Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

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jbc0302
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby jbc0302 » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:59 pm

Hi Spivey-

I was on your blog looking at the 170+ LSAT data, and a question occurred to me. It may be unanswerable, but I am curious if you can take your experiences and make an educated guess.

Is there any data on the # of 170+ students who go to schools outside the T14? I imagine this is nearly impossible to figure out reliably, but it would be very interesting. How many of the total number of 170+ students are likely to attend the T14, and therefore how likely it is that these schools will retain their medians? If there is a crunch, are we more likely to see a drop in medians or a smaller class size (or is that impossible to know)?

Just curious and messing around with data. Thanks!

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Iwanttolawschool
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby Iwanttolawschool » Thu Feb 12, 2015 8:35 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:WE'RE DOING THE USNWR PREDICTION GAME AGAIN!! it's official, spread the word! Big Prizes, No Whammies!


I will contact my people's people! (im in)

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby MikeSpivey » Thu Feb 12, 2015 10:29 pm

jbc0302 wrote:Hi Spivey-

I was on your blog looking at the 170+ LSAT data, and a question occurred to me. It may be unanswerable, but I am curious if you can take your experiences and make an educated guess.

Is there any data on the # of 170+ students who go to schools outside the T14? I imagine this is nearly impossible to figure out reliably, but it would be very interesting. How many of the total number of 170+ students are likely to attend the T14, and therefore how likely it is that these schools will retain their medians? If there is a crunch, are we more likely to see a drop in medians or a smaller class size (or is that impossible to know)?

Just curious and messing around with data. Thanks!


I've pondered this before too, sadly I believe that only LSAC has that data and they haven't shared with anyone to my knowledge.

I *suspect* from having worked at 3 law schools (currently) ranked 16, 18 and 43 that the % outside the top 14 is more than one might conjecture. In other words, I think the TLS collective might guess, I dunno, 85% go to T14 where my guess would be more like 65 -70%. Maybe LSN can help from previous years but that is just a small fraction of the pool.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby MikeSpivey » Thu Feb 12, 2015 10:33 pm

** Coming tomorrow (or shortly thereafter) on our blog**

20 Things That Annoy Admissions Deans & Hiring Partners.

This will be fun :)

Feel free to start guessing I have the list already just waiting on one person for one more!

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cannibal ox
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby cannibal ox » Thu Feb 12, 2015 10:34 pm

Not wearing collar stays.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby MikeSpivey » Thu Feb 12, 2015 10:36 pm

cannibal ox wrote:Not wearing collar stays.


:) That's my mentor and Spivey Consulting informal board chair:

http://www.gibsondunn.com/Lawyers/jchapman

One of our top 20 might be from Jeff, but it's not the infamous collar stay debacle.

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storpappa
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby storpappa » Fri Feb 13, 2015 12:08 am

shirts with pockets ... but that goes along with good shirts and collar stays

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hairbear7
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby hairbear7 » Fri Feb 13, 2015 12:22 am

Negotiating scholarships the same day you receive your initial offer

Chronic underthought
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby Chronic underthought » Fri Feb 13, 2015 11:18 am

.
Last edited by Chronic underthought on Thu Jul 23, 2015 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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fra
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby fra » Fri Feb 13, 2015 11:38 am

MikeSpivey wrote:** Coming tomorrow (or shortly thereafter) on our blog**

20 Things That Annoy Admissions Deans & Hiring Partners.

This will be fun :)

Feel free to start guessing I have the list already just waiting on one person for one more!


Forgetting to change the name of the school/firm in your copy-pasted email or essay.

'I am super excited about X law school' in an email to Y law school.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby MikeSpivey » Fri Feb 13, 2015 12:58 pm

Here is the list! 20 Things (plus one bonus) that annoy Admissions Deans and Hiring Partners:

http://spiveyconsulting.com/blog/20-thi ... -partners/

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lawschool1741
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby lawschool1741 » Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:09 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:Here is the list! 20 Things (plus one bonus) that annoy Admissions Deans and Hiring Partners:

http://spiveyconsulting.com/blog/20-thi ... -partners/

Sad that these have to be said...but always a good refresher! Thanks for the quality content, as always!!

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby MikeSpivey » Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:10 pm

lawschool1741 wrote:
MikeSpivey wrote:Here is the list! 20 Things (plus one bonus) that annoy Admissions Deans and Hiring Partners:

http://spiveyconsulting.com/blog/20-thi ... -partners/

Sad that these have to be said...but always a good refresher! Thanks for the quality content, as always!!


You'd be amazed at the response rate and time on these. I think people on the other side like to vent, too :)

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hairbear7
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby hairbear7 » Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:10 pm

Lol at adding an admissions officer on Facebook.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby MikeSpivey » Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:13 pm

hairbear7 wrote:Lol at adding an admissions officer on Facebook.


When I first joined Facebook I was in law school admissions and I started getting all kinds of friend requests from unfamiliar names. After I few days of file reading I started recognizing their names. So awkward.

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Winston1984
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby Winston1984 » Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:25 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:
hairbear7 wrote:Lol at adding an admissions officer on Facebook.


When I first joined Facebook I was in law school admissions and I started getting all kinds of friend requests from unfamiliar names. After I few days of file reading I started recognizing their names. So awkward.

If we do friend them, would you recommend going back and liking every thing they ever posted/all pictures?

secadc11
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby secadc11 » Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:29 pm

Winston1984 wrote:
MikeSpivey wrote:
hairbear7 wrote:Lol at adding an admissions officer on Facebook.


When I first joined Facebook I was in law school admissions and I started getting all kinds of friend requests from unfamiliar names. After I few days of file reading I started recognizing their names. So awkward.

If we do friend them, would you recommend going back and liking every thing they ever posted/all pictures?


+1. Cracking up.

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KarenButtenbaum
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby KarenButtenbaum » Fri Feb 13, 2015 2:47 pm

Chronic underthought wrote:Hi Karen and Mike. I have a question about my potential choice of internship. Thanks in advance for your help.

For some context, I have a 173 and 3.9x, so I am aiming for law schools in that range. I am thinking about interning at a small personal injury firm this summer (junior currently, so last summer before LS apps). The firm has a good local reputation, and has handled a lot of seven and eight figure settlements. My own personal interests are in criminal and tort litigation. I have done several internships at places in the former area (DA's office etc.), but I have no experience with the latter. So this internship would give me some more diversity in experiences, and let me explore how much I really like it before I go to LS. For what it's worth, I have done mock trial for many years now, which includes a lot of tort lit., so my interest here is somewhat grounded.

My concern, however, is how it might reflect on my application? While they're one of the more successful firms around here, they are still in an industry that I think people see as categorically less respectable. I have other more orthodox options for ways to spend my summer, but I sincerely rather do this. How bad will it look? How hard will it be to sell it as a genuine expression of my interests (i.e. not out of desperation/no better choices)?


Do what is interesting to you - if you are genuine about your interest, it will come across that way.
I think there is less judgment than you might think about this type of work from an admissions standpoint. It is more important that you get the experience you want. I really wouldn't worry too much about how the type of law is viewed; it matters less than you think.

wombat2111
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby wombat2111 » Fri Feb 13, 2015 5:32 pm

One thing that was always a red flag for me in my professional life was an email time stamp from a weird hour. There is only rarely a justification for a professional email to be sent at 3am--particularly when the recipient works a 9-5 job.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby MikeSpivey » Fri Feb 13, 2015 5:41 pm

wombat2111 wrote:One thing that was always a red flag for me in my professional life was an email time stamp from a weird hour. There is only rarely a justification for a professional email to be sent at 3am--particularly when the recipient works a 9-5 job.


I hear this from hiring partners, too. For whatever reason(s) it's never bothered me. People can't sleep some nights, have to get up to take the dog out or for whatever reason, and sometimes getting things done gets you back to bed. Plus we live in such a 'get things done from home' society now this just isn't something I default to some nefarious back-setting to, but again I know others don't like it either. A few times when I was at WashU I would actually email my dean back when he would email me at 2 or 3 and I think he sorta thought that was nice that we were both marching forward at an odd hour.

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haus
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby haus » Fri Feb 13, 2015 5:47 pm

wombat2111 wrote:One thing that was always a red flag for me in my professional life was an email time stamp from a weird hour. There is only rarely a justification for a professional email to be sent at 3am--particularly when the recipient works a 9-5 job.

In my field (InfoSec), sending emails in the middle of the night is par for the course.

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Mack.Hambleton
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby Mack.Hambleton » Fri Feb 13, 2015 5:57 pm

haus wrote:
wombat2111 wrote:One thing that was always a red flag for me in my professional life was an email time stamp from a weird hour. There is only rarely a justification for a professional email to be sent at 3am--particularly when the recipient works a 9-5 job.

In my field (InfoSec), sending emails in the middle of the night is par for the course.


Are you a leet hacker

wombat2111
Posts: 11
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby wombat2111 » Fri Feb 13, 2015 6:00 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:
wombat2111 wrote:One thing that was always a red flag for me in my professional life was an email time stamp from a weird hour. There is only rarely a justification for a professional email to be sent at 3am--particularly when the recipient works a 9-5 job.


I hear this from hiring partners, too. For whatever reason(s) it's never bothered me. People can't sleep some nights, have to get up to take the dog out or for whatever reason, and sometimes getting things done gets you back to bed. Plus we live in such a 'get things done from home' society now this just isn't something I default to some nefarious back-setting to, but again I know others don't like it either. A few times when I was at WashU I would actually email my dean back when he would email me at 2 or 3 and I think he sorta thought that was nice that we were both marching forward at an odd hour.


This is a good point. I think once you establish a working relationship with another the boundaries of what is and is not professional become more malleable. Still, if I'm sending a cold email to someone, I try to avoide things that have bugged me in the past.

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haus
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby haus » Fri Feb 13, 2015 6:18 pm

Mack.Hambleton wrote:
haus wrote:
wombat2111 wrote:One thing that was always a red flag for me in my professional life was an email time stamp from a weird hour. There is only rarely a justification for a professional email to be sent at 3am--particularly when the recipient works a 9-5 job.

In my field (InfoSec), sending emails in the middle of the night is par for the course.


Are you a leet hacker

In my old age, I primarly herd cats (or security analyst, or whatever that want to be called this week....)

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Q&A with former Harvard, Chicago, Vandy Admissions officers

Postby MikeSpivey » Mon Feb 16, 2015 11:21 am

wombat2111 wrote:
This is a good point. I think once you establish a working relationship with another the boundaries of what is and is not professional become more malleable. Still, if I'm sending a cold email to someone, I try to avoide things that have bugged me in the past.


I think the best rule of thumb is what you just pegged, if it bothers you it must likely bothers other people (which means other people must get really annoyed when my significant other drives over curbs every time she turns her car out of a parking lot).

Have we missed any questions in this thread of late?


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