Mac or PC?

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kalvano
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby kalvano » Tue Apr 26, 2011 11:28 pm

Dell sucks, no matter what line. Acquiring Alienware didn't change that.

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haus
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby haus » Tue Apr 26, 2011 11:47 pm

aesis,

Alienware purchase by Dell was the death knell for Alienware.

Spend some time on audio visual web forums, most well tell you not to bother with 1080p TV sets unless you are over 40". On a 15" inch laptop screen (even with the closer vantage point) you are mostly wasting your time.

Also the battery live on the XPS units stink, even if you go for the upgraded 90 Whr battery reviews talk about light usability time of less than 4 hours, far less then what you will get with the Mac unit, and with the Mac you will not need to deal with the battery that bulges out of the normal form factor of the laptop, which makes it a nuisance to get it in and out of many laptop bags. Theoretically you could get multiple batteries for the Dell, but with no external charger you would need to shuffle them in and out of the laptop to keep them charged. The second battery for our Dell laptops are standard issue at my company but almost no one bothers keeping the spare charged due to the hassle factor.

If you are going to go with a Dell, you are better off if you can find a way to snag onto a business purchase order. The models are more expensive, but Dell Business support is done in the US and seems to be of a considerable higher quality level then consumer support. But once the price difference compared to the Apple systems drops even more the motivation to put up with extra hassle is that much less.

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aesis
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby aesis » Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:23 am

haus wrote:aesis,

Alienware purchase by Dell was the death knell for Alienware.

Spend some time on audio visual web forums, most well tell you not to bother with 1080p TV sets unless you are over 40". On a 15" inch laptop screen (even with the closer vantage point) you are mostly wasting your time.

I call BS.

From Laptopmag.com:
"Display

The 15.6-inch, 1920 x 1080 resolution display on the XPS 15 is one of the brightest and most colorful we've tested. Even at viewing angles of nearly 90 degrees to the left or right, images stayed sharp and bright. The XPS 15 played every video we threw at it without hesitation, from a 1080p QuickTime trailer for Thor to a 720p Episode of Fringe streamed from Fox.com to a Blu-ray movie of Hitch. The screen is so sharp that it exposed some film grain in the Hitch Blu-ray."

From cnet.com:
"The 15.6-inch LED-backlit glossy 16:9 display in our high-end XPS 15 configuration has a 1,920x1,080-pixel full-HD display, which costs an extra $150 on Dell's Web site to customize. Based on our experience, it's worth the upgrade: colors popped, images were extremely vivid, and movies and games looked spectacular. Combined with the XPS' powerful sound, it adds up to one of the best portable home-theater offerings in any recent laptop we've seen."

From expertreviews (UK):
"Build quality overall is excellent, and the case feels solidly built. We especially like the metal panel around the keyboard, which should stop the laptop from getting shabby-looking where your wrists rest while typing. The keyboard itself is firm and has comfortably moulded keys, and the action is perfect - light, but with a crisp bite at the top of the keystroke that provides excellent feedback for touch-typists. The touchpad is large and responsive, with two large buttons that also have a light action."

From PCMag:
"There isn't a screen better than the one on the XPS 15 (Sandy Bridge). The RGB LED screen option is a must-have if color accuracy and a wide color gamut are critical to your profession or hobby. In other words, it's a flat-out stunning, razor-sharp screen. The RGB LED screens also has a 1,920-by-1,080 (1080p) resolution, which is the highest available on a desktop replacement laptop and a boon for high-definition enthusiasts."

haus wrote:
Also the battery live on the XPS units stink, even if you go for the upgraded 90 Whr battery reviews talk about light usability time of less than 4 hours, far less then what you will get with the Mac unit,.

From PCMag:
"With the 92WH battery in our review unit, the payoff was huge. The XPS 15 (Sandy Bridge) scored 6 hours 58 minutes in MobileMark 2007, blowing past the Asus N53SV-A1 (3:51), HP dv7-4283cl (5:46), and Apple 15-inch (4:40). "


So are people really suggesting a laptop with objectively worse specs (excepting graphics card) but with a more appealing form factor/weight worth the extra $800?

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haus
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby haus » Wed Apr 27, 2011 8:45 am

aesis wrote:
So are people really suggesting a laptop with objectively worse specs (excepting graphics card) but with a more appealing form factor/weight worth the extra $800?


Do not forget notably worse customer support.

I would not bother with the Dell for another $300 off the asking price.

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zonto
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby zonto » Wed Apr 27, 2011 11:01 am

How is the keyboard on the XPS 15?

By the way, you can configure a model that is around $1,100 with the current coupon/discount for that model that has all the premium upgrades except the TV tuner and the 540M (faster clocked 525M) if memory serves me right.

EDIT: :drool: (LinkRemoved)

EDIT2 regarding XPS15 battery life: "When equipped with a bulky nine-cell battery, the Dell XPS 15 lasted 4 hours and 26 minutes on the LAPTOP Battery Test, which involves continuous surfing over Wi-Fi at 40-percent brightness. That's a little better than the 4:02 mainstream notebook average and way better than the 3-hour mark provided by the ASUS N53JF, but it pales in comparison to the 8-hour and 23-minute time of the 15-inch MacBook Pro."

spets
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby spets » Wed Apr 27, 2011 5:51 pm


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DeeCee
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby DeeCee » Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:09 pm



awesome, haha

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zonto
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby zonto » Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:28 pm

Goodbye desktop. Hello Dell Outlet with coupon code!

Dell XPS 15 L502X
    -- Intel Core i7-2720QM processor (2.20 GHz with Turbo Boost 2.0 up to 3.30 GHz)
    -- 6 GB DDR3 SDRAM 1333MHz (2 DIMMs)
    -- 640 GB SATA Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
    -- 15.6 inch FHD (1920x1080) B+RGLED Display with 2.0 MP HD webcam
    -- NVIDIA GeForce GT540M 2GB graphics with Optimus
    -- Blu-ray Disc Combo (DVD+/-RW + BD-ROM)
    -- Power DVD Software
    -- Internal Backlit Keyboard
    -- 9 Cell Primary Battery
    -- Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6230 and Bluetooth 3.0
    -- Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit Operating System
    -- Sound Blaster X-Fi MB Panzer software version 1.2

Subtotal: $911.20
Shipping and Handling: $19.99
Shipping Discount: -$19.99
Sales Tax: $60.14
Total Amount: $971.34

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ResolutePear
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby ResolutePear » Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:29 pm

You can build yourself a better desktop for less.

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haus
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby haus » Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:53 pm

ResolutePear wrote:You can build yourself a better desktop for less.


This is true.

Although they are a bit awkward to carry to class, if you are so inclined.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby ResolutePear » Thu Apr 28, 2011 5:22 pm

haus wrote:
ResolutePear wrote:You can build yourself a better desktop for less.


This is true.

Although they are a bit awkward to carry to class, if you are so inclined.


I'll never understand people who insist in having a huge SUV or Pickup truck, but can't carry a desktop to class.

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zonto
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby zonto » Thu Apr 28, 2011 5:32 pm

Thing is, I don't want/need a desktop during law school and this has more than enough power for the multimedia/Photoshop work I would want to do. I can sell my HTPC for a few hundred bucks and just use this as my sole machine. PS3 can pick up gaming slack when I can finally get a nice TV this Christmas. Until then, movies/Netflix on this will be more than sufficient. And by that I mean that I won't have time for any of that so it doesn't matter anyway. :)

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aesis
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby aesis » Thu Apr 28, 2011 6:48 pm

zonto wrote:Goodbye desktop. Hello Dell Outlet with coupon code!

Dell XPS 15 L502X
    -- Intel Core i7-2720QM processor (2.20 GHz with Turbo Boost 2.0 up to 3.30 GHz)
    -- 6 GB DDR3 SDRAM 1333MHz (2 DIMMs)
    -- 640 GB SATA Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
    -- 15.6 inch FHD (1920x1080) B+RGLED Display with 2.0 MP HD webcam
    -- NVIDIA GeForce GT540M 2GB graphics with Optimus
    -- Blu-ray Disc Combo (DVD+/-RW + BD-ROM)
    -- Power DVD Software
    -- Internal Backlit Keyboard
    -- 9 Cell Primary Battery
    -- Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6230 and Bluetooth 3.0
    -- Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit Operating System
    -- Sound Blaster X-Fi MB Panzer software version 1.2

Subtotal: $911.20
Shipping and Handling: $19.99
Shipping Discount: -$19.99
Sales Tax: $60.14
Total Amount: $971.34


This is an amazing deal, props on sniping this one. I'm freaking jealous, though wondering about the refurb risk? Probably nothing to worry about.

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zonto
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby zonto » Thu Apr 28, 2011 6:51 pm

Full 1-year warranty and you can add a SquareTrade warranty within a month or two as well. There are still more available; PM me if you want details. :mrgreen:

EDIT: Sweet baby James! Just upgraded that system to a 750GB hard drive, 8GB DDR3 RAM, TV Tuner, and an Intel Centrino Advanced-N + WiMAX 6150 network card for like $60. $1031 total!

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kalvano
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby kalvano » Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:24 pm

Unfortunately, you still have a Dell.

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zonto
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby zonto » Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:35 pm

kalvano wrote:Unfortunately, you still have ordered, but do not yet have in your possession, a Dell.

Unfortunately the "arguments" you've posted on the last two pages bashing Dell are baseless and ignorant. I'm guessing that you've used a consumer line of their laptops before and had a bad experience. Perhaps you blame the company in some way for your own incompetence using one of their systems. Either way, you should know that I've never had a problem with any computer I've built or purchased, Dell or otherwise, and their customer service to me this week has been nothing but stellar.

Anywho, to quote Neena Broderick (the malpractice attorney played by Julianna Margulies on Scrubs): "I don't care about anything that you think about anything."
Last edited by zonto on Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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kalvano
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby kalvano » Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:44 pm

zonto wrote:
kalvano wrote:Unfortunately, you still have a Dell.

Unfortunately the "arguments" you've posted on the last two pages bashing Dell are baseless and ignorant. I'm guessing that you've used a consumer line of their laptops before and had a bad experience. Perhaps you blame the company in some way for your own incompetence using one of their systems. Either way, you should know that I've never had a problem with any computer I've built or purchased, Dell or otherwise, and their customer service to me this week has been nothing but stellar.

Anywho, to quote Neena Broderick (the malpractice attorney played by Julianna Margulies on Scrubs): "I don't care about anything that you think about anything."


Their customer service to you while attempting to get you to buy a computer from them has been good? Shocking.

I blame Dell for shitty after-purchase service, and for using the cheapest possible parts when it's actually detrimental to do so, as well as making stupid stuff proprietary so you can't fix.

They are the Wal-Mart of the computing world.

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zonto
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby zonto » Thu Apr 28, 2011 8:58 pm

Dell is in the business of selling computers, and, with the volume they do, they can use proprietary parts all they want. If you're capable of building your own desktop computer, you probably wouldn't buy a Dell. You also wouldn't buy an HP, Gateway, Toshiba, or (gasp) a Mac either though.

Apple's whole business model centers on the proprietary nature of their products, so do you view them as the Wal-Mart Supercenter of the computing world? Do you boycott buying printers because you refuse to buy proprietary cartridges of ink or toner?

If you want quality parts composing your machine, you pay a premium for it from a manufacturer (Apple) or you build it yourself. Dell's consumer line definitely isn't catered to those that desire that quality enough to pay for it, and as long as Dell is a business trying to make money they are going to batch order products from those they subcontract with to cut their costs. It's no different than what anyone else does.

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kalvano
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby kalvano » Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:10 pm

zonto wrote:Apple's whole business model centers on the proprietary nature of their products, so do you view them as the Wal-Mart Supercenter of the computing world? Do you boycott buying printers because you refuse to buy proprietary cartridges of ink or toner?

If you want quality parts composing your machine, you pay a premium for it from a manufacturer (Apple) or you build it yourself. Dell's consumer line definitely isn't catered to those that desire that quality enough to pay for it, and as long as Dell is a business trying to make money they are going to batch order products from those they subcontract with to cut their costs. It's no different than what anyone else does.



What's inside a Mac is of generally good quality, though. Dell not only uses proprietary parts, they use completely shitty ones.

Whatever, though. Enjoy your Dell.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby ResolutePear » Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:16 pm

kalvano wrote:
zonto wrote:Apple's whole business model centers on the proprietary nature of their products, so do you view them as the Wal-Mart Supercenter of the computing world? Do you boycott buying printers because you refuse to buy proprietary cartridges of ink or toner?

If you want quality parts composing your machine, you pay a premium for it from a manufacturer (Apple) or you build it yourself. Dell's consumer line definitely isn't catered to those that desire that quality enough to pay for it, and as long as Dell is a business trying to make money they are going to batch order products from those they subcontract with to cut their costs. It's no different than what anyone else does.



What's inside a Mac is of generally good quality, though. Dell not only uses proprietary parts, they use completely shitty ones.

Whatever, though. Enjoy your Dell.


Dell = parts bin.

Mac, HP, (maybe, regular)Lenovo, Sony, etc. = all made in the same factory.

jdhonest
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby jdhonest » Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:25 pm

The only thing more annoying than mac owners obsessed with their macs are PC people who hate mac owners for being obsessed with their macs. Are some mac owners snarky pricks who don't even have a good grasp on why their computer is "better"? Sure. But, that by no means reflects on the quality of the product.

Also, the myth that macs are also for those who don't know their way around a computer is bogus, outdated, and based on one of the most annoying superiority complexes that exists on the internet: the computer nerd superiority complex. I know my way around a PC just fine, and I still prefer my mac book pro.

If the OP is still following the thread, I suggest you try out a mac book pro for a week, and see how you like it. If you enjoy it, buy one. I think you'll find that although some mac benefits may be overstated, the same is true of the mac negative qualities.

At the end of the day, the mac vs. pc debate boils down to an individual preference best made by the individual.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby ResolutePear » Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:28 pm

jdhonest wrote:The only thing more annoying than mac owners obsessed with their macs are PC people who hate mac owners for being obsessed with their macs. Are some mac owners snarky pricks who don't even have a good grasp on why their computer is "better"? Sure. But, that by no means reflects on the quality of the product.

Also, the myth that macs are also for those who don't know their way around a computer is bogus, outdated, and based on one of the most annoying superiority complexes that exists on the internet: the computer nerd superiority complex. I know my way around a PC just fine, and I still prefer my mac book pro.

If the OP is still following the thread, I suggest you try out a mac book pro for a week, and see how you like it. If you enjoy it, buy one. I think you'll find that although some mac benefits may be overstated, the same is true of the mac negative qualities.

At the end of the day, the mac vs. pc debate boils down to an individual preference best made by the individual.


You have it a bit skewed.

Macs *ARE* still for people who know next to nothing about computers. And you're right, it is outdated. It's outdated because Windows and Linux have moved to becoming just as easy to use as a Mac.

hth. Love,
The Internet Nerd. /rage<3

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tiniestdancer7
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby tiniestdancer7 » Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:33 pm

i know pretty much nothing so macbook air it is! i like how small it is

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kalvano
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby kalvano » Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:42 pm

tiniestdancer7 wrote:i know pretty much nothing so macbook air it is! i like how small it is



Which is a perfectly valid reason for buying it.

If your argument for or against either a Mac or a PC consists of anything other than personal preference, odds are it's wrong.

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tiniestdancer7
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Re: Mac or PC?

Postby tiniestdancer7 » Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:43 pm

i know absolutely thing comparing the two. i just have lots of friends who help me out either way. plus being able to fit in a small bag is super nice




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