixd.html

December LSAT:

There aren't necessarily a few more points to be "had" by taking the December LSAT, but the trend does seem to be that December has a more forgiving curve. Don't take this to mean that you will do better on the LSAT because you take it in December, however, as the curve is calculated so that a score on one test would correlate to a score on any other.

Stalking:

Click the "Profile" button under a post. Lots of people have their numbers / application cycle posted in their profile.

[warandpeace]

Addenda:

Addenda are additional statements that you can add to your application that explain something that isn't evident in the application proper. For instance, a family death being the cause for a semester of poor grades could be explained in such a statement.

http://www.top-law-schools.com/guide-to ... ments.html
http://www.top-law-schools.com/appendixd.html

December LSAT:

There aren't necessarily a few more points to be "had" by taking the December LSAT, but the trend does seem to be that December has a more forgiving curve. Don't take this to mean that you will do better on the LSAT because you take it in December, however, as the curve is calculated so that a score on one test would correlate to a score on any other.

Stalking:

Click the "Profile" button under a post. Lots of people have their numbers / application cycle posted in their profile.

thank you bhan, you've been so helpful.

[FlanAl]

the december lsat this year was super rough and we only got a -12 curve (many people on here expected a -14). My guess is that more and more people have started to recognize the importance of a good lsat score and are re-taking the test (usually re-taking in December)

[FlanAl]

i think it was also out of like 103 questions instead of the usual 101 or whatever. but yeah i re-took in december thinking the exact same thing as you. I did alright but I would definitely not under-estimate the december test.

[warandpeace]

i think it was also out of like 103 questions instead of the usual 101 or whatever. but yeah i re-took in december thinking the exact same thing as you. I did alright but I would definitely not under-estimate the december test.

am i just better off studying this summer/winter break and taking it in february next year?

[FlanAl]

my understanding is that you don't want to do february because they never publish that test and you won't be able to see where you went wrong if you want to re-take. I personally think that June is the best bet because they offer a test in the afternoon. Having to lsat at 8am was a hassle. Also with June you have two more re-take attempts with which you can apply during that cycle. But the best advice is to study and take it when you feel most ready. Give yourself a good 4 months (usual recommended is 3 but give yourself some wiggle room) for like the June test and if you don't feel quite ready go for it in October or whatever works given your schedule.

But yeah just don't count on december being easier. After taking most of the Prep-tests I feel like it generally is but the one I actually took this year was a big slap in the face.

[warandpeace]

my understanding is that you don't want to do february because they never publish that test and you won't be able to see where you went wrong if you want to re-take. I personally think that June is the best bet because they offer a test in the afternoon. Having to lsat at 8am was a hassle. Also with June you have two more re-take attempts with which you can apply during that cycle. But the best advice is to study and take it when you feel most ready. Give yourself a good 4 months (usual recommended is 3 but give yourself some wiggle room) for like the June test and if you don't feel quite ready go for it in October or whatever works given your schedule.

But yeah just don't count on december being easier. After taking most of the Prep-tests I feel like it generally is but the one I actually took this year was a big slap in the face.

yeah i just want to prep for it at a time when i don't have to deal with school. can i ask what score you got :/ or the range?

thanks for helping

[Richie Tenenbaum]

the december lsat this year was super rough and we only got a -12 curve (many people on here expected a -14). My guess is that more and more people have started to recognize the importance of a good lsat score and are re-taking the test (usually re-taking in December)

The strength of the current test takers does not affect the curve of the test, since it has already been predetermined based on results from experimental sections.

To OP: There is no hidden advantage, in terms of help because of the curve, to any particular test. I liked the June test because I'm not a morning person. I probably wouldn't like taking the February test if I could avoid it, since it's an unreleased test. If you are applying for the following year, the June test might be the best in term of app timing (allowing you a safety net with the sept/oct test in case things go wrong on the June test). Timing for app and how well prepared you are should be your main considerations on which test to take.

[zonto]

i think it was also out of like 103 questions instead of the usual 101 or whatever. but yeah i re-took in december thinking the exact same thing as you. I did alright but I would definitely not under-estimate the december test.

-14 curve. 102 questions.

[warandpeace]

i think it was also out of like 103 questions instead of the usual 101 or whatever. but yeah i re-took in december thinking the exact same thing as you. I did alright but I would definitely not under-estimate the december test.

-14 curve. 102 questions.

what does this -13/-14 thing mean? sorry for my ignorance.

[zonto]

i think it was also out of like 103 questions instead of the usual 101 or whatever. but yeah i re-took in december thinking the exact same thing as you. I did alright but I would definitely not under-estimate the december test.

-14 curve. 102 questions.

what does this -13/-14 thing mean? sorry for my ignorance.

No worries. The "curve" is TLS terminology for the maximum number of questions you can miss and still get a 170 on that particular LSAT. December 2010 had 102 total questions, and a raw score of 88 resulted in a 170 (hence the -14 curve).

[kwais]

I agree with most of bhan's post, but I just want to point out that I got into columbia with a 3.6/173, no URM and average soft factors. But he/she is right that it's not the norm. It is however, worth the app fee.

Congrats man! Are you going to be at the March 30/31 ASP?

kwais brings up a very good point: APPLY BROADLY. You never know what schools will bite and what schools will give you unexpected $$ to negotiate with.

Thanks! I wish, but I have to work, so I'm going to the April 18th mini ASD