Top Law Schools

I am 97% sure I will be going in the fall.

Anyone else?

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I'll be headed to ND in the fall, unless someone else comes back with a ridiculous scholarship offer before the deposit deadline. Anyone going to the accepted students weekend on 4/10?

I'll be attending in the fall!

I went to the ASW last weekend. I'm sure you'll love the upcoming one!

I will be attending in the fall as well.

99% sure I'll be here, going to ASW this week

jerrycallo wrote:I'm either ND or Illinois at this point. ND student weekend this upcoming weekend and UofI's the next so we'll see how those go and if ND ups their scholarship offer

Wait, was UofI's ASW actually on easter weekend? o.O Did many people actually go? I can't imagine that would be a cheap or convenient trip for many.

But anyways, do you have any updates? I'd be curious to hear how you found each ASW!

ND class of 2014 at 37.4 big law plus fed

Effingham wrote:ND class of 2014 at 37.4 big law plus fed

Awesome! Up nearly 6%!

Hopefully ND upward trend in employment continues. I believe in 2012 LST gave ND a 62% employment score, 2013 71%, and this year looks like they might hover around 75%. ND still doesn't compete with the Top 14 in terms of employment, but seems to do better than some of their peer schools when it comes to employment score (Looking at you WUSTL and USC), though they are equal in big firm placement.

Between those 3 schools, ND is a great choice, especially since their median LSAT is 163 vs the 166's of the others. You'll get more $$$ with the same opportunities.
Of course, Illinois is an even better choice if you want Chicago, given their 161 LSAT.
Gotta play the game.

eriedoctrine wrote:Between those 3 schools, ND is a great choice, especially since their median LSAT is 163 vs the 166's of the others. You'll get more $$$ with the same opportunities.
Of course, Illinois is an even better choice if you want Chicago, given their 161 LSAT.
Gotta play the game.

I don't think the median LSAT is what determines scholly offers. I mean, WUSTL throws money around, doesn't it? ND definitely seems on the more conservative end of things, from what I've noticed on LSN.

prodigal.daughter wrote:

eriedoctrine wrote:Between those 3 schools, ND is a great choice, especially since their median LSAT is 163 vs the 166's of the others. You'll get more $$$ with the same opportunities.
Of course, Illinois is an even better choice if you want Chicago, given their 161 LSAT.
Gotta play the game.

I don't think the median LSAT is what determines scholly offers. I mean, WUSTL throws money around, doesn't it? ND definitely seems on the more conservative end of things, from what I've noticed on LSN.

The latter comment is more on point. I've got a difficult decision - virtually free ride at Washu while ND pretty much said they won't match. There's a lot to the scholarship game and a school like Washu just seems to be willing to throw cash to get kids with high lsats. I would choose ND at even money so it's a pain right now. Anyone going to ASD this Friday?

Like I mentioned in the other post, WUSTL throw lots and lots of money at students, so it is unrealistic to expect ND to match, although it seems that people have better success this year to negotiate scholarship with ND, whereas in past years, ND seldom budged.

That being said, regarding employment in Chicago, I too was debating between WUSTL, ND, UofI. It was easy for me to rule out UofI. It is true that UofI has good placement in Chicago, but that is it for UofI, if you strike out in Chicago, you do not have much other backup options.

Whereas for ND (and probably true for WUSTL), albeit not a T14, it has the brand power to place you in most major cities (NY, DC, CA) and your home market. In addition, ND also has superior Fed Court placement that is on par with some T14 schools.

Ultimately, I decided on ND over WUSTL based on several reasons. Both are great schools, academically speaking, but ND offers more than just a diploma. You become a part of one of the most loyal alumni base in any university, which helps significantly when you are searching for a job. You get the full experience of being in a major university (Football, Basketball, etc). In addition, the smaller class size and the availability of a Chicago program (ND owns a whole building in downtown Chicago) were big draws for me as well.

As usual, happy to answer any question.

According to the c/o 2014 disclosure, Notre Dame absolutely improved relative to previous years. Only thing is there is a significant amount of people in firms smaller than 25 people.. is that your typical slip and fall firm?

Mozart Lacrimosa wrote:According to the c/o 2014 disclosure, Notre Dame absolutely improved relative to previous years. Only thing is there is a significant amount of people in firms smaller than 25 people.. is that your typical slip and fall firm?

18 people from class of 2014 worked at a firm smaller than 25. Those firms can range anything from small town firms or family law firms, to boutique firms such as tax, immigration, or IP boutiques. While I would agree that many small firms are what people think of as ambulance chasers, there are also small firms that do business transactions, real estates, immigration, IP, tax, and what some may consider as more "prestige" line of legal work.

kyle010723 wrote:

Mozart Lacrimosa wrote:According to the c/o 2014 disclosure, Notre Dame absolutely improved relative to previous years. Only thing is there is a significant amount of people in firms smaller than 25 people.. is that your typical slip and fall firm?

18 people from class of 2014 worked at a firm smaller than 25. Those firms can range anything from small town firms or family law firms, to boutique firms such as tax, immigration, or IP boutiques. While I would agree that many small firms are what people think of as ambulance chasers, there are also small firms that do business transactions, real estates, immigration, IP, tax, and what some may consider as more "prestige" line of legal work.

Got it. You're providing on point advice btw very appreciated.

Paying my first seat deposit today!

I hope this isn't an inappropriate place to ask this, but is paying the first seat deposit binding? I'm on the waitlist at a school in my home market and even though I really don't expect to attend any school other than NDLS, I would like to know if paying the deposit today closes that door entirely.

Thanks for the feedback!

Decisions Decisions wrote:Paying my first seat deposit today!

I hope this isn't an inappropriate place to ask this, but is paying the first seat deposit binding? I'm on the waitlist at a school in my home market and even though I really don't expect to attend any school other than NDLS, I would like to know if paying the deposit today closes that door entirely.

Thanks for the feedback!

Nah, nothing is binding really. You'll just be forfeiting you money if you change your mind.

For those that went, what did everyone think of the admitted students events? I was thoroughly impressed by the profs and students I met.

Overall I thought it was a great weekend.

Was a little surprised by how shitty South Bend is. I mean I knew it would be bad, but I didn't realize the school would be surrounded by it all. I imagined it as being a little more isolated.

My only hesitation at this point is nervousness re: Catholicism. I get that it doesn't have to be a big part of the law school experience, but I am worried (paranoid?) that it plays into bonding with alum, etc.

liberalartslawyer wrote:Overall I thought it was a great weekend.

Was a little surprised by how shitty South Bend is. I mean I knew it would be bad, but I didn't realize the school would be surrounded by it all. I imagined it as being a little more isolated.

My only hesitation at this point is nervousness re: Catholicism. I get that it doesn't have to be a big part of the law school experience, but I am worried (paranoid?) that it plays into bonding with alum, etc.

Technically we are in Notre Dame, IN, surrounded by Niles, Mishawaka, and South Bend. But the school is already isolated and there really is no reason to venture into South Bend beside bar reviews.

In terms of Catholicism, I myself am not a Catholic and it never bug me. The more correct saying is that catholicism is "NOT" a big part of the law school experience. Some professors start classes with a prayer, but that's about it.

While ND probably has the strongest alumni base of any school, for big law positions out of law school, that is but a marginal factor. I would caution you all to refrain from thinking that this school fervor will make you employable all across the country. Law schools, even within the T14, are regional. While ND does place a relatively large number of folks in NY, that city is the exception. Among ND's peers, USC is far better for California and the west coast. In DC, a very tough city to crack even for the top Chicago law schools, GW is by far better. The latter two schools also tend to place students in bigger law firms, but that is the advantage of being the best or second best law school in a very large home market. Your career goals need to be considered when making your law school choice, though a huge scholarship tends to shift the decision (and risk) in other directions.

Calbears123 wrote:Hopefully ND upward trend in employment continues. I believe in 2012 LST gave ND a 62% employment score, 2013 71%, and this year looks like they might hover around 75%. ND still doesn't compete with the Top 14 in terms of employment, but seems to do better than some of their peer schools when it comes to employment score (Looking at you WUSTL and USC), though they are equal in big firm placement.

You need to look at Notre Dame's employment carefully. For the class of 2014 for the first time they have a large number of grads in school funded jobs -- 24 versus 2 for the class of 2013. If you take their FT/LT JD required or preferred jobs minus their school funded ones, they actually went down this year from 79.3% to 72.1%. Now that US News has announced they will no longer fully count the school funded jobs in their rankings - watch them disappear before you graduate.

I think ND was like number 20 in a recent study of most nlj250 partners. I agree with ducks that if you know you want to work in an area by all means attend that strong regional. I think the alumni network thing is not really specifically biglaw but a sense of community of people with a shared background and strong sense of helping others and one another.

I went to a t14 ugrad so I had some contact with law students and profs and I can definitely say that going to a better school =/= that community is more tight knit. Just something to consider among a host of other factors like outcomes/costs/geography.