Which law schools most outperform their ranking? Forum

[SupraVln180]

I am interested in this b/c I have less than stellar numbers 3.5/163 and want to see what schools might land me the best job opportunities when I get out. Obviously, regional schools in non-saturated markets, but lets hear some specifics.

[rman1201]

UF.
Best school in one of the biggest states. The legal market it is crap, but if you go to UF and stay in state you'll probably be fine.

[northwood]

what region do you want to work in? That will help narrow down your search.

[SupraVln180]

East Coast/Midwest

[MrPapagiorgio]

Great idea. Will def check back here to look at some hopefully helpful answers.

[pu_golf88]

Notre Dame does really well thanks to an outstanding alumni network.

[SupraVln180]

Notre Dame does really well thanks to an outstanding alumni network.

I always thought this, but I heard OCI was a real bloodbath last year. I guess it is everywhere though.

[luckyme]

BC

[2011Law]

UF.
Best school in one of the biggest states. The legal market it is crap, but if you go to UF and stay in state you'll probably be fine.

I'll +1 this, but I'd only go if I got in-state tuition. Total CoA for in-state is around $87,000. Out of state is about $144,000. (with no scholly). I'd do whatever it took to get in state before 1L, and would not go without it.

[TommyK]

BYU - Mormon Mafia has a really impressive alumni network from what I hear.

[northwood]

If I were in your shoes, I would blanket as many schools as possible in each of those regions, and see which ones give you the best scholarship options. You need to do some serious research onb cost of living, lifestyle of the area, and outlooks. I would recommend that you take the summer and visit the areas you like, and try to get a feel for the overall area and environment. Its hard, but if you can possibly narrow down your regions into a list of cities and rank them. Then work on schools that place in those cities,( looking at and not looking at USNEWS and reports) you need to talk to lawyers, try to get any info on where the majority of those lawyers went to school. You need to do this work on your own. It wont be in any college ranking guide. You will get the info that will help you make your school choices, and get a guide for what you need to get on the LSAT. Once you have figured this out, apply in october ( or before if you have a good enough lsat score). Then choose the school that ranks high on your list of cities and areas, and gives you the best financial aid package.

I know this isnt a list that you want, but hope this helps.

[Patriot1208]

UF.
Best school in one of the biggest states. The legal market it is crap, but if you go to UF and stay in state you'll probably be fine.

I'll +1 this, but I'd only go if I got in-state tuition. Total CoA for in-state is around $87,000. Out of state is about $144,000. (with no scholly). I'd do whatever it took to get in state before 1L, and would not go without it.

LOL, considering there are multiple LR people without any offers, i'll say no.

[2011Law]

UF.
Best school in one of the biggest states. The legal market it is crap, but if you go to UF and stay in state you'll probably be fine.

I'll +1 this, but I'd only go if I got in-state tuition. Total CoA for in-state is around $87,000. Out of state is about $144,000. (with no scholly). I'd do whatever it took to get in state before 1L, and would not go without it.

LOL, considering there are multiple LR people without any offers, i'll say no.

wow, didn't know it was that bad. does that mean offers just from biglaw though? cause if thats it, then thats not that unexpected ITE, right? it never was a school to go to if you wanted biglaw. or maybe they messed up their grades after they got onto LR? I'm kinda assuming thats what happened to the editor in chief of Kent.

[re-applicant]

Stanford

[apollo13]

If you don't mind including NYC in one your tie lists, Fordham or Brooklyn could be bang for rank. Obv, these skoos are huge beneficiaries of saturated legal market. As I am from the City, I see/hear about Fordham/Brooklyn grads everywhere - from the NYC legal department to Skadden, Paul Weisee, B&M, etc etc. If you are looking for BigLaw - then def. Fordham although it is contingent that you make it upper 15% of the class.

[Stonewall]

UF.
Best school in one of the biggest states. The legal market it is crap, but if you go to UF and stay in state you'll probably be fine.

I'll +1 this, but I'd only go if I got in-state tuition. Total CoA for in-state is around $87,000. Out of state is about $144,000. (with no scholly). I'd do whatever it took to get in state before 1L, and would not go without it.

LOL, considering there are multiple LR people without any offers, i'll say no.

and the fact Florida has about 22 different lawl skoolz doesn't help, even if UF is the "best" one

[observationalist]

Whichever ones are willing to disclose full employer lists showing where their graduates end up. Once you're accepted, ask each school to send you the employer lists for the Class of 2010. You're looking for the names and cities of each employer that hired a 2010 grad (not just the law firms). More helpful still would be the starting salaries for each graduate, or at a minimum the 25th/median/75th combined with how many people actually reported salaries. This will allow you to get a more realistic idea of how much you will likely make coming out of the school. From there you can figure out how much debt you're comfortable taking on, and based on that select a school that offers the best price tag. As northwood mentioned, I would work aggressively to gain scholarships to help reduce the pricetag. Just be aware that some scholarships (like Brooklyn's) are conditional on a certain gpa, meaning you can lose it after the first year. When calculating your debt loads at those schools I recommend assuming you'll pay sticker for 2L and 3L year, just to be safe.

Schools have an incentive to disclose where their graduates go aside from whether it makes them look better than their U.S. News rank, but very few of them are doing so. IMO the ones who have something to show in terms of job prospects are the ones most likely to show it. The trick is keeping them honest and making sure they disclose data on the entire class (not just top performers). G'luck.

[Patriot1208]

UF.
Best school in one of the biggest states. The legal market it is crap, but if you go to UF and stay in state you'll probably be fine.

I'll +1 this, but I'd only go if I got in-state tuition. Total CoA for in-state is around $87,000. Out of state is about $144,000. (with no scholly). I'd do whatever it took to get in state before 1L, and would not go without it.

LOL, considering there are multiple LR people without any offers, i'll say no.

wow, didn't know it was that bad. does that mean offers just from biglaw though? cause if thats it, then thats not that unexpected ITE, right? it never was a school to go to if you wanted biglaw. or maybe they messed up their grades after they got onto LR? I'm kinda assuming thats what happened to the editor in chief of Kent.

There is at least one known person who is in the top 10 people after 3 semesters and has no offer, whatsoever, for 2L summer.

[Lwoods]

BYU - Mormon Mafia has a really impressive alumni network from what I hear.

This.
Also Fordham (though it's more selective than similarly ranked schools).

[vamedic03]

UF.
Best school in one of the biggest states. The legal market it is crap, but if you go to UF and stay in state you'll probably be fine.

I'll +1 this, but I'd only go if I got in-state tuition. Total CoA for in-state is around $87,000. Out of state is about $144,000. (with no scholly). I'd do whatever it took to get in state before 1L, and would not go without it.

LOL, considering there are multiple LR people without any offers, i'll say no.

wow, didn't know it was that bad. does that mean offers just from biglaw though? cause if thats it, then thats not that unexpected ITE, right? it never was a school to go to if you wanted biglaw. or maybe they messed up their grades after they got onto LR? I'm kinda assuming thats what happened to the editor in chief of Kent.

(1) Hiring is based on your 1L grades. Many firms never look at your grades again. Big Law hiring, for the most part, is finished after OCI at the beginning of your 2L year.

(2) As to Kent Law's EIC - there are 2 factors at play. First, managing board positions aren't doled out on the basis of grades. All you know about his performance is that he succeeded in getting onto LR, which might have been through grades or through a tryout process. Second, T2 schools have had significant problems placing graduates, especially ITE.

[rman1201]

(1) Hiring is based on your 1L grades. Many firms never look at your grades again. Big Law hiring, for the most part, is finished after OCI at the beginning of your 2L year.

(2) As to Kent Law's EIC - there are 2 factors at play. First, managing board positions aren't doled out on the basis of grades. All you know about his performance is that he succeeded in getting onto LR, which might have been through grades or through a tryout process. Second, T2 schools have had significant problems placing graduates, especially ITE.

And if I recall from the thread on the Kent grad, his grades were around 40%... at a T2... in Chicago...

[RUCamdenguy]

I would check out Temple. Your stats may give you an outside shot at some scholly money, and if you can get in-state tuition TU is really cheap considering where it's ranked. I had 3.9/166 and could have gone to Temple for almost free after scholly money if I would have been able to get in-state. Compensation prospects are good for the ranking if you do well and are content to work in Philly.

[CanadianWolf]

Northwestern & Georgia tend to outperform their rankings. SMU also does well.

[TeddyMuir]

Washington & Lee

They are ranked 34 now, but they used to be much higher, and many people still perceive and treat them as such.

[Iceman389]

I've heard Marquette does pretty well placing graduates in Wisconsin. Don't have to take the bar and only have UW-Madison to compete with. There are a number of top firms in Milwaukee as well