Go to Law School???

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monaarts
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Go to Law School???

Postby monaarts » Sun Aug 29, 2010 2:19 am

Hello everyone,

I have been thinking about law school for a couple of years now, ever since I took my Business Law class in undergraduate at my current college. I truly enjoyed the subject and loved the way two people could see the same law differently. I was genuinely interested in what I learned that entire semester…

I have been thinking hard about it over the last couple months and I have done a lot of research. It seems like everything I can find to read says "Do NOT go to law school because of ___________". Mainly seems to be about issues finding jobs after graduation or salaries with job you do find after graduation.

I am somewhat of a risk taker but I am engaged to be married in May 2011 and my fiance wants to have children in the next couple of years, so I have to think about financial safety as well. From you guys who are in law school or had just recently graduated, do you think there is a better chance of not being financially happy soon after graduation from law school? I don't need to be making $500k a year, but enough to pay off my school loans, pay for a nice house and provide my family with a nice life is what I do consider mandatory.

Thanks for your help and input in advance!


- Joe

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Adjudicator
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby Adjudicator » Sun Aug 29, 2010 2:22 am

What was your undergraduate GPA?

I ask, because the answer to your question will depend in large part on which schools you can get into.

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ResolutePear
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby ResolutePear » Sun Aug 29, 2010 2:28 am

Whether or not to go to law school... all I can say is: maybe.

monaarts
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby monaarts » Sun Aug 29, 2010 2:35 am

I haven't graduated yet. I will graduate with probably around a 2.9-3.0. I typically do really well on tests and would imagine I could do well on the LSAT too. I would like to go to either the University of Georgia or Georgia State University. Thank again!


- Joe

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ResolutePear
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby ResolutePear » Sun Aug 29, 2010 2:54 am

monaarts wrote:I haven't graduated yet. I will graduate with probably around a 2.9-3.0. I typically do really well on tests and would imagine I could do well on the LSAT too. I would like to go to either the University of Georgia or Georgia State University. Thank again!


- Joe


Have you checked the rankings? Also, at least do a PT to know a baseline for what rankings you'll qualify for.

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rdcws000
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby rdcws000 » Sun Aug 29, 2010 4:14 am

monaarts wrote:Hello everyone,

I have been thinking about law school for a couple of years now, ever since I took my Business Law class in undergraduate at my current college. I truly enjoyed the subject and loved the way two people could see the same law differently. I was genuinely interested in what I learned that entire semester…

I have been thinking hard about it over the last couple months and I have done a lot of research. It seems like everything I can find to read says "Do NOT go to law school because of ___________". Mainly seems to be about issues finding jobs after graduation or salaries with job you do find after graduation.

I am somewhat of a risk taker but I am engaged to be married in May 2011 and my fiance wants to have children in the next couple of years, so I have to think about financial safety as well. From you guys who are in law school or had just recently graduated, do you think there is a better chance of not being financially happy soon after graduation from law school? I don't need to be making $500k a year, but enough to pay off my school loans, pay for a nice house and provide my family with a nice life is what I do consider mandatory.

Thanks for your help and input in advance!


- Joe


I'm thinking if you're just about to graduate and you're getting married you should enter the workforce for a couple years, assuming this is a possibility for you.

Make some money and start your family, and really think about whether it is something you want to do. You could work for 3 years and still enter law school at age 25 (assuming you're graduating undergrad at the standard age).

Whatever you do, just don't do it for the lack of a better idea.

judgeholden
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby judgeholden » Mon Aug 30, 2010 9:35 am

Do you have loans to pay off from undergrad?

Is law school worth it? Depends, really, on what law school you can get into and how badly you want to be an attorney. If you think law is kind of neat and maybe you'll enjoy it, then it's likely not worth it. If your father is an attorney, your uncle is an attorney, and you know what they do inside and out and know it's for you, it's most likely worth it. If those two can get you jobs at their firms it's absolutely worth it.

As mentioned, though, if it's because you're only mildly interested, or because you can't think of anything else, or because you think it'll lead to a "career" and some kind of financial security, look elsewhere. It's a poor option for these reasons, and these reasons are a big reason why law is such a miserable profession - too many get in for these reasons and absolutely despise it in retrospect.

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johnnyutah
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby johnnyutah » Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:15 am

judgeholden wrote:As mentioned, though, if it's because you're only mildly interested, or because you can't think of anything else, or because you think it'll lead to a "career" and some kind of financial security, look elsewhere.

Depends on what his other options for earning a paycheck are. Some people don't really have any good ones.

judgeholden
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby judgeholden » Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:27 am

johnnyutah wrote:
judgeholden wrote:As mentioned, though, if it's because you're only mildly interested, or because you can't think of anything else, or because you think it'll lead to a "career" and some kind of financial security, look elsewhere.

Depends on what his other options for earning a paycheck are. Some people don't really have any good ones.


In that case you likely have no options to get into a good law school and no options to get a good job afterwards, so you're paying $150k to limit your career choices and likely be in a lesser position than you had been 3 years prior.

CanadianWolf
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby CanadianWolf » Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:31 am

Your chances are slim for Georgia or Georgia State with a GPA of approx. 2.95. If you want to attend law school in Georgia, your best option based on your GPA may be Mercer University in Macon.

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johnnyutah
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby johnnyutah » Mon Aug 30, 2010 11:38 am

judgeholden wrote:
johnnyutah wrote:
judgeholden wrote:As mentioned, though, if it's because you're only mildly interested, or because you can't think of anything else, or because you think it'll lead to a "career" and some kind of financial security, look elsewhere.

Depends on what his other options for earning a paycheck are. Some people don't really have any good ones.

In that case you likely have no options to get into a good law school

Why's that?

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St.Remy
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby St.Remy » Mon Aug 30, 2010 11:49 am

johnnyutah wrote: Why's that?


Because if he would have no other career prospects that probably translates into having no good work experience or other meaningful softs. Combine that with a <3.0 GPA and he's not looking good for any top school or even a good target area school unless he knocks the LSAT out of the park (and "testing well" doesn't seem like a great reason to have high expectations on the LSAT).

Pip
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby Pip » Mon Aug 30, 2010 1:08 pm

monaarts wrote:Hello everyone,

I have been thinking about law school for a couple of years now, ever since I took my Business Law class in undergraduate at my current college. I truly enjoyed the subject and loved the way two people could see the same law differently. I was genuinely interested in what I learned that entire semester…

I have been thinking hard about it over the last couple months and I have done a lot of research. It seems like everything I can find to read says "Do NOT go to law school because of ___________". Mainly seems to be about issues finding jobs after graduation or salaries with job you do find after graduation.

I am somewhat of a risk taker but I am engaged to be married in May 2011 and my fiance wants to have children in the next couple of years, so I have to think about financial safety as well. From you guys who are in law school or had just recently graduated, do you think there is a better chance of not being financially happy soon after graduation from law school? I don't need to be making $500k a year, but enough to pay off my school loans, pay for a nice house and provide my family with a nice life is what I do consider mandatory.

Thanks for your help and input in advance!


- Joe


First, let me address your business law experience.... Yes it was good, it normally is... I had a class in undergrad in business law also and it was great... the corporate law class I took in law school was also great, also very easy to ace... BUT the rest of the law school classes were not like business law. If I had to rank the enjoyment of all my law school classes I would certainly rank business law way up there... but I would also rank at least half the other classes way down on the enjoyment scale some down onto torture. So don't think that because your one experience with undergrad business law is going to be a fair representation of what you would experience in law school, it isn't.

Now, based on your GPA you aren't likely to get into a top law school...but because there are more law schools than you can shake a stick at you could get into one unless you managed to completely bomb the LSAT, and then you would probably still be able to get into one of the very bottom schools (not because they believed in you but because they want you to borrow money and give it to them).... with the fact that you aren't getting into a top school you're job prospects are not what you see on TV shows. You might even find that after law school you are forced to work outside the field of law... You could be making very low wages, that's just the fact of a profession that has more lawyers than are needed.

You may find that you are now making the same money you would have made if you went to work after you graduated undergrad, but you will be forking over a lot more money in student loan payments... that might not be a problem if you were doing this because you loved the law, but I don't hear anything in what you say telling me you really just love the law.

Do yourself a favor, don't go.

Go start your family, work and if you want to get a law degree later do it part time... some companies you work for will actually cover your costs of part time study.

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johnnyutah
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby johnnyutah » Mon Aug 30, 2010 5:42 pm

St.Remy wrote:
johnnyutah wrote: Why's that?

Because if he would have no other career prospects that probably translates into having no good work experience or other meaningful softs. Combine that with a <3.0 GPA and he's not looking good for any top school or even a good target area school unless he knocks the LSAT out of the park (and "testing well" doesn't seem like a great reason to have high expectations on the LSAT).

Since when is testing well not a good reason to expect a good score on the LSAT?

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ResolutePear
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby ResolutePear » Mon Aug 30, 2010 5:50 pm

I sat around today and give this post some thought and reflected it on myself. You know what I came up with?

Grow some balls and play Russian Roulette. That'll put life into perspective.

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beachbum
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby beachbum » Mon Aug 30, 2010 6:04 pm

St.Remy wrote:
johnnyutah wrote: Why's that?


Because if he would have no other career prospects that probably translates into having no good work experience or other meaningful softs. Combine that with a <3.0 GPA and he's not looking good for any top school or even a good target area school unless he knocks the LSAT out of the park (and "testing well" doesn't seem like a great reason to have high expectations on the LSAT).


Since when do work experience and softs dictate where you can and can not go to law school? If the OP does well on the LSAT (which, mind you, is a very learnable test), he'll have plenty of options to choose from.

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legalease9
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby legalease9 » Mon Aug 30, 2010 6:27 pm

Do you really want to be a lawyer? If no, then don't go.

If yes, then you have to decide how strongly you want to be a lawyer. Even if you get into a decent school, you are probably looking at 5 or more years of financial struggle starting now. Could be as many as 10. Having a family and going to law school can be done, but it is a stressful path. And its not worth it unless you really want to be a lawyer. So its all about my first question.

Bumi
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby Bumi » Mon Aug 30, 2010 11:59 pm

johnnyutah wrote:
judgeholden wrote:As mentioned, though, if it's because you're only mildly interested, or because you can't think of anything else, or because you think it'll lead to a "career" and some kind of financial security, look elsewhere.

Depends on what his other options for earning a paycheck are. Some people don't really have any good ones.

People without good options coming out of undergrad are almost certainly unlikely to have good options coming out of law school. If you can't market yourself or interview well now, 3 years in a law library ain't gonna change that.

OP: If it's a job you want, find the biggest (or fastest growing) companies in the cities you'd be willing to work in, and then apply to them. Doesn't matter what job you're applying for, you can sort all that out when you get called back. I deal with business law on a regular basis, and I've never been a lawyer, I just work in business. Anyways, come back to the idea of law school after you've tried applying to companies and it didn't work out. Law isn't a field for people who can't think of anything else to do.

Also, if you are a risk taker, you will NOT fit in with lawyers. Lawyers are risk averse. This is how they are paid to act. If you want to take risks, go work for a small company or startup. Hell, start a business. Take the $200K debt that you were willing to borrow for a law education and try to build a company from scratch.

lawschooliseasy
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby lawschooliseasy » Tue Aug 31, 2010 9:00 am

johnnyutah wrote:
St.Remy wrote:
johnnyutah wrote: Why's that?

Because if he would have no other career prospects that probably translates into having no good work experience or other meaningful softs. Combine that with a <3.0 GPA and he's not looking good for any top school or even a good target area school unless he knocks the LSAT out of the park (and "testing well" doesn't seem like a great reason to have high expectations on the LSAT).

Since when is testing well not a good reason to expect a good score on the LSAT?


Because most people say that they test well because they aced the ACT/SAT... then sit down and realize that the LSAT is actually hard.

judgeholden
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby judgeholden » Tue Aug 31, 2010 11:01 am

Bumi wrote:
johnnyutah wrote:
judgeholden wrote:As mentioned, though, if it's because you're only mildly interested, or because you can't think of anything else, or because you think it'll lead to a "career" and some kind of financial security, look elsewhere.

Depends on what his other options for earning a paycheck are. Some people don't really have any good ones.

People without good options coming out of undergrad are almost certainly unlikely to have good options coming out of law school. If you can't market yourself or interview well now, 3 years in a law library ain't gonna change that.

OP: If it's a job you want, find the biggest (or fastest growing) companies in the cities you'd be willing to work in, and then apply to them. Doesn't matter what job you're applying for, you can sort all that out when you get called back. I deal with business law on a regular basis, and I've never been a lawyer, I just work in business. Anyways, come back to the idea of law school after you've tried applying to companies and it didn't work out. Law isn't a field for people who can't think of anything else to do.

Also, if you are a risk taker, you will NOT fit in with lawyers. Lawyers are risk averse. This is how they are paid to act. If you want to take risks, go work for a small company or startup. Hell, start a business. Take the $200K debt that you were willing to borrow for a law education and try to build a company from scratch.


Ding ding ding.

The legal job market is a tougher one than the non-legal job market. If this guy is having a rough time finding a job anywhere doing anything then he'll more likely than not have a really, really hard time after limiting himself to one very specialized and very hurting industry.

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johnnyutah
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby johnnyutah » Tue Aug 31, 2010 10:21 pm

Bumi wrote:
johnnyutah wrote:
judgeholden wrote:As mentioned, though, if it's because you're only mildly interested, or because you can't think of anything else, or because you think it'll lead to a "career" and some kind of financial security, look elsewhere.

Depends on what his other options for earning a paycheck are. Some people don't really have any good ones.

People without good options coming out of undergrad are almost certainly unlikely to have good options coming out of law school. If you can't market yourself or interview well now, 3 years in a law library ain't gonna change that.

I think there are a fair number of people this isn't true of (although I'm not arguing that OP is one of them, necessarily).

monaarts
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby monaarts » Thu Sep 09, 2010 4:29 pm

I had never said that I don't have any other career options, so I don't know where a couple of you got that from. I also said I normally do well with tests because I have alot of common sense and I study hard for test, I'm just the type of person to pick up on things easily.

I have worked my entire college career, as a supervisor at Dicks Sporting Goods and as a sales associate at Bank of America. So as far as job experience outside of law, I have it.

Finally, regarding the blaw classes I have taken, I enjoyed the way that law is. I enjoyed doing the research and reading cases. Maybe that helps.


- Joe

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GATORTIM
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Re: Go to Law School???

Postby GATORTIM » Thu Sep 09, 2010 4:38 pm

no




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