Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Special forum where professionals are encouraged to help law school applicants, students, and graduates.

What movie should we all watch at the Spivey Consulting Firm Retreat?

The Town
12
12%
Interstellar
40
39%
Cabin in the Woods
25
25%
Logan
25
25%
 
Total votes: 102

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Fri Mar 31, 2017 9:35 am

laqueredup wrote:Thanks for all you guys do for free on here. Saw the note on your blog that you are at Wait-list Consulting capacity. Do you have a waitlist for your waitlist consulting? Seems like the lists may be getting very long this year.


Well, we are working on freeing up capacity/adding someone new. Id just check back here soon!

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KarenButtenbaum
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby KarenButtenbaum » Fri Mar 31, 2017 10:56 am

enoca wrote:Hey Spivey et al.!

I am considering deferring for work reasons, but my LSAT score expires this cycle. What is the "readmission" process like for a deferral and would an expiring LSAT score be an issue? Or is this just something I need to check school by school?

Thanks


It will vary from school to school, so be sure to check .... but it should be OK for a deferral.
KB

enoca
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby enoca » Fri Mar 31, 2017 11:17 am

Thanks Karen!

BabyDoc2JD
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby BabyDoc2JD » Fri Mar 31, 2017 6:49 pm

Spivey Group I am held at Columbia and NYU, wait listed at Penn and Harvard. I am admitted to Michigan and Duke. (other admits and wait lists also) I am visiting Michigan and Duke this week and I understand these are great choices. Due to curriculum and institutes available that match my goals, I would like to get offers from Columbia and or Harvard. HELP! I know you can't help here anyway you can give an assist?

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mtf612
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby mtf612 » Sat Apr 01, 2017 9:03 am

Spivey group: If someone is waitlisted at H (or any other top school), with a GPA above the median and an LSAT at the 25th, then is their only real hope to get off the waitlist to retake the LSAT (in June?) to hit at/above median?

TXguy2016
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby TXguy2016 » Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:17 pm

Shangrilala wrote:Hello,

Not sure whether I can ask a question like this here but...
Will writing an addendum actually hurt the application someway?
I have weak eyes and I wrote about it, but I wonder the adcom ppl will think I cannot endure the hard work in law school then...should I stop submitting this addendum?
I would like to hear honest opinion from adcom ppl but don't know where to ask so...

Thank you


I came across this and was curious as to your take as I have a similar situation that I posted about viewtopic.php?f=9&t=274158

How concerned should I be about applying to schools that require either a Skype Interview or an interview in person?

Thanks

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Thu Apr 06, 2017 9:56 am

Hi everyone,

I've been swamped with life stuff and work stuff and thus backed up some. I'll try to be more present here starting late next week. I did want to let everyone know that based on what I am seeing with the data and hearing in conversations with colleagues of mine, I really think this is going to be a wild waitlist summer with substantial movement.

Mike

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SybillAnnDorsett
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby SybillAnnDorsett » Thu Apr 06, 2017 10:47 am

MikeSpivey wrote:Hi everyone,

I've been swamped with life stuff and work stuff and thus backed up some. I'll try to be more present here starting late next week. I did want to let everyone know that based on what I am seeing with the data and hearing in conversations with colleagues of mine, I really think this is going to be a wild waitlist summer with substantial movement.

Mike


I may or may not be crying.
Even if I've no reason to have hope as a serious reverse splitter, this still gave me a glimmer.

Good to have you back, Spiv!

njdevils327
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby njdevils327 » Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:22 am

I am also interested in the waitlist consulting this year, as I would love to get off the waitlist at UPenn but I don't particularly know how to go about doing so.

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TripleM
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby TripleM » Thu Apr 06, 2017 12:06 pm

SybillAnnDorsett wrote:
MikeSpivey wrote:Hi everyone,

I've been swamped with life stuff and work stuff and thus backed up some. I'll try to be more present here starting late next week. I did want to let everyone know that based on what I am seeing with the data and hearing in conversations with colleagues of mine, I really think this is going to be a wild waitlist summer with substantial movement.

Mike


I may or may not be crying.
Even if I've no reason to have hope as a serious reverse splitter, this still gave me a glimmer.

Good to have you back, Spiv!

Hope is the cruelest.

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SCG_Anna
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby SCG_Anna » Fri Apr 07, 2017 11:59 am

Hello TLS! My name is Anna, and I've been working with SCG for a few years now, but only recently full-time. I actually first started working with Mike when he posted about an internship in this very thread. Hooray for TLS!

I'm not a consultant, and I don't have any experience working with admissions offices, but I did go through the application process and ended up with some difficult decisions to make about where to attend. I ended up choosing UVA, where I received a Dillard full scholarship.

I'd be happy to answer any questions about the process of choosing a law school (e.g. based on your specific situation/choices) or about UVA specifically!

AlexFergusonLS
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby AlexFergusonLS » Fri Apr 07, 2017 1:10 pm

SCG_Anna wrote:Hello TLS! My name is Anna, and I've been working with SCG for a few years now, but only recently full-time. I actually first started working with Mike when he posted about an internship in this very thread. Hooray for TLS!

I'm not a consultant, and I don't have any experience working with admissions offices, but I did go through the application process and ended up with some difficult decisions to make about where to attend. I ended up choosing UVA, where I received a Dillard full scholarship.

I'd be happy to answer any questions about the process of choosing a law school (e.g. based on your specific situation/choices) or about UVA specifically!


I have a low (3.0-3.3) GPA and am waitlisted at Harvard (big splitter, non-URM). I can't seem to find a single historical example of someone with under a 3.3 GPA getting in off the waitlist. Any advice or thoughts?

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SCG_Anna
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby SCG_Anna » Fri Apr 07, 2017 2:39 pm

AlexFergusonLS wrote:
SCG_Anna wrote:Hello TLS! My name is Anna, and I've been working with SCG for a few years now, but only recently full-time. I actually first started working with Mike when he posted about an internship in this very thread. Hooray for TLS!

I'm not a consultant, and I don't have any experience working with admissions offices, but I did go through the application process and ended up with some difficult decisions to make about where to attend. I ended up choosing UVA, where I received a Dillard full scholarship.

I'd be happy to answer any questions about the process of choosing a law school (e.g. based on your specific situation/choices) or about UVA specifically!


I have a low (3.0-3.3) GPA and am waitlisted at Harvard (big splitter, non-URM). I can't seem to find a single historical example of someone with under a 3.3 GPA getting in off the waitlist. Any advice or thoughts?

Unfortunately I'm really not qualified to answer questions about admissions/WLs/etc.

I should have clarified - I can only answer questions from my own personal perspective, and only about choosing a law school type topics.

Npret
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby Npret » Fri Apr 07, 2017 3:06 pm

SCG_Anna wrote:
AlexFergusonLS wrote:
SCG_Anna wrote:Hello TLS! My name is Anna, and I've been working with SCG for a few years now, but only recently full-time. I actually first started working with Mike when he posted about an internship in this very thread. Hooray for TLS!

I'm not a consultant, and I don't have any experience working with admissions offices, but I did go through the application process and ended up with some difficult decisions to make about where to attend. I ended up choosing UVA, where I received a Dillard full scholarship.

I'd be happy to answer any questions about the process of choosing a law school (e.g. based on your specific situation/choices) or about UVA specifically!


I have a low (3.0-3.3) GPA and am waitlisted at Harvard (big splitter, non-URM). I can't seem to find a single historical example of someone with under a 3.3 GPA getting in off the waitlist. Any advice or thoughts?

Unfortunately I'm really not qualified to answer questions about admissions/WLs/etc.

I should have clarified - I can only answer questions from my own personal perspective, and only about choosing a law school type topics.

Given the seemingly endless threads here where people doubt taking a full or significant scholarships at T14 schools over sticker or significant debt at Harvard or other schools, do you mind explaining your decision process in choosing the Dillard?

It seems that often explaining the advantage of no debt or significantly reduced debt and the similar outcomes available from top schools is unconvincing to many 0Ls.

I'm not asking you to necessarily make specific recommendations, but walking through your decision process might help others clarify their thinking.

A few examples:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=274520

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=276286

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=275838

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=276214

Thanks and congrats on the full time job with Spivey

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SCG_Anna
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby SCG_Anna » Fri Apr 07, 2017 4:08 pm

Npret wrote:
SCG_Anna wrote:
AlexFergusonLS wrote:
SCG_Anna wrote:Hello TLS! My name is Anna, and I've been working with SCG for a few years now, but only recently full-time. I actually first started working with Mike when he posted about an internship in this very thread. Hooray for TLS!

I'm not a consultant, and I don't have any experience working with admissions offices, but I did go through the application process and ended up with some difficult decisions to make about where to attend. I ended up choosing UVA, where I received a Dillard full scholarship.

I'd be happy to answer any questions about the process of choosing a law school (e.g. based on your specific situation/choices) or about UVA specifically!


I have a low (3.0-3.3) GPA and am waitlisted at Harvard (big splitter, non-URM). I can't seem to find a single historical example of someone with under a 3.3 GPA getting in off the waitlist. Any advice or thoughts?

Unfortunately I'm really not qualified to answer questions about admissions/WLs/etc.

I should have clarified - I can only answer questions from my own personal perspective, and only about choosing a law school type topics.

Given the seemingly endless threads here where people doubt taking a full or significant scholarships at T14 schools over sticker or significant debt at Harvard or other schools, do you mind explaining your decision process in choosing the Dillard?

It seems that often explaining the advantage of no debt or significantly reduced debt and the similar outcomes available from top schools is unconvincing to many 0Ls.

I'm not asking you to necessarily make specific recommendations, but walking through your decision process might help others clarify their thinking.

A few examples:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=274520

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=276286

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=275838

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=276214

Thanks and congrats on the full time job with Spivey
Thanks!

For me, debt load was my #1 concern going into the admissions process, although admittedly the prestige factor can be tempting. I think it can be difficult for anyone to fully understand, going into law school, what the debt load will actually be like after graduation just because we've never experienced anything close to it. $100,000 of debt to me felt just as unimaginably enormous as $300,000 of debt (though of course intellectually I understood that they're vastly different).

One thread that really caused it to hit home for me was this one: viewtopic.php?t=220025 (Student Loan Payments: Actual Numbers). And those numbers only get worse and worse as the years progress of course. People who had graduated and were paying off loans at the beginning of that thread, in 2013, had on average quite a bit less debt than the TLSers considering their law school options today. So that thread scared me.

For me, it came down to employment outcomes vs. debt load - and debt load not as one abstract big number, but as calculated payments, how it would really affect my everyday life after graduation. UVA's big law and clerkship numbers are great and honestly not substantially different from higher ranked schools. And it was a full scholarship (for me, $0 debt - yay being married to a spouse who works!) vs. $150k+ debt, so the choice was a no brainer. I'm also from VA and want to work in VA, so it was even more obvious a decision. If you lose the geographical preference factor, as you get more and more disparity in employment outcomes or less and less disparity in debt load, the choice becomes less clear. The only thing I can recommend is trying to really understand what the debt will mean in your life.

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Motion22Step
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby Motion22Step » Thu Apr 13, 2017 10:24 pm

Thanks for the wealth of info you take the time to provide! It's been very valuable.

A quick question from a cost-conscious applicant: I've been placed on several waiting lists among T15 programs. Is it typical for schools to tell applicants admitted off the wait list of any merit-aid offer (assuming there's a scholarship offer at all) as they're extending the admission offer or is any scholarship info normally conveyed AFTER that applicant has already accepted?

Any insight on this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

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Nightwing
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby Nightwing » Fri Apr 14, 2017 8:05 am

MikeSpivey wrote:Hi everyone,

I've been swamped with life stuff and work stuff and thus backed up some. I'll try to be more present here starting late next week. I did want to let everyone know that based on what I am seeing with the data and hearing in conversations with colleagues of mine, I really think this is going to be a wild waitlist summer with substantial movement.

Mike


Greetings Sir,

As a 17x splitter who's literally being waitlisted at a dozen T20/T13 schools, you've given me tremendous hope that it's not predominantly because of some horrendous deed listed on my application and is instead indicative of some strange external complication. Should things not work out from the waitlist this cycle, I will be strongly considering consulting assistance. Either way, I'd simply like to thank you for your contributions.

-Nightwing


P.S. Patrick Stewart is awesome.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:54 am

Motion22Step wrote:Thanks for the wealth of info you take the time to provide! It's been very valuable.

A quick question from a cost-conscious applicant: I've been placed on several waiting lists among T15 programs. Is it typical for schools to tell applicants admitted off the wait list of any merit-aid offer (assuming there's a scholarship offer at all) as they're extending the admission offer or is any scholarship info normally conveyed AFTER that applicant has already accepted?

Any insight on this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!


It's somewhat unlikely although I could probably go on and on about the happy outliers who received a good deal off the WL. But generally it is nothing or a small amount e.g. 5k/year.

Keep in mind, though, you can also use an admissions off the WL to increase scholarship at the school(s) you have deposited at!

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Fri Apr 14, 2017 9:55 am

Nightwing wrote:
MikeSpivey wrote:Hi everyone,

I've been swamped with life stuff and work stuff and thus backed up some. I'll try to be more present here starting late next week. I did want to let everyone know that based on what I am seeing with the data and hearing in conversations with colleagues of mine, I really think this is going to be a wild waitlist summer with substantial movement.

Mike


Greetings Sir,

As a 17x splitter who's literally being waitlisted at a dozen T20/T13 schools, you've given me tremendous hope that it's not predominantly because of some horrendous deed listed on my application and is instead indicative of some strange external complication. Should things not work out from the waitlist this cycle, I will be strongly considering consulting assistance. Either way, I'd simply like to thank you for your contributions.

-Nightwing


P.S. Patrick Stewart is awesome.


Nightwing, good luck this cycle. If you need help next PM me and we will discuss Picard first, and help second. It's possible you will get our Patrick Stewart endowed scholarship.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Fri Apr 14, 2017 10:33 am

May 7th and 8th I will be with Karen, Derek, and Danielle at our annual corporate retreat and watching of Cabin in the Woods. (if anyone cares everyone's bio's are here, point being just that there is a lot of law school experience going into whatever we do below: https://www.spiveyconsulting.com/about/ )

We will *likely* do some sort of webinar/podcast/AMA. Maybe our awesome Chief of Staff Anna can figure out how to do a poll, but does anyone have a strong preference or thoughts on the best format for this?

Oh, also the other movies we voted on seeing were Interstellar and The Town. So also if you care, which would you have picked? This is important stuff.

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Motion22Step
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby Motion22Step » Fri Apr 14, 2017 12:25 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:
Motion22Step wrote:Thanks for the wealth of info you take the time to provide! It's been very valuable.

A quick question from a cost-conscious applicant: I've been placed on several waiting lists among T15 programs. Is it typical for schools to tell applicants admitted off the wait list of any merit-aid offer (assuming there's a scholarship offer at all) as they're extending the admission offer or is any scholarship info normally conveyed AFTER that applicant has already accepted?

Any insight on this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!


It's somewhat unlikely although I could probably go on and on about the happy outliers who received a good deal off the WL. But generally it is nothing or a small amount e.g. 5k/year.

Keep in mind, though, you can also use an admissions off the WL to increase scholarship at the school(s) you have deposited at!


That's helpful to know (especially the possibility of scholly increase & those "happy outliers")! In that case, please excuse me as I resume praying about those schools I'm still under review at ... :D

Thanks for the quick reply, and all your help here!

nyc56
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby nyc56 » Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:18 pm

Spivey! Quick question. How do adcoms view one or two pass/fail classes on transcripts? Taking classes over the summer and don't want to risk my gpa.

Thanks!

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:45 pm

nyc56 wrote:Spivey! Quick question. How do adcoms view one or two pass/fail classes on transcripts? Taking classes over the summer and don't want to risk my gpa.

Thanks!


They don't care at all. Or at least, never met a single adcom who has yet to care about 1-2.

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Sun Apr 16, 2017 1:46 pm

MikeSpivey wrote:May 7th and 8th I will be with Karen, Derek, and Danielle at our annual corporate retreat and watching of Cabin in the Woods. (if anyone cares everyone's bio's are here, point being just that there is a lot of law school experience going into whatever we do below: https://www.spiveyconsulting.com/about/ )

We will *likely* do some sort of webinar/podcast/AMA. Maybe our awesome Chief of Staff Anna can figure out how to do a poll, but does anyone have a strong preference or thoughts on the best format for this?

Oh, also the other movies we voted on seeing were Interstellar and The Town. So also if you care, which would you have picked? This is important stuff.


Okay, poll is up for how you'd rather see our advice in a Q&A format. We can do a podcast with questions from here, a webinar live, or an AMA. Let us know please!

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MikeSpivey
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Re: Spivey Consulting Q&A with Adcoms from Yale, Harvard, Penn, Chicago etc.

Postby MikeSpivey » Tue Apr 18, 2017 1:49 pm

It's official! We will do a reddit AMA (Ask US Anything to be precise) May 7th and 8th in their lawschooladmissions subreddit.

Just to save people some effort it is highly unlikely that we can answer specific school questions or questions about scholarship negotiation. Additionally, there is a great deal we do with or clients that, to use one of said clients own terms, is "proprietary strategy" and we can't divulge things that are specifically to our firm for our clients.

That said, there are nearly an unlimited array of questions, including strategic, we can answer. So bring it on, then. Looking forward to it!

-Mike


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