UC San Diego=New law school...This is out of hand Forum

[Aberzombie1892]

Normally I'm not all doom and gloom, but this is getting ridiculous.

The UC system needs to just stop.

I mean they have:

Berkeley
UCLA
Davis
Hastings
Irvine (in progress)

and now they want San Diego?

Not only are they hurting the competition, but they are cannibalizing themselves.

All of this on top of massive tuition hikes.

--LinkRemoved--

[jlnoa0915]

Until law schools stop making big money off students, they're going to continue doing this

[gymboree]

at least it's a school that already exists... it's not as if they'd be spitting out 300 additional lawyers each year.

[danquayle]

at least it's a school that already exists... it's not as if they'd be spitting out 300 additional lawyers each year.

University of San Diego has a law school already. UC San Diego doesn't. So unless I'm missing something in your post, I think you're mistaken. They would indeed be spitting out 300 additional lawyers each year.

[DoctorNick189]

at least it's a school that already exists... it's not as if they'd be spitting out 300 additional lawyers each year.

University of San Diego has a law school already. UC San Diego doesn't. So unless I'm missing something in your post, I think you're mistaken. They would indeed be spitting out 300 additional lawyers each year.

merger w/ cal western

[sapp]

Considering the law school choices for San Diegans are USD (private) and 2 relatively unknown T3 schools and how big/geographically important a city San Diego, is I think it makes perfect sense. Though the UC system in general drives me crazy.

[sundaynightdelite]

Considering the law school choices for San Diegans are USD (private) and 2 relatively unknown T3 schools and how big/geographically important a city San Diego, is I think it makes perfect sense. Though the UC system in general drives me crazy.

T4, to be exact.

That's the facts, Jack.

[JOThompson]

Normally I'm not all doom and gloom, but this is getting ridiculous.

The UC system needs to just stop.

I mean they have:

Berkeley
UCLA
Davis
Hastings
Irvine (in progress)

and now they want San Diego?

Not only are they hurting the competition, but they are cannibalizing themselves.

All of this on top of massive tuition hikes.

--LinkRemoved--

The UCSD law school would be privately funded. I imagine the merger would benefit UCSD and Cal Western, so I don't see why there's an uproar over the proposal.

[1WingedAngel]

Because Southern California has enough law schools. We don't need more law grads oversaturating the market or more people in horrible debt. San Diego gets a lot of people from the Los Angeles-area schools as well.

[im_blue]

Because Southern California has enough law schools. We don't need more law grads oversaturating the market or more people in horrible debt. San Diego gets a lot of people from the Los Angeles-area schools as well.

Cal Western is an existing law school that wants to merge with UCSD.

[danquayle]

It doesn't saturate the market any further then, but it does (arguably) threaten the pre-existing San Diego area schools, since I'm sure the UC name will improve the school's marketability.

[saltoftheearth]

It doesn't saturate the market any further then, but it does (arguably) threaten the pre-existing San Diego area schools, since I'm sure the UC name will improve the school's marketability.

this

[Great Satchmo]

I think UCSD should have merged with Cal Western before UC Irvine dumped money into a new law school.

LA area has a lot of decent and solid schools (UCLA, USC, Pepperdine, Loyola, and on...), but San Diego has USD, Cal Western, and Thomas Jefferson.

I'm from San Diego, so of course I hate the place, but I'm considering USD because it's (1) a decent school, and (2) it's campus is not immediately bound by 3 top 30 schools.

[nycparalegal]

Can the California afford another law school?

[eaters333]

I think UCSD should have merged with Cal Western before UC Irvine dumped money into a new law school.

LA area has a lot of decent and solid schools (UCLA, USC, Pepperdine, Loyola, and on...), but San Diego has USD, Cal Western, and Thomas Jefferson.

I'm from San Diego, so of course I hate the place, but I'm considering USD because it's (1) a decent school, and (2) it's campus is not immediately bound by 3 top 30 schools.

UC Irvine is located in one of the wealthiest counties in the US. Law Firms and Tech companies are continually moving into OC every year. There are no T1 law schools in the county and LA is already saturated. So why not live in an amazing area and go to a top notch school. I dont know why you have a problem with UC Irvine starting what promises to be a great school

[BruinsFan]

I'm from San Diego and would like to stay in the area. I've been offered over 81 k in scholarship $ from Cal Western, but haven't heard a peep from USD. I've also been accepted at SCU, Miami, and UoP. Miami's out and I don't know if I can justify paying 150 k for SCU when Cal, Stanford, and Hastings are next door. Talk of this merger makes the idea of attending Cal Western for virtually free (I wouldn't have any living expenses) and having the UC name attached to it within the next couple of years is very tempting. If it doesn't happen, that's a whole other issue.

They tried this once before, in the early 1980's and it didn't pan out because the law school wouldn't be financially independent and would have received some state funding. This time around, it looks as though they would keep the Cal Western facility downtown (rather than move it to UCSD) and it would remain financially independent. On top of all that Cal Western is doing really well financially. It seems like both UCSD and Cal Western would benefit from this union and part of the article mentioned cool areas of focus like medical law and things of the sort.

Before I would have said I would pay sticker at USD over the $$ from Cal Western, but this new factor is definitely impacting my decision. Any thoughts would be appreciated!

[GATORTIM]

UC Irvine is located in one of the wealthiest counties in the US. Law Firms and Tech companies are continually moving into OC every year. There are no T1 law schools in the county and LA is already saturated. So why not live in an amazing area and go to a top notch school. I dont know why you have a problem with UC Irvine starting what promises to be a great school

Whittier and Chapman (although certainly not T-1) are both in OC and graduates are all over the county. Orange County may be wealthy, but it is certainly not as populated as LA and there are a lot of grads from LA law schools in the OC.

[saltoftheearth]

literally just received this email:

UCSD
CAMPUS NOTICE
University of California, San Diego


OFFICE OF THE CHANCELLOR

OFFICE OF THE SENIOR VICE CHANCELLOR –
ACADEMIC AFFAIRS

February 10, 2010


ALL ACADEMICS AND STAFF AT UCSD
ALL STUDENTS AT UCSD

SUBJECT: Joint Committee to Explore UC San Diego Affiliation with
California Western School of Law

UC San Diego and California Western School of Law have formed a joint
committee to consider an affiliation that could lead to the
establishment of a UC San Diego School of Law. The committee is
composed of faculty and administrators from both institutions.

It is important to note that UC San Diego and the joint committee will
only consider a law school that would be self-supporting, and we would
ensure that no state or UC San Diego campus funds would be needed to
make the new law school viable.

The committee will explore ways in which a UC San Diego School of Law
might build on existing strengths, enhance other academic disciplines
and create unique broad-based areas of exploration in law, science and
technology. In addition, the committee will consider how to integrate
existing California Western faculty and plan for new hires; attract
students with strong credentials; maintain consistency with University
of California, American Bar Association and American Association of Law
Schools standards; and chart a smooth transformation into a UC San Diego
School of Law.

If the Joint Committee determines that the proposal should advance, a
planning document would be submitted to the UC San Diego Faculty Senate
and administration, and to the California Western faculty and Board of
Trustees. If those bodies endorse the committee’s recommendation, it
would then be sent to the UC Office of the President for a final
evaluation and decision.

UC San Diego has had a substantial history of academic interactions with
California Western. In December 2002, the two institutions signed a
formal Memorandum of Association providing broad interdisciplinary
opportunities for the faculty and students of both institutions. This
Memorandum pledged the institutions to explore joint educational efforts
and cooperative degree programs and research opportunities in medicine,
political science, history, and other disciplines to the law school’s
faculty and students.

The joint committee does not have a firm timeline for making a
determination on the possible establishment of the public law school.
We will keep you informed of the committee’s progress and decision.



Marye Anne Fox
Chancellor

Paul W. Drake
Senior Vice Chancellor –
Academic Affairs

[Great Satchmo]

I'm from San Diego and would like to stay in the area. I've been offered over 81 k in scholarship $ from Cal Western, but haven't heard a peep from USD. I've also been accepted at SCU, Miami, and UoP. Miami's out and I don't know if I can justify paying 150 k for SCU when Cal, Stanford, and Hastings are next door. Talk of this merger makes the idea of attending Cal Western for virtually free (I wouldn't have any living expenses) and having the UC name attached to it within the next couple of years is very tempting. If it doesn't happen, that's a whole other issue.

They tried this once before, in the early 1980's and it didn't pan out because the law school wouldn't be financially independent and would have received some state funding. This time around, it looks as though they would keep the Cal Western facility downtown (rather than move it to UCSD) and it would remain financially independent. On top of all that Cal Western is doing really well financially. It seems like both UCSD and Cal Western would benefit from this union and part of the article mentioned cool areas of focus like medical law and things of the sort.

Before I would have said I would pay sticker at USD over the $$ from Cal Western, but this new factor is definitely impacting my decision. Any thoughts would be appreciated!

I'm in a similar position, for the most part.

I, for the better or worse, did not apply to Cal Western. My dad went there, and my uncle may have went there (can't recall if he went to Thomas Jefferson or Cal Western). I grew up in San Diego, and my parents still live there.

However, I could not bank on attending Cal Western in the hope that an UCSD affiliation actually occurs. As far as the UC system goes, things seem very touchy and I wouldn't expect this to be either expedient or even necessarily successful. Had the merger been approved, I would have strongly considered the option.

USD is a strong enough school (ranked just out of T1) and is in a region without true competition until you get to LA.

I'm in at USD, with no word on scholarship (not that I necessarily expect it), and it's a consideration. I don't claim to know the legal market in SD too well, but it seems to be somewhat unique from the LA/bay area markets. USD would actually be a more appealing option had I not grown up in San Diego and felt jaded. I may need to attend an ASD and stay somewhere downtown, intentionally avoiding staying with my family, to see if I could stomach moving back.

As far as $150k at SCU, I get the sense that SCU can be another peculiar case. Considering the proximity to big schools (also know that since Boalt and Stanford are national schools, not all graduates will end up staying) they seem to place pretty well. I think their placement is skewed due to the strength in IP, where existing engineers/professionals end up making a great way for themselves by enhancing an existing tech career. However, aside from that, if you are ok staying south of San Francisco, more on the Peninsula or south bay (i.e. San Jose), the prospects don't look terrible.

Since you mentioned it, I'd give UoP (McGeorge) a decent look. I have a friend that is a 3L there and despite him slacking some, he has some decent prospects. McGeorge, although not an exemplary school, does hold a fair amount of regional placement power. I have an $18k/year scholarship offer there, and as begrudgingly as I am about it, it's still on the table for a reduced-cost option. The caveat for me is that I can't see myself spending 5-10 years in Sacramento.

[BruinsFan]

I'm in a similar position, for the most part.

I, for the better or worse, did not apply to Cal Western. My dad went there, and my uncle may have went there (can't recall if he went to Thomas Jefferson or Cal Western). I grew up in San Diego, and my parents still live there.

However, I could not bank on attending Cal Western in the hope that an UCSD affiliation actually occurs. As far as the UC system goes, things seem very touchy and I wouldn't expect this to be either expedient or even necessarily successful. Had the merger been approved, I would have strongly considered the option.

USD is a strong enough school (ranked just out of T1) and is in a region without true competition until you get to LA.

I'm in at USD, with no word on scholarship (not that I necessarily expect it), and it's a consideration. I don't claim to know the legal market in SD too well, but it seems to be somewhat unique from the LA/bay area markets. USD would actually be a more appealing option had I not grown up in San Diego and felt jaded. I may need to attend an ASD and stay somewhere downtown, intentionally avoiding staying with my family, to see if I could stomach moving back.

As far as $150k at SCU, I get the sense that SCU can be another peculiar case. Considering the proximity to big schools (also know that since Boalt and Stanford are national schools, not all graduates will end up staying) they seem to place pretty well. I think their placement is skewed due to the strength in IP, where existing engineers/professionals end up making a great way for themselves by enhancing an existing tech career. However, aside from that, if you are ok staying south of San Francisco, more on the Peninsula or south bay (i.e. San Jose), the prospects don't look terrible.

Since you mentioned it, I'd give UoP (McGeorge) a decent look. I have a friend that is a 3L there and despite him slacking some, he has some decent prospects. McGeorge, although not an exemplary school, does hold a fair amount of regional placement power. I have an $18k/year scholarship offer there, and as begrudgingly as I am about it, it's still on the table for a reduced-cost option. The caveat for me is that I can't see myself spending 5-10 years in Sacramento.

Thanks for the insight! I definitely plan to visit everywhere before I make a concrete decisions. U o P offered me 13 k a year and might be a good option that's a little more in between the super cheap and the super pricey. The thing that worries me about SCU was that only 40% reported their salary and, just my instincts here, if they were making a good amount of money they would have been more than happy to report it.

I think the only schools I'd be willing to pay sticker at are USD, Loyola, Pepperdine, and U of O. All schools my numbers are borderline at. There are people on LSN with my numbers who got in and ones who didn't. Although, I say this now.

I don't think I would attend Cal Western "banking" on it happening. It's definitely something to monitor in the news. Sounds like you were pretty traumatized by living here though.

[Great Satchmo]

Thanks for the insight! I definitely plan to visit everywhere before I make a concrete decisions. U o P offered me 13 k a year and might be a good option that's a little more in between the super cheap and the super pricey. The thing that worries me about SCU was that only 40% reported their salary and, just my instincts here, if they were making a good amount of money they would have been more than happy to report it.

I think the only schools I'd be willing to pay sticker at are USD, Loyola, Pepperdine, and U of O. All schools my numbers are borderline at. There are people on LSN with my numbers who got in and ones who didn't. Although, I say this now.

I don't think I would attend Cal Western "banking" on it happening. It's definitely something to monitor in the news. Sounds like you were pretty traumatized by living here though.

McGeorge really doesn't seem like a bad option if Sacramento is ok with you, and it really has some decent parts. The campus is actually a lot nicer than I thought it would be. The cost of living is cheap, almost surprisingly so for what I'm used to. Plus, I keep getting the sense that placement in Sacramento is strong.

I didn't know the report for SCU was only 40%, that's lower than I imagine. Anyhow, with ANY of those reported data, unless it's an incredibly high proportion reporting, there is self-selection bias at play. if you're making $35k a year, or unemployed, you're most likely not going to report it at the rate that someone making $120k a year. I suppose I'll need to sit down and actually write out objective facts for schools before I make a serious decision.

It's not that I was really traumatized, I think it's just the way that many people feel about where they grew up. Being an adolescent in north county San Diego wasn't all that exciting. I'm really torn about USD, especially with no scholarship, it's going to be difficult to pass up. On one hand, I went to school in Sonoma and my life has been in Northern California for years, as well as the fact that I love area for a lot of reasons. On the other hand, despite never being a family-oriented person, some family health issues are making me rethink my attitude and commitment to family. Also, my uncle and aunt currently practice and I'm sure they know many people, and SD seems to have a slightly more accessible market for USD grads than, say, San Francisco for USF grads.

[Great Satchmo]

Oh, and as far as Cal Western, it's not that I see it as useless without a UCSD affiliation. I guess I didn't apply, despite having the potential for what I would hope would be a significant scholarship consideration, because I'm not sold on moving back to San Diego.

I applied to schools I regard similarly, Golden Gate and Suffolk, as I love those cities and given enough scholarship, would consider attending to give myself latitude in choosing work in a city I love with low debt load to worry about. Cal Western would have been the same if San Diego was something I was considering more seriously.