Decisions, Decisions

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utk
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Decisions, Decisions

Postby utk » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:19 pm

Hypothetical situation:

Choice 1: University of Tennessee Law School
- Graduate with no debt
- Near top of class (if not the top) and held leadership role in the law review

Choice 2: Vanderbilt University
- Graduate with 75k+ in debt
- Probably would be around cum laude maybe magna cum max and no role in the review

(Having had several conversations with people who actually made this decision, I'm guessing this is about what I could pull off.)

Which choice is better for pursuing assistant U.S. attorney position and which is better for big law?

Thanks

cavebat2000
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby cavebat2000 » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:25 pm

utk wrote:Hypothetical situation:

Choice 1: University of Tennessee Law School
- Graduate with no debt
- Near top of class (if not the top) and held leadership role in the law review

Choice 2: Vanderbilt University
- Graduate with 75k+ in debt
- Probably would be around cum laude maybe magna cum max and no role in the review

(Having had several conversations with people who actually made this decision, I'm guessing this is about what I could pull off.)


Which choice is better for pursuing assistant U.S. attorney position and which is better for big law?

Thanks


I mean you no offense, but I wouldn't be so presumptuous about your class rank. That being said, I think 75k debt is a small price to pay for the lifetime of benefits you will get going to Vanderbilt.

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NU_Jet55
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby NU_Jet55 » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:30 pm

cavebat2000 wrote:
utk wrote:Hypothetical situation:

Choice 1: University of Tennessee Law School
- Graduate with no debt
- Near top of class (if not the top) and held leadership role in the law review

Choice 2: Vanderbilt University
- Graduate with 75k+ in debt
- Probably would be around cum laude maybe magna cum max and no role in the review

(Having had several conversations with people who actually made this decision, I'm guessing this is about what I could pull off.)


Which choice is better for pursuing assistant U.S. attorney position and which is better for big law?

Thanks


I mean you no offense, but I wouldn't be so presumptuous about your class rank. That being said, I think 75k debt is a small price to pay for the lifetime of benefits you will get going to Vanderbilt.


+1, but this is actually being way too nice. If you want some of that good old-fashioned TLS honesty, it is absolutely ridiculous to presume anything about your class rank.

msfreethink
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby msfreethink » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:33 pm

I would definitely choose Vandy.

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Veyron
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby Veyron » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:34 pm

Yah dood, I wouldn't be nearly so cocky about how I would do at those schools, I guarantee I have better #’s than you as well (see, I am cocky, just not suicidaly so).

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4for44
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby 4for44 » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:35 pm

NU_Jet55 wrote:
cavebat2000 wrote:
utk wrote:Hypothetical situation:

Choice 1: University of Tennessee Law School
- Graduate with no debt
- Near top of class (if not the top) and held leadership role in the law review

Choice 2: Vanderbilt University
- Graduate with 75k+ in debt
- Probably would be around cum laude maybe magna cum max and no role in the review

(Having had several conversations with people who actually made this decision, I'm guessing this is about what I could pull off.)


Which choice is better for pursuing assistant U.S. attorney position and which is better for big law?

Thanks


I mean you no offense, but I wouldn't be so presumptuous about your class rank. That being said, I think 75k debt is a small price to pay for the lifetime of benefits you will get going to Vanderbilt.


+1, but this is actually being way too nice. If you want some of that good old-fashioned TLS honesty, it is absolutely ridiculous to presume anything about your class rank.



+2 Go to Vandy, no way you can expect to be top of class- Vandy will give you more connections assuming you don't graduate top __%

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T14_Scholly
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby T14_Scholly » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:36 pm

Choice 1: retarded assumption

Choice 2: retarded assumption

Answer to your question: impossible to say when assuming your retarded hypothetical situation.

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utk
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby utk » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:41 pm

Sorry, I didn't mean for it to come off that way, but I know several people who just got into UT law and their academic abilities are almost humorous. Actually, I was able to sit in on a contracts class last semester and was very unimpressed by some of the attitudes and responses given by the students. I mean this prof was calling on people left and right and I would guess only 1 out of 5 could even answer the question. Maybe I was just there on an off-day, but the unpreparedness of the students was pretty shocking. I have no qualms about competing with some of these people.

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Veyron
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby Veyron » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:46 pm

utk wrote:Sorry, I didn't mean for it to come off that way, but I know several people who just got into UT law and their academic abilities are almost humorous. Actually, I was able to sit in on a contracts class last semester and was very unimpressed by some of the attitudes and responses given by the students. I mean this prof was calling on people left and right and I would guess only 1 out of 5 could even answer the question. Maybe I was just there on an off-day, but the unpreparedness of the students was pretty shocking. I have no qualms about competing with some of these people.


Class participation =/= exam performance. I have heard this over and over again from my friends attending T-14's whenever I say that kids in class didn't look that smart or ready. Trust me, the kids in classes I visited at Penn and NYU looked like idiots too... they are not.

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NU_Jet55
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby NU_Jet55 » Tue Mar 30, 2010 4:50 pm

utk wrote:I know several people who just got into UT law and their academic abilities are almost humorous...I have no qualms about competing with some of these people.


Not the best attitude to approach any law school with...Answering questions in class in no way affects your grade or class rank. Furthermore, your first semester of 1L is the most important of your life; I hope for your sake you realize this, and don't for a second assume that your classmates don't realize this.

Go to Vandy and do your best. /thread

HTH

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traehekat
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby traehekat » Tue Mar 30, 2010 5:08 pm

NU_Jet55 wrote:
utk wrote:I know several people who just got into UT law and their academic abilities are almost humorous...I have no qualms about competing with some of these people.


Not the best attitude to approach any law school with...Answering questions in class in no way affects your grade or class rank.


Everyone knows the smarter you are the less you prepare for class.

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TTTennis
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby TTTennis » Tue Mar 30, 2010 5:12 pm

T14_Scholly wrote:Choice 1: retarded assumption

Choice 2: retarded assumption

Answer to your question: impossible to say when assuming your retarded hypothetical situation.


Hilarious...+1

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gdane
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby gdane » Tue Mar 30, 2010 10:01 pm

Noon here is going to hire you for a U.S. Attorney's position or a Biglaw job. Dont worry about what a bunch of law students and pre law students say.

With that being said, I would recommend Vandy. Simply because I dont like Tenn. Ha!

Just work hard, try to make a lot of connection and be as persistant as you can be and you'll be fine.

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TTTennis
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby TTTennis » Tue Mar 30, 2010 10:14 pm

gdane5 wrote:Noon here is going to hire you for a U.S. Attorney's position or a Biglaw job. Dont worry about what a bunch of law students and pre law students say.

With that being said, I would recommend Vandy. Simply because I dont like Tenn. Ha!

Just work hard, try to make a lot of connection and be as persistant as you can be and you'll be fine.


I agree...I'm going TTTT, and after graduating top of my class, am going to start a career in academia. If I end up at the bottom half of the curve I will just work hard and be really persistent. Plus, I hear the hiring partners really like cookies and my mom is an extraordinary baker, so she's gonna help too. Screw those elitist TLS snobs, they don't even know what the real world is like!

P.S. Vandy all the way baby, woooo!

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utk
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby utk » Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:00 pm

haha i would love to see TTTennis run his mouth in person

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TTTennis
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby TTTennis » Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:04 pm

utk wrote:haha i would love to see TTTennis run his mouth in person


:shock: easy tough guy...I run it all the time and I'm healthy as can be :D

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TTTennis
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby TTTennis » Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:12 pm

On a different note, I say Tenn...coming out of law school with no debt is a great thing, especially ite. And if your hypotheticals don't work out, you won't have a huge student loan to worry about.

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Grizz
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby Grizz » Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:13 pm

Vandy because of increased job prospects justifying the debt, unless you for some reason never see yourself leaving TN; hopefully you aren't as pompous as your assumptions in your first post make you out to be.

Geist13
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby Geist13 » Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:30 pm

vandy all the way. pick up one of these:

http://www.zazzle.com/i_hate_tennessee_ ... 9987770974

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ggocat
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby ggocat » Tue Mar 30, 2010 11:40 pm

utk wrote:Choice 2: Vanderbilt University
- Graduate with 75k+ in debt
- Probably would be around cum laude maybe magna cum max and no role in the review

What are you defining as "cum laude" and "magna cum" (in terms of class rank; these terms mean different things at different schools)? Can a Vandy student pipe in and comment? From Vandy's website, it doesn't even appear as if the school gives cum/magna/summa honors. See http://law.vanderbilt.edu/academics/hon ... ndex.aspx; see also http://www.nalplawschoolsonline.org and search Vanderbilt.

utk wrote:Which choice is better for pursuing assistant U.S. attorney position and which is better for big law?

Assuming cum/magna is in the top third, then Vandy is probably a better bet for biglaw. But top 10% at UTK will also probably be fine for biglaw.

For AUSA positions, you're unlikely to get one of these straight out of school under either of the options you presented. Thus, I don't think it matters. But USAOs seem to hire local school graduates graduates more so than non-local school graduates, and they often hire from DA offices (for the criminal division). So to the extent graduating with no debt and going to the local school would better position you for a an ADA position, then maybe UTK has a slight edge?

Regardless, unless you are debt averse, I think Vandy offers significantly better employment opportunities and is actually the "better bet" of the two schools. In a good year, more than half the class at Vandy had either biglaw or federal clerkship. Probably less than 15-20% at UTK. http://pdfserver.amlaw.com/nlj/composite.pdf. Unlike the difference in biglaw placement that most people face when considering a scholarship (usually 10% vs. 20% or 30% in the typical tier 1 vs. tier 2 scenario), the difference between Vandy and UTK is significant.

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Grizz
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby Grizz » Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:46 am

Vandy has a "Dean's List" or something for the top 30% I think (too lazy to look up numbers, it's in the Obiter Dictum they sent you), but they don't rank and have no magna, summa, etc.

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Richie Tenenbaum
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby Richie Tenenbaum » Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:55 am

utk wrote:haha i would love to see TTTennis run his mouth in person


:roll: :roll:

I call flame. OP is just trying to hard to come off as super-douchetastic.

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stratocophic
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby stratocophic » Wed Mar 31, 2010 12:58 am

Richie Tenenbaum wrote:
utk wrote:haha i would love to see TTTennis run his mouth in person


:roll: :roll:

I call flame. OP is just trying to hard to come off as super-douchetastic.

You're obviously unfamiliar with UTK fans. Not saying you're wrong about calling flame, but as someone who lives in the state...

270910
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Re: Decisions, Decisions

Postby 270910 » Wed Mar 31, 2010 11:44 am

utk wrote:Sorry, I didn't mean for it to come off that way, but I know several people who just got into UT law and their academic abilities are almost humorous. Actually, I was able to sit in on a contracts class last semester and was very unimpressed by some of the attitudes and responses given by the students. I mean this prof was calling on people left and right and I would guess only 1 out of 5 could even answer the question. Maybe I was just there on an off-day, but the unpreparedness of the students was pretty shocking. I have no qualms about competing with some of these people.


AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAH.

Some of the stupidest people when it came to getting called on in class were at the top of the class in terms of grades.

I know plenty of people who got in with LSAT scores far above my school's 75th percentile who are in the bottom 25th percentile in terms of grades.

Look, you might do it. But expecting it is completely insane. You have no idea what law school is like. You cannot predict your success (at least using those metrics).




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