Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

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AreJay711
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby AreJay711 » Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:14 am

BruceWayne wrote:
bdubs wrote:Even at Harvard? DC is the second largest legal market in the country, I can't imagine that it is very hard for a Harvard grad to find a market paying job here.

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1


I personally think that TLS exaggerates the difficulty a bit, but it's definitely harder than the other mass legal market: NYC.


My rational side tells me that too. From what I get from here I might as well just write off D.C. completely and only even consider a future career in NYC, a PD earning 40K a year, or a proud owner of a hot-dog cart. Then again maybe the legal market is worse than I realize from the pessimism on TLS.

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vanwinkle
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby vanwinkle » Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:36 am

bdubs wrote:Even at Harvard? DC is the second largest legal market in the country, I can't imagine that it is very hard for a Harvard grad to find a market paying job here.

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1

As someone who is at Harvard and been through OCI, I can tell you that it's possible to do very well in other markets while getting totally shut out of DC. I say that from both my own personal experience and what I've gathered from others here.

Quite a few Harvard kids are upset right now about how they tanked at OCI and had to scramble to find jobs. One repeating scenario I heard of was the kid without excellent grades who focused on DC and got nothing, and ended up pissed that nobody told him focusing on DC was a bad idea.

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RVP11
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby RVP11 » Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:47 am

AreJay711 wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
bdubs wrote:Even at Harvard? DC is the second largest legal market in the country, I can't imagine that it is very hard for a Harvard grad to find a market paying job here.

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1


I personally think that TLS exaggerates the difficulty a bit, but it's definitely harder than the other mass legal market: NYC.


My rational side tells me that too. From what I get from here I might as well just write off D.C. completely and only even consider a future career in NYC, a PD earning 40K a year, or a proud owner of a hot-dog cart. Then again maybe the legal market is worse than I realize from the pessimism on TLS.


The last two years there have been LR grade-on people from UVA striking out in DC, and it's generally accepted that if you're not top third (or even top quarter) every bid you place on a DC firm is a total waste. To compare to NYC, most LR grade-ons can get a V10 in NYC if they want it, and I don't know of a single person above median who shot for NYC and missed.

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AreJay711
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby AreJay711 » Mon Nov 29, 2010 2:31 am

RVP11 wrote:
AreJay711 wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
bdubs wrote:Even at Harvard? DC is the second largest legal market in the country, I can't imagine that it is very hard for a Harvard grad to find a market paying job here.

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1


I personally think that TLS exaggerates the difficulty a bit, but it's definitely harder than the other mass legal market: NYC.


My rational side tells me that too. From what I get from here I might as well just write off D.C. completely and only even consider a future career in NYC, a PD earning 40K a year, or a proud owner of a hot-dog cart. Then again maybe the legal market is worse than I realize from the pessimism on TLS.


The last two years there have been LR grade-on people from UVA striking out in DC, and it's generally accepted that if you're not top third (or even top quarter) every bid you place on a DC firm is a total waste. To compare to NYC, most LR grade-ons can get a V10 in NYC if they want it, and I don't know of a single person above median who shot for NYC and missed.


Very interesting. Good thing I like NYC lol.

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bostlaw
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby bostlaw » Mon Nov 29, 2010 2:41 am

BruceWayne wrote:
bdubs wrote:Even at Harvard? DC is the second largest legal market in the country, I can't imagine that it is very hard for a Harvard grad to find a market paying job here.

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1


I personally think that TLS exaggerates the difficulty a bit, but it's definitely harder than the other mass legal market: NYC.


TLS exaggerates everything a bit

whymeohgodno
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby whymeohgodno » Mon Nov 29, 2010 3:02 am

Only Harvard can get away with having such a large class size.

HeavenWood
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby HeavenWood » Mon Nov 29, 2010 1:45 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:Only Harvard can get away with having such a large class size.


Poor Cooley...

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nealric
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby nealric » Mon Nov 29, 2010 3:44 pm

I don't quite understand the class-size thing. Yes, GULC has a large class size compared to other law schools, but it also attracts more employers to OCI than any other school besides Harvard. It was pretty cool to pretty much pick any firm in the country you wanted to interview with (with just a few exceptions).

I thought attending GULC was a great experience.

But I guess
Image

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RVP11
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby RVP11 » Mon Nov 29, 2010 5:08 pm

bostlaw wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
bdubs wrote:Even at Harvard? DC is the second largest legal market in the country, I can't imagine that it is very hard for a Harvard grad to find a market paying job here.

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1


I personally think that TLS exaggerates the difficulty a bit, but it's definitely harder than the other mass legal market: NYC.


TLS exaggerates everything a bit


This is one thing TLS actually understates. DC is by far the most difficult big market.

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bostlaw
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby bostlaw » Mon Nov 29, 2010 5:17 pm

RVP11 wrote:
bostlaw wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
bdubs wrote:Even at Harvard? DC is the second largest legal market in the country, I can't imagine that it is very hard for a Harvard grad to find a market paying job here.

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1


I personally think that TLS exaggerates the difficulty a bit, but it's definitely harder than the other mass legal market: NYC.


TLS exaggerates everything a bit


This is one thing TLS actually understates. DC is by far the most difficult big market.


show me somewhere where anyone credible understated it?

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nealric
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby nealric » Mon Nov 29, 2010 6:15 pm

This is one thing TLS actually understates. DC is by far the most difficult big market.


Perhaps, but more GULC students are NYC bound. In my class, I know at least 2 NYC people for every DC one.

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im_blue
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby im_blue » Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:56 pm

nealric wrote:
This is one thing TLS actually understates. DC is by far the most difficult big market.


Perhaps, but more GULC students are NYC bound. In my class, I know at least 2 NYC people for every DC one.

Nope, DC 42% vs NYC 24%.

http://www.law.georgetown.edu/admissions/QuickFacts.htm

markymark
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby markymark » Mon Nov 29, 2010 9:01 pm

RVP11 wrote:
This is one thing TLS actually understates. DC is by far the most difficult big market.



I actually disagree with this. Seems from friends that this year Chicago was much more difficult to break into. Either way, both markets are infinitely harder than NYC.

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nealric
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby nealric » Mon Nov 29, 2010 10:40 pm




I'm talking biglaw people because people seemed to be talking about "Cracking" DC as a biglaw market. Those numbers include everyone.

motiontodismiss
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby motiontodismiss » Tue Nov 30, 2010 7:20 pm

The same reason Cornell gets such cap here....it's the worst T14. That and placement numbers are worse than Vanderbilt.

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nealric
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby nealric » Tue Nov 30, 2010 7:26 pm

The same reason Cornell gets such cap here....it's the worst T14. That and placement numbers are worse than Vanderbilt.


They were for one year based on certain criteria. With the recession beginning to ramp up, Vanderbilt benefited from a more stable base for SA hiring (i.e. firms in the south). In past years, GULC has done better.

Georgetown blows Vanderbilt away in placement in the United States Congress:
Vanderbilt: 0
Georgetown: 7
:mrgreen:


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Last edited by nealric on Tue Nov 30, 2010 7:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.

whymeohgodno
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby whymeohgodno » Tue Nov 30, 2010 7:28 pm

Also having the letter "t" in your school almost never helps. Too many TTT jokes.

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Sentry
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby Sentry » Tue Nov 30, 2010 11:03 pm

whymeohgodno wrote:Also having the letter "t" in your school almost never helps. Too many TTT jokes.

Just ask STTTanford.

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Perch
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby Perch » Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:19 am

im_blue wrote:
nealric wrote:
This is one thing TLS actually understates. DC is by far the most difficult big market.


Perhaps, but more GULC students are NYC bound. In my class, I know at least 2 NYC people for every DC one.

Nope, DC 42% vs NYC 24%.

http://www.law.georgetown.edu/admissions/QuickFacts.htm


If I'm looking for NYC, what seems better these days- Vanderbilt or Georgetown? Of course, who knows where I end up in 10 years but as a 0L NYC seems like where I want to end up.

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BruceWayne
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby BruceWayne » Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:13 pm

bostlaw wrote:
BruceWayne wrote:
bdubs wrote:Even at Harvard? DC is the second largest legal market in the country, I can't imagine that it is very hard for a Harvard grad to find a market paying job here.

http://www.law.com/jsp/nlj/PubArticleNL ... hbxlogin=1


I personally think that TLS exaggerates the difficulty a bit, but it's definitely harder than the other mass legal market: NYC.


TLS exaggerates everything a bit


Yeah, you're preaching to the choir. I actually know a reasonable amount of people who are headed to DC firms here at UVA, and honestly none of them have sky high grades. One of them was below median first semester 1L and I believe they didn't get any higher than the median by the time 1L was over. TLS has a flare for the dramatic. If you're grading onto LR ( that means you are one of the top 25 people in your entire class--those are insanely good grades) and you're getting shut out of DC, it isn't because of your grades/school.


im_blue wrote:
nealric wrote:
This is one thing TLS actually understates. DC is by far the most difficult big market.


Perhaps, but more GULC students are NYC bound. In my class, I know at least 2 NYC people for every DC one.

Nope, DC 42% vs NYC 24%.

http://www.law.georgetown.edu/admissions/QuickFacts.htm


This is another thing that keys you into the fact that TLS is exaggerating, if DC were as hard as they make it out to be (ie only HYS and top 2 percent at the rest of the top 14 have a shot) there's no way in hell that high of a percentage of GULC's class (or George Washington for that matter) would be working in DC.

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Patriot1208
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby Patriot1208 » Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:30 pm

BruceWayne wrote:
im_blue wrote:
nealric wrote:
This is one thing TLS actually understates. DC is by far the most difficult big market.


Perhaps, but more GULC students are NYC bound. In my class, I know at least 2 NYC people for every DC one.

Nope, DC 42% vs NYC 24%.

http://www.law.georgetown.edu/admissions/QuickFacts.htm


This is another thing that keys you into the fact that TLS is exaggerating, if DC were as hard as they make it out to be (ie only HYS and top 2 percent at the rest of the top 14 have a shot) there's no way in hell that high of a percentage of GULC's class (or George Washington for that matter) would be working in DC.


This discussion about firms in DC and NYC was limited to biglaw. That number is, without a doubt, not talking about biglaw and instead all students together. I'd wager, purely anecdotally of course, that over half of that 42% are government jobs, small firms, PI, etc.

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RVP11
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby RVP11 » Fri Dec 10, 2010 12:34 pm

BruceWayne wrote:If you're grading onto LR ( that means you are one of the top 25 people in your entire class--those are insanely good grades) and you're getting shut out of DC, it isn't because of your grades/school.


That's not the point, though. The point is that people who are top 25% and better and go for NY basically never get shut out (so, even if they interview terribly), while people with those grades get shut out of DC all the time. Also, this year it seemed like very few people had more than one DC option, while a lot of people had multiple offers from NYC.

I remember a lot of 1Ls last year thought the way you do. Then they changed their tune after seeing their return on DC preselects.

Feel free to PM UVA 2Ls like Cavalier and vamedic. They don't disagree with me.

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nealric
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Re: Why does Georgetown get a bad rep?

Postby nealric » Fri Dec 10, 2010 1:23 pm

I'd wager, purely anecdotally of course, that over half of that 42% are government jobs, small firms, PI, etc.


Right, the vast majority of people I know staying in DC are doing government or public interest.




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